Topic: '07 110" Heads (Read 4482 times)

Texas 103 · « **on:** July 15, 2006, 11:05:44 PM »

Anybody have the scoop on the '07 heads yet?

Are they just another rehash of our CVO 103 heads or did the MOCO step up and put a real set on the "07's? See you in Sturgis>>> Greg

Thumper007 · « **Reply #1 on:** July 15, 2006, 11:31:10 PM »

don't no about the heads, but i was wondering if the throttle body on the new motor is bigger

jeffj · « **Reply #2 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:31:38 AM »

I was talking with a friend on Saturday as he will be getting the Razor Red SERK3 in the middle of August

The dealer warned him that the 103" markings could still be on the heads as the display bikes at HD show were showing the 103" instead of the 110".

A lot of questions were asked at HD show and the MoCo had mentioned that the new 110" castings weren't available as of yet.....what ever that means

His dealer said it may ship that way as his bike will be a very early # SERK3

I quickly pointed out that I didn't think the MoCo would ship it that way but if they did my feelings were the bike might be a somewhat of a collectors item.

Surely the MoCo will have the correct casting of 110" when his bike arrives.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #3 on:** July 16, 2006, 10:53:06 AM »

Quote

I quickly pointed out that I didn't think the MoCo would ship it that way but if they did my feelings were the bike might be a somewhat of a collectors item.

Surely the MoCo will have the correct casting of 110" when his bike arrives.

Collector's item? That'd drive me nuts. Plus think of the hassle later when it was time to trade. Lots of guys wouldn't believe you hadn't done "something." Like trashed the original 110" and stuck a 103" back in it's place or just believe it never had a 110" to begin. Nope, this would be a major bitching point for me. Dealer would sign off on replacing heads when they became available if they wanted me to walk out with the bike this way.

mr_magoo · « **Reply #4 on:** July 16, 2006, 11:06:42 AM »

Can't believe they would cast a new head for the 110 in motor and leave the 103 script on them, not even the motor company is that dumb well...

jeffj · « **Reply #5 on:** July 16, 2006, 11:19:32 AM »

I hear what you're saying on the wrong casting of 103" vs. 110" - I would not like it and it would be a deal breaker

Maybe some of our members can verify with their dealers that attended the show if the "Demos" at show had: 103" or 110" castings

Fired00d · « **Reply #6 on:** July 16, 2006, 01:05:09 PM »

On a positive note if they are still using the same heads wouldn't that mean that our heads could be upgraded to 110 (that is if somebody wanted to do that instead of upgrading to 113)? [smiley=nixweiss.gif] If it was an entirely new mold you would think that they would have made the change to 110 when they made the new casts.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #7 on:** July 16, 2006, 04:26:30 PM »

Quote

On a positive note if they are still using the same heads wouldn't that mean that our heads could be upgraded to 110 (that is if somebody wanted to do that instead of upgrading to 113)? [smiley=nixweiss.gif] If it was an entirely new mold you would think that they would have made the change to 110 when they made the new casts.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Trouble is Gary we don't know yet how much is interchangeable down low. From the P&A and engine descriptions that are currently out we know or can safely surmise that cases are different for oil pattern flows, that cams and tensioners are different and that other parts of the reciprocating mass have changed too.

It actually sounds like could be a significant change to the Twin Cam. The heads may still bolt down but it may very well be the case that everything below them is only generally visually similar but with little interchangeability. If that's the case then the only upgrade options we'd have would be the ones we've always had. A lot of the new stuff really looks to apply to 07 and newer only (at least that's the way it looks so far).

Fired00d · « **Reply #8 on:** July 16, 2006, 05:08:35 PM »

Oh well, we know that the Zippers 113ci and Jims 120ci will work for us. For those of us that have extra heads we also know they will look real nice powder coated red to match our rides when we do one of the above.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #9 on:** July 16, 2006, 07:28:37 PM »

Quote

For those of us that have extra heads we also know they will look real nice powder coated red to match our rides when we do one of the above.

Yes, we do [smiley=drink.gif] .

naitram · « **Reply #10 on:** July 16, 2006, 07:38:29 PM »

not sure what the pic above is supposed to be...... it is not an 07 motor though.

1) oil filter mount is not cast into the motor

2) oil line interface cover, this would not be present on an 07

jeffj · « **Reply #11 on:** July 16, 2006, 07:56:46 PM »

Quote

not sure what the pic above is supposed to be...... it is not an 07 motor though.

