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CVO Technical => Intake/Exhaust/ECM => Topic started by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:49:41 PM

Title: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:49:41 PM
Hi gang, I'm back from London and was able to install my Fullsac baffles today.  I though I'd compile a how-to for these as well. 

The first step is to remove the exhaust from the bike.  First you loosen the main nut at the front of the muffler.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:50:56 PM
The next step is to remove the two screws at the back of the muffler under the saddlebags.  The left and right mufflers are exactly the same. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:52:54 PM
If you haven't already removed your catalytic converter you can see it by looking in the right pipe main header toward the engine.  If you want to remove yours you can get step by step directions via this link:

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=27814.0
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:56:26 PM
After the muffler is off of the bike you need to remove the chrome heat shields.  These are held on by three large hose clamps.  The trick here is to slightly loosen the two forward clamps (ones close to the small inlet hole) and loosen to the point of almost removing the last clamp.  This will let the last clamp slip over the two rear mounting screw nuts and it will slide right off. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:57:15 PM
Here's a pic of the heat shield being slid off the muffler. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:58:34 PM
Next you need to remove the muffler end cap.  This is held on with three screws. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 08:59:44 PM
After the screws are removed the cap slides off.  It can be a bit tight.  Be careful not to scratch anything when you pull it.  Do not use tools to pry it off. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:01:10 PM
After the end cap is removed you can see the two welds that need to be removed.  These two welds are all that holds the baffle in the exhaust pipe. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:04:15 PM
Next you use a die grinder or some sort-of rotary cutter to grind the welds.  You need a good bit that is designed to grind metal.  I used a Dremel with a carbide serrated bit. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:05:36 PM
Here's a pic of a weld nearly ground down.  You must be careful here.  It is very easy to damage the muffler.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:10:01 PM
After grinding through the welds you need to punch the OEM baffle out.  I used a wooden dowel rod so I wouldn't damage the OEM baffle.  I may use it again some day. 

The center of the OEM baffle sticks out a bit, so you need a block of wood to get the muffler off of the ground and hit the dowel rod gently with a hammer.  It will pop right out if you have broken the welds.  It will not budge if you haven't. 

A trick I used for this step was I first hammered the OEM baffle back into the pipe a bit after I though I had the welds ground down.  This way I could break it free and grind anything I missed. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:12:44 PM
Here's a pic of the inside of the muffler after the OEM baffle was removed.  There's sound deadening insulation lining the length of the pipe.  I left mine in, but I have noticed that it does quiet the pipe quite a bit.  If you want a bit more noise you can probably remove it.  It is only tacked onto the pipe with glue. A long thin knife will cut it right out. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:19:03 PM
Now we need to drill the hole that will hold the Fullsac baffles in place.  This is easy, but you need to take your time.  The pipe is hard and round.  A drill bit will walk down the pipe and scratch the H#|| out of it if you are not careful. 

Step one here is to measure in from the bottom of the pipe 1 3/8" from the edge.  The bottom of the pipe is directly opposite of the nuts that hold it on the bike.  Don't drill on the wrong side!  Measure twice cut once as they say :) 

Step two is to use a center punch and punch the mark where you want to drill.  Do NOT skip this step.  A drill bit will not bite into the pipe if it isn't punched!  If you don't have a center punch use a metal screw with a hard point. 

Step three is to start with a small drill bit and then work your way up to a 1/4" drill bit.  Take it easy and do not jump sizes too quickly.  The more bits you use the easier the hole will be to drill.  If you have a drill press use it.  If not, just be careful.  I used a standard battery powered drill with no problem.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:20:58 PM
After you've drilled the pipe, the next step is to install the Fullsac baffle.  Just slide it into the muffler and line up the set screw holes.   You may need a block of wood and tap it with a hammer to get it in.  Do not hit it hard!  The metal will bend if hit directly with a hammer. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:22:02 PM
Then install the set screw with the nut and lock washer on the inside of the muffler. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:29:13 PM
Here's the best part. 

"This Harley-Davidson Exhaust 64768-09 system meets EPA noise emission requirements of 80 db (a) for the following motorcycles.  Installation of this exhaust system on motorcycle models-not specified may violate federal law.  HARFLT1800."

Go figure.  I so happen to have these installed on a HARFLT1800.  How cool is that  :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 09:29:50 PM
Here's what they look like installed...
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on September 27, 2008, 10:03:05 PM
Here's what they look like installed...

Hey Jim
            Idea for your next thread.  How to remove the reflector above the license plate light on an 09 SERG . That's one gorgeous looking back porch there EXCEPT for that ugly reflector.

B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 10:04:55 PM
Funny you mention that.  I removed it after I took that picture. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on September 27, 2008, 10:07:48 PM
Funny you mention that.  I removed it after I took that picture. 

If I say pretty please will you post a picture of rear WITHOUT the fugly reflector ?

B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Carlos Silva on September 27, 2008, 10:09:01 PM
once again - excellent work Jim, your step-by-steps are well done and very much appreciated...love the EPA text, I hadn't noticed it, can't wait to say "yes officer, if you can kneel down you'll see here that these comply, your hand-held must need calibration" ;D...also like your t-shirt, G B indeed
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 10:25:49 PM
If I say pretty please will you post a picture of rear WITHOUT the fugly reflector ?

It's night in Chicago, so this was as good as I could get.  Enjoy...
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Carlos Silva on September 27, 2008, 10:41:26 PM
If I say pretty please will you post a picture of rear WITHOUT the fugly reflector ?

jeeeez, he didn't even stay logged on to see the pic!!...I myself had no doubt of its subsequent post

nice tag bracket Jim...and I see ya got your real tag too...cool
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: sadunbar on September 27, 2008, 10:48:00 PM
It's night in Chicago, so this was as good as I could get.  Enjoy...


Where abouts are you Jim?  I grew up in Wilmette on the North Shore...

And great write-ups!  Awesome contributions to the site! :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 10:50:06 PM
jeeeez, he didn't even stay logged on the see the pic!!...I myself had no doubt of its subsequent post

nice tag bracket Jim...and I see ya got your real tag too...cool
I was waiting to get my real tag to give me a reason pull the reflector.  That thing has been driving me crazy.  What a piece of junk.  $31K bike and they stick that cheap crap on it.  I've taken the ones off of my saddlebags off as well.  I still need to get the reflectors on the shocks.  That glue is a pain in the @$$.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: ..Hawk on September 27, 2008, 11:06:05 PM
Great Job on the pics and all.  What size baffles did you install?  How's the sound?  I'm running supertrapp slip ons UCSE3, nice low deep rumble.  What's next dyno time?
 
Thanks for the thread.

Hawk
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 11:09:27 PM
Where abouts are you Jim?  I grew up in Wilmette on the North Shore...

And great write-ups!  Awesome contributions to the site! :2vrolijk_21:

I live in the South Loop area of the City close to McCormick Place. 

Wilmette is nice.  I ride up that way all of the time. It's beautiful up there.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: sadunbar on September 27, 2008, 11:12:04 PM
I live in the South Loop area of the City close to McCormick Place. 

Wilmette is nice.  I ride up that way all of the time. It's beautiful up there.

I grew up on Lake Ave. a couple of blocks west of Sheridan Dr.   I live about 80 miles northeast of the city now...have for the last 20 years.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 27, 2008, 11:28:22 PM
Great Job on the pics and all.  What size baffles did you install?  How's the sound?  I'm running supertrapp slip ons UCSE3, nice low deep rumble.  What's next dyno time?

Hi Hawk, thanks for the kind words.  I'm just doing my part to help this great board.  moco doesn't support us, so we will have to unite and do it ourselves.  Fine by me! 

I got the 1 3/4" baffles from Fullsac.  Most were going with the 2", so I thought I'd try the smaller size and see if there's much of a difference.  I also live in the City and they are a PITA about loud bikes.  I'm trying to keep it as quiet as possible without restricting performance. 

The sound is a deep rumble, but not too loud.  I'm idling about 99 db's.  This isn't a legal sound test, but basically what I hear using a Radio Shack sound meter.  To compare this, I started out stock at 93db.  When I pulled the cc I was at 96db and with the 1 3/4" I'm at 99 db.  Each exhaust mod has bumped me up about 3db.  I bet if I remove the insulation from the muffler it will significantly increase the volume as well. 

I'm going to Dyno the bike next week.  I'll post the results when I get them. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: ..Hawk on September 27, 2008, 11:40:27 PM
Thanks for the info Jim.

I'm out in the West Suburbs, maybe we can meet some where for a burger and beer some day.
 
Keep me posted,  this site is the most useful site I've ever read on the internet.

You and others are doing a great job sharing their experiences.

Thanks again.

Hawk
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 28, 2008, 08:28:14 AM
I'm out in the West Suburbs, maybe we can meet some where for a burger and beer some day.

Hawk, I'm always looking for someone to ride with.  I live in the City and there are not many people with bikes downtown.  If you or anyone in the area wants to ride let me know.  I'm happy to ride out of town and meet you. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: planenut on September 28, 2008, 08:36:21 AM
thanks jim for the updates on the exhaust project and the great info :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: ..Hawk on September 28, 2008, 01:41:39 PM
It figures that the weather just took a dump for awhile.  I'll keep in touch Jim and try and get a ride in before the seasons over.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 28, 2008, 07:15:13 PM
Here's a video of my pipe changes.  The video steps through the stock pipes, the stock pipes without the catalytic converter and finally the beautiful sound of the v-twin and fullsac 1 3/4" baffles.  You need good speakers to listen to this, but it's night and day difference from stock. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCByoE3T_bo

Here's my Radio Shack sound meter details:

Idle with cat: 93db - w/o cat: 96db - w/fullsac baffles: 100db
2K RPM with cat: 102db - w/o cat: 100db - w/fullsac baffles: 103db
3K RPM with cat: 96db - w/o cat: 101db - w/fullsac baffles: 107db
4K RPM with cat: 104db - w/o cat: 105db - w/fullsac baffles: 110db
5K RPM with cat: 102db - w/o cat: 106db - w/fullsac baffles: 109db

The pipes now have a lot more base, but the volume is not intrusive at all.  I can still hear the radio and it doesn't set off car alarms when I drive by.  I'm going to Dyno next week.  We'll soon see what difference the pipe changes have actually made. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: sadunbar on September 28, 2008, 07:23:44 PM
Here's a video of my pipe changes.  The video steps through the stock pipes, the stock pipes without the catalytic converter and finally the beautiful sound of the v-twin and fullsac 1 3/4" baffles.  You need good speakers to listen to this, but it's night and day difference from stock. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCByoE3T_bo

Here's my Radio Shack sound meter details:

Idle with cat: 93db - w/o cat: 96db - w/fullsac baffles: 100db
2K RPM with cat: 102db - w/o cat: 100db - w/fullsac baffles: 103db
3K RPM with cat: 96db - w/o cat: 101db - w/fullsac baffles: 107db
4K RPM with cat: 104db - w/o cat: 105db - w/fullsac baffles: 110db
5K RPM with cat: 102db - w/o cat: 106db - w/fullsac baffles: 109db

The pipes now have a lot more base, but the volume is not intrusive at all.  I can still hear the radio and it doesn't set off car alarms when I drive by.  I'm going to Dyno next week.  We'll soon see what difference the pipe changes have actually made. 

Jim,

Where are you having your dyno tune done?

Scott
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on September 28, 2008, 07:59:08 PM
Thanks Jim. Well done as always! :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 28, 2008, 08:16:59 PM
Where are you having your dyno tune done?

I'm going to IL Harley Davidson on Harlem.  They have an awesome engine guy that knows his way around the Dyno and Harley fuel injection systems.  I've met with most of the dealers in the area and this guy seems to know what he's doing better than most.  The proof, of course, is in the outcome.  I'll let you know how it goes when I get the bike back. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 911Hawk on September 28, 2008, 08:17:47 PM
How will this effect the PCM? To my understanding a Power Commander program is not available for the 09 at this time.
Thanks for the great info as these are the changes I will make.

911 Hawk
09 SERG
NC
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 28, 2008, 08:26:49 PM
How will this effect the PCM? To my understanding a Power Commander program is not available for the 09 at this time.

I'm using the Super Race Tuner, not Power Commander.  You would use one or the other.  There are advantages to both.  Super SERT's advantage is that they have maps for the new models and they allow much more control over the computer (Throttle by wire control is a good example).  Power commander can be removed without anyone knowing it was there and it is a lot easier to use.   
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 911Hawk on September 28, 2008, 08:46:30 PM
If I make the changes you made, What effects would I have without some type of tuner ?
Thanks,
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 28, 2008, 09:11:25 PM
The O2 sensor on the bikes is designed to handle exhaust changes.  The bike was running fine without a race tuner.  The key issue for me is that stock bikes run way too lean in order to meet EPA standards.  To get the most power out of the bike and cool the engine down you need a tuner and enrichen the mixture. 

There are other options to put more fuel in the bike, but they aren't available for the 09's yet.  The cheapest I've found was sent to me by Iglide.  The company is called Nightrider (www.nightrider.com).  They sell a product called XiED that will trick the O2 sensor in thinking the bike is leaner than it actually is.  This causes the computer to add fuel.  Great product.  Can't wait to see how it works when they get it to work with the 09's. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 911Hawk on September 28, 2008, 09:31:42 PM
The wait for a Power Commander program is killing me. Can't wait to get started. :-\

Thanks, for all your help
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on September 29, 2008, 07:42:14 AM
The wait for a Power Commander program is killing me. Can't wait to get started. :-\

Thanks, for all your help

They will eventually get it working.  moco changed the bikes big time in 09.  The O2 sensors work differently, the ECM protocol is different, we have throttle by wire, we have a new exhaust design, they put the cat's in the headers, etc.  Power Commander connects between the ECM in order to fool it into thinking the bike is running stock when it isn't.  moco doesn't like it when they don't make money off of us and/or when we try to trick their computer.  moco's strategy is the same as when they went to the Twin Cam from the Evolution engines.  They change things around enough to make it difficult for competitors to compete with them.  If you want to make an ECM change now you're going to need the Super SERT.  Otherwise hang in there for awhile.  The market will catch up. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: bribe36 on October 03, 2008, 01:31:13 AM
Hey Jim

I greatly appreciate everthing you have been doing, the write ups, pics and videos are great and helpfull. This is my first CVO and I'm a little concerned about the effect of these changes on the warranty, especially the extended warranty. What is your thought on the moco giving a fellow grief for a claim on a bike that has these things done. Also are you planning on keeping this bike for a long time and did you purchase the extended warranty?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 03, 2008, 07:23:47 AM
I greatly appreciate everthing you have been doing, the write ups, pics and videos are great and helpfull. This is my first CVO and I'm a little concerned about the effect of these changes on the warranty, especially the extended warranty. What is your thought on the moco giving a fellow grief for a claim on a bike that has these things done. Also are you planning on keeping this bike for a long time and did you purchase the extended warranty?

Guys have been modifying their bikes since day one.  How many bikes have you seen that have stock pipes and air cleaners?  Taking a hard line on warranty for items damaged that have nothing to do with the mods that were made would have a serious impact on their bottom line.  This would have even more of an impact if a moco after market mod failed causing the problem and they didn't cover it.  This stuff is not cheap.  MoCo makes much more money on after market parts than they do selling new bikes and they build in a good profit margin on new bikes that cover warranty repairs.  Dealers make money off of parts sales, dnyo's and service.  Warranty claims are certainly expensive, but many of us do other things while we are there that helps them offset the cost of the repairs.

