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[ggraves427]

So I'm thinking about what my 04 SEEG wants for Christmas and I thought about the 113.   I called the local stealer and the first thing he says is that he has to change the heads and that is $1,000.00 for the heads. Says the 113 pistons won't work on the 103 heads.  I  was thinking pistons and jugs.  Do you have to change the heads?  The reason I am asking here is that I can get more reliable information here than I can get from the stealer.

[syclone]

Yep ...you have to change the heads cause they are a "hemi" design with HUGE chambers..like 91cc. OR have the them welded up and re-machined by someone like SBC..and thats $1000.00.
Start adding up the parts , including the labor, and dont forget the $300.00 for the timken update on your cases. Cams , heads, cylinders, bore the cases to fit the cylinders, and you end up with used cylinders, CVO cams no one wants, CVO heads ...E-Bay??
When to get near that $6000.00 mark that 120 Jims sure starts to look better and better..It's really bullet proof for any kind of street use..and you have your complete stock motor to stick back in when you sell.
The Jims has beefy cases, timken bearings on both sides, 4340 rods, roller rockers, springs that will go to .700 lift, 264 cams, adjustible pushrods,heads.forged pistons.....all the good sh*t
A Jims 120 "A" motor costs the dealer @ 6100.00.  Tell them "low Gross is better than no gross" and offer them 6500.00 and let them make some money on the install.
Or ...pistons,heads and cams for your 103 ...can make some really good power for way less money....the 113 just doesnt make $$$$$$ sense to me.
But hey..just throwin out some ideas.

[fatboyse2]

After taking my 103SE to the limit (see going for broke).  I suggest a JIMs120 before going to the 113.  Certainly you'ld get more for your money.

[mdduce]

IM DOING THIS AS WE SPEAK . the dealer says you can run the cnc ported heads from 95" motor but it wont flow as good as the 103 plus heads,but the 103 plus heads from harley are not ported or polished from what i understand,keep in mind i am just a coustomer having this done so i only know what i have read and been told by harley !I have posted stuf about this little undertaking on the scramingeagle,site,i am doing the pistons heads, well the whole kit.

[mdduce]

what the other fellow is telling you is good advice on the jim's direction i just got a good deal on what im doing because they havent done one around this area yet and they offerd what i belive or know is a good deal to do it ,thats the only reason; plus you wont be able to tell thet iv'e done this just by looking at it,heeee I just hope it runs pretty good

[Unbalanced]

Plus you won't be able to tell I did this.

First off the juggs are bigger, there is a bolt through the cases in between the juggs, and your going to prolly change your heads unless you have them welded up.  More than likely you will also  be looking for a larger throttle body or carb.

Your reasonably correct that 95 percent of the people out there will have no idea you done anything other than leave them in the dust.   There is though another 5 percent that will ask you what the mods are.

[Grover]

I'm in the process of doing the 113 also. The only reason is because dealership is eating all the labor and are giving me a hell of a price on parts. (See 103 blown motor in T.C. section.)
  I had my CNC SE heads flowed to see if it they're good enough for the bigger jugs. They are at 161 cfm. Speed shop said that is a good enough flow rate for the 113. And that the xtra $$ to have them ported more would'nt be worth it for the performance gain that it would achieve. Does anybody disagree?
  
Grover

[Unbalanced]

Grover,

161 CFM at where?   25 at 10 ... What intake what exhaust.   What are the valve clearances?  Have the rocker boxes been clearanced if so to what so you know what cam you can run.  

Cant just go by a flow number.  There are all sorts of games you can play with CFM you just have to know the questions to get validity on the answer.

[Grover]

Unbalanced,
  I don't have the flow sheet results in front of me.  I took my heads to a VERY REPUTABLE SPEED SHOP in  my area to get them flowed for compatability on a 113 motor.
  The tech called me and said that they would work just fine. That the $$ of porting them, to gains I would get would not be justified. I just asked him what they flowed at; he told me 161 on intake and (I think it was) upper 140's on exhaust. I'm going with an S&S gear drive set-up, 625g cam. They are taking care of all the head work and yes; the rocker boxes have been clearanced to except the cams.
  I just tossed out the flow # because that's all I asked the tech over the phone at the time. And I just wanted to know what another SE CNC head flowed at to compare to mine!! I don't know all the indepth technicalities on engine building...that's why I take it to the professionals to be done.
  SO IF I IRRITATED YOU WITH MY IGNORANCE [smiley=duhk.gif], SORRY!!!  
 But that's what this site is all about. To get more KNOWLEDGE from all the EXPERTS that have been there and done that; RIGHT?! [smiley=confused5.gif]
Thanks for the input, and don't take my sarcasm personal. That's just my goofy humor at times.

Take care, [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]
Grover

[Unbalanced]

Grover,

I threw out the questions to allow you to ask more questions to learn / share with us.   If your getting 161 at 25 then we would want to inform you to look other places.   Ask the guys specifically about what they are doing to get you a 161 CFM... EG what the setup on the flow bench.  

What compression are you going to run the 625 cam at.   That cam likes to run over 10.5 to 1 .. and does well at 11.0 to 1.

Are you planning on going with compression releases?
-harry

[Grover]

The compression will be @10.5:1
HALS Speedshop here in Wisconsin is doing the head work, and also guiding me along with the other mods to complete the 113. But my dealership is doing the assembly due to warranty. I'll ask them next week for the flow sheets. Then I'll post them for you to look over.

Thanks for the reply [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Grover

[d-rock]

I went the same route as Grover my dealer took the labor from ext. warr. from my blown motor.   I havn't  seen a Jims 120 yet but I have to say my 113 has a ton of power and I am happy with the set up so far.  I puttin in the six gear now and the new throtle body before the dyno and can't wait to see the numbers. The best part of the 103+ heads are that no one knows in advance that I goin by in a hurry

[Grover]

Grover,

161 CFM at where?   25 at 10 ... What intake what exhaust.   What are the valve clearances?  Have the rocker boxes been clearanced if so to what so you know what cam you can run.  

Cant just go by a flow number.  There are all sorts of games you can play with CFM you just have to know the questions to get validity on the answer.

Unbalanced,

  Here is my cfm chart from awhile back. My graph is under musgrove1. They compared my heads to some hand ported ones they did for a similar motor. Any response would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Grover

[DCFIREMANN]

Just a question for those of you who are or have done the 113 conversion. When you had the cases split did you do the timken conversion?

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[Grover]

Just a question for those of you who are or have done the 113 conversion. When you had the cases split did you do the timken conversion?

Be Safe

THE DAWG

DC,
  Yes, I had the timken conversion done. I also had the SE Pro crank strengthened as well.

Grover