1) oil filter mount is not cast into the motor

2) oil line interface cover, this would not be present on an 07

True I was just showing the casting of 103" and Screaming Eagle, so people could reference what I was talking about

Sorry for the confusion

jeffj

naitram · « **Reply #12 on:** July 16, 2006, 08:09:07 PM »

thanks for clarifing. reading through this thread i thought maybe HD had built some examples of the 07 CVO's but snuck in an 06 motor

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #13 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:04:32 PM »

The 110 inch heads will be the same casting as the 103 and the new motor will have a cat muffler and you will sign a form stating you won't modify the motor. The motors still need to meet EPA specs and 2007 is tougher than 2006. I will have to check on the throttle body. I would think it may stay the same to meet emissions. Not only are the new CVO's ugly the rules suck tooooo.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Fired00d · « **Reply #14 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:10:04 PM »

I thought those mufflers seemed rather large. That really sucks having to sign a waiver saying you will not alter the motor.

I just can't imagine any Harley owner leaving a motor totally stock. I'm sure there are some, but not many. Just adds another reason to keep what I have now.

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Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #15 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:25:12 PM »

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and you will sign a form stating you won't modify the motor.

So Harley Davidson is now wearing a badge and functioning as an agent of the State? Even assuming that HDI doesn't actively enforce the behavior on the dealerships this throws a completely new and different wrinkle on the impact of these bikes on the resale value of the prior model machines. Can already see the aftermarket's new advertising campaign pitching product to the "Open Access pre-2007" motorcycle and preaching the free spirit of the men and women who dare to ride them in the face of an intrusive Motor Company and an overarching government. Not only will the aftermarket adjust to any new regulations but Harley just handed them a free pass to greater market share within the existing market.

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #16 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:38:36 PM »

Quote

So Harley Davidson is now wearing a badge and functioning as an agent of the State? Even assuming that HDI doesn't actively enforce the behavior on the dealerships this throws a completely new and different wrinkle on the impact of these bikes on the resale value of the prior model machines. Can already see the aftermarket's new advertising campaign pitching product to the "Open Access pre-2007" motorcycle and preaching the free spirit of the men and women who dare to ride them in the face of an intrusive Motor Company and an overarching government. Not only will the aftermarket adjust to any new regulations but Harley just handed them a free pass to greater market share within the existing market.

No not Harley,your dealer will have this EPA FORM for you!!!!! Did you notice how the MOCO will not be selling any exhaust systems except for stock replacements!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

RedFXR2 · « **Reply #17 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:46:28 PM »

I don't know how HD can require some form stating "I, the undersigned, will not alter the motor..."

But I'm already wondering about the alter-ability of the 2007's. Early this year, my local dealer told me that for the 2006 models, there were only a few, HD package deals of mechanical upgrades the dealers would do. Both the 95" and 103" kits were available but only as part of a package which included cams (rather mild cams, I might add) and that the exhausts must either remain stock or include a set of HD dealer-only pipes that used a catalyst. He showed me the paperwork from HD with the parts lists and all. There was no more parts picking and choosing and a whole lot of other hi-perf parts were going away (from HD, anyway).

However, you could still go wild with your 2005 or earlier motor, depending on what parts HD still offered for earlier TC's.

So now it's 2007 and HD's come from the factory with bigger engines. Does anybody know what the dealers will be allowed to do to them? Are the Feds and EPA going to start sniffing the pipes of 2007's?

Maybe HD is figuring that folks won't want to mess with a motor that's already bigger, but we all know how that goes.

grc · « **Reply #18 on:** July 16, 2006, 09:52:08 PM »

Quote

The 110 inch heads will be the same casting as the 103 and the new motor will have a cat muffler and [highlight]you will sign a form stating you won't modify the motor[/highlight]. The motors still need to meet EPA specs and 2007 is tougher than 2006. I will have to check on the throttle body. I would think it may stay the same to meet emissions. Not only are the new CVO's ugly the rules suck tooooo.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Dawg,

What happens if I sign the form and then modify the motor anyway? Will a truck & trailer with a big bar & shield on the side roll up to my house and wisk the bike away? [smiley=nervous.gif] Sounds a little like the bs form the Dyna buyers had to sign in '06 concerning the 15k trans bearing replacement - CYA for the MoCo. Obviously they've been spending too much on lawyers.

I'm 99.9% certain that one thing we will see is that the MoCo will only sell EPA approved performance packages. They seem to have finally taken the anti-tampering portion of the law seriously. Of course, that really doesn't mean a whole lot to the average Harley rider, since there is a ton of stuff in the aftermarket, much of which is better than what H-D offered anyway. Early buyers may have to wait awhile for the aftermarket folks to gear up for the new engine configurations, but gear up they will.

Jerry

RedFXR2 · « **Reply #19 on:** July 16, 2006, 10:02:13 PM »

Quote

Early this year, my local dealer told me that for the 2006 models, there were only a few, HD package deals of mechanical upgrades the dealers would do. Both the 95" and 103" kits were available but only as part of a package

Quote

I'm 99.9% certain that one thing we will see is that the MoCo will only sell EPA approved performance packages.

