Topic: List yer '04 engine fixes (Read 2791 times)

Garznhogs · « **on:** September 27, 2006, 08:46:53 PM »

Pumpkin goes in next week to try to figure out why it won't run smooth from 1,700 to about 2,500 rpm with LIGHT (less than 6%) throttle...like when yer just cruisin' easy through yer neighborhood. Runs real good above 3,000, or when you give just a little more throttle. Feels like a miss, jerky, sputter, ... sounds like a 2-stroke!

SE performance slip-ons, Ness Big Suck, SERT, Dyno'd twice. Dealer already found and fixed intake leak. Plugs replaced twice. I'm putting in new battery tomorrow. Only 7,500 miles, and I'm tired of it. It just HAS to be some damm part that ain't workin'.

HELP! What performance problems have YOU found and fixed on your '04 seeg? I've done massive searches and came up with some stuff, but I wanna know it ALL. I'm ready to tell tech to replace every sensor, injectors, plug wires, credit card, etc. Dealer is working with me, and wants to get it resolved. (good people!)
Thanks so much for any info you can share, and have shared in the time I've been here!
Garz

grc · « **Reply #1 on:** September 27, 2006, 09:52:28 PM »

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Pumpkin goes in next week to try to figure out why it won't run smooth from 1,700 to about 2,500 rpm with LIGHT (less than 6%) throttle...like when yer just cruisin' easy through yer neighborhood. Runs real good above 3,000, or when you give just a little more throttle.

TallyClassic · « **Reply #2 on:** September 28, 2006, 11:15:39 AM »

My '05 SEEG is bad too. So annoying to be moving in 2nd, 3rd or 4th gear in traffic on light throttle and having it do it's little dance. Like you said any increase in throttle or extra load, like going up an incline/hill makes it go away.
Tried SE plugs....that made it worse. Autolites were better. Now I'm on NGK titanium's, seems a little better and barely noticable. I run a ThunderMax and since their upgrades with software, maps and flash, that has made a difference too.
In all, I agree that there is something in the fuel delivery, heads, injectors. I wonder if people have the same problem after they do the CVO head fix.

Garznhogs · « **Reply #3 on:** September 28, 2006, 03:33:37 PM »

Thanks Jerrry & Tally... ya described it exactly. Damn, that's sort of what I've been afraid of hearing. But ya probably saved me some money. "Nature of the beast".
Tally, I had the same experience with the SE plugs.

Jerry, when I first installed the SERT, I started playing with the fuel in the subject range, but chickened out when I got to about 12% over the base map and didn't have a real noticeable improvement. So now that it's been "dyno tuned" (I use the term loosely), can I mess with idle and fuel mixtures without messing up the whole dyno tune? Can I upload from the bike's ECM, make changes, then download it back in? Or will it be "POOF".

Seems like the new Tmax with O2 sensors would be the total answer. Tell me again... how much did I spend for this bike?

TallyClassic · « **Reply #4 on:** September 28, 2006, 03:53:14 PM »

As long as you have the original dyno map, play all you want. If you go too far, just reload your 'base' map.
As far as the ThunderMax, I have nothing but good things to say and the O2 can only make it awesome. Canned maps from Zippers, and the one in my bike have the cylinder balance to where the front is white/tan, the rear black/tan. This is normal tuning. The rear is always a bit richer so it runs cooler. The o2 should be able to compensate when the surging occurs, but it's not the fix, just the bandaid.
I still think this is an intake/heads/cylinder-fill/injector issue. I never had a peep of trouble from my '02 88B. The 103CVO is an EPA whore. It wasn't made to run great or powerful, just satisfy the suits.

