Topic: single front disc (Read 8323 times)

hogasm · « **on:** February 11, 2007, 09:57:23 AM »

Installed a single 13" front disc from Performance Machine and their 6 piston caliper. Used the stock 11/16 bore master cylinder. Brake feels mushy.

What difference does the 9/16 bore have from the 11/16 bore master cylinder when used with a single disc and caliper?

Should I switch out the 11/16 for a 9/16 when using the single caliper?

Fired00d · « **Reply #1 on:** February 11, 2007, 10:46:40 AM »

Which bike? No pictures?

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

Puzzled · « **Reply #2 on:** February 11, 2007, 11:43:36 AM »

Quote from: hogasm on February 11, 2007, 09:57:23 AM

Should I switch out the 11/16 for a 9/16 when using the single caliper?

Yes is the short answer.

I went the other way on a build and had similar results.

How do you feel you did on the bleeding of the brakes? Do you have a firm lever but a soft brake? (sounds all wrong!

) I believe your moving the volume of fluid but it's pressure you after which the larger bore MC isn't giving you. Than again I could be wrong.

Hoist! · « **Reply #3 on:** February 11, 2007, 12:29:46 PM »

You need the single caliper master (9/16") for proper operation. As puzzled stated, you won't get the right pressure. I had a caliper go bad on a '95 Dyna and plugged one port of the Ness brakeline tee before I fixed it. The brake feel and response was definitely noticibly worse. That was enough proof for me. I run a single caliper master on a single 4-piston differential bore PM front brake on my Pro Street. Brakes are great. No problem whatsoever!

Hoist!

crshnbrn · « **Reply #4 on:** February 11, 2007, 02:50:17 PM »

Quote from: hogasm on February 11, 2007, 09:57:23 AM

Installed a single 13" front disc from Performance Machine and their 6 piston caliper. Used the stock 11/16 bore master cylinder. Brake feels mushy.

What difference does the 9/16 bore have from the 11/16 bore master cylinder when used with a single disc and caliper?

Should I switch out the 11/16 for a 9/16 when using the single caliper?

I have ridden a few touring bikes where the right front caliper has been removed to show more of a custom front wheel, and the original 11/16" bore front master cylinder was retained. There was very little lever movement before the brake began to apply because the master cylinder was displacing enough fluid for two calipers, but it took more lever effort once the brake did apply. Your front brake lever should have less travel now that you have only one caliper. It definitely should not be mushy.

"He who has no brakes will stop at nothing."
- words of wisdom seen scrawled in the salt-spray-covered back door of a semi trailer

hogasm · « **Reply #5 on:** February 11, 2007, 08:16:19 PM »

New front tire

Metzler 880 120 on 21"x3.25" Performance Machine rim and 6 piston caliper with 13" rotor

hogasm · « **Reply #6 on:** February 11, 2007, 08:19:05 PM »

Left side.......oh yea new front fender.

hogasm · « **Reply #7 on:** February 11, 2007, 08:21:00 PM »

Waiting on flush axle kit and a few other misc OCD parts

Fired00d · « **Reply #8 on:** February 11, 2007, 08:25:01 PM »

Brian,
That looks awesome, good job.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #9 on:** February 11, 2007, 11:36:59 PM »

Wow Brian it looks fantastic. As you know I am doing a wheel swap as well but I didn't do the 21 I wish I would have but it wasn't in the cards. I am going to retain the dual disc though just in case I ever sell it i can keep my wheels. And I like the stopping power of two discs. But I want to see a full side view of your bike it must be great. Later Bro,Q

Grover · « **Reply #10 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:17:59 PM »

That looks great Brian

Where did you get the paint codes? From the photo's it looks right on

Is that a fat baggers front fender? If not, it sure looks like one.

Lookin' good

Twolanerider · « **Reply #11 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:24:59 PM »

Brian, there might be some slight differences in "feel" of the front brake lever. But "mushy" should not be it. Especially given the overall small volume of fluid bled is bled. It's actually a lot more of an issue going to dual brakes with a smaller master cylinder than it is the other way around.