I'm not a warranty expert and not providing you with legal direction, but in my opinion I believe MoCo knows their entire network would crash if they forced everyone to stay stock.  No one would buy the extended warranty that couldn't be used, we would all be out here talking about how to install parts from third-party's that MoCo doesn't know about, dealers would loose a large portion of sales because we'd be afraid to have them order or install the mods in case we had an issue we needed them to cover, etc.  From what I've seen, moco generally fix warranty items no questions asked.  In most cases, MoCo relys on the dealer to make the determiniation.  Build a good relationship with a couple of dealers by spending money with them.  Get to know them and make sure they know you.   Dealers are the ones that will help you when you need it. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Carlos Silva on October 03, 2008, 09:12:10 AM
Jim, you have a PM...oh the pitfalls of bein' a smart guy ;)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on October 03, 2008, 01:09:27 PM
Jim, you have a PM...oh the pitfalls of bein' a smart guy ;)

HEY! I never got one of those! :D
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 08, 2008, 10:50:49 PM
HEY! I never got one of those! :D

You're going to start getting them now.  The sub and the V&H's are going to put you on everyone's list.   :oops:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on October 09, 2008, 11:45:29 AM
You're going to start getting them now.  The sub and the V&H's are going to put you on everyone's list.   :oops:

I'm pretty sure that sub stunt is going to put me on the "other" list!  :D
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: TN on October 10, 2008, 01:15:37 PM
i have 1.75 baffles on the way. having har time finding a core bit local. :nixweiss:





TN
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Pumba11 on October 10, 2008, 03:35:36 PM
I was able to rent one at the local rental shop.  Give that a try.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on October 10, 2008, 04:50:32 PM
I was able to rent one at the local rental shop.  Give that a try.
You rented a coring bit?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Pumba11 on October 10, 2008, 04:52:37 PM
Yes, but the cost was almost as much as buying one.  But they had it.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on October 10, 2008, 04:53:32 PM
Yes, but the cost was almost as much as buying one.  But they had it.

I would only use it once anyway!!  ;D

Thanks!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on October 10, 2008, 04:54:30 PM
Not to say that I would actually rent or buy one of those things and drill my cc out....that would be against the law.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 10, 2008, 04:56:38 PM
Not to say that I would actually rent or buy one of those things and drill my cc out....that would be against the law.

54 Posts before the lights finally come on.

B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Robmay on October 10, 2008, 04:57:37 PM
54 Posts before the lights finally come on.

B B

I've been thinking that the whole time. Wouldn't take much to run it down for some fines and whatnot would it?  :o :P
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 10, 2008, 07:42:53 PM
I've been thinking that the whole time. Wouldn't take much to run it down for some fines and whatnot would it?  :o :P

Not sure about every state, but IL does not require emission testing on motorcycles.  You can't be fined by another state for emission issues even if they have stringent legal requirements.  Emission standars are enforced where the bike is titled.  From what I can gather form the EPA regs is that except for California, motorcycles aren't required to have cats until 2010. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 10, 2008, 07:45:47 PM
Not sure about every state, but IL does not require emission testing on motorcycles.  You can't be fined by another state for emission issues even if they have stringent legal requirements.  Emission standars are enforced where the bike is titled.  From what I can gather form the EPA regs is that except for California, motorcycles aren't required to have cats until 2010. 

Conspiracy to commit a crime carries the same sentence as actually commiting it in most states, and the fact that you crossed state lines in your conspiracy makes it a Federal offense - - - - which of course is actually a good thing since the Federal prison system is far far superior to that of your home state Illinois . And California - - - - - -fuhgedaboutit, you don't even want to think about being a guest of the CDC


B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 10, 2008, 08:48:18 PM
Conspiracy to commit a crime carries the same sentence as actually commiting it in most states, and the fact that you crossed state lines in your conspiracy makes it a Federal offense - - - - which of course is actually a good thing since the Federal prison system is far far superior to that of your home state Illinois . And California - - - - - -fuhgedaboutit, you don't even want to think about being a guest of the CDC

What crime are we talking about here?  Can you point us to the EPA regulations or any other law that states that a Motorcycle is legally required to have a Cat in every state in the USA?  I have found a lot of the subject including the EPA ruling requiring cats on Motorcycles in 2010.  I have not found anything that specifies that my 2009 Motorcycle is legally required to have one.  If it is, my own state does not know about it or enforce it.  Accordingly, virtually every H-D on the road has high-bypass pipes installed that clearly state they are not street legal. The 2008 110 owners removed their cats when they removed their OEM muffler.  Your position here is that the owner/operators and the mechanics that maintain those bikes are conspiring to commit crimes and are moments away from spending time in CDC.  Good luck with that!   

We also have the little thing called free speech to deal with.  This discussion board and the administrators enable conversations like this one to happen.  We as Americans have the right to discuss our thoughts and opinions.  Yes we can even teach people how to take illegal drugs, how to build bombs and even how to core catalytic converters.  You and the other administrators participate in and condone discussions like this as well.  You are protected under the Constitution of the United Sates and so are we.  It most certainly isn't a conspiracy to share ones thoughts and ideas.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 10, 2008, 08:53:10 PM
FTC!!! You guys are funny! Just cause you don't drill em out, doesn't mean ya ain't violating something with every set of pipes A/C and dyno tune ya'll have been doing for years!!! Now ya GAS about drilling cats?!! Funny stuff!!! FTC!!! :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Screamin on October 10, 2008, 08:58:28 PM
FTC!!! You guys are funny! Just cause you don't drill em out, doesn't mean ya ain't violating something with every set of pipes A/C and dyno tune ya'll have been doing for years!!! Now ya GAS about drilling cats?!! Funny stuff!!! FTC!!! :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)

Was thinking the same. I know exactly one guy that's totally legal.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 10, 2008, 09:23:34 PM
FTC!!! You guys are funny! Just cause you don't drill em out, doesn't mean ya ain't violating something with every set of pipes A/C and dyno tune ya'll have been doing for years!!! Now ya GAS about drilling cats?!! Funny stuff!!! FTC!!! :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)

There are 1000's of posts on this site discussing illegal headlights, illegal exhaust systems (including Rinehart True Duals, V&H, Fullsac, etc), illegal race tuners, etc.  The entire site is successful because it is a place that we can openly discuss modifying our motorcycles.  Even if some of those modifications are not legal everywhere in the world.  After 50+ post on the subject we get someone that takes a high-road on a cat removal of all things?  Everyone has the right to their own opinion, but what kills me is that this comment is form an admin that participates in virtually every one of the discussions on this board including the illegal ones.  Give me a break !!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 10, 2008, 09:29:38 PM
There are 1000's of posts on this site discussing illegal headlights, illegal exhaust systems (including Rinehart True Duals, V&H, Fullsac, etc), illegal race tuners, etc.  The entire site is successful because it is a place that we can openly discuss modifying our motorcycles.  Even if some of those modifications are not legal everywhere in the world.  After 50+ post on the subject we get someone that takes a high-road on a cat removal of all things?  Everyone has the right to their own opinion, but what kills me is that this comment is form an admin that participates in virtually every one of the discussions on this board.  Give me a break !!

When I first read it, I thought it was tongue-in-cheek! Then start talkin about fines! WTF!!! :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:

Disclaimer: Everything we talk about here and do to the bikes, is for off road and race use on a closed course only!!! Not one of us would dare do any of this stuff on the streets, would we? ::) :P :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fired00d on October 10, 2008, 09:32:42 PM
There are 1000's of posts on this site discussing illegal headlights, illegal exhaust systems (including Rinehart True Duals, V&H, Fullsac, etc), illegal race tuners, etc.  The entire site is successful because it is a place that we can openly discuss modifying our motorcycles.  Even if some of those modifications are not legal everywhere in the world.  After 50+ post on the subject we get someone that takes a high-road on a cat removal of all things?  Everyone has the right to their own opinion, but what kills me is that this comment is form an admin that participates in virtually every one of the discussions on this board including the illegal ones.  Give me a break !!
Who/What admin?? :confused5:

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 10, 2008, 09:35:11 PM
Who/What admin?? :confused5:

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:

You're right.  Didn't realize that until after I posted it. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fired00d on October 10, 2008, 09:36:27 PM
You're right.  Didn't realize that until after I posted it. 
Ok, that's kewl. :2vrolijk_21: I (we) get blamed for enough as it is. ;D

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 10, 2008, 09:39:11 PM
Who/What admin?? :confused5:

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:

HeHe!!! Funny Gary! Not one admin post in the entire thread! But it's fun to blame ya anyway!!! ;D :2vrolijk_21:

It's still strange that anyone who participates here, is seriously concerned about making a muffler mod on a performance motorcycle!!! No way could it be a serious post. But leave it to B B to throw the slammer into the mix!!! ;D ;D ;D :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Iglide on October 10, 2008, 10:08:04 PM
Where good friends gather to have fun, you will always find someone who shows up, to "Rain on the Parade"!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 10, 2008, 10:09:40 PM
Where good friends gather to have fun, you will always find someone who shows up, to "Rain on the Parade"!

Well good thing we all got Rain Gear then!!! ;D ;D ;D

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 10, 2008, 10:12:43 PM
Once again I fall victim to posting something as a joke that nobody gets

Sorry everyone, but my entire post regarding legal issues was tongue in cheek.

We don't by the way have a tongue in cheek emoticon - - - - I checked

One would hope that after 8,000 posts, somebody would have figured me out by now.

Again, sorry for the ruffled feathers


B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 10, 2008, 10:15:21 PM
Once again I fall victim to posting something as a joke that nobody gets

Sorry everyone, but my entire post regarding legal issues was tongue in cheek.

We don't by the way have a tongue in cheek emoticon - - - - I checked

One would hope that after 8,000 posts, somebody would have figured me out by now.

Again, sorry for the ruffled feathers


B B

Thanks BB!  Thought it was strange to take a stand on cat drilling of all things.  If we need to take a stand it should be on politics, inflation or the rapidly crashing stock market :) 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 10, 2008, 10:19:59 PM
HeHe!!! Funny Gary! Not one admin post in the entire thread! But it's fun to blame ya anyway!!! ;D :2vrolijk_21:

It's still strange that anyone who participates here, is seriously concerned about making a muffler mod on a performance motorcycle!!! No way could it be a serious post. But leave it to B B to throw the slammer into the mix!!!  ;D ;D ;D :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)

Hell Howie, I've got more friends on the inside than the outside
 
I'm trying to even it up here.

B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 10, 2008, 10:21:41 PM
Once again I fall victim to posting something as a joke that nobody gets

Sorry everyone, but my entire post regarding legal issues was tongue in cheek.

We don't by the way have a tongue in cheek emoticon - - - - I checked

One would hope that after 8,000 posts, somebody would have figured me out by now.

Again, sorry for the ruffled feathers


B B

Take you serious about drilling mufflers Brian. BWAAA HAAAA HAAAA! ;D ;D ;D

It started before you. And it sure seemed serious! :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:

Ooops, he musta been on the wrong site I guess! ::) :o ;)

Hell Howie, I've got more friends on the inside than the outside
 
I'm trying to even it up here.

B B

Wow, I was worried we were all going to the slammer for a muffler violation!!! Would they do that in ME? :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 10, 2008, 10:28:22 PM

Wow, I was worried we were all going to the slammer for a muffler violation!!! Would they do that in ME? :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:

Hoist! 8)

Actually yes. My friends the Reynolds family that owns Big Moose H-D and Augusta H-D tells me they get reminded on a regular basis by the Maine State Police regarding Maine law on the subject. Since Maine has a vehicle inspection law, if a dealership loses it's Inspection Station license, they're screwed. If I can manage to pull off buying a new 09 SERG in Maine, it will retain the stock exhaust until I see how harda$$ the MSP is on this issue.

B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 10, 2008, 10:29:49 PM
Actually yes. My friends the Reynolds family that owns Big Moose H-D and Augusta H-D tells me they get reminded on a regular basis by the Maine State Police regarding Maine law on the subject. Since Maine has a vehicle inspection law, if a dealership loses it's Inspection Station license, they're screwed. If I can manage to pull off buying a new 09 SERG in Maine, it will retain the stock exhaust until I see how harda$$ the MSP is on this issue.

B B

Buncha commies up there huh! Can't even go 93 in peace anymore!!! >:( :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Iglide on October 10, 2008, 10:40:00 PM

One would hope that after 8,000 posts, somebody would have figured me out by now.



B B

Enough Said.... Now Let It Go!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 11, 2008, 07:50:17 AM
Actually yes. My friends the Reynolds family that owns Big Moose H-D and Augusta H-D tells me they get reminded on a regular basis by the Maine State Police regarding Maine law on the subject. Since Maine has a vehicle inspection law, if a dealership loses it's Inspection Station license, they're screwed. If I can manage to pull off buying a new 09 SERG in Maine, it will retain the stock exhaust until I see how harda$$ the MSP is on this issue.

You are right about Maine.  They have a strict Motorcycle inspection program, but they do not test the actual emissions.  Their inspection criteria is designed to fail bikes that have illegal exhaust installed.  Items such as installing True Duals, straight pipes, running without baffles, etc. would be caught in a second.  I would bet many bikers install street legal slip-ons before an inspection and use something else afterwords.   

Here's a couple of links to read through:

This one has the inspection details for Motorcycle exhaust:
http://ubm-usa.org/PDF/Unit%203%20Page%209.pdf

This is the main page that has all 15 pages of the Maine Motorcycle Inspection requirements!
http://www.ubm-usa.org/inspection.html

FWIW, you can legitimately title a vehicle in another state, which circumvents the Maine state inspection laws.  You would then have to follow the laws of the state in which it is titled in.  There are companies like this one in Montana that enable you to title the vehicle in their state and get out of sales tax as well as emissions testing requirements: 

http://www.mtvehicles.com/

And before we get into the conspiracy thing again...Yes titling a vehicle in another state is legal!  A corporation/LLC/LLP/etc. is formed that owns it.  The corp is registered to do business in the state where the vehicle is registered and co's like Deer Creek handle all of the required paperwork. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 11, 2008, 12:28:03 PM
Enough Said.... Now Let It Go!

Let what go ?

 Huh ??????????????

Just posting away as usual. Do you do the above to Howie, d00d, and a 100 other members that have Sienfeld posts ?


B B


PS
     Jim
          I bought a 97 Caddy Deville in super shape to leave in Maine. I am registering it in Maine to the address of the summer home on Sebago Lake because California says I have to bring it back here and have it smogged to register it even if it never sees CA. Maine on the other hand will allow a seasonal resident to register a vehicle. Your post however has me thinking I will register the new H-D in Cal even though it will stay in Maine since there is no smog test yet on motorcycles in CA. Not sure, but I don't think Maine can hold a vehicle with out of state plates to their inspection standards - - - can they ?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on October 11, 2008, 12:41:46 PM
Let what go ?

 Huh ??????????????

Just posting away as usual. Do you do the above to Howie, d00d, and a 100 other members that have Sienfeld posts ?



B B


PS
     Jim
          I bought a 97 Caddy Deville in super shape to leave in Maine. I am registering it in Maine to the address of the summer home on Sebago Lake because California says I have to bring it back here and have it smogged to register it even if it never sees CA. Maine on the other hand will allow a seasonal resident to register a vehicle. Your post however has me thinking I will register the new H-D in Cal even though it will stay in Maine since there is no smog test yet on motorcycles in CA. Not sure, but I don't think Maine can hold a vehicle with out of state plates to their inspection standards - - - can they ?


HeHe!!! i was wondering WTF he meant too!!! But I "just let it go!" ;D

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Texas 103 on October 11, 2008, 02:39:58 PM
FTC!!! You guys are funny! Just cause you don't drill em out, doesn't mean ya ain't violating something with every set of pipes A/C and dyno tune ya'll have been doing for years!!! Now ya GAS about drilling cats?!! Funny stuff!!! FTC!!! :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:

Hoist! 8)




AMEN>>FTC...
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 11, 2008, 08:55:48 PM
Maine on the other hand will allow a seasonal resident to register a vehicle. Your post however has me thinking I will register the new H-D in Cal even though it will stay in Maine since there is no smog test yet on motorcycles in CA. Not sure, but I don't think Maine can hold a vehicle with out of state plates to their inspection standards - - - can they ?

Maine cannot enforce local inspection standards on out of state registered bikes.  Where the bike is titled determines emissions, inspection, taxes, etc.  States only have the power to prevent people from getting their new vehicle registration if they don't comply with inspection laws.  This is not an issue if you get you are titled in and get your license from another state. 

The only thing states can nail people on is use tax.  Use tax is imposed when a vehicle is primarily used in the state even though it is registered out of state.  The New England states are notorious for this since many New Yorkers have summer homes and keep vehicles up there.  You should check out the Mane Use and Sales tax laws before taking a vehicle into the state for long term use.  The fines can be outrageous (in some cases more than the bike costs).  FYI, many states have a 3-6 month out of state exemption.  If the vehicle is based out of state for the grace period you can the bring it into the state without paying the tax. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Twolanerider on October 11, 2008, 09:18:50 PM

Your post however has me thinking I will register the new H-D in Cal even though it will stay in Maine since there is no smog test yet on motorcycles in CA. Not sure, but I don't think Maine can hold a vehicle with out of state plates to their inspection standards - - - can they ?