Garznhogs · « **Reply #5 on:** September 28, 2006, 10:06:38 PM »

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[highlight]As long as you have the original dyno map,[/highlight] play all you want. If you go too far, just reload your 'base' map.
As far as the ThunderMax, I have nothing but good things to say and the O2 can only make it awesome. Canned maps from Zippers, and the one in my bike have the cylinder balance to where the front is white/tan, the rear black/tan. This is normal tuning. The rear is always a bit richer so it runs cooler. The o2 should be able to compensate when the surging occurs, but it's not the fix, just the bandaid.
I still think this is an intake/heads/cylinder-fill/injector issue. I never had a peep of trouble from my '02 88B. The 103CVO is an EPA whore. It wasn't made to run great or powerful, just satisfy the suits.

That's the question, Tally... all I have is the bike with the ECM as programmed by the dynoman. I don't have it on my computer. Will it upload to my computer when I tell it to?

Twolanerider · « **Reply #6 on:** September 28, 2006, 11:47:15 PM »

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That's the question, Tally... all I have is the bike with the ECM as programmed by the dynoman. I don't have it on my computer. Will it upload to my computer when I tell it to?

Power Commander you can save the map from. SERT you can't.

Garznhogs · « **Reply #7 on:** September 29, 2006, 07:29:59 PM »

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Power Commander you can save the map from. SERT you can't.

And why am I not surprised? Don't know that the dynotune was so great anyway, but hate to lose it at this point. So, since there's probably nothing the tech is going to find, like a dead rat in the throttle body, I'll probably cancel the shop time and save $$$. There is some consolation in knowing I'm not alone with the problem.

Thanks for all the info, gentlemen!

Garz

grc · « **Reply #8 on:** September 29, 2006, 09:54:24 PM »

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Thanks Jerrry & Tally... ya described it exactly. Damn, that's sort of what I've been afraid of hearing. But ya probably saved me some money.

Fired00d · « **Reply #9 on:** September 29, 2006, 10:25:06 PM »

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Jerry,

I think the answer to your last question is the same as for all of us - about $10k too much.

Garznhogs · « **Reply #10 on:** October 01, 2006, 02:46:20 PM »

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Jerry,

I think the answer to your last question is the same as for all of us - about $10k too much.

I know there isn't a way to download the existing map to disk with the SERT, but how about printing out the various tables with the SERT software? Then you could manually put everything back where it was after playing around. I'm pretty sure 'd00d mentioned this capability some time back.

Jerry

Jerry, that's a good idea. Seems like stone-age work in current technology, doesn't it.

d00d, at the time of the dyno, I hadn't seen (or didn't remember) your post about taking a disc along. I wonder if the dynotune I got was all that great. I did get 90.16 HP, 103.49 TQ (SD smoothing: 3, whatever that means).

Thanks guys. I'm gonna run it to the shop now. Talked with the GM this morning and he really wants to get it running right. Said they might call Tech Support at HD, or whatever it takes. Good guy! He mentioned that the owner of the shop(s) has a pumpkin but didn't remember hearing that he had any problems. (All I know the owner's bike is running a 2-1 exhaust...)
Stay tuned for the next episode of "WTF?"
Jerry

Fired00d · « **Reply #11 on:** October 01, 2006, 03:29:05 PM »

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.....

d00d, at the time of the dyno, I hadn't seen (or didn't remember) your post about taking a disc along. I wonder if the dynotune I got was all that great. I did get 90.16 HP, 103.49 TQ (SD smoothing: 3, whatever that means).

......
Jerry

The mention of taking a disc w/you when it's getting dyno'd may not have been in this thread that may be the reason you hadn't seen it. Sometimes the dyno guy will keep a copy on there computer in case someone comes in with the same/similar mods they can load that up as a baseline. You may want to ask if they save/still have a copy of yours on there computer.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Garznhogs · « **Reply #12 on:** October 02, 2006, 03:19:26 PM »

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The mention of taking a disc w/you when it's getting dyno'd may not have been in this thread that may be the reason you hadn't seen it. Sometimes the dyno guy will keep a copy on there computer in case someone comes in with the same/similar mods they can load that up as a baseline. You may want to ask if they save/still have a copy of yours on there computer.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

d00d, makes sense... I could check with them... thanks. But, I want to see what the dealer comes up with. There's another dynotuner that they have trailered bikes to, that they think is really good. SO, maybe my bike will end up there.? Wait and see!
Garz

Unbalanced · « **Reply #13 on:** October 04, 2006, 10:02:23 AM »

Garz,

Would the guy with the Trailer happen to be Jim with BraggingRightsMobile Dyno?