The bike is an 04. So it's probably got DOT 5 (aka, silicone) brake fluid in it. Any time you've got a mushy brake pedal on a DOT 5 system blame the fluid until proven otherwise. It is so easy to entrain air in that fluid. If you pumped the lever fast during braking you caused a problem. If bottle of fluid got shook up much in handling really anytime in the couple of weeks prior to its use you caused a problem. DOT 5 is good stuff (for it's purpose). But it's a pain in the arse to work with.

hogasm · « **Reply #12 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:38:06 PM »

Quote from: Grover on February 12, 2007, 08:17:59 PM

That looks great Brian

Where did you get the paint codes? From the photo's it looks right on

Is that a fat baggers front fender? If not, it sure looks like one.

Lookin' good

Milwalkee Iron I think makes Fat Baggers fender. All the measurements are the same and costs half as much

hogasm · « **Reply #13 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:40:19 PM »

Switched to a 9/16 master cylinder. Will see Wednesday if it makes any difference.

Grover · « **Reply #14 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:52:59 PM »

Quote from: hogasm on February 12, 2007, 08:38:06 PM

Milwalkee Iron I think makes Fat Baggers fender. All the measurements are the same and costs half as much

I wish I'd have known that before I got bent over by fat baggers! Damn!!

hogasm · « **Reply #15 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:07:26 PM »

Mark, I did buy the bracket from them. 79.99 + S & H.

Paint job looks great. Had John St.Claire re paint the bike. While the parts were there he painted the new finder.

He matched the colors perfect

Hoist! · « **Reply #16 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:09:19 PM »

Quote from: Grover on February 12, 2007, 08:52:59 PM

I wish I'd have known that before I got bent over by fat baggers! Damn!!

Mark after all you got into that beautiful front end, what's another chrome MC!

Hoist!

Grover · « **Reply #17 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:27:16 PM »

Quote from: hogasm on February 12, 2007, 09:07:26 PM

Mark, I did buy the bracket from them. 79.99 + S & H.

Paint job looks great. Had John St.Claire re paint the bike. While the parts were there he painted the new finder.

He matched the colors perfect

You had the whole bike repainted? Why?

That must look awesome in person! The pictures look fantastic!!

hogasm · « **Reply #18 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:34:30 PM »

Quote from: Grover on February 12, 2007, 09:27:16 PM

You had the whole bike repainted? Why?

That must look awesome in person! The pictures look fantastic!!

Had the front end repainted. After Daytona I am leaving the bike with John so he can paint the rest. He is in Orlando, well close to it.

Bessie has had a few mishaps in her life, she needed a new coat.

hogasm · « **Reply #19 on:** February 16, 2007, 10:46:41 AM »

Grover wanted me to post this so his pain would be lifted a little

Part # for fender adapter for a 21" front wheel is
Drag# 1410-0021 Dealer cost $54.90 Sugg retail $79.95

You need to use a 5.5" fender for a 21" wheel

The one I used is a Milwalkee Iron Cow Catcher
Sugg retail $220.00 Bought it for $120.00

Parts from Fat Baggers were around $600 for both. Is that right Grover

Grover · « **Reply #20 on:** February 18, 2007, 01:12:18 PM »

Quote from: hogasm on February 16, 2007, 10:46:41 AM

Grover wanted me to post this so his pain would be lifted a little

Part # for fender adapter for a 21" front wheel is
Drag# 1410-0021 Dealer cost $54.90 Sugg retail $79.95

You need to use a 5.5" fender for a 21" wheel

The one I used is a Milwalkee Iron Cow Catcher
Sugg retail $220.00 Bought it for $120.00

Parts from Fat Baggers were around $600 for both. Is that right Grover

That's right Brian. I was given a discount and paid about $520.00! Still got taken for a ride

So if anybody's looking to upgrade their front end w/21'' wheel and fender....go the route that Brian did. Same items but for much, much less. I'm sure Milwaukee Iron supplies Fatbaggers with the fender.