If it's a 49 state bike you wouldn't be able to register it in California Brian. At least not until it got 7500 miles on it.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: SPIDERMAN on October 11, 2008, 09:55:04 PM
If it's a 49 state bike you wouldn't be able to register it in California Brian. At least not until it got 7500 miles on it.

Didn't think of that. So much for getting LD to Maine in the spring and the new bike out here next fall

B B
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on October 17, 2008, 06:46:44 AM
well Jim, i have been following your antics for a bit now and I thank you for supplying the Knowledge. I too have an 09 FLTRSE3, but mine is the stardust/pewter model. My 2" fullsacs came yesterday and tonight we wrench. but my Q is if I don't drill the cats now can I do just as ez later. I got a big ride tomorrow and i don't want to start something I can't finish tonight.
Also, if, and when I core the cats out, what are the chances I'll need a fuel Management system? Pulled the plugs at 1200 and they looked great, but I want to change to NGK. my thoughts are cut the cats, run for 1k, then re-look at the plugs.
My reflectors are gone except for that one on the tail, I have also install a factory H-D CB module. the module fits nice, the wires, not so ez.
I am originally from Chicago, south side, but now Im in Tennessee. wanna buy a snow shovel and some rock salt?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 17, 2008, 01:29:06 PM
well Jim, i have been following your antics for a bit now and I thank you for supplying the Knowledge. I too have an 09 FLTRSE3, but mine is the stardust/pewter model. My 2" fullsacs came yesterday and tonight we wrench. but my Q is if I don't drill the cats now can I do just as ez later. I got a big ride tomorrow and i don't want to start something I can't finish tonight.

You can drill the cat at any time.  I did my cat first and then the exhaust, but others have done it the other way.  Not a problem one way or the other.  Just adds a bit more work since you have to pull the right exhaust pipe twice. 

Also, if, and when I core the cats out, what are the chances I'll need a fuel Management system? Pulled the plugs at 1200 and they looked great, but I want to change to NGK. my thoughts are cut the cats, run for 1k, then re-look at the plugs.

The O2 sensor will cover you in closed loop mode when you make changes like this.  Closed loop is somewhere between 3000/4000 RPM and below.  I would not run it hard or do wide open throttle (WOT) until you have had some sort-of tuning done to the bike. 

I am originally from Chicago, south side, but now Im in Tennessee. wanna buy a snow shovel and some rock salt?

Chicago is great, but the winters not so great.  I need more than a shovel.  More like a big 4x4 with a plow! 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Iglide on October 17, 2008, 10:30:09 PM
Larry B,

After the cat drill, and with stock ECU settings, do not linger more than 5-10 min in idle. Even with the canned down load map from the SERT, my bike was way lean in idle rpm range. It is my understanding that idle is outside the closed loop mode and O2 sensor control. I let mine idle for 15-20 min and it foamed and boiled the oil in the crankcase. Temps can exceed 300 deg F. Don't lug it around below 2500 rpm, shift higher; in this cooler weather you will be OK as long as you use your common sense. With a good tune the engine idle can be corrected and the temps reduced by making the mix a little more rich.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on October 19, 2008, 08:16:28 AM
Well I decided to hold off just for a bit. I will do the baffles this week but am going to wait on the cats until I can schedule a SERT install & Dyno. way too much at risk if I damage it. I changed the plugs to a NGK, cooler one, say 5degrees to check on the lean issue. V&H sent me a custom map for a Fuelpak but these are tricks and you know, tricks are for kids. So I figure SE=SE.
Yesterday was beautiful for riding in TN, the sleeping beast is waiting to arise.  :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on October 20, 2008, 06:23:30 AM
Stopped at a local dealership, old friend of mine named Bubba, how can you go wrong with that. He was drooling over my bike. End result was, do whatever you want, but after you drill out the cats bring it in for a super tuner and dyno. he said not to wait long as he has seen problems when people wait TILL they have problems, and then bring it in. He said the whole kit and kaboodle would be about 1k. And he is the only dealer in TN certified to do it so far.
But the Fullsacs are a GO this week.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 20, 2008, 09:22:41 AM
Stopped at a local dealership, old friend of mine named Bubba, how can you go wrong with that. He was drooling over my bike. End result was, do whatever you want, but after you drill out the cats bring it in for a super tuner and dyno. he said not to wait long as he has seen problems when people wait TILL they have problems, and then bring it in. He said the whole kit and kaboodle would be about 1k. And he is the only dealer in TN certified to do it so far.
But the Fullsacs are a GO this week.

Bubba knows best!  He is right.  Best to do the SERT as soon as possible.  The bikes are engineered to run way too lean.  They need more fuel to stay cool and run properly. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LETS_ROLL on October 22, 2008, 11:28:56 PM
Jim, what's the part # for the correct Race Tuner that will fit on our bikes? Want to order one on-line but need the part # and I don't want to srew it up and get a wrong model 9If there is such a thing.  Let's Roll
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Jim Kerr on October 23, 2008, 07:10:39 AM
Jim, what's the part # for the correct Race Tuner that will fit on our bikes? Want to order one on-line but need the part # and I don't want to srew it up and get a wrong model 9If there is such a thing.  Let's Roll

You need to order these parts form a H-D dealer:

32109-08A - Super SERT Race Tuner
32111-09 - Version 2 of the tuner software
32184-08 - Cable Kit for SE Pro Super Tuner

32111-09 is a computer program that is loaded on a laptop.  It is used to program your bikes electronic fuel injection/ignition system.  The 32109-08A SERT is a protocol converter that is used to convert your bikes ECM (Electronic Control Module) language to one your computer can understand.  The cables are what is used to connect everything together.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LETS_ROLL on October 23, 2008, 09:38:59 PM
You need to order these parts form a H-D dealer:

32109-08A - Super SERT Race Tuner
32111-09 - Version 2 of the tuner software
32184-08 - Cable Kit for SE Pro Super Tuner

32111-09 is a computer program that is loaded on a laptop.  It is used to program your bikes electronic fuel injection/ignition system.  The 32109-08A SERT is a protocol converter that is used to convert your bikes ECM (Electronic Control Module) language to one your computer can understand.  The cables are what is used to connect everything together.

Thanks, Let's Roll
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: JMS on October 26, 2008, 01:12:33 PM
This is a nice post thanks
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: grit on November 18, 2008, 05:41:36 PM
This thread has been so useful. Big thanks to all of you. Now with my newly acquired knowledge the Local H-D Service Manager will think I'm really smart!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 18, 2008, 09:13:14 PM
Okay, I read every word in this long post and I don't recall seeing anywhere how much the Fullsac cores cost.  On their website, the only options I saw were send in your mufflers, buy some already modified, or buy some other muffler that they have, and I don't remember if they mentioned '09's or not.  So, how much are they?  I assume you have to call them to go this route.  Also, it looked like they were recommending the 1 3/4" and the 2" if your motor was built up.  Would the 110" be considered built up?  Very nice write up by the way.  It's broken down step by step and it looks pretty easy when proper instructions are there.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: hdbrad03 on November 18, 2008, 09:16:43 PM
$107.00 for 1 3/4" baffles plus $18.00 shipping. Best dollars I have ever spent on a Harley!

 :bananarock: :bananarock:
     Brad
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 18, 2008, 09:18:00 PM
hate to ask...is that for the pair or each?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fired00d on November 18, 2008, 09:19:58 PM
Okay, I read every word in this long post and I don't recall seeing anywhere how much the Fullsac cores cost.  On their website, the only options I saw were send in your mufflers, buy some already modified, or buy some other muffler that they have, and I don't remember if they mentioned '09's or not.  So, how much are they?  I assume you have to call them to go this route.  Also, it looked like they were recommending the 1 3/4" and the 2" if your motor was built up.  Would the 110" be considered built up?  Very nice write up by the way.  It's broken down step by step and it looks pretty easy when proper instructions are there.
Take a look at this thread - Fullsac Performance (http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=27481.0) for contact information and discount to CVOHarley members.

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: ultracobbie on November 18, 2008, 11:30:56 PM
I just finished installing the Fullsac 2.25" baffles and I got to say they are frickin awesome.  Cost me $141.10 shipped.  Very easy to do thanks to Jim Kerr's step by step illustrated instructions.  It's kind of late here so I couldn't open my garage door when I fired her up but you can bet I will let her loose tomorow after the 2 LEO's go to work.

Steve   :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Zipper104 on November 19, 2008, 12:04:22 AM
That's for the pair.

Z

hate to ask...is that for the pair or each?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 19, 2008, 03:31:50 AM
I just finished installing the Fullsac 2.25" baffles and I got to say they are frickin awesome.  Cost me $141.10 shipped.  Very easy to do thanks to Jim Kerr's step by step illustrated instructions.  It's kind of late here so I couldn't open my garage door when I fired her up but you can bet I will let her loose tomorow after the 2 LEO's go to work.

Steve   :2vrolijk_21:

Have you done anything else to your exhaust or engine yet?  Did you remove the Cat Conv?  I think this is the first time I saw 2.25" mentioned.  Are they louder or deeper than the smaller diameter?  I wish I had someone local with these pipes that I could hear.  I really liked the V&H True Dual Long Shots on my last bike, but I think the volume was a bit excessive.  This sounds like a very inexpensive route to and it would also give me the satisfaction of knowing that I did them myself.  Does going with the bigger size cut back on back pressure?  I have so many questions.  BTW, nice bike...looks like the one in my garage.  Nice choice.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 19, 2008, 03:37:46 AM
I just finished installing the Fullsac 2.25" baffles and I got to say they are frickin awesome.  Cost me $141.10 shipped.  Very easy to do thanks to Jim Kerr's step by step illustrated instructions.  It's kind of late here so I couldn't open my garage door when I fired her up but you can bet I will let her loose tomorow after the 2 LEO's go to work.

Steve   :2vrolijk_21:

I just found the thread on the 2.25" Fullsacs and that answered my questions, or at least some of them.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: ultracobbie on November 19, 2008, 10:08:55 PM
Have you done anything else to your exhaust or engine yet?  Did you remove the Cat Conv?  I think this is the first time I saw 2.25" mentioned.  Are they louder or deeper than the smaller diameter?  I wish I had someone local with these pipes that I could hear.  I really liked the V&H True Dual Long Shots on my last bike, but I think the volume was a bit excessive.  This sounds like a very inexpensive route to and it would also give me the satisfaction of knowing that I did them myself.  Does going with the bigger size cut back on back pressure?  I have so many questions.  BTW, nice bike...looks like the one in my garage.  Nice choice.

The only other thing I've done is remove the cc.   I'm very happy with the 2.25 baffles.  A friend has the Rinehart true duals on his 110 SE and these sound just as good and as loud.   When I removed my baffles the insulation came out with them and I left it out.  My next step is to do the SERT.  The picture shows my old baffles and insulation.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 19, 2008, 10:13:04 PM
I can't find anywhere to get the coring bit to remove the cat converter.  I would like to get all of this done at one time and then take the bike to the shop for calibration.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on November 20, 2008, 05:18:47 AM
Harbor Freight
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 20, 2008, 10:14:51 AM
I checked their website and couldn't find it there.  They have a store near me.  I thought I would stop in and see if they might have it.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 20, 2008, 10:29:24 AM
I just called Harbor Freight and was told that they don't carry anything like that.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 21, 2008, 07:09:41 PM
I ordered my Fullsac's and I have core bit coming, so I'm starting to prep the bike.  I have the right muffler off and I'm at the stage to take the endcap off.  Any suggestions on how to get that endcap off?  I'm not having any luck with getting it to break loose at all.  (YES, I have all 3 screws removed already).  Everything else is going as planned thus far.  I figured I should be able to have both mufflers ready to insert the new core in yet tonight...if I can figure out how to get the endcaps off.

Any help?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: guppytrash on November 21, 2008, 07:59:43 PM
Just take your time with the end caps.  They are tight but you can get them loose by hand...use your open palm and give it a wack.  Rock it back and forth they will come off...I did not use any tools just your hands so you don't scratch.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 12:32:39 AM
I got the endcaps off.  I am very sorry that I ever decided to go forward with this project.  I have just spent over 4 hrs trying to grind out the welds in one muffler.  Neither one is done and I now have a hole in my muffler where I ground through it.  Luckily, the hole is going to be on the absolute bottom side of the muffler and should be past the end of where the new pipe will go.  I'm still not happy about this.  I'd like to know exactly what Dremel tool was used for this.  It is very difficult to get the tool down in there to work in the first place and I am grinding and grinding and not seeing the light of day. 

What Dremel attachment are you guys using?  I am trying with a 9901 Tungsten Carbide Cutter  http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=73390-353-9901-03&lpage=none (http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=73390-353-9901-03&lpage=none)
What should I be using?  I am getting to the point where I'll be trying to sell some Fullsac's and a coring bit and spend a fortune on some aftermarket complete system.  If I sound frustrated, I am.  HELP!

Please, someone answer that isn't guessing.  I've noticed very quickly that just because people on here receive an e-mail about a posting, they think they have to give an answer.  You have only received an e-mail because you checked off "Notify me of replies".  That doesn't mean that you know the answer.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on November 22, 2008, 04:30:53 AM
Let me say that patience is a virtue; catch it if you can; seldom in a woman, never in a man.
When I did mine, I left the mufflers on the bike to grind the welds, made it more stable to work with. I had the bike up on the lift. Ez view into the muffler. With the dremel I used the small grinding wheel. got it at Home Depot. ground it till it looked close the tapped it backwards just a bit to release. weld broke away and then I ground away the remaining weld on the muffler to make removal of the baffle EZ.
As you grind the weld, use a back and forth motion with the Dremel. Don't let it stay in one spot or you'll.........never mind.
It took me under 2 hours to do both of mine. How mechanically inclined are you?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 07:30:34 AM
What grinding wheel did you use?  Do you know a part number or the exact "Dremel" part description? 

I followed the instructions step by step, but again the question mark in the original instructions became which particular dremel tool did he use that he was able to get in there and make it work.  They make a lot of different tools, as you know.  The one that I tried actually is shaped like a drill bit (if you checked the photo at the hyperlink I provided) and you cannot get it fit down in there parallel to the muffler shell, because it is not long enough and the bit holder will then hit the back end of the muffler.  You have to come at it from angles and then it acts more like a drill bit by only catching the weld with the tip of the bit.  In doing so, it jumps around on contact.

I'm quite capable of doing this type of job, however as is the case with many procedures, you can extend great efforts and never accomplish anything if you aren't using the correct tool.  If the welds were a 1/2" closer to the end of the pipe, I wouldn't be asking, as I'd have no problems getting it done with the tool I have here.  I tried several times to not put the bit the entire way into the dremel, but it loosens and falls out of the holder very quickly, so I'm obviously at that point where I am seeking help from those who have already been through this.  When I look at the photo that Jim provided for this step, it looks like his bit extends further out of the dremel than mine will, and I do not know how to rectify the situation.

Larry, let me say that I am obviously being very patient with the process...working 4 hours straight on one weld...but at some point you do have to get to a frustration point where you know that you are doing something wrong and you need to ask for some experienced assistance.  I really don't want to put any more holes in my muffler.  I think the one I did put in it already is in a really good spot, if there is such a thing.