I should have mentioned that my dealer told me the same thing--the packages were approved by the EPA.

I would imagine that the aftermarket, if not HD, will soon come up with parts that will up the performance, but still comply with emissions requirements.

Still, IMO, it does give the owner of a '05 or older a bit of a reason to keep their bike for a while longer--if they want to modify it, that is.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #20 on:** July 16, 2006, 10:32:06 PM »

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No not Harley,your dealer will have this EPA FORM for you!!!!!

Though that makes them the State's agent. Perhaps no more than is a retailer for collecting the various taxes on products purchased. But an agent nonetheless. Of course the real questions will be enforcement and acquiescence to changes requested anyway. It's still a boost for the aftermarket and prior models.

arcticdude · « **Reply #21 on:** July 16, 2006, 11:46:00 PM »

All of this emission's stuff is really a mute point anyway. Since 1979 it's been illegal to tamper with ANY emissions related items; ie: cams, exhaust, intake/air cleaner, etc. I don't think anybody has been worried so far. How many of us have done just what has been illegal for 26 years?!?!? The practical side is that the EPA and the local states don't have the manpower to truly enforce this law. The latest American Motorcyclist has a very good article speaking directly to this very subject. It essentially tells us that the latest laws actually may OPEN up some of the former restrictions. The moco may not sell any "07" and later performace parts, but has the header pipe diameter changed?? How about the air cleaner fitment??? Since the cam bearings are now single piece as opposed to roller, it will take a while before the after market catches up- but the journal sizes may not have changed, so only hardening of the current cam selections may be needed to make them compatible with the 07's. So who's to say if I buy an exhaust to fit my "03" and end up putting it on my 07? Just stirring the pot a little. 8-)

firegabe · « **Reply #22 on:** July 17, 2006, 12:02:38 AM »

so here is a good question for you all... since I added the 6spd to my bike uppon purchase! (this allegedly will also include the new trans in my 7 year ext. warr.
they did not ask me to sign anything about 15K, bearrings.

!!!???

hd-dude · « **Reply #23 on:** July 17, 2006, 12:46:02 AM »

Quote

so here is a good question for you all... since I added the 6spd to my bike uppon purchase! (this allegedly will also include the new trans in my 7 year ext. warr.
they did not ask me to sign anything about 15K, bearrings. !!!???

Gabe;
The 15k Bearing issue was only with the 06 Dyna models. Not to worry, And yes since you had the trannyinstalled at purchase it will be covered under warranty.

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #24 on:** July 17, 2006, 06:36:49 AM »

Quote

Though that makes them the State's agent. Perhaps no more than is a retailer for collecting the various taxes on products purchased. But an agent nonetheless. Of course the real questions will be enforcement and acquiescence to changes requested anyway. It's still a boost for the aftermarket and prior models.

Don in Maryland we sign the from NOW!!!!! But there is no enforcement. Unless they start emissions tests on motorcycles as of this year I don't know how they can enforcement the law.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #25 on:** July 17, 2006, 06:39:03 AM »

Quote

Dawg,

What happens if I sign the form and then modify the motor anyway? Will a truck & trailer with a big bar & shield on the side roll up to my house and wisk the bike away? [smiley=nervous.gif] Sounds a little like the bs form the Dyna buyers had to sign in '06 concerning the 15k trans bearing replacement - CYA for the MoCo. Obviously they've been spending too much on lawyers.

I'm 99.9% certain that one thing we will see is that the MoCo will only sell EPA approved performance packages. They seem to have finally taken the anti-tampering portion of the law seriously. Of course, that really doesn't mean a whole lot to the average Harley rider, since there is a ton of stuff in the aftermarket, much of which is better than what H-D offered anyway. Early buyers may have to wait awhile for the aftermarket folks to gear up for the new engine configurations, but gear up they will.

Jerry

Jerry again it's not the MOCO it's the EPA aka THE FEDS!!!! It's a from you will sign when you take delivery. I don't know how they can enforcement the law.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

RedFXR2 · « **Reply #26 on:** July 17, 2006, 08:17:51 AM »

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I don't know how they can enforcement the law.

I think enforcement would be easy. Just like with cars in many states, all they have to do is require passing an annual emissions test in order to gain the annual vehicle registration. Fail the test--no tag.

I figure that's what's coming. Just a matter of time. Since HD only offered EPA approved package upgrades for 2006, I'm guessing they know it's coming soon.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #27 on:** July 17, 2006, 12:37:51 PM »

Quote

Don in Maryland we sign the from NOW!!!!! But there is no enforcement. Unless they start emissions tests on motorcycles as of this year I don't know how they can enforcement the law.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

I understand that Dawg. And please don't confuse concern for amusement on my part. Quite frankly I'm not at all bothered by the fact that Harley may be self-legislating itself out of a lot of the upgrade market. The aftermarket will quickly tool up to fill any void and will do a good job of it. The automotive environment teaches us that.