DW6019 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 26, 2007, 10:23:55 PM »

Any one know anything about John St Claire or how to get in contact with him? Post says he is close to Orlando which is close to me and I never heard of him. But from looks of the fender I need to talk to him.
Thanks
Don

hard10 · « **Reply #22 on:** March 26, 2007, 10:31:33 PM »

Quote from: DW6019 on March 26, 2007, 10:23:55 PM

Any one know anything about John St Claire or how to get in contact with him? Post says he is close to Orlando which is close to me and I never heard of him. But from looks of the fender I need to talk to him.
Thanks
Don

Don, PM me.

IronButt · « **Reply #23 on:** March 30, 2007, 03:18:45 AM »

Quote from: hogasm on February 11, 2007, 09:57:23 AM

Installed a single 13" front disc from Performance Machine and their 6 piston caliper.

Help me out here guys.. I am working on a brake up grade,,, Thought about a single disc for the flashy look but am concerned about performance. Right now my twin disc is not keeping up, lots of brake fade. Hoist rides hard as I do. If you went with a larger diameter rotor would it compensate for the loss of the other disc? Keep in mind I am 250 and ride with my FLHTCUI loaded.

I understand that a larger rotor is like having a longer prybar, more leverage. But how does it equate from 2 short to 1 long?

Thanks....

BTW my name is Steven

Twolanerider · « **Reply #24 on:** March 30, 2007, 03:26:10 AM »

Quote from: SJPZZZ on March 30, 2007, 03:18:45 AM

Help me out here guys.. I am working on a brake up grade,,, Thought about a single disc for the flashy look but am concerned about performance. Right now my twin disc is not keeping up, lots of brake fade. Hoist rides hard as I do. If you went with a larger diameter rotor would it compensate for the loss of the other disc? Keep in mind I am 250 and ride with my FLHTCUI loaded.

I understand that a larger rotor is like having a longer prybar, more leverage. But how does it equate from 2 short to 1 long?

Thanks....

BTW my name is Steven

Steven, I know Brian (Hogasm) and a few others here have gone the single caliper route. And it breaks my heart. I've met a lot of them. Don't want less brakes for any of them.

Can still remember adding juice brakes to bikes that didn't have it. Adding front brakes to bikes that only had rear. Going from drums to disc. Looking for more.

I don't care how good are the single sided brakes that might be installed. They can't be as good as one more braking subsystem. That difference might never be needed. But sometime a few feet might make all the difference. Can't imagine how well and truly pissed I'd be if a friend's epitaph was "man that single rotor looked good."

IronButt · « **Reply #25 on:** March 30, 2007, 03:28:15 AM »

Good point! Well taken!

ESJ JESTER · « **Reply #26 on:** March 30, 2007, 03:30:47 AM »

Hey Steven, From what you said about riding hard with lots of weight and experiencing brake fade that imho you should upgrade the brake fluid from dot 4 to a dot 7maybe. not dot 5 as thats silicon and wont work. the fluid reaches its boiling point and when doing so the boiling produces air bubbles and when you squeeze the brake the bubbles can compress thus the "FADE" feeling. some of the Ate German brake fluids for Benzes and Bimmers have higher boiling points and might just be your answer first. After the fade is cured with two then you might want to try the larger single disc and 6 piston and you can do the same experiment and if it fades well then you have a solution waiting.

PS I am with TwoLane tho... looks could kill sometimes.........

IronButt · « **Reply #27 on:** March 30, 2007, 03:59:20 AM »

Quote from: ESJ JESTER on March 30, 2007, 03:30:47 AM

Hey Steven, From what you said about riding hard with lots of weight and experiencing brake fade that imho you should upgrade the brake fluid from dot 4 to a dot 7maybe. not dot 5 as thats silicon and wont work. the fluid reaches its boiling point and when doing so the boiling produces air bubbles and when you squeeze the brake the bubbles can compress thus the "FADE" feeling. some of the Ate German brake fluids for Benzes and Bimmers have higher boiling points and might just be your answer first. After the fade is cured with two then you might want to try the larger single disc and 6 piston and you can do the same experiment and if it fades well then you have a solution waiting.
PS I am with TwoLane tho... looks could kill sometimes.........