If I were you I would call the original tuner and ask to get a copy of your map based on your issues your having. The other thing you could look at is definately injectors, but first question I would ask is do you have the newer software that allows you to add fuel to the bike like the fuel pump on the PCiii? My suggestion would be to get the original map and then you can always put the bike back where it is now, but to go into the tables of your map after renaming it and saving it so you have another copy and then reupload it and see if the issue goes away. In most cases adding that tiny bit of fuel for that under 10 percent throttle we have seen the issue you describe pretty much go away. Just a suggestion.

-harry

Garznhogs · « **Reply #14 on:** October 04, 2006, 02:50:01 PM »

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Garz,

Would the guy with the Trailer happen to be Jim with BraggingRightsMobile Dyno?

If I were you I would call the original tuner and ask to get a copy of your map based on your issues your having. The other thing you could look at is definately injectors, but first question I would ask is do you have the newer software that allows you to add fuel to the bike like the fuel pump on the PCiii? My suggestion would be to get the original map and then you can always put the bike back where it is now, but to go into the tables of your map after renaming it and saving it so you have another copy and then reupload it and see if the issue goes away. In most cases adding that tiny bit of fuel for that under 10 percent throttle we have seen the issue you describe pretty much go away. Just a suggestion.

-harry

Hi Harry! I don't remember who they said the tuner was, but it was someone who "really knew their stuff", and he was north of here, on the Gulf side. Somewhere around Tampa, maybe. But "BraggingRights" sounds strangely familiar.. is he particularly good? and where is he?

I was playing with the SERT when I first got it.. adjusted the fuel just like you said, a little, at low throttle / 1,800 to 2,500 rpm, but didn't note a difference so put it back to base map, then it went to the dyno.
I'll stop by and have the guy put the dyno map on a disc, and then like you said, I can screw around with it. That is, if it hasn't had another dynotune.
Thanks,
Garz

Unbalanced · « **Reply #15 on:** October 04, 2006, 03:59:28 PM »

Garz,

Jim brings his dyno down to tampa harley, crystal river, ocala, and he stores it at Clermont Harley frequently when they are not offering rider ed courses. He is located about 6 miles west of highway 27 and highway 50. You can go to his website at www.braggingrightsmobiledyno.com He is a certified harley mechanic and does specialize in the racetuner. I have spent many hours with him tuning bikes such as the Zippers 575 cam testing he is the guy I did this with. I believe he has tuned BLM's bike and a few others on the site here as well.

I also think this was my 1000 post hehe. cheap plug .. cya in MV ... <reference made>

Garznhogs · « **Reply #16 on:** October 04, 2006, 09:00:35 PM »

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Garz,

Jim brings his dyno down to tampa harley, crystal river, ocala, and he stores it at Clermont Harley frequently when they are not offering rider ed courses. He is located about 6 miles west of highway 27 and highway 50. You can go to his website at www.braggingrightsmobiledyno.com He is a certified harley mechanic and does specialize in the racetuner. I have spent many hours with him tuning bikes such as the Zippers 575 cam testing he is the guy I did this with. I believe he has tuned BLM's bike and a few others on the site here as well.

I also think this was my 1000 post hehe. cheap plug .. cya in MV ... <reference made>

OK, first and most important... [size=16]Congratulations on yer 1,000th post, Harry![/size][/color] [smiley=vrolijk_26.gif]And ya did it on my thread... that's cool! (bragging rights)

Next, it was you who gave me the confidence to screw with the SERT in the first place... Thanks!