Back to the original question...What specific dremel grinding wheel did you use?  Thanks!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on November 22, 2008, 09:10:54 AM
HI, you have really expended a lot of effort, I used the same dremel bit that you purchased, I did before starting practice on an old muffler I had laying around, You need a lot of light, and you need to stay away from the muffler body I just let the bit follow the contour of the lip on the old baffle when it was flat I took the muffler and dropped the opposite end onto a piece of carpet on the floor the impact broke what was left of the remaining weld and moved the baffle inward about 1/16 of an inch I cleaned up what weld was left and removed the baffle, I really dont think it took an hour and I spent lot less time on the second muffler, It sounds like your working in the dark, its just like an operating room you cant have to much light. the bit your using is fine.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 12:27:45 PM
Well, I decided to go at it again this morning.  The first thing I did was drop it by the other end on some carpet in the garage.  What do you know?  It broke free.  Within minutes I had the guts out of that muffler.  I'm celebrating and taking a break now before I start on muffler #2.  I guess I had it last night and just needed a little encouragement today.  Once the welds were broken free, it came out real easy.  I assume I will be better at this for the 2nd one.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on November 22, 2008, 12:39:45 PM

Good Deal, like most jobs the first time takes considerably longer, a dremel is a wonderful tool but at 35,000 rpms a slip can be costly.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 12:55:24 PM
Geez, I was hoping that noone would point out that Dremel tools are dangerous.  I was trying to forget that aspect of this.  Anyway, Dartman...do you play darts or what?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on November 22, 2008, 01:20:12 PM
Yes, naturally I would excell at something that does not pay well, I do get a number of free shots on league night however,
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 01:26:56 PM
I used to be on the Arachnid Pro List, but I just don't get out to play much anymore.  I still have a Scorpion dart machine in my basement that doesn't get turned on too much either.  I bought it from a local vendor that was going through some tough times.  I play steel and plastic, and I still get e-mails and phone calls for all the local events, but I just never show up anymore.  I don't think I want to find out just how out of practice I really am.  Well, back to the garage to move on to muffler #2.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on November 22, 2008, 03:01:42 PM
I can relate, advanceing years tend to take the fun out of such activities, I always wanted a scorpion but a dozen years ago they were selling for a couple of grand so I settled for a decent wall mount, The pub where I played for years clo and I pretty much phased out, I substitute occasionally for a friend but without frequent practice ive lost my edge,advise how that second baffle turns out.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 04:49:08 PM
Well, so far, I have matching mufflers.  I put a hole in the 2nd one in the exact same spot.  Both are on the dead bottom on the muffler and from measuring, it looks like they are less than 1/16th inch from the spot where I need to drill a hole anyway to bolt the Fullsac in.  I think by the time I drill my hole there, it will get rid of the 2nd hole in the process.

This 2nd muffler is going no better than the first.  I have a problem with the Dremel whereas I can't get the bit tightened well enough...there is a problem with the lock mechanism... so the bit keeps coming loose or falling out.  I'm going to take it back tomorrow, since I just bought it recently. 

Anyway, I've got plenty of time to complete this stage, since my Fullsac's probably won't be here until the end of next week and my core bit hasn't arrived to do the cat converter either.  Looks like I'm making this into a full-time long-term project.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: DonT on November 22, 2008, 07:08:58 PM
I just did mine on 08 SERK, put in 2" cores used the 1/4 x 1/4 inch Brown Cylinder Grinding Stone, 1/8 inch shank took about 10 minutes each weld.  just laid the flat side of the grinding stone against the inside muffler body and pushed the end of the grinding stone against the weld.  Used a short pipe and a hammer to drive out the baffle from the header end of the muff..  Took a few solid taps of the hammer on the pipe.


Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 08:02:13 PM
I'm not going to do any more until I exchange this Dremel for one that works properly and I'll pick up one of those cylinder grinders while I'm at it.  Thanks DonT.  If I can get it to do the job quickly, then I'll spread the word.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on November 22, 2008, 08:46:14 PM
Sorry I had to be away, I could have helped more earlier. Did not use a bitI used the same as DonT. Grinding wheel. Cleaned the slag off with it and then a sanding drum in the dremel. Did you do this job with the mufflers on or off. much easier on and the scoot up on the jackstand.
I may be re-installing the insulation, heard that it will direct the "potato" to the rear instead of it dissipating to the sides and rear. So don't trash yours yet.
Enough beverages during this process helps.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 22, 2008, 09:52:37 PM
I actually just posted a bit ago in another thread that I spoke with Steve at Fullsac and he suggested not removing the insulation.  He said with the insulation the sound is not quite as loud, but sounds great.  He said that if you remove the insulation, the sound gets a little tinny.

I'm actually working on the mufflers with them laying on a shelf that is about chest high and I have a overhead flourescent lights and a drag light mounted in direct line with the subject area.  I don't think I could get better positioning to do the job.

I'm going to try the grinding wheel tomorrow.  I'm sure I could finish with the bit I'm using, but I'd rather try to see what works better between the two, so I can pass that info along. 

I really appreciate the input from you guys.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: DonT on November 23, 2008, 07:03:05 PM
I just sat on my second step on my garage walk-up ,set the muff (standing up) on a piece of carpet. put the muffs between my legs, put the work about 1' from my face.  To save allot of work on the welds, just ground what was overlapping the baffle plate and the muff, not the weld on the baffle plate.  Here is a pic of the Dremel I used, you have the bit from previous post.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 23, 2008, 08:43:55 PM
I can get at it much better with the cylinder grinder.  I got one to break free, but can't seem to get the other side to break.  I took a break and I'll get it finished tonight or tomorrow.  No big rush here.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Zipper104 on November 23, 2008, 11:40:46 PM
I feel your pain. I used the same bit (9901?) and I wouldn't recommend it. I was about 40 minutes on the one side and less than 20 on the side I didn't spend the extra time punching a hole in it. Mine is at the top that will be hidden by the bag. I'm figuring some day to strip the chrome and do a repair and re-chrome 'em. That, or buy another set of stockers.

Z


I can get at it much better with the cylinder grinder.  I got one to break free, but can't seem to get the other side to break.  I took a break and I'll get it finished tonight or tomorrow.  No big rush here.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 24, 2008, 12:02:41 AM
I got the #932 Dremel tonight and it is much easier to use and get to the welds.  I haven't finished the other weld on my 2nd muffler yet, but I will get to it tomorrow and it will work for me.  The problem I am having with this weld is that the baffle was bent a little when they welded and left a gap between the baffle and the muffler, and the weld apparently filled the gap and that part I can't get at until it breaks free.  I'm assuming it will break free after I get about every little bit of what is exposed.  This baffle had gaps in areas all around the circumference.  A pretty crummy show of workmanship.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: grit on November 24, 2008, 04:46:12 PM
I also used a dremel with the first grinding bit i found in the case. Ground the 4 welds off in about 45 minutes ... working carefully of course. The bit is now shot but so what!  Did this very simple procedure early last week before even ordering the FullSac baffels. You see I keep everything so i had the stock mufflers off my old 07 seuc, which BTW I'm told, are the same as on the 09 seuc, so i ground the 07 mufflers first. I'm trying the 2.0' replacements baffels. OK, got to be honest here ... I also ruined the "chuck" in the dremel, because the bit shafts are so short,  :oops: but i can replace the "chuck" for very little cost. (I Hope) Are we having fun yet? ;)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on November 24, 2008, 07:17:25 PM
I got the mufflers apart and the baffles out.  Just awaiting my Fullsacs now and my coring bit got her today, so it's time to go work on the cat.  The grinding cylinder worked so much better for me.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 03, 2008, 04:49:40 PM
I received my Fullsac's finally...UPS took 12 days to get them here.  I installed them last night...what a breeze to put them in once you have everything ready to go...not even 10 minutes to have both mufflers done.  I took it to the shop today for my SERT download and went for a nice long ride.  I checked my phone a few hours after I left the shop.  There was a message from one of the salesmen at the dealer.  He wanted to let me know that he had just walked outside when I was leaving and that my pipes sound awesome.  He said there were 3 guys in the parking lot that came right over to him and asked what kind of pipes those were and that they wanted a set.  I already knew that I liked them when the mechanic took my bike for a test ride...I went outside to listen to him ride away.  I got the 2.25" and I left the insulation in the mufflers.  They have a nice deep tone, and plenty of volume, but not even close to obnoxiously loud.  I am really pleased with these, not only for the sound, but also they are quite a bargain compared to changing out the entire system, like I was planning.  I said somewhere in an earlier post that I would give an objective opinion, and believe me...I was not expecting to like these.  It was definitely worth the torture of grinding those welds out.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 03, 2008, 07:04:33 PM
Very Cool.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: cola on December 03, 2008, 08:17:20 PM
My 2" fullsac's came today. I ordered them Monday, 2 days. Helps to be only 225 miles from Havasu.
After talking to Steve on Monday I decided to cut my exhaust in half and remove the cat 100%. I get home yesterday and low & behold, full instructions with pictures.
Thanks, Mike
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Texas 103 on December 03, 2008, 08:41:46 PM
My 2" fullsac's came today. I ordered them Monday, 2 days. Helps to be only 225 miles from Havasu.
After talking to Steve on Monday I decided to cut my exhaust in half and remove the cat 100%. I get home yesterday and low & behold, full instructions with pictures.
Thanks, Mike

HELL YEA>>>>> Get that Power Robber out of there and let it breathe, I get my pipe  back tomorrow. What have you noticed, is it louder and did it hit harder, In other words what did the Azz Dyno say??? Thanks Greg
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: cola on December 03, 2008, 09:19:10 PM
I'm following you, I'm doing mine this weekend.
Mike
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Texas 103 on December 04, 2008, 08:40:40 AM
I'm following you, I'm doing mine this weekend.
Mike

Make sure you clean up the outlet end, I went in and cut the pipe on the left  a little and cleaned it up so I would have a better "divider" in the back. You'll see when you get there...Cant' wait to get mine back today I won't have it on the Dyno till this weekend sometime because of work and  while I have mine down, off comes the  cam cover and in goes a " Baisley Spring", best $12.95 you will ever invest in a Twin Cam, bumps the Oil Pressure up about 15%, I think it quiets 'em down a little but most importantly you will have good O.P. at a hot idle.... All Good>>>>P.M. me if you need any assistance>>>>Greg     
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on December 04, 2008, 08:43:50 AM
Make sure you clean up the outlet end, I went in and cut the pipe on the left  a little and cleaned it up so I would have a better "divider" in the back. You'll see when you get there...Cant' wait to get mine back today I won't have it on the Dyno till this weekend sometime because of work and  while I have mine down, off comes the  cam cover and in goes a " Baisley Spring", best $12.95 you will ever invest in a Twin Cam, bumps the Oil Pressure up about 15%, I think it quiets 'em down a little but most importantly you will have good O.P. at a hot idle.... All Good>>>>P.M. me if you need any assistance>>>>Greg     

Greg, did you check? I'm not sure you'll need that spring with these newer style oil pumps. That spring was designed for the earlier style OP's. Do they make a special one for the late model OP/camplate setup? :confused5:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 04, 2008, 09:01:33 AM
Okay gents, I think we need to get a little more scientific here.  We need to get someone to post their dyno results with mufflers and air cleaner and no change to the cc, someone with similar setup with upper half of the cc removed, and similar setup with the entire converter removed.  It will probably be difficult to find somone with the identical setup and each of the 3 cc situations, but it sure would answer some questions that we would all like to know.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Texas 103 on December 04, 2008, 10:06:40 AM
Greg, did you check? I'm not sure you'll need that spring with these newer style oil pumps. That spring was designed for the earlier style OP's. Do they make a special one for the late model OP/camplate setup? :confused5:

Hoist! 8)

 NO, but I will call Dan today ...I'm basing that on OP Guage readings and my experience with the other pumps...I may be all wet here, let me get some additional info..Thanks...Greg
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Texas 103 on December 04, 2008, 10:10:55 AM
Okay gents, I think we need to get a little more scientific here.  We need to get someone to post their dyno results with mufflers and air cleaner and no change to the cc, someone with similar setup with upper half of the cc removed, and similar setup with the entire converter removed.  It will probably be difficult to find somone with the identical setup and each of the 3 cc situations, but it sure would answer some questions that we would all like to know.

 The only question I'm going to answer is does make more power with all the Cat removed.... period end of report. Greg   
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fired00d on December 04, 2008, 10:14:09 AM
Okay gents, I think we need to get a little more scientific here.  We need to get someone to post their dyno results with mufflers and air cleaner and no change to the cc, someone with similar setup with upper half of the cc removed, and similar setup with the entire converter removed.  It will probably be difficult to find somone with the identical setup and each of the 3 cc situations, but it sure would answer some questions that we would all like to know.
The only way that will be good/relative/compatible information is if all the bikes were run on the same dyno with temps and relative humidity the same. Different dyno's will yield different numbers for the same bike.

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 04, 2008, 10:38:59 AM
I don't suppose we have anyone on this forum that has access to a dyno and the time to check it out.  All we need is someone to donate a stock exhaust when they switch out to aftermarket.  They could run with the stock pipes, then drill out the partial cc, run again, then get rid of the rest of the cc, and run again.  There would be our results on the same bike, with all other factors remaining equal...and a whole bunch of time eaten up by some kind soul...for the benefit of all of us around the world.  I think we would all find the results quite interesting.

I'm not saying that I have doubts that there would be some gains, the further the exhaust is opened up, but how much of a gain is the question that needs answered in order to determine just how far someone wants to go in the process.  Not everyone on here is going to be willing to do a lot of extra work to gain an unnoticeable 1 or 2 hp.  Some will do anything to squeeze every little bit they can, and others will be quite content with what they have if there isn't some sizeable gain.

If I am running with the partial cc removed, and it's proven that removal of the entire cc gets me from 92 hp to 93 or 94 hp, I don't think that I am willing to go to the work of cutting my exhaust pipe apart, removing the rest of the converter, and welding it back together.  If we are talking about another 5 to 8 hp, that might be enough of an argument to move more of us to action.

I would think that it would be much easier to get the pipes off a standard 09 model before cutting our apart.  There will soon be lots of stock systems sitting in peoples' garages once some of the aftermarket systems hit the market.  I'm assuming that the pipes off the 96" are the same size as ours, but just without the cc.  If not, then that shoots down my argument.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Texas 103 on December 04, 2008, 06:31:01 PM
Greg, did you check? I'm not sure you'll need that spring with these newer style oil pumps. That spring was designed for the earlier style OP's. Do they make a special one for the late model OP/camplate setup? :confused5:

Hoist! 8)

Hoist, Just got off the phone with Wes and he said,  As we know that the new pumps are much better with a higher volume. He said it sure wouldn't hurt anything , Texas summers, 100+ heat... Yea I'm going for it..... Greg.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hoist! on December 04, 2008, 08:03:55 PM
Hoist, Just got off the phone with Wes and he said,  As we know that the new pumps are much better with a higher volume. He said it sure wouldn't hurt anything , Texas summers, 100+ heat... Yea I'm going for it..... Greg.

Just checking Greg. Didn't think it was necessary. Just wanted to make sure it wouldn't hurt anything in the current system! :2vrolijk_21:

Hoist! 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 06:30:02 AM
In answer to your pic of the stock cores (http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28086.0;attach=92140)    http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28086.0;attach=92140 (http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28086.0;attach=92140)   
My guess ( tell me wether i am right please ) :
The emisssions ( coming from the front ) streaming into the cores , through the first ( half ) part of the cores and then streaming out the cores ( at the point where they are pressed together ) then streaming ( outside the cores but inside the slip-ons ) around to the other side of the cores that the emission is able to stream into the second half of the core ( at the point where it is pressed together ) to flow through and then out of the core .
Is this right how i do see the flow ?????
When yes , wouldn`t it be effective just to put out the stock cores , remove the insulation and put in the stock cores again , just fixed with the help of a metal ring by the endcaps ?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 07, 2008, 06:42:22 AM
And how would this be a benefit? It's the baffles and Cat that is the obstruction, not the insulation. Actually the insulation helps direct the sound out the rear, If the insulation is removed then the sound will dissipate out the sides and rear.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 07:04:02 AM
I thought that ( without insulation ) you would have a little better flow ( faster ) and a little bit better sound because the insulation does slow down the flow . And no loose of horse power because no loose of back pressure ? And still " stock " exhaust , not visible at the first for the police and not really too loud ( for Germany ) .
OK , bore a hole through the catalyst in addition will make the flow more better additional .
But here in Germany the police controls the exhaust by putting a bar into the mufflers and if the bar goes inside and has no stop then they know that there is a manipulation .


Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 07, 2008, 07:10:01 AM
hhmmmm. I'd move
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 07, 2008, 07:10:45 AM
When I spoke with Steve from Fullsac, he told me to leave the insulation in, as removing it will cause for a tinny sound.

It sounds like, from your last post, that you are trying to find a way to modify the stock baffle, so that you don't have a problem if the police try to put a bar in your exhaust.  I don't have the answer, but I thought maybe that interpretation might help someone else come up with an answer for you.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 07:43:19 AM
hhmmmm. I'd move

Muhuhuhahahha , that would solve the problem , yes .  :D
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 07:45:04 AM
When I spoke with Steve from Fullsac, he told me to leave the insulation in, as removing it will cause for a tinny sound.