Also, since so many of the Harley shops do such a bad job of mixing and matching "performance upgrades" with the variety options they've had before if those shops are now left with the only options being 1) do nothing or 2) use only approved "kits" the bike owners who have to trust that those dealerships know what they're doing will now be a lot better served. Dumbing down the process will make it a lot easier for the dealerships to avoid the mistakes they so commonly make.

Ceej · « **Reply #28 on:** July 17, 2006, 08:51:13 PM »

The thing that will get this enforced is $$$$$ - 15k fine for any modification - means no shops will do this work once they start sending out undercover "Customers" - you know the states and feds will go after these $$$$$$'s :-?

Fired00d · « **Reply #29 on:** July 17, 2006, 08:55:59 PM »

"Undercover Customers"....

Is this like a "Secret Shopper".

Hmm, will the MoCo supply you with a new bike of your choice to ride and try to have modified? If so this may be a job for me as I'm getting close to retirement. 8-)

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Ceej · « **Reply #30 on:** July 17, 2006, 09:16:44 PM »

Not the MOCO - The State or feds, They'll probably set up a fine upstanding public servant like you on a nice bone stock 883 or Yamaha V-Star and send ya knocking.....and your back aching!!! - - - ok, I know thats not fair - to the Vstar

grc · « **Reply #31 on:** July 17, 2006, 10:08:41 PM »

Quote

I think enforcement would be easy. Just like with cars in many states, [highlight]all they have to do is require passing an annual emissions test in order to gain the annual vehicle registration. Fail the test--no tag.[/highlight]
I figure that's what's coming. Just a matter of time. Since HD only offered EPA approved package upgrades for 2006, I'm guessing they know it's coming soon.

Red,

That's the system we have in N.W. Indiana, since we have been classified as a "non-attainment" area for poor air quality (ozone and particulates). Funny how most of the air pollution is from industrial sources, power plants, and heavy truck traffic on I-80, and yet the only folks penalized are car and light truck drivers. Anyway, back to the point - the "test" here consists of checking the gas cap to make sure it doesn't vent to the atmosphere, and then plugging a scan tester into the OBDII (On-Board Diagnostics) connector on your car. If there are no codes stored, you pass. Tailpipe sniffers are only used on pre-'95 vehicles which don't have OBDII systems, and the test is rather lenient compared to the original EPA test cycle. The electronics on bikes are not OBDII compliant, so any test would have to be of the sniffer variety. I don't see any state spending the bucks to set up special test facilities just for bikes, at least not until Uncle forces them to do so. So, in conclusion, I don't intend to lose any sleep over this issue.

As for the $15k fine for tampering, unless someone changed the law recently that only applies to dealers and manufacturers, not private owners. The fine is $15k per occurrence per day, by the way, so the total fine if they were to get caught selling things like SERT's would be massive. The fact they haven't been nailed in the past only means the EPA was ignoring them. The EPA has now obviously put out the word that they will be enforcing the law from this point forward.

Jerry

CVOJOE · « **Reply #32 on:** July 17, 2006, 10:28:27 PM »

[highlight]The 110 inch heads will be the same casting as the 103 [/highlight]

That's what I was told by a dealership svc mgr today, and that the 'new' CVO engines are basically the '06 Dyna engine block with big bore and stroker kits, etc. installed to get to 96" & 110". Apparently the same heads the are on the 103" today but with Screamin 110" on it, etc.

Forgot to ask about the throttle body. [smiley=nixweiss.gif]
Spec sheets are supposedly being sent to dealerships this week for unpacking. Did see two new FLTRI's today and except for the huge mufflers, not much difference is visible on a quick glance.

e4seter · « **Reply #33 on:** July 18, 2006, 01:49:28 PM »

Quote

I was talking with a friend on Saturday as he will be getting the Razor Red SERK3 in the middle of August

The dealer warned him that the 103" markings could still be on the heads as the display bikes at HD show were showing the 103" instead of the 110".

A lot of questions were asked at HD show and the MoCo had mentioned that the new 110" castings weren't available as of yet.....what ever that means

His dealer said it may ship that way as his bike will be a very early # SERK3

I quickly pointed out that I didn't think the MoCo would ship it that way but if they did my feelings were the bike might be a somewhat of a collectors item.

Surely the MoCo will have the correct casting of 110" when his bike arrives.

From the attached picture I got off the HD site, the 110 07 heads just say Screamin Eagle..

CVOJOE · « **Reply #34 on:** July 18, 2006, 01:57:19 PM »

Looks like they just bolted the nameplate over the old script for the photo shot doesn't it ?

Author Topic: '07 110" Heads (Read 4482 times)

RedFXR2

RedFXR2

RedFXR2