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CVO Technical => Drive Train => Topic started by: harleygtp on April 26, 2019, 06:45:22 PM
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Recently, the MoCo had completely replaced the part # for clutch packs in the Assist & Slip clutches on all M8 models. The 110" big twin had this same Assist & Slip clutch installed in model years 2014-2016. This new clutch pack has 10 friction plates and 9 steel plates as compared to the previous clutch pack with 9 friction plates and 8 steel plates. This new clutch pack has thinner friction plates to accommodate the additional steel and friction.
I have compared both of these clutch packs and prelimary measurements and comparison leads me to believe this new part # is completely compatible, even though the MoCo and every single dealer I've dealt with will tell you otherwise.
The clutch pack for '14-'16 110" big twins is 37000118
The "new" high capacity clutch plate kit is 37000258
Similarly to earlier years, the M8 crowd has complained about the clutch engagement position of the assist & slip. We big twin owners know this problem all too well. The clutch level being released at around 90-95% before engagement.
Seems as if the MoCo has listened to their feedback, and in 2019 introduced a new damper seat part # 37000295. M8 owners have been replacing their damper seat with this new part number and are reporting a significant improvement in clutch engagement positiion.
The old damper seat part # 37000036
The new damper seat part # 37000295
You can read more about the damper seat swap on another forum in the M8 section.
I am going to update this post regularly with pictures and progress. I hope that with the replacment of the clutch pack to the high capacity kit and the new damper seat, older model 110" with the assist & slip clutch can FINALLY resolve the clutch engagement issues for good.
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Looking forward...
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I don't really have a problem with my '15, but then again, I may have a problem I'm not aware of. Following along to see the end results.
Sent from my boring Droid phone.
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I'm not sure it can be considered a problem. I mean,the clutch does work as intended, I'm just not happy with the engagement point. I've read that others share this sentiment and without a way to adjust the hydraulic clutch, I'm just hoping this fix can help some people who turn to the forums for answers as I did.
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is it a ''problem'' or is it a '' preference '' :nixweiss: on my 13 I changed out the clutch with a bandit and the engagement point was same as stock, for me its a non issue...
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is it a ''problem'' or is it a '' preference '' :nixweiss: on my 13 I changed out the clutch with a bandit and the engagement point was same as stock, for me its a non issue...
Use whatever word you want to, problem, preference, whatever. That's not what this thread is about.
This thread is about those that want to: 1) upgrade their clutch pack to the high-friction clutch pack from the M8's, and 2) adjust their clutch engagement area on a hydraulic clutch with no adjustments available.
Here are some bench pictures to show the comparison between the two clutch packs
(https://i.ibb.co/w6bNx7z/20190428-121803.jpg) (https://ibb.co/w6bNx7z) (https://i.ibb.co/RT2140K/20190428-121808.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RT2140K) (https://i.ibb.co/6PR5r3N/20190428-122018.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6PR5r3N) (https://i.ibb.co/fqwQk53/20190428-122029.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fqwQk53) (https://i.ibb.co/hFPqYw0/20190428-122211.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hFPqYw0) (https://i.ibb.co/594tQHZ/20190428-122257.jpg) (https://ibb.co/594tQHZ) (https://i.ibb.co/9WgBWrZ/20190428-122323.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9WgBWrZ) (https://i.ibb.co/5ch5txv/20190428-122508.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5ch5txv) (https://i.ibb.co/kJFB30K/20190428-122520.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kJFB30K) (https://i.ibb.co/Cb26H0X/20190428-122652.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Cb26H0X)
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1) upgrade... :2vrolijk_21: 2) adjust ??? OR change … its still not adjustable
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1) upgrade... :2vrolijk_21: 2) adjust ??? OR change … its still not adjustable
I think Fast may be missing the point. I have read of many who have complained that their hydraulic clutch grabs too far from the bars, and has a very small friction zone. I definitely appreciate the effort to document the change, I hope it makes an improvement. Time will tell.
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Well, I went ahead and installed both the high-capacity clutch and the new damper seat, eureka!!!!! :apple: :carrot: :jalapeno: :cucumber: :pineapple: :pepper: :2vrolijk_21: Clutch engagement point is definitely improved significantly. Everything installed perfectly, following the same directions as the stock clutch.
So for anyone looking to improve their clutch engagement position without bending your stock lever or buying an adjustable, this is the way to go! Plus the high-capacity clutch now has 10 friction plates instead of 9!
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Well, I went ahead and installed both the high-capacity clutch and the new damper seat, eureka!!!!! :apple: :carrot: :jalapeno: :cucumber: :pineapple: :pepper: :2vrolijk_21: Clutch engagement point is definitely improved significantly. Everything installed perfectly, following the same directions as the stock clutch.
So for anyone looking to improve their clutch engagement position without bending your stock lever or buying an adjustable, this is the way to go! Plus the high-capacity clutch now has 10 friction plates instead of 9!
Glad it did what you were hoping for. What would you say your total cost of the project is?
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Glad it did what you were hoping for. What would you say your total cost of the project is?
G’day harleygtp,
My question exactly OBB. Clutch kit is listed as $219.95 in the H-D online store BUT as stated above only lists retro fitment back to 2017.
I am more interested in it’s performance during heavy stop start traffic conditions on a 2015 at altitude as Lucille has had no clutch at all on a couple of such occasions.
The simple fix is pull over & wait for a bit until it cools down & starts working again. Considering the instant discombobulation it causes me when I suddenly have no clutch in less than ideal conditions, along with the fact that there is not always a suitable spot to pull over in the windy mountain roads, a couple hundred bucks or so seems a reasonable solution.
Cheers Tom
Cheers Tom
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Glad it did what you were hoping for. What would you say your total cost of the project is?
Prices from surdyke.com:
Damper Seat: $12
High-Capacity 10 plate clutch: $202
Primary case cover gasket: $40
2 quarts primary oil: $20
@Major Tom - Yes, the clutch does not cross-reference back to anything prior to the introduction of the M8, but those with the 110" prior to 2017 where equipped with the same assist & slip hydraulic clutch. Not too sure on heavy stop traffic conditions yet. I will report back when I have had the chance to really heat it up.
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Thanks mate
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I should note, it is NOT necessary to change out your clutchpack to install the new damper seat. I could have simply pulled the plates, installed new damper seat, and put plates back in. It's the damper seat that changes the clutch engagement position at the lever.
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How is this set-up working now, with some miles on it?
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How is this set-up working now, with some miles on it?
Ditto what He said.
I never gave my clutch engagement point much thought until you posted this. Now I find myself questioning the stock setup constantly.
Sent from my boring Droid phone.
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I should note, it is NOT necessary to change out your clutchpack to install the new damper seat. I could have simply pulled the plates, installed new damper seat, and put plates back in. It's the damper seat that changes the clutch engagement position at the lever.
$12 to move the engagement point from 90% to 25% let-out is a bargain, especially if you do the work yourself, and it's an easy job. Even some of the Bandit clutches had this problem until they redesigned the damper seat (or spring washer or whatever it was).
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Any pics showing the difference in the damper seats and would that new one fit my 103?