It sounds like, from your last post, that you are trying to find a way to modify the stock baffle, so that you don't have a problem if the police try to put a bar in your exhaust.  I don't have the answer, but I thought maybe that interpretation might help someone else come up with an answer for you.

That`s good , just sorry about my bad english , THXS .  ::)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 07, 2008, 07:52:15 AM
You do much better than a lot of folks that speak only English.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 07, 2008, 08:10:00 AM
I might go ahead and do the hole mod and then drill and insert a bolt in the baffle to keep the cops stick from going any further.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on December 07, 2008, 10:38:28 AM
Larry, ive encountered that type of nightstick baffle check in the past, prior to installing mine I just ran a 1in self tapping screw through the baffle about 10 in inside the outlet.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 11:05:04 AM
That would be an idea ,
Perhaps there will be another good idea from someone , just wait and see who will have one .
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 07, 2008, 01:54:35 PM
Dartman, that's where my idea comes from. Have had to do many things to keep authorities off my six. Had to ride 21 in apes with the bracket just loose enough so as to pull the bars down to legal when the heat was on. If i remember the law said bottom of grips could be no higher than 17in above seat.
Hey I did some work years ago up in Evansville Wis. not far from you, Ya hey der
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 02:02:16 PM
" To put in the fulsac cores " isn`t this the same effect as if you would drill a hole through the baffles just from the endcaps in direction to the front . Then you would have exactly the same , but not such much work ? ( or is this wrong ) ??
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 07, 2008, 02:11:52 PM
Yes, that would be wrong.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 07, 2008, 02:13:15 PM
Tell me why please .
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on December 07, 2008, 03:20:52 PM
HJ, There are some good pictures of OEM baffles that have been removed somewhere on this forum, The OEM pipes have two overlapping tubes, the inlet tube ehausts toward the rear of the chamber reverses Direction and exits via the outlet tube opening at the front of the chamber. I have been tinkering with them and many other style baffles over the years, Hole saws, surveyors stakes, Cutting torches, Saws, shortning baffles , removing Cats, Etc and the best sound I have been able to achieve is a tinny,
chirping trashy sound,  Steve at Fullsac has put together a nice perforated baffle that fits our SE CVO pipes perfectly, Sound is very subjective, but to my old ears ,my 1 3/4,s have a nice muted rumble and sound as good or better then pipes  ive tried costing 5 times as much. IMHO there is no one muffler that can do it all, some sound better at idle, others while under a load, and some at x-way speeds, for a very minimal price the Fullsac cores rank very well.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 08, 2008, 01:28:46 AM
Wow . that`s an impressive collection you have , reeespect , guess you know what you are talking about  8) 8).
But what is the main difference between a fullsac core and the " stock-one drilled through " ?
Are the fullsac straight open from front to rear or do they have baffles too ?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 08, 2008, 07:38:44 AM
Oh now I see , in reply 14 ( step 15 ) of Jim Kerr`s description you can see how the baffles look inside ,
Is the core closed at the front end that the flow runs through these baffles from outside ,
 Could I see a pic of the whole fullsac-core ?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on December 08, 2008, 11:03:13 PM
Oh now I see , in reply 14 ( step 15 ) of Jim Kerr`s description you can see how the baffles look inside ,
Is the core closed at the front end that the flow runs through these baffles from outside ,
 Could I see a pic of the whole fullsac-core ?

There was actually a post on here a while back with pictures of all 3 sizes of Fullsac cores for comparison, but, I can't find it now......you can search back a bit, and maybe see them........
If anyone else can find the post?? maybe link it back??
I'll try this: http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=29910.msg485579#msg485579
Let me know if it works.

Thanks
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 09, 2008, 01:48:34 AM
That`s a good post , thxs .
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 09, 2008, 02:28:15 AM
Now, before you ask, those Fullsac's are wide open through the inside and the outside fits back into the surrounding fiberglass insulation of the muffler.  You can remove the fiberglass insulation, but if you do, the sound will be more tinny and lose some of the deep throatiness of the mufflers, and they would be a bit louder that way.  Suggestion is to leave the insulation in there.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on December 09, 2008, 02:49:55 AM
So the way of the flow is straight through ?
I do not check it , sorry .

Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 09, 2008, 03:03:39 AM
YES
Title: Fullsac Baffles on 08 SECU3
Post by: Techie0212 on December 09, 2008, 05:02:07 PM
Okay...Did the order for my 08SEUC3. Steve is very helpful and spent a little time to chit/chat. He's gonna fabricate me a fresh one and ship the 2.25 baffle to arrive on Friday. Awesome (Ikaikai in Hawaiian)...Not knowing what I don't know - it was very informative knowing Dyno numbers. A stock 96ci got 70hp and the 110ci got 80hp . . . not good considering the amount of coconuts spent on a CVO. The other tidbit is the louvers are from the same supplier as the HD Dyno venders (Was that okay to say???) anyways, alot more interesting stuff to come from Thunder Parts / Fullsac.

Aloha,
Techie
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 09, 2008, 05:47:30 PM
As much as I hate to do it, I found the best way to really appreciate your new Fullsac's is to let someone else get on a ride your bike away.  Then you get to hear what everyone else is hearing.  I also have the 2.25" and when the shop rode mine away for a test spin, I got pretty excited.  I told them that when they were done tuning it, and ready to take it for a test ride, I wanted to be outside to listen to the bike drive away.  Trust me, it will be music to your ears.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Spazz on December 09, 2008, 05:51:43 PM
Okay, it's been a while for you fellas with the Fulsacs. Do you still like them or would you change to the new V&H Power duals? My sister lives in Arizona and is going to come visit me for the holidays, do I ask her to bring a set with her or not? I am willing to spend on the V& H set up but if the same sound or perfomance can be achieved with the Fulsacs I will go that way. I don't have to worry about the c/c because Canadian bikes don't have them installed anyway.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 09, 2008, 05:59:44 PM
You can still get the V&H power duals and use the stock mufflers with Fullsac inserts.  The power duals only replace the exhaust pipes, not the mufflers.  Until otherwise proven by dyno results, at this time the power duals are pretty much the same as the stock system without the cat converter.  They have that fancy looking heat shield over the area where the converter is on our bikes, and school's still out on how that will look.  I'm not sure if I like the looks of it or not, and I'd like to see one in person before I am sure about that.  That area is supposed to be their power chamber, but again, until I see some dyno tests to prove it's any better than a convertless stock pipe, I'm holding back.  So, again to answer your actual question...the mufflers are not part of the Power Dual system and you still need to make a decision on the mufflers.  I already know that I am very happy with the Fullsac's, so that part of my bike is done.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 09, 2008, 06:37:19 PM
So, what's next?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 09, 2008, 06:42:03 PM
I think it's time to sample some suds and interview potential candidates for the back seat position on my bike.  That will determine communication device needs and luggage requirements.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Spazz on December 10, 2008, 09:14:46 AM
I guess i should have asked the question differently. Would you change the Fulsacs for slip ons or are you happy with the the pipes the way you have changed them. I didn't need the explanaition to the header pipes but I would have changed the entire system if I changed the muffler section.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Techie0212 on December 10, 2008, 10:15:01 AM
Depends on how much you want to invest in the bike. Because there are so many options, one doesn't fit everyone's ear. I would suggest talking with Fullsac owner - Steve George 928-505-2912 or steve@fullsac.com. He has a header true dual conversion set that is OEM compatible. He should send that out on the forum. BTW he really does have some interesting future products to offer in regards to getting better Dyno numbers....

Aloha,

Techie
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on December 10, 2008, 10:27:11 AM
I guess i should have asked the question differently. Would you change the Fulsacs for slip ons or are you happy with the the pipes the way you have changed them. I didn't need the explanaition to the header pipes but I would have changed the entire system if I changed the muffler section.

Everyone has their own idea what looks/sounds good to THEIR ears. Check out what your buddies are running and make your decision based on what YOU like. Power differences will probably not vary more than 1-3 HP for most popular slip-ons. Me, I like the looks of the stock CVO mufflers and have these on 2 of my bikes, one is true dual and the other is an stock '09 header, 2-1-2. Both have the core conversions, one is 2", the other is 1 3/4". I like the looks and sounds on both bikes, and seat of the pants performance is fine, no spitting, popping, surging or anything other than smooth riding. I hope this helps you a little in your decisions.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Spazz on December 10, 2008, 10:48:29 AM
I don't see the need to change the header pipes on a 2009. The 2 into 1 into 2 system works great. The true duals will kill power, not enhance it, especially true do to the Canadian bikes not having a c/c. If I went to the V&H system I would change to their 2 into 1 into 2 only to match the mufflers, the performance difference of thiers vs. H-D's would be minimal if anything. I guess you really answered my question anyway, The question I asked is; Now that you have had some time with ther Fullsac cores do you still like them or are you conteplating a change? I think you answered that you still like them.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on December 10, 2008, 01:01:08 PM
I don't see the need to change the header pipes on a 2009. The 2 into 1 into 2 system works great. The true duals will kill power, not enhance it, especially true do to the Canadian bikes not having a c/c. If I went to the V&H system I would change to their 2 into 1 into 2 only to match the mufflers, the performance difference of thiers vs. H-D's would be minimal if anything. I guess you really answered my question anyway, The question I asked is; Now that you have had some time with ther Fullsac cores do you still like them or are you conteplating a change? I think you answered that you still like them.

LOL..........yep! No complaints!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Indenial on December 10, 2008, 08:46:52 PM
Need a little help. I have seen Jim Kerr's video comparing the 1.75 with/without CC, but I can't find the site for the comparison of the 1.75 and the 2.0 baffles. Anyone know where it is? Thanks
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on December 10, 2008, 08:51:05 PM
youtube
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Techie0212 on December 12, 2008, 07:41:43 PM
In like FLINT . . .  Awesome delivery just when I thought it would come in, it was at my doorstep.  Thanks Steve. Got the bike all prepped with the baffles all removed. Now to have it ready for the weekend. Gonna be rainy here in Hawaii for the Marathon week, but who the hell cares when I can rumble with these 2.5 baffles.

More to come about the insert. I have to say that the toughest part of all was to remove the welds and make sure that there were no places in the exhaust tube to impede the removal. It is easy, but the experience to do that for a non mechanic is precious. A Carborundum disc is way better than the stone or the carbide. Much quicker.

Aloha, Techie
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 12, 2008, 07:44:16 PM
Putting them in is extremely easy.  Just slide them in to match your drilled hole, tighten the one bolt, and you are ready to put everything back together.  I am assuming you meant to say 2.25"...I don't think they make a 2.5".
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Techie0212 on December 12, 2008, 07:51:01 PM
TYPO - Had to look back and you're right...but the remedial part of placement is to put the baffle in the muffler, tighten screw. Then attach the heat shields and end pipe. Finally attach to the headers.  Correct?

Thanks,

Techie
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 12, 2008, 09:01:27 PM
Might take you ten minutes per side or so, but not a lot to it.  It makes it pretty easy, since you were the one that took it apart recently, so you know just where everything goes.  Toughest part for me was a little struggle getting one of the endcaps back on.  Believe me, if I can get this back together quickly, ANYONE can...I usually move a little slow in getting these things done.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Techie0212 on December 13, 2008, 10:57:56 AM
Got it all together and hit the switch. OMG. Can't hear the radio!!! This was in the garage and not the open air outside. I think it has to be louder than the 2:1 Thunderheader I had on my 2003 RoadKing. Might be thinking of going to the 1.75 instead. Then again, more air flow... The baffles look beefy from the rear... BTW the measurement for me was 1 2/8 instead of the suggested measurement. Found that out on the predrill preparations. I did leave in the fiberglass. To try again today and ride around the block. Still rainy conditions, but nothing falling down yet. Thanks again Steve @ Fullsac... I have shared this with my Waipahu HOG group...  :pineapple:

Aloha,

Techie
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 13, 2008, 11:22:01 AM
Got it all together and hit the switch. OMG. Can't hear the radio!!! This was in the garage and not the open air outside. I think it has to be louder than the 2:1 Thunderheader I had on my 2003 RoadKing. Might be thinking of going to the 1.75 instead. Then again, more air flow... The baffles look beefy from the rear... BTW the measurement for me was 1 2/8 instead of the suggested measurement. Found that out on the predrill preparations. I did leave in the fiberglass. To try again today and ride around the block. Still rainy conditions, but nothing falling down yet. Thanks again Steve @ Fullsac... I have shared this with my Waipahu HOG group...  :pineapple:

Aloha,

Techie

Are you sure you got the baffle seated the entire way into the muffler?  I had to stand my muffler up and drop it on the front end of the muffler several times before it seated in there the entire way.  I knew it was there once it matched up with the hole I had drilled.  Nobody else has mentioned a difference in the measurement to drill the hole and it was about right on for me.  Also, you were in the garage when you started it up.  It should sound a lot louder in the garage.  Better back it outside.  They have some tone to them but I don't think they are that loud.  Certainly not enough to drown out the stereo
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Techie0212 on December 13, 2008, 05:06:13 PM
Spun it around the block and loved it since. Stereo is fine. The look is beefy from the tail pipes. Heat buildup from the pipes are less even with Xied hooked up. This is in shorts, and sandals. Best 20 min ride.

Aloha,

Techie
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Spazz on December 15, 2008, 10:34:25 AM
I got this reply last week under the topic heading "Total removal of our Cats 09"

Spazz, I have dissected just about every brand of muffler ever made. V&H Bassani ,S&S, Cobra, Wild Pigs, Rush, Supertrapp, SE,Samson, ETC, IMHO other then Supertrapp With there Tuneable Discs, And the tuneable Bub Mufflers there is very little difference, In Muffler baffles, in fact some of the major Brand baffles will interchange, I am not a performance addict but many of my friends are, and from most dyno runs  Ive seen, it takes one awesome engine to support 2.25 baffles without a noticeable loss of low end torque, 3 additional HP at 5800 rpms is ok for bragging rights but not at the loss of 5 hp at 3000 rpms ,sometimes less is more.

Has anyone else experience power loss with the installation of the 2.25" cores?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on December 18, 2008, 07:03:09 PM
I just started my bike and put my hand behind each muffler.  There is plenty coming out of the right side, but the left side has VERY little exhaust being routed that way.  I keep thinking that you could plug the left side pipe right where it makes the little bend out of the cat converter chamber, and then slip the left pipe back on and leave it as a dummy pipe.  Anyone have thoughts on what this might accomplish?  It seems as though it would turn the system into a 2 into 1.  Would that yield any positive results?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on December 18, 2008, 08:52:33 PM
I just started my bike and put my hand behind each muffler.  There is plenty coming out of the right side, but the left side has VERY little exhaust being routed that way.  I keep thinking that you could plug the left side pipe right where it makes the little bend out of the cat converter chamber, and then slip the left pipe back on and leave it as a dummy pipe.  Anyone have thoughts on what this might accomplish?  It seems as though it would turn the system into a 2 into 1.  Would that yield any positive results?

Take a look at your stock mufflers, if they are like mine there is less restriction on the left than on the right. The internal baffles are totally different from left to right. I noticed when running the stock system there was equal pulses from each side. Like you, when replacing the mufflers and/or baffles, you would PROBABLY notice more from the right side (path of least resistance). Not a big deal, as you will probably get enough flow with your new setup. Enjoy the sound!
I think most of us are waiting to see a dyno comparison from the stock to the fullsac's to V&H or whatever.....I still believe you will not see much more than a 5-9HP difference with just muffler changes.
Have you taken the bike for a run? Notice any changes in sound?? Pleasant or annoying?? I think you will like them!
But, to answer your question, I would not plug off the crossover to the left pipe. I don't think you would gain anything.
Mike
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HDDOCFL on January 04, 2009, 08:49:08 AM
Talking to two local dealers about muffler changes and both say they will honor the warrinty with any muffler changes, but will not with any mods to the cats on the CVO bikes, or any tunning devices witch they do not install, so for me it looks like my options are limited as I want the warrinty in to stay in tack. I plan on the Fullsac 2 1/4" baffles and if they are not what I want will add the super trapp disc set up to them to quiet them down and If I notice any drop in power also due to lack of back pressure, but I assume with the cats in place I will not have a back pressure problem. I await nightriders 09 ideas and hope he has something like the XIEDs for the 09 110" motors as these leave not trace that they were on the bike.  Thanks Doc
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: nautilus on April 12, 2009, 10:53:35 AM
Thanks to everyone on this thread who has contributed to the "do's and don'ts" and "tips and tricks".