Next, Jim sounds like a person I'll have to locate and use. Thanks for the info!

Finally, thanks for the MV reference, Buddy! Rub it in if ya will, but I'm sittin' here polishing my OFFICIAL MV Eastern Gathering pin, which you ain't even SEEN yet. How 'bout them apples? [smiley=sauer019.gif]

Bike is still at the dealer...no phone calls, no nothin'. Sittin' and waitin'. Maybe I'll call 'em tomorrow to check on progress.
Just a BTW on how the Naples shop is changing for the better... when I ran into the GM at the parade site Sunday, he offered to 'swap' bikes with me... (his 'dealer demo' is a customized '06 FHLX w/95, 2-1, Stage 1). I declined because I didn't want him to be without his ride. He rides to the store almost every day. Mine sits in the garage during the week anyway.

Garz

Garznhogs · « **Reply #17 on:** October 06, 2006, 09:47:37 PM »

Got it back from the 'dyno' (try #3). "New" map: Less HP, less TQ, still have herky-jerky; can't ride 2,100 rpm in second gear in my neighborhood.
Screw it. Probably just mess with the SERT myself. What can it hurt?

bigdog257 · « **Reply #18 on:** October 06, 2006, 10:22:51 PM »

Jerry that dyno tuner that Naples uses is Cycle Rama in the St.Pete area I believe.

Bigdog

grc · « **Reply #19 on:** October 07, 2006, 09:33:49 AM »

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Got it back from the 'dyno' (try #3).

Fla_Eagle · « **Reply #20 on:** October 07, 2006, 04:39:56 PM »

Garz
I had a similar problem on my 04 SE. Turned out to be the temp sensor.It was covererd under the 5 year emmissions warranty. Note 5 year emmissions warranty!!!
regards
Pete

grc · « **Reply #21 on:** October 07, 2006, 08:11:09 PM »

Update to my previous post: Many seem to think the CVO's came with the new style injectors (25

Unbalanced · « **Reply #22 on:** October 09, 2006, 12:56:37 AM »

Garz,

Did you get a copy of the map this time? If not go get one. I am not at home so I cant remember if i gave you a map to try or not. Let me know, because if you have the map that is in the bike now you can easily try one or 2 that I have and see if the bike runs any different.

-harry

Garznhogs · « **Reply #23 on:** October 09, 2006, 01:40:53 PM »

Bigdog, yer right...Cycle Rama's the place. Talked with Don in Naples and he wants to see if they can send it up there. (It's been done 3 times at Ft Myers)

Jerry, I was gonna put the laptop in my saddlebag and adjust on the go... but that sounds like a recipe for disaster... Especially since the laptop isn't mine.

Fla_Eagle... see?! That's why I wanted service dept to check for that stuff FIRST! Boy, would that pizz me off if the problem turned out to be the temp sensor.

Thanks for your input... gives me a little more ammunition.

Jerry, I mentioned the injectors in my notes to the service dept, thinking they might check that, but I got no word that they looked at anything...but, they didn't charge me, either.

Harry, no, I didn't get a copy of the dyno map... didn't think to put a disc in the saddlebag when I dropped it off. And, I had no idea they'd be taking it up for the tune so fast... I thought maybe they'd call me with SOME words of what they found or didn't find ("Hey Jerry, we found a dead rat in yer throttle body") before running it back up to FT Myers. I haven't received any maps from you, but I appreciate the offer.

I'll see what the dealer plans to do next. I found out my bike was the topic of their manager's meeting recently. My mileage this weekend was 35.9, mixed hiway/surface. Meanwhile, wife gets 44.3.

Thanks for all your input, guys! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]
Stay tuned for more exciting episodes of As the [smiley=pumpkin.gif] Turns![/color]

Author Topic: List yer '04 engine fixes (Read 2791 times)