Point well taken, looking at all options before I pull the trigger. Believe me, I will

before I make a decision

Thank you ESJ

IronButt · « **Reply #28 on:** March 30, 2007, 04:08:19 AM »

Quote from: ESJ JESTER on March 30, 2007, 03:30:47 AM

Hey Steven, From what you said about riding hard with lots of weight and experiencing brake fade that imho you should upgrade the brake fluid from dot 4 to a dot 7maybe. not dot 5 as thats silicon and wont work. the fluid reaches its boiling point and when doing so the boiling produces air bubbles and when you squeeze the brake the bubbles can compress thus the "FADE" feeling. some of the Ate German brake fluids for Benzes and Bimmers have higher boiling points and might just be your answer first. After the fade is cured with two then you might want to try the larger single disc and 6 piston and you can do the same experiment and if it fades well then you have a solution waiting.
PS I am with TwoLane tho... looks could kill sometimes.........

I googled DOT 7 and did not find any info?

Can you Tell me where to find it, Thanks

ESJ JESTER · « **Reply #29 on:** March 30, 2007, 04:26:02 AM »

Try racing brake fluid. what you want is the highest boiling point they are over 500deg. there are many suppliers. The dot 7 was specifically mercedes you want to compare different brands like ferrodo ......ate.....pentosin......just something higher.

ESJ JESTER · « **Reply #30 on:** March 30, 2007, 04:27:15 AM »

http://www.raceshopper.com/brake_fluid.shtml

Midnight Rider · « **Reply #31 on:** March 30, 2007, 08:57:57 AM »

S...can't say this for certain, but if I were a betting man, I'd bet that it's not a brake fluid issue, but that you are running stock brake pads and calipers. The pads that come on our bikes are some of the cheapest, low bid products HD can find. Add to that the calipers, and when the pads get heated up, along with your standard calipers and rotors, your brakes suddenly become even less effective.

If you want to see more wheel on front, go to an 18"...Metz makes a 140/70x18 front that is rated very close to stock load ratings....within 40lbs. Overall diameter of wheel/tire is within 1/2" of your stock tire/wheel. That, and more open, floating rotors will let you see more wheel.

JMO

Hoist! · « **Reply #32 on:** March 30, 2007, 12:55:54 PM »

Quote from: SJPZZZ on March 30, 2007, 03:18:45 AM

Help me out here guys.. I am working on a brake up grade,,, Thought about a single disc for the flashy look but am concerned about performance. Right now my twin disc is not keeping up, lots of brake fade. Hoist rides hard as I do. If you went with a larger diameter rotor would it compensate for the loss of the other disc? Keep in mind I am 250 and ride with my FLHTCUI loaded.

I understand that a larger rotor is like having a longer prybar, more leverage. But how does it equate from 2 short to 1 long?

Thanks....

BTW my name is Steven

No way would I give up dual front brakes for a single larger rotor set-up! I'm researching which calipers to use, but I'm retaining the 11.5" rotors. I like the SERK rotors and believe the calipers/pads make the biggest difference. I have HD brakes on my other bikes and have had numerous rear wheel lock-ups, fading brakes, etc. I have PM's on my Pro Street, PM diff bore 4 piston front & 4 piston PM on rear. Night and day. My '85 4-speed has single HD brakes. I have to be much more careful on that bike! I like the 4-pad Brembo idea, but only if they make itfor 11.5 in rotors. Brakes are very important to my riding style. Every aspect of performance is essential to my riding style and looks always take a back seat!!! I have OPD not OCD!

Hoist!

Author Topic: single front disc (Read 8323 times)

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm

hogasm