I'm not a Wrench yet, but I do believe I'm on my way...   I just removed my entire exhaust all by myself without scratching or damaging anything  :bananarock:

Monday I'll be ordering the 2" cores from Fullsac along with a Master Tune. Soon enough I'll be good to go.

Question:  When I removed my header pipes, I also removed the compressed gasket seal that inserts between the header pipes and engine.  The gaskets were silver in color.  I had seen them colored copper before... Is there a difference in quality and is there a specific p/n that might be suggested..?

Thanks again All!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 09 S/T FLTRSE3 on April 12, 2009, 02:08:38 PM
Talking to two local dealers about muffler changes and both say they will honor the warrinty with any muffler changes, but will not with any mods to the cats on the CVO bikes, or any tunning devices witch they do not install, so for me it looks like my options are limited as I want the warrinty in to stay in tack. I plan on the Fullsac 2 1/4" baffles and if they are not what I want will add the super trapp disc set up to them to quiet them down and If I notice any drop in power also due to lack of back pressure, but I assume with the cats in place I will not have a back pressure problem. I await nightriders 09 ideas and hope he has something like the XIEDs for the 09 110" motors as these leave not trace that they were on the bike.  Thanks Doc

That's insane. So if you put a D&D 2 into 1 or a set of Reinhart true duals on your bike it will void the warranty? That's just nuts! Before you make a decision, you should speak to a few more dealers. Their policies all differ greatly. In this area there are those that say any mods except mufflers will void warranty, and others that will allow different headers, cams, throttle bodies, etc without voiding.

I switched out the 09 cat headpipe for an 09 non cat, installed 2" Fullsacs, and downloaded the generic SESRT map for my application myself. I am going to take it to a local dealer for tuning / dyno, but they are aware of the mods I have made and my warranty will not be effected. Shop around.

Cheers, Ken  8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on April 12, 2009, 03:07:07 PM
Mpst dealers don't even know that there are cats in the exhaust pipes.  Assuming your dealer knows they are there, ask them why it's okay to change the mufflers, since the previous models had the cats in the mufflers themselves.  It sounds like they were okay with that.  As far as the Fullsac 2 1/4" baffles, I don't think you will need the Super Trapp disc setup to quiet them down.  They aren't that loud.  If you think you will want them any quieter, get a smaller size Fullsac.  That will give you a little more back pressure and even less volume.  They sound great, but I don't think anyone considers them to be loud.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: gordy on April 12, 2009, 11:06:34 PM
Spazz-has anyone informed you that the Canadian CVO's have catalytic converter material in the headpipe?
Bribe and I know that the SERG's have.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on April 13, 2009, 05:50:17 AM
Spazz-has anyone informed you that the Canadian CVO's have catalytic converter material in the headpipe?
Bribe and I know that the SERG's have.
Not so sure. Aren't the Canadian bikes the same as all international models? just pull the right side muffler and look inside the head pipe
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: jamesrgarner on April 13, 2009, 08:41:48 AM
I finally got my done Friday and rode 350 Saturday; it made an amazing difference in power and sound.  Now I've got to do something about a tune - I'm thinking about going with a super sert. 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: ragrep on April 13, 2009, 12:54:14 PM
Feedback on the intall-

Fullsac performance are great people. They spent plenty of time on the phone going over the attributes of their product. It's a quality piece too- nice welds, and the baffle design looks impressive. Saturday I removed the stock baffles and installed 2" Fullsac baffles. Following the Fullsac directions- the job was fairly simple- the only time consuming part was being patient enough to carefully grind the welds completely to get them to break loose- you dont want to go too far too fast. I set the pipe on a block of wood and tapped the old baffle forward into the pipe a bit to get the welds to break loose, then turned it over and set the pipe bewteen two blocks of wood, used a 3/4" x 12" extension with  a 1-1/8 inch impact socket- placed it down in the opening until it hit the top of the baffle and gave it a few taps, and it quickly worked its way out.

Fullsacs instructions say to drill the baffle mounting hole 1-1/2 inches from the end of the pipe, and the instructions in the post say 1-3/8 inches. I used the 1-1/2 inch mounting and they fit fine.  Note- I didnt like the look of the mounting bolt & nut that fullsac sends, so I used a stainless 1/4 inch buttonhead- it forms to the pipe nicely and the finished look is a little nicer, more factory looking than a chunky hex head bolt on the underside of the pipe

I also replaced the header pipe with a non-cat header from another 09.

Ok- how do they sound?- very nice. I've owned Samsons, Hookers, V&H, Supertrap, Kerkers, and you have to consider that loud and tone is so subjective from one ear to the next. All I can report is that they( 2"baffles) are definitely not too loud, actually far from it. At idle they have a deep impressive sound, and at 50%+ throttle( acceleration) you can hear them yeah, but their not obnoxious to scare old ladies in the car next to you. At cruise speed, not too loud, actually  the wind noise overshadows the pipe noise. But at least now, I cant hear the air cleaner sucking air over the exhaust.  Someone said they sound like Rinehart's- well they do have a nice deep note now, but they dont have the snappy sound that Rineharts produce. Anyway the sound was better than I expected, and the performance result was very noticeable.

Overall- if you are the slight bit handy, you can do the job yourself- the baffle replacement is worth the $120.  I think the stock can looks great, so why toss it, and spend $500 on somthing else with similar performance? And if you want, you can change the end caps for a different look. The throttle response was much better, I noticed a little drop in torque( by feel only) between 2000 & 2500rpm, but more pull than before between 2500 to 4000. I know the bike needs to be tuned, I expect everything to improve after that. (I would like to have heard the 2.25" just to compare though.)

Thank you to "birdman" for posting the PC5 map- I'm not running lean any more. " I love the smell of fuel in the morning"

Final note- after the baffle replacement and header replacement, the exhaust flow is noticeably reduced in the left side can- definetly stronger in the right side. Which doesnt bother me, I think it will result in more of a 2-into -1 effect- which  should help with torque values a little.

Picture of the standard baffle next to the Fullsac baffle-



Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: GtreetSlide on April 14, 2009, 04:43:34 PM
I finally got my done Friday and rode 350 Saturday; it made an amazing difference in power and sound.  Now I've got to do something about a tune - I'm thinking about going with a super sert. 

I just tuned my new 103 (fullsac baffles) with the new TTS unit. It was quick and easy, only requiring 2 or 3 test runs using their software on a laptop. Doc wrote up easy to follow instructions that made it really simple. I highly reccomend the TTS masterTune. It runs great getting 40 mpg when running around in the hills and the motor runs so much cooler it's really sweet.  :bananarock:

jb
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 2UP3DOWN on April 21, 2009, 08:30:17 AM
I took some pics of the cat removal I did a week ago.  I'm pretty damn lucky I have a bud with a band saw and welding equip.  Otherwise this would have cost me a small fortune.  I will say that I enjoyed doing this mod myself.  I learned a lot and had fun while doing it.

Pre Cut w/ a line drawn to match the exhaust back up after weld.
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/mkantz/FLTRSE3/OpenCatsPreCut.jpg)

Cutting the exhaust
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/mkantz/FLTRSE3/OpenCatsCutting.jpg)

'Tis what it looks like inside (BTW this shtuff is razor sharp so be carefull when tearing it out)
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/mkantz/FLTRSE3/OpenCats.jpg)

Using an air chisel to remove the cc
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/mkantz/FLTRSE3/OpenCatsRemoving.jpg)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: fourstar on April 21, 2009, 04:48:11 PM
Did you photoshop that weld?  I can't even see it!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 2UP3DOWN on April 21, 2009, 06:40:47 PM
Did you photoshop that weld?  I can't even see it!

:ROFLOL:


OMG...  now that's funny...

I grabbed the pre- cut & weld photo showing the header before we started...   :wall:

So yes, there's no weld on that pic.

I'll try and remember to add the post weld shot later if daim bramage doesn't kick in again...

Thanks for pointing that out...  too funny.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: fourstar on April 21, 2009, 11:16:58 PM
I was going to send my pipe to you if you could weld like that!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 2UP3DOWN on April 22, 2009, 08:12:11 AM
I was going to send my pipe to you if you could weld like that!

Here's the weld .  My good friend Mikey showing off his work, a master welder  :2vrolijk_21:

(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/mkantz/FLTRSE3/OpenCatsPostWeld.jpg)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 09 S/T FLTRSE3 on April 22, 2009, 07:06:30 PM
Hey Eaglerider,

Tell Mikey that his weld looks better than the factory ones.

Cheers, Ken  8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: fourstar on April 22, 2009, 07:31:42 PM
Hey Eaglerider,

Tell Mikey that his weld looks better than the factory ones.

Cheers, Ken  8)

Real nice Ken!  Some poor Chinese kid probably worked his a$$ off on those welds!!  :D
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 2UP3DOWN on April 22, 2009, 07:37:15 PM
 :huepfenlol2:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on April 24, 2009, 07:34:35 AM
Here's the weld .  My good friend Mikey showing off his work, a master welder  :2vrolijk_21:

(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/mkantz/FLTRSE3/OpenCatsPostWeld.jpg)


You're friend did a great job.  Yesterday my neighbor did the same thing for my pipe.  He was an air frame welder for Boeing, and did a great job too.

Man the bike sounds so much better with the cat free head pipe, 2.25 fullsac baffels the TTS Master tune with Steve Fullsacs map.  It also runs stronger and cooler.

Fullsac is a class act, great service too.

This set up is not as loud as Rinharts in my opnion, but a little deeper.  Nice deep low tone at idle, you can hear the stereo at 75 and wind nice is as loud as the pipes.  Crack the throttle and they get louder, above 4500rpm they really bark.  I am very happy with the sound, seems fitting for a bagger.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on April 25, 2009, 07:33:19 AM
You're friend did a great job.  Yesterday my neighbor did the same thing for my pipe.  He was an air frame welder for Boeing, and did a great job too.

Man the bike sounds so much better with the cat free head pipe, 2.25 fullsac baffels the TTS Master tune with Steve Fullsacs map.  It also runs stronger and cooler.

Fullsac is a class act, great service too.

This set up is not as loud as Rinharts in my opnion, but a little deeper.  Nice deep low tone at idle, you can hear the stereo at 75 and wind nice is as loud as the pipes.  Crack the throttle and they get louder, above 4500rpm they really bark.  I am very happy with the sound, seems fitting for a bagger.
Question, I've heard many hear speak of running in high rpms. I did do this while doing my V-tune session. But if you're running at 4500 rpms, what gear are you in? I'd be causing a sonic boom if I did that
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Screamin on April 25, 2009, 07:37:13 AM
Yeah but you'd be out running the boom. I frequently bust 4500 hundred but it's on the way to the next gear.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on April 25, 2009, 07:47:21 AM
Ok, your not cruising at that, In that case, I completely understand. makes it easier when I reset the rev limiter
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on April 25, 2009, 07:50:25 AM
Question, I've heard many hear speak of running in high rpms. I did do this while doing my V-tune session. But if you're running at 4500 rpms, what gear are you in? I'd be causing a sonic boom if I did that

I think if I hit 4500 rpm past maybe 2nd, that boom you hear will probably be hitting a tree, or more likely a car.  I'm usually watching the road though, if I might be hitting those types of rpm's and I usually glance down at the speedo to see that I'm over 100 and better back off.  Yesterday, I hit 100 on a bridge for the first time.  I was sure hoping not to hit a crosswind at that point.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on April 28, 2009, 06:04:13 PM
Question, I've heard many hear speak of running in high rpms. I did do this while doing my V-tune session. But if you're running at 4500 rpms, what gear are you in? I'd be causing a sonic boom if I did that

After the cat gut, and tune, I ran it hard thru the gears till I hit tripple diget once.

Normally I shift around 2700 rpm.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Tony Smith on May 20, 2009, 09:06:48 PM
It's night in Chicago, so this was as good as I could get.  Enjoy...


I hate to be a Nelly, but what about the state safety inspection?  Aren't they going to gripe about the reflectors being removed? :nixweiss:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on May 20, 2009, 09:22:27 PM
I hate to be a Nelly, but what about the state safety inspection?  Aren't they going to gripe about the reflectors being removed? :nixweiss:

You probably need to check the inspection laws for your state.  I know that here in PA, they require one red reflector on the rear of the bike and I think a lot of states have that requirement.  I'm not sure about the sides...but then I've left my side reflectors on anyway.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on May 21, 2009, 06:53:40 AM
no safety inspection here in TN
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on May 21, 2009, 09:07:12 AM
no safety inspection here in TN

So that's why they allow that contraption of yours on the highways?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on May 21, 2009, 12:55:50 PM
So that's why they allow that contraption of yours on the highways?
Screamin' Grey Contraption?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 1abastarsmda on May 21, 2009, 06:47:39 PM
Screamin' Grey Contraption?

Yeah, that thing.  Hey, we didn't even leave the state today.  We were about half way there when one of the guys remembered it was bikini day at a local bar.  Can you say U-turn?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Boatman on July 16, 2009, 09:17:06 PM
FWIW-
I just bought 09 SERG mufflers and put in the 1.75" baffles from Fullsac on my wife's 09 FLHX.   Runs excellent.

Thanks to Jim Kerr for the how to.

Thanks to Dartman for "have plenty of light" when grinding the welds.  I would not think of doing this in a basement or garage.   Do it in sunlight.

Thanks to Ragrep for the 1.5" hole measurement and the button head screw.  I got stainless screws and nuts at ACE Hardware.  Looks like a rivot-much better than Fullsacs galvanized hex head.  1/4 X 1/2"..

Map from FuelMoto on a PC-V and their air cleaner.

Stock 4" CVO mufflers-sounds like a Honda-The stock FLHX mufflers are MUCH louder.

1.75" baffles are throatier but not much louder than the stock 09 FLHX mufflers.

If you want noise, you better get the 2" or 2.25" baffles.  Hope this helps someone as you folks have helped me.

Was able to hear OHIODave's-thanks Dave.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: OhioDave on July 17, 2009, 09:09:14 AM
Glad the mods worked out for you Bob...now you better hope that HD doesn't sell a SEFLHX in 2010 or the wifey will want to trade !!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on July 17, 2009, 11:05:35 AM
But even then the fulsacs won`t be lost money ( i do know someone who would buy them immediately - and i see him every day when i do look into the mirror  ::)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Harleydude001 on August 03, 2009, 05:51:31 PM
What a weekend, spent Saturday afternoon changing out the 09 SERG CC headers for a set from this site of 09 96 Cu.In, non Cat headers, the 2" Fullsac Baffles and the new mapping that Steve included.  Everything is going smoothly until it comes to the grinding the welds.  I had a pneumatic hand grinder and grinding away, broke the weld loose and could spin the baffles, even took the time to knock them down into the pipe as a tip on the instructions.  well the weld was not smooth on the muffler and that d&*$ baffle would not come out.  I was so concerned with not cutting a hole in the muffler I worked on that until I was so frustrated I had to leave it for the night and sleep on it.  Woke up and had to play golf to clear my head from this project, and my golf game sucked cause I was still thinking about the pipes......Geeeez couldn't win for losing.  well got home from golf and went back to work on the weld, ground it down in the muffler and the freakin  baffle slid right out......wow imagine that.  So if your going to do this project yourself, take the time to push the baffle into the pipe then knock the rest of the weld off the muffler and you'll have instant gratification.......So the bike sounds great the wife is ticked cause now my mod is louder then her Vance and Hines true dual with Bub mufflers with a Power Commander and Dyno........on her 07 SG....
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Screamin on August 03, 2009, 08:44:47 PM
Atta boy!  :2vrolijk_21: Sometimes it's just best to walk away.  ;) There's times I should have and didn't. Hot tempered red head I guess.  ;D  Glad you got it sorted out and are happy w/ the results!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: mjb765 on August 17, 2009, 07:40:42 PM
Funny you mention that.  I removed it after I took that picture.  

