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[mhjimh]

Had a friend and club brother crash this weekend from the well known H-D wobble. This one started in a curve which is the only time I've experienced them. He has a few concutions a cracked rib and a bad cut on his face. My question is does any one now if there is any thing published about this problem other than magizen opinions? Most of my friends have never heard of this problem where I've been reading for years about it.

  Thanks Jim

[Chief]

Had a friend and club brother crash this weekend from the well known H-D wobble. This one started in a curve which is the only time I've experienced them. He has a few concutions a cracked rib and a bad cut on his face. My question is does any one now if there is any thing published about this problem other than magizen opinions? Most of my friends have never heard of this problem where I've been reading for years about it.

  Thanks Jim

I've never seen anything like you're looking for. Sorry.

[RedDevil]

I've been riding HD's for quite awhile and have never experienced the "infamous harley wobble", nor have I seen anything on it.  Sorry I can't help ya either. 
Cheers ,
 

[mhjimh]

Ya I've had 5 baggers since 1996 and only my 2007 have I felt it.

[murphy]

There are threads here that describe it... you just need to locate them.

It used to happen to me when I first got my Ultra.

[DavidB]

The only time I have seen the wobble was on a guys bike that had really low
front tire pressure and it happened while decelerating. Guess the tire was squishing
out like mashing on a water baloon from the down force.

[Ceej]

It's not just a HD thing - Years ago I had the same wobble on my Yamaha Venture....

[Screamin]

Search the threads for High Speed Wobble.  I think you'll find plenty.

[mhjimh]

Thanks; I've read every thing on the site, but I was more looking for something offical possable from the DOT, government or (GOD FORBID) H-D on the problem.

[Midnight Rider]

I've never seen anything about it referencing DOT, and forget about HD.

Lot's of discussion on various forums though.

[spydglide]

Thanks; I've read every thing on the site, but I was more looking for something offical possable from the DOT, government or (GOD FORBID) H-D on the problem.

I can tell you it's a frightening experience that you won't be soon forgetting even if you're successful in not experiencing the full blown tank slapper, rather the wobble that feels like you've pretty much lost control a do whatever you can to ride it out.  I think there are many causes......but I'm not sure where you'd look for a 'offical' discussion.  spyder

[Ironhorse]

Google it. You will find links to lots of info.

I had a wobble with my Ultra two years ago. Doing 75-80 on the freeway passing cars when it just started. I think wind buffeting was a factor, but I can't say for sure. I got it under control and have not had a wobble since. It does stick in the back of my mind though.

[ccr]

My husband and I virtually have the same bikes, except for the color.  He has never had a wobble on his. I get a wobble on mine.  I have found though, that I can bring it on and somewhat control it too, as long as it has not gotten too bad.  It always is a surprise when it happens, it is not at all times in the same conditions.  Usually only happens when you are in a slight curve going quite fast.  For me, if I wiggle around in my seat - front to back - I can find the good spot that pulls the bike back to straight and not wobbling.  Otherwise I gotta slow down.  I only had the tank slap thing happen one time, and that was three years ago and I slowed waaaaaaaaayyyyyyy down.  Never had it that bad again.  I also keep the fall over in the neck tighter than HD recommended.  That is what works for me.  Everyone has their own tricks, if they have the problem at all.  Hubbard said he put his foot out on the crash bar and stabilized his.  But as for official? ,from my understanding no one is admitting that it really happens at all from the MoCo point of view. I've never been in a position though that I could not recover from it.  Hope your buddy and his bike heals quickly. 

[Midnight Rider]

Yea, Candy...the only time mine might "wiggle" just a little bit is 85-90 in big sweepers like interstate exchanges.  Loosening up the grip on the bars helps.  Fortunately, I've never experienced what others describe, but I've only had mine up to 115 or so for a few minutes at a time...I just don't run my machine like that...I get the thrill, then I'm done.

There have even been reports of this happening on Vrods, so it's not isolated to the FL bikes.  My V is rock solid up to speeds that scare me.

[Chief]

Yea, Candy...the only time mine might "wiggle" just a little bit is 85-90 in big sweepers like interstate exchanges.  Loosening up the grip on the bars helps.  Fortunately, I've never experienced what others describe, but I've only had mine up to 115 or so for a few minutes at a time...I just don't run my machine like that...I get the thrill, then I'm done.

There have even been reports of this happening on Vrods, so it's not isolated to the FL bikes.  My V is rock solid up to speeds that scare me.

  I've been there, but for time that can be measured by counting Mississippis, not minutes. 

[Hugh Janis]

I went down on my Goldwing GL1100 in 1985 from a tank slapper in a curve.  The bad news is I was on the back letting a friend drive it.  He came into the curve too fast and had to hit the breaks hard before leaning it in.  He ended up in one ditch I ended up in the other.  It's never happened on my HD but I ride a little more cautious than I used to.....