So how did you get that Damn reflector off????
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on August 18, 2009, 06:30:20 AM
fishing line and WD-40
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: mjb765 on August 18, 2009, 07:18:56 AM
Then maybe it is different on mine. I have a 10 SESG and it looks like it is connected to the lic plate light mount somehow. I guess I will need to investigate further.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on August 18, 2009, 08:18:41 AM
oh, that reflector, need to get under the fender and disassemble the wire housing and slide the light out and remove plastic tab on reflector and then re-assemble. but as long as you're there, why not do this. its a Kury product
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fireguy on August 18, 2009, 08:37:25 AM
May I say Larry.....That is a beautiful bike.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: mjb765 on August 18, 2009, 09:04:57 AM
oh, that reflector, need to get under the fender and disassemble the wire housing and slide the light out and remove plastic tab on reflector and then re-assemble. but as long as you're there, why not do this. its a Kury product

I could not find it on the site so I called Kuryakyn. They said they do not have a lic plate light/mount that will work on a SERG. Just a regular RG
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on August 18, 2009, 04:05:15 PM
here ya go
http://www.kuryakyn.com/index.cfm/go/Home.ProductDetail/catID/12/scID/25/IMID/1457
thanks fireguy. its been a blast
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: jasel on August 30, 2009, 05:06:53 PM
Got my baffle out on the right side. Thanks Jim, instructions saved the day. The fiberglass and screening slid out with the baffle which is fine by me. Decided to just reinsert stock baffle to see how they sound. Much better without the liner.

One caveat if it wasnn't mentioned, I didn't line up the inlet end when reinserting the baffle, and if I had pounded too hard I would have bunged things up. But I got it out and installed correctly. The fit and end cap should hold it in without the need for a hole and bolt. It actually sounds like a Harley now. Going to do the left side when it cools off.

I thought you or someone said there was a CC in the right muffler. Is it different in the 2010? In the head pipe?

Now I just have to decide if I want to go with the Fullsacs, the full boat, or just stick with the sound improvement of removing the liners. I have a 2003 that I got a SERT with, and after toying with it for awhile have rarely touched it. With the O2 sensor doesn't the ECU do a lot of the work itself?

Thanks again,

james
2010 FLHTCUSE5
2009 FLHX w/110 kit
2003 FLHTCUI w/ BB St2 and SERT
1998 Fat Boy Street Stalker
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on August 30, 2009, 05:10:18 PM
I left the insulation out when I first did my Fullsac's. put it back in, seems to direct the sound to the rear better, let em hear you pulling away. with it out it seemed a bit tinny.
the CC in the head pipe, right in front of the right side muffler. Look inside, many of us used a core bit to remove but found we were leaving alot of it still in, so we cut the pipe open and chiseled it out. Steve at Fullsac can do it for you, for a nominal charge. I did it myself
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hotrod50 on August 31, 2009, 06:34:43 PM
Larry,  what kind of lower fairings are those?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on September 01, 2009, 07:49:24 AM
they're HD fairings, off an 06, customized for my SERG
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Hotrod50 on September 01, 2009, 12:37:25 PM
Do you have a frontal picture of these fairings?  Were they off an 06 Ultra?   What had to be customized?  Do they go on and off easy for quick change?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on September 01, 2009, 01:33:28 PM
they are from a road glide 06. I painted them to match my bike, added speaker pods and cut in the vents. without the speaker pods they are eazy to remove/install. the pods add a bit of complexity to it but still ok.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on September 01, 2009, 01:34:43 PM
pods
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on September 01, 2009, 01:35:44 PM
all in
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fireguy on September 03, 2009, 11:23:59 PM
Just when you think there is nothing else to do your bike......here comes LarryB with alot more ideas. THANKS lol
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on September 04, 2009, 01:43:44 AM
That`s what we love and keeps us in progress .  :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on September 04, 2009, 07:36:51 AM
Just when you think there is nothing else to do your bike......here comes LarryB with alot more ideas. THANKS lol
think I'll get my camera out today and shoot some more pics
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Fired00d on September 04, 2009, 08:41:16 AM
think I'll get my camera out today and shoot some more pics
:devil: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:

 :pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 :fireman:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: db1945 on September 08, 2009, 11:24:00 PM
 Hello,just read your article on the full sac baffles,I am considering the same thing,but also removing the CAT. How do you like the sound? I see you left the packing in the muffler did it make much difference? thanks for the article and the photos.My ride is a 09 yellow pearl SERG.I really like it but the stock pipes need some help.






Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on September 09, 2009, 07:43:17 AM
let's see some pics of your scoot
 :worthless:
where in the world are you?
this Mod is an easy one.
I'm looking at some alternatives now
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: db1945 on September 09, 2009, 11:43:52 PM
 Will  have pics shortly,I live in northwest Arkansas just south of Fayettville : :orange:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: RGLIDE on September 11, 2009, 08:55:24 PM
I just bought two Stage 1 Fullsac kits today one for my 09 SERG( Fast Silver) and one for my wifes 09 SERG( Slower Yellow). Thanks to David at Fullsac for his info and handling the sale. Also got the slant tips for the eagles aswell.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Banana man on September 11, 2009, 09:52:05 PM
I just bought two Stage 1 Fullsac kits today one for my 09 SERG( Fast Silver) and one for my wifes 09 SERG( Slower  Yellow). Thanks to David at Fullsac for his info and handling the sale. Also got the slant tips for the eagles aswell.

MY old yeller ain't slow!!!!!!!   :bananarock: :bananarock:


                    Mark
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: RGLIDE on September 11, 2009, 10:09:17 PM
LOL I already heard about it from the wife OUCH!!!! :oops:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Banana man on September 11, 2009, 10:38:32 PM
LOL I already heard about it from the wife OUCH!!!! :oops:
That will teach ya. Ya can't mess with the Yellow bike owners and
get away with it. And besides everyone knows YELLOW bikes are
very FAST!!!!!! They just enjoy a good wobble on the freeway at
80 MPH once in a while, to keep the owner on there toes.  :bananarock:
 
Bananas do rock the world!!!!!


                                Mark
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on September 12, 2009, 02:27:15 AM
I just bought two Stage 1 Fullsac kits today one for my 09 SERG( Fast Silver) and one for my wifes 09 SERG( Slower Yellow). Thanks to David at Fullsac for his info and handling the sale. Also got the slant tips for the eagles aswell.

What do you mean with " Stage1 Fullsac kit " ?
The fullsac cores ?
Or anything else?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on September 12, 2009, 08:26:49 AM
What do you mean with " Stage1 Fullsac kit " ?
The fullsac cores ?
Or anything else?

check out: 
http://www.fullsac.com/
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Highjagger on September 12, 2009, 01:10:42 PM
allready seen , thxs.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: bobroadglide on November 01, 2009, 08:23:36 AM
Okay, now that I have read all 17 pages of this thread after grinding through the muffler body on the first weld, which tool was finally recommended.  I used an 8 in long carbide cutter, which did remove some weld but I went through the muffler body.  I can't get the dremel tool into the muffler enough to use either the cutter bit first recommended nor the stone bit recommended further into the thread (page 5 or 6 I think).  Someone else recommended a carbide pad, but didn't show it or provide a link to see one.  I read where some ground a while and then slept on it, I did that too, just haven't started back up yet.  What did everyone who ground through do to cover the hole?  Leave it, cover it with the new baffle, fill in weld? 
Boy this thread went from baffles to tuning to reflector removal to lowers and speaker mods.  Glad no one mentioned windshields in here.  I still would like to know which bit, which tool.  I am going to look at dremel site, but don't think they make longer bits.   
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 04se103 on November 01, 2009, 08:59:08 AM
This the bit i used  :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on November 01, 2009, 09:18:06 AM
Okay, now that I have read all 17 pages of this thread after grinding through the muffler body on the first weld, which tool was finally recommended.  I used an 8 in long carbide cutter, which did remove some weld but I went through the muffler body.  I can't get the dremel tool into the muffler enough to use either the cutter bit first recommended nor the stone bit recommended further into the thread (page 5 or 6 I think).  Someone else recommended a carbide pad, but didn't show it or provide a link to see one.  I read where some ground a while and then slept on it, I did that too, just haven't started back up yet.  What did everyone who ground through do to cover the hole?  Leave it, cover it with the new baffle, fill in weld?  
Boy this thread went from baffles to tuning to reflector removal to lowers and speaker mods.  Glad no one mentioned windshields in here.  I still would like to know which bit, which tool.  I am going to look at dremel site, but don't think they make longer bits.    

Once you do a few this is a fairly simple task, but like any delicate surgery you need a lot of light,  I also use an adjustable magnifying glass. These grinding bits aren't as fast as the carbide cutters, but by design they are far less likely to penetrate the muffler body, I stone will do approx 2 mufflers http://power-tools.hardwarestore.com/63-378-hobby-bits-grinding/dremel-grinding-stone-272377.aspx
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: bobroadglide on November 01, 2009, 09:44:06 AM
Okay, I am off to Lowe's for the grinding stones that Dartman suggested, and I think I will try to following also:
Dremel Flex-Shaft Attachment
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=94685-353-225-01&lpage=none

What did everyone who cut through the muffler body do about that?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 04se103 on November 01, 2009, 09:54:47 AM
What did everyone who cut through the muffler body do about that? I did not cut through the mufflers when doing mine how bad is it ? But I do have a spare set of mufflers that have the factory baffles removed I might sell if that helps
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on November 01, 2009, 11:46:05 AM
Okay, I am off to Lowe's for the grinding stones that Dartman suggested, and I think I will try to following also:
Dremel Flex-Shaft Attachment
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=94685-353-225-01&lpage=none

What did everyone who cut through the muffler body do about that?
If you cut through slightly on the bottom side, your puncture should  be very close to where the hole for the baffle bolt would be located, if your a little off center no one will notice.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: db1945 on November 01, 2009, 10:00:53 PM
 Hello,dremel makes a small cutting wheel about the size of a nickel,it has a very small hole in the middle for the screw that attaches it to a dremel grinding arbor.You can buy both at wal mart,Lowes,or home depot,I found it best leave the muffler on the bike for this step,you can do as you like,start at the top of one of the 3 welds(where the weld touches the baffle) work slowly,you will need several of these disk,so buy accordingly.I used the dremel without the small grinding attachment.Let me know how it goes.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: KODAGRIN on November 01, 2009, 10:42:18 PM
Thanks,  nice pictures!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on November 02, 2009, 08:06:38 AM
sorry to jump in here, but spent the day riding.
the Only bit to use on this is the grinding wheel on the dremel. do not use any cutting wheels or bits  or such. mistakes can happen too fast with those. the abrashive wheel is forgiving if you veer off. you shouldn't need an extension or flexable shaft. do the work with the mufflers on the bike, set up camp, and grind away. have a rubber mallet close by, when you think you are close on both welds tap on the baffle trying to drive it forward. keep this routine up till it breaks free, then remove the rest of the weld and pull the baffle out.
if you do cut through the muffler, hopefully on the bottom, it should be on or in the rear of the new baffle flange and all is good. and since you will drill for a new mount you have the adjustability to cover up.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Heatwave on November 02, 2009, 10:33:42 AM
When using the dremel to "grind" the welds, its important not to use a cutting wheel. Make sure you're using a grinding wheel and slowly take your time and this is a rather simple and straight-forward project. If you're the kind of person who get's impatient and tries to rush the grinding (or worse - a cutting wheel), you're almost sure to make a mistake and end up going through the muffler.

As others have already suggested. Its best to take the tips off and leave the mufflers on the bike while doing the grinding. You'll have a much more stable position for the grinding. Once the grinding is nearly complete, then you can remove the mufflers and hold it between your knees for the last little bit of grinding needed to release the baffles. I found a sharp drop on the baffle end on a concrete floor covered with a blanket, would make the remaining weld crack. I then used a strap wrench around the baffle to twist it out. Add a little WD40 and the baffle will slide right out. Then you can either leave the packing in or slide it out also. Be careful, the fiberglass packing is somewhat sharp.

The other aspect that made the project quite easy for me was using a 3' flex extension adapter on my dremel. By using the extension, the body of the dremel motor stayed out of the way while trying to maneuver inside the muffler body. A bright light is critical for the grinding and you really can't have too much light.

If you use the dremel extension, have lot's of light, keep changing to fresh grinding wheels and take your time, this is an easy project that can be done in a couple of hours.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: guppytrash on November 02, 2009, 04:21:54 PM
Focus on grinding the weld on the baffle lip, when the lip is flush with the exhaust your weld should be gone. 
Think of it as notching the lip of the baffle until flush with the exterior pipe.
 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: 04se103 on November 03, 2009, 07:55:23 AM
Oh Larry you so Bad  :)  :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: guppytrash on November 03, 2009, 08:13:17 AM
YEA!
And take your time.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: bobroadglide on November 06, 2009, 05:07:02 PM
okay, so finally got both baffles out.  The first one was real difficult, after I got the weld ground down and the baffle pushed forward slightly, I could not get the baffle backwards and out.  Called Steve and he said use a 1 inch tube or dowel.  I was using a 1 1/4 socket and was just spreading inlet of the baffle.  Stuck a 1 inch socket on a 18 inch extension, dropped the muffler on the workbench and the baffle flew out so fast it surprised me.  The second baffle removal was easier, The weld was much smaller, I wonder if the first baffle weld was re-welded by hand.  Removing the baffle after the weld was ground down was more difficult than the first one.  But just as Steve said, they sometimes stick at the brackets.  It did, ended up distorting the baffle flange but I did get it out with only two blood blisters.  Hope Steve can afford the loss of a baffle recore job, his advise saved me $199 plus shipping two ways.  Now for my order of the Stage One kit.... 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on November 06, 2009, 06:32:20 PM
way to go Bob :2vrolijk_21:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: baggerben on November 07, 2009, 05:16:23 PM
i used a piece of rebar and did the same. poped the stock baffel right out.
i couldnt get the new baffels to line up right. i thought i was retarted.
called steve and sure enough i didnt have the new baffles line up straight. o well.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Heatwave on December 12, 2009, 08:28:56 PM
I went with Fullsac 2.25" baffles on my 2010 SEUC. After running with my new engine build I decided to go to a D&D Boss FatCat with a big bore baffle. While I liked the Fullsac approach I decided that to get the full performance out of my engine build, I needed to go to a 2:1. If anyone's interested, my 2.25" used Fullsac baffles (perfect condition) are for sale. New they go for $139 plus $20 shipping. Drop me a PM if you're interested.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Ron Hawkins on December 14, 2009, 12:19:10 AM
Heatwave, I would be interested in them. What are you thinkin price wise?

Ron
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Heatwave on December 14, 2009, 12:37:50 AM
Heatwave, I would be interested in them. What are you thinkin price wise?

Ron

They have already been sold. Thanks.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: KODAGRIN on December 16, 2009, 03:47:52 PM
so..............
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: KODAGRIN on March 19, 2010, 12:29:49 PM
...I still don't know which size baffle to get.  Seems like I read somewhere that the smaller (1.75 inch) baffle resulted in the most torque gain--is that right?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: GregKhougaz on March 19, 2010, 12:43:38 PM
Fullsac posted that 2" produced most power though they were all very close. 

See here:  Muffler core Dyno Test! 2.25 vs 2.0 vs 1.75. Is bigger better? (http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=37828.0)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Screamin on March 19, 2010, 12:57:16 PM
...I still don't know which size baffle to get.  Seems like I read somewhere that the smaller (1.75 inch) baffle resulted in the most torque gain--is that right?

Tons of stuff here to pour through but if you've still got doubts you ought to call Steve and ask him.

Steve George
Owner Fullsac Performance
www.fullsac.com
928-505-2912
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on March 19, 2010, 01:43:46 PM
...I still don't know which size baffle to get.  Seems like I read somewhere that the smaller (1.75 inch) baffle resulted in the most torque gain--is that right?
2in sound great but too loud for my ears on extended trips, I have both I use 1.75 most of the time. Depends on your riding style. 2 in have a nice deep sound but riding two up in the mountains they really hammer your ears on the upgrade.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dkflhxse on March 30, 2010, 02:58:12 PM
2in sound great but too loud for my ears on extended trips, I have both I use 1.75 most of the time. Depends on your riding style. 2 in have a nice deep sound but riding two up in the mountains they really hammer your ears on the upgrade.

I am debating between the 1.75 and 2 inch baffles.  I'm planning on running stock headers with cc.  I don't want a lot of noise, just a bit more rumble than stock.  Any advice would be appreciated.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on March 30, 2010, 04:04:29 PM
I am debating between the 1.75 and 2 inch baffles.  I'm planning on running stock headers with cc.  I don't want a lot of noise, just a bit more rumble than stock.  Any advice would be appreciated.

Get both!
 :2vrolijk_21:
You can swap them out in about 3 minutes if you want quieter/louder! 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on April 06, 2010, 08:55:30 AM
my .02 , 2in
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: magicdjduster on May 06, 2010, 06:39:40 PM
Thank you to everyone who added info to this process. Here are my 2 cents and hopefully it will help the next person tackling this task. I used the Dremel #932 grinding stone as prescribed by the pros (got mine at Menards).  I used 4 of them (2 per pipe) and took my time on each muffler.  It took about 1 1/2 hours of grinding on the first muffler and 1 hour on the second one (two separate days).   I placed the muffler on a workbench with a trouble light above the work space. I layed the pipe in a feather bed like used in a baby crib and propped the pipe at an angle on a vise.  I used a Black&Decker RTX-B 3 speed rotary tool from Wal-Mart.  I swiveled it 90 degrees when grinding and that kept the knurled tightner from rubbing the end of the muffler.  I had no problem with the grinder after rotating it and it would grind flat with the Dremel bit that way. Recommend keeping the Dremel stone as straight/flat as possible when grinding to keep from grinding through the cover. You have to be patient as told in previous posts.  I blew up two of the grinding stones in the process.  Since I didn't need to save my old baffles, I hit them out with a 2" piece of solid steel rod.  It took several times back and forth with the bfh, bar and grinder process before each baffle broke loose.  Now I'm waiting for the 2" baffles to arrive in the mail and install them. Can't wait!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: StrikerDown on May 14, 2010, 04:00:00 PM
Now I'm waiting for the 2" baffles to arrive in the mail and install them. Can't wait!

So, How does it sound without baffles?  We know you had a listen!

I have been looking all around this and other places to decide on what to get for a little more Tail pipe feedback, I must say it is quite exhausting!

I decided to go with the 2" baffles from Fullsac to begin with and possibly an X pipe in the future depending how I like what this gives me. Wish me luck with the grinder!  :nervous:  :drink:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: magicdjduster on May 14, 2010, 09:53:54 PM
The sound/rumble/note is very nice with the 2" baffles, not too harsh and far from wimpy ... just shined up the chrome on the pipes with windex and did the final wrenching to ensure everything was tight again.    Prior to these I had Bassani 4" megaphones on it with Vance and Hines head pipes.  Kept the V & H head pipes with the CVO cans and Fullsac 2" Baffles.  The wife and me couldn't hold a conversation at stoplights with out yelling with the Bassanis even though they sounded really mean.  We now can listen to the radio, hold a conversation and when the throttle is snapped it snarls ... I love it!  Also put a HD Stage I Air cleaner on with a power commander and kept the stock air cleaner cover.  The bike looks totally stock.  It dyno'd at 92.3 hp with 113.31 torque.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: redrum on December 18, 2010, 08:13:39 PM
Hi jim did you by any chance remove the insulation from your mufflers yet since youv'e put the fullsac baffels in if so how much difference did it make and is there any chance that the packing in the muffler will blow out the back
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: walstibsf on December 20, 2010, 08:02:14 PM
One thing I found out by experimenting with the different Dremel grinding wheels and rotary files:  if used very carefully and lightly, the tiny cutoff abrasive wheels will do the trick in 5-10 minutes whilst using the edge of them like a grinder.  I had to cut off the 'stingers' on the old stock baffles(can you say sawzall?) to get clearance at angles to allow the cutoff wheel to move around enough.  Just be very careful not to undercut the muffler body, as these wheels cut very quickly.

Another thing I did was to drill two holes in the top of my work bench that have the same spacing as the muffler mounts.  Then run bolts from underneath to hold the mufflers while I worked.  (towel, pad, or rag under front of muffs to prevent scratches).  I suppose I could've built a jig like this to go in a vise, also.  I found this very secure to prevent damage to the muff bodies and provide a stable working mount. 

Be sure and wear your safety glasses and remember you've got sparks and tender.

Good luck....YMMV


Hope this helps.....
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Borntodubb on February 02, 2011, 03:16:17 PM
Hi,

Nice detailed instructions, thanks.  Do you have any pictures of the stock baffles?

Borntodubb
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: dartman on February 02, 2011, 10:57:06 PM
Here
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Borntodubb on February 04, 2011, 12:50:24 AM
Thank you,

I can see just how much better the Fullsac  baffles will work!!

Borntodubb
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: MC88 on April 16, 2011, 01:00:34 AM

Great information here guys .

I read through all 20 pages and took the plunge , used dremmel grinding wheels and only took about half an hour per side.

Now im deciding which size baffles to go with most likely go for quiet and medium as I am looking for a deep rumble and not too loud.

So for those wondering I cranked it up and had a listen with and without the packing inside.

With the packing it sonds nice and deep and loud ,  only problem is the packing started to fly out as no baffle to keep in in place.

Without the packing it sounds a lot louder and has an echo to it, sound is ver similar to my springer with Rinehart crossbacks on it , set of car alarms in my car park... my opinion is a bit too loud .

So time to order the fullsac bafffles and try them out .
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: MC88 on May 05, 2011, 06:38:38 AM
I got my 2 inch baffles this week and at the same time the dealer rang and said he had my  Hi outputs  as well,

First the V&H went on , nice deep rumble  resonably loud and sets off car alarms in my car park.

Second on was the fullsacs , BTW im also running the V&H power duals and the sound is great at idle and  a nice mellow tone through the rev range. No alarms set off in the car park.

So it looks like they will stay on for now , i really like the stock ends of the pipes with the black tips ,.

So its another    :2vrolijk_21:for Steve.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: John_HD on May 26, 2011, 08:51:37 AM
I'd like to share my experiences as I did this yesterday to 2011 Street Glide CVO pipes. Total job took about 2 hours but could have been much less.



Good luck. This wasn't hard and it wasn't easy to screw up either. I had minimal tools, and I got it done.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: rayz1951 on June 10, 2011, 06:35:21 PM
Great installation directions.  I have Bub 7 trueduals on my 08 but they seem to be annoyning lately, or I'm getting older, but I still like the looks of the OEM mufflers.  Which fullsac baffle is quiet but still louder than stock.

Ray Z
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on June 20, 2011, 07:47:23 PM
the 2" works well for that
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: stevegoetsch on June 21, 2011, 11:53:10 PM
Excellent step by step, thanks for your time showing us how to do do this, but I have one question that the old school in me wants to ask. What would it be like if after the baffle was removed a person just put the end cap back on and called it good. I wonder how noise and performance would be changed, it would be a cheap way to make your pipes sound better then stock and obtain more power...I think! :apple:
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on June 22, 2011, 10:02:16 AM
Excellent step by step, thanks for your time showing us how to do do this, but I have one question that the old school in me wants to ask. What would it be like if after the baffle was removed a person just put the end cap back on and called it good. I wonder how noise and performance would be changed, it would be a cheap way to make your pipes sound better then stock and obtain more power...I think! :apple:

Only way to know if YOU like it is to try it.
I'm betting you will not like it.
 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: LarryB on June 22, 2011, 07:14:17 PM
Excellent step by step, thanks for your time showing us how to do do this, but I have one question that the old school in me wants to ask. What would it be like if after the baffle was removed a person just put the end cap back on and called it good. I wonder how noise and performance would be changed, it would be a cheap way to make your pipes sound better then stock and obtain more power...I think! :apple:
you will probably loose some low end torque, with no baffles there's not enough back pressure with just the plate
Title: Trying to get baffles out of 06 CVO pipes
Post by: Z10 on July 16, 2011, 08:59:24 AM
Got the welds ground down and broken. Can move the baffle forward. Smoothed the pipe ID assuring no ridges that would prevent the baffle from going past the grounded down welds. Baffle still is getting hung up somwhere when trying to knock it out. These are 06 pipes and as you can see by the pic the CAT is in the muffler. You'll also notice that this is where I've been putting the doll rod. Question...Note the edge the arrow is point at. Is that part of the baffle too? I don't think it it because I don't see marks where it has moved only forward. Going back out in the garage this morning to play with it. Last night before I called it a day I hit it with some penetrating fluid.
Title: Re: Trying to get baffles out of 06 CVO pipes
Post by: HOGMIKE on July 16, 2011, 09:47:10 AM
Got the welds ground down and broken. Can move the baffle forward. Smoothed the pipe ID assuring no ridges that would prevent the baffle from going past the grounded down welds. Baffle still is getting hung up somwhere when trying to knock it out. These are 06 pipes and as you can see by the pic the CAT is in the muffler. You'll also notice that this is where I've been putting the doll rod. Question...Note the edge the arrow is point at. Is that part of the baffle too? I don't think it it because I don't see marks where it has moved only forward. Going back out in the garage this morning to play with it. Last night before I called it a day I hit it with some penetrating fluid.

That lip is part of the pipe and stays. Just use a big piece of pipe about 2 ft long on the cat, turn the muffler over, use it like a "slide hammer" on the floor, give it a good whack, and it will pop out. Assuming you have your welds ground down where they separate from the flange.
Used this on quite a few mufflers, and works fine. Then you can dress up the remaining weld marks inside the housing, and slide the new cores right in.
Good luck. 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Z10 on July 16, 2011, 01:27:33 PM
 :2vrolijk_21:  Thx HogMike...Top portion of the floor jack handle did the trick. Both pipes are ready for new baffles. Will order the 2" baffles this weekend.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: HOGMIKE on July 16, 2011, 06:36:38 PM
:2vrolijk_21:  Thx HogMike...Top portion of the floor jack handle did the trick. Both pipes are ready for new baffles. Will order the 2" baffles this weekend.

You didn't have the cores already?????
Tech tip:
If you have access to a Whitney punch, use that to punch the holes in the chrome pipes, follow the directions to leave them a little loose fit at the inlet (room for expansion).
 8)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Z10 on July 16, 2011, 09:35:00 PM
You didn't have the cores already?????

Didn't want to order them till I had the old ones out and was sure I still had a good set of pipes.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: gabhart on July 18, 2011, 10:16:54 PM
Great thread guys. So great in fact that I am ready to move forward with this on my 2011 CVO Ultra. The ONLY thing holding me back is not being able to hear what the catless stock header pipe and any of the Fullsac baffles sound like. Is there anyone with this configuration within a 100 mile radius of Northern Virginia that I can hook up with to hear this?

My computer speakers just will not cut it.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Z10 on July 27, 2011, 09:35:28 PM
Update:  Finally got the baffles installed and the pipes on the bike tonight.  What a nice pleasant throaty sound. I believe the Pythons were alot more restrictive than I thought. You can't see a bit of light when looking through them. I wish I understood muffler accoustics better. You can see clear through the stock pipes now with the fullsac and the bike is much more easier on the ears compared the the Pythons.

My tune must not be too far off. Took if for a spin, no intake or exhaust sputtering on accel or decels. Got on it hard and she pulled real hard...no flat spots noticed by the seat of the pants. Taking it to the Blue Ridge parkway this weekend with the wife. Can't wait to see how she does on the road with temps in the high 90's and dewpoints in the 70 range.

Another trick to keep the drill bit from walking when drilling the 1/4" hole. Put a piece of duct tape on the area your going to drill. Measure the 1.5", mark and punch it (on the tape) and drill. No bit walking at all. I first used a smaller bit and then went to the 1/4.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Dan_Lockwood on July 28, 2011, 11:40:19 AM
Another trick to keep the drill bit from walking when drilling the 1/4" hole. Put a piece of duct tape on the area your going to drill. Measure the 1.5", mark and punch it (on the tape) and drill. No bit walking at all. I first used a smaller bit and then went to the 1/4.

Z10, sounds like you're a happy camper now.

I did the same thing to my '09 SERG and did the work on my full lift.  Drilling holes on round hard surfaces can be tricky.

I have a few of the spring loaded center punches that Harbor Freight sells.  I have their small light duty and the heavier duty model as well.  With the heavy duty center punch you can actually place a prick punch divot in the muffler that makes it very easy for a 1/16" drill bit to follow without walking off center.  I always pre-drill and the follow up with the true size I need.  I've ruined a few parts in the learning process, but pre-drilling in my older age has proved to safe time and money.

I have the Fullsac 2" baffles with the stock HD packing.  They bark when needed, but can quiet down on the open road to talk and hear my tunes.  Very nice compromise between stock and drag pipes.  On my last '08 SERK I had the V&H Ovals and they were a bit loud and it was hard to talk while riding.  The 2" were a welcomed relief.

Thanks for your review of the new exhaust additions.
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: tomjetty on July 29, 2011, 04:19:39 PM
Just finished the full sack upgrade. Thanks Jim you made it rather simple...Tom
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Resbiker on August 04, 2011, 07:38:30 PM
I just pulled my 1+3/4" fullsacs and replaced them with 2".  Really....not much difference on sound.  Maybe slightly deeper.  Anyway, I have a pair of 1+3/4" for sale.  Only 5,000miles on them.  A little dirty, but cheap.  I'd take $75 for the pair, including stateside UPS if anyone' interested.  I'll be gone for about 10 days, so be patient.  I'll check the site for any interest.
SOLD
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Trigger-Man on December 15, 2011, 09:46:42 PM
Resbiker ............do you still have those Fullsac 1.75" cores for sale? Just installed the Stage I with 2" cores and am really happy with reduction in heat and seat of pants power increase! The sound however, is a bit more than I'd want to listen on an all day ride .............I'm particularly looking at options for softening that hammering sound when going through the gears and/or riding uphill. Tomorrow, I'll replace the fiberglass  packing with TechMat to see if any improvement with acoustics. If that's not the answer, perhaps the 175"? Different strokes for different folks ..........natch .......... at one time, Steve@Fullsac loved the 2"ers, but was reportedly using the 175"'s for longer rides.
Many mahalo's to Jim for his most excellent instructional guide!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: Cvostu on December 15, 2011, 11:52:26 PM
i still like my Bub 7 Stealth best though ;)
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: n7543g on December 16, 2011, 10:42:23 PM
I just finished installing 2" in 11 CVO mufflers. This post was very valuable!!!
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: hdff on January 26, 2012, 10:30:08 PM
I just finished installing 2" in 11 CVO mufflers. This post was very valuable!!!
So how is the sound? I am fixing to do this mod and need advice on which size to go with
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: whozathd on February 23, 2012, 04:30:43 PM
Just wondering did you ever go the fullsac on your bike and if so, which one?
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: hdff on February 23, 2012, 05:39:49 PM
Just wondering did you ever go the fullsac on your bike and if so, which one?
yes i did.. easy mod to do. took about 15 mins max to cut the old baffles out. i installed the new 2" fulsac baffles with the white packing that came out with the original baffles. i wanted something a little louder but not to loud as i pull a trailer and the last bike i had had rhinehart 3 1/2 " and it was way to loud with the trailer on the hyway. well after a short ride the new baffles came back out and went back in without the packing, damn near sounded stock with the packing. now it has a louder sound but not to loud so i think it is going to be good with the trailer. i don't think that is as loud as a friends that has 4" rhineharts but it is louder and has a decent sound i think so far. i am going to have a friend ride it soon so i can hear it not riding bike. i had no problems removing the old or drilling for the new and the new ones slid right in twice  now with no problems. i do wonder in my head how the 2.25 would sound and some day might get them to see and swap out for trips.
i also put on a catless coated head pipe from fuel moto 
Title: Re: Installing Fullsac Baffles on 09 CVO Road Glide
Post by: whozathd on February 25, 2012, 08:40:40 AM
Many thanks for all the info in this thread!   I'm considering many different setup's at this moment, but leaning most recently towards the Vance and Hines Power duals head pipes and the CFR (Cary Faas Racing) mufflers and the SERT for turning on the 2012 CVO Ultra.   With the sound bites I've found those sound pretty hot and not everyone has them.   Anyone heard this setup by chance?   IF so - thoughts you care to share?  Thanks!