[ccr]

I've been there, but for time that can be measured by counting Mississippis, not minutes. 

  em

  eye

  es


  es

  eye
 
  es

  es

  eye

  pee

  pee

  eye

OK,  I may have held it for a few seconds longer than that.      But really, I was always trying to diminish that distance between myself and my husband as he was bee bopping to his music and not realising that the great divide was enlarging between us.   

[Chief]

  em

  eye

  es


  es

  eye
 
  es

  es

  eye

  pee

  pee

  eye

OK,  I may have held it for a few seconds longer than that.      But really, I was always trying to diminish that distance between myself and my husband as he was bee bopping to his music and not realising that the great divide was enlarging between us.   

Well, I was on I-75 going through Marietta at the time and didn't think keeping it pegged in the left lane was the best decision, so I backed off. I'm sure I shocked a few cagers in the process. 

[ccr]

and that's your story and your sticking to it.

I've only exceeded the speed limit for milliseconds and only to avoid a possible problem to keep myself and others safe.  Honest.   

[mr_magoo]

Saw something awhile back when CHP was evaluating Harley's for a new fleet purchase where they talked about the high speed wobble and how they would not purchase the bikes because of that,  will look around and see if I can find it.

[spydglide]

Yea, Candy...the only time mine might "wiggle" just a little bit is 85-90 in big sweepers like interstate exchanges.  Loosening up the grip on the bars helps. 

Yep, me too on those.....I think the undulating road-surface actually might be what induces it in those sweepers.  JMHO.  Who knows actually what causes 'em, or what works to stop 'um.....all I know is they're scary as chit if they start suddenly.     spyder

[RJ749]

I never thought about it as this when I bit the dust this past summer in Nelson with Cindy on the back but what tossed us was a tank slapper in the sand.

I braked in the corner, obviously was going to hit a giant chuck hole, eased to the right to get around it braking front and rear and got the tank slap going onto the shoulder/parking strip.  I just figured they do that when over cooked in a corner and braking hard etc.

Never thought of it as a defect of the bike in that case (only of the dumbass rider ME).  Maybe I have another excuse?  Nah, just the dumbass rider in my case I guess.

The tank slapper wasn't any fun though and it gave me no chance to control a role out to a stop.

[spydglide]

Very few have ever come out good on a 'tank-slapper'.....I've seen lots of professional riders (racing) get tank slappers and most go down.  Just too violent and quick to re-gain control.  spyder

[RJ749]

Very few have ever come out good on a 'tank-slapper'.....I've seen lots of professional riders (racing) get tank slappers and most go down.  Just too violent and quick to re-gain control.  spyder

I'd agree Spyd, Cindy said afterward I must have told her to hold on 15 times in 5 seconds and it was over, dumped my a$$ and tossed her too.  She had some road rash (first time ever riding in a T-shirt for her).  Doubt she would have had any visible damage other than the scuff on her helmet if she'd had any kind of a sleeved garment on.

I still have a mark (dark spot) on my shin from the contusion I got when my leg kicked some part of the bike in the fall.

I seldom notice anything from the twisted knee etc. that I got.  Don't plan on doing it again.  First time I'd been down in 40 years of riding.  Really pizzed me off, but all turned out ok.  We rode away from it so I guess any crash you can ride away from is good in that sense anyway.  I was just a bit too aggressive for the quality of the road surface and it bit me.

[ccr]

...I still have a mark (dark spot) on my shin from the contusion I got when my leg kicked some part of the bike in the fall.

I seldom notice anything from the twisted knee etc. that I got.  Don't plan on doing it again.  First time I'd been down in 40 years of riding.  Really pizzed me off, but all turned out ok.  We rode away from it so I guess any crash you can ride away from is good in that sense anyway.  I was just a bit too aggressive for the quality of the road surface and it bit me.

Wow,  that is a long time for a bruize, isn't it?  So glad is was not worse. Your right.  If you ride away from a downing, it is good.  Glad the knee is not bothering you too. 

[RJ749]

Wow,  that is a long time for a bruize, isn't it?  So glad is was not worse. Your right.  If you ride away from a downing, it is good.  Glad the knee is not bothering you too. 

Thanks Candy, no problem with the knee now, it took several months though, of course Cindy always asks what the Doc said.....I just give her a knowing smile and chuckle a bit.  I maybe should have had it looked at, but they would have just said to sell the bike and stay of the knee.  If I'd done that how the hell would I get to Sedona and be able to sit on top of a ten thousand foot mountain to watch elk during hunting season? 

Sell the bike....NOT. 

[ccr]

Thanks Candy, no problem with the knee now, it took several months though, of course Cindy always asks what the Doc said.....I just give her a knowing smile and chuckle a bit.  ...

Well, watch it still.  Jamey never heeded the docs warning about taking it easy after a couple of breaks in his back, and at a very young 46, he's pretty crippled up now.  It sucks when the body can't execute what the mind wants to accomplish.  We'll see you in Sedona this spring. Can't wait. 

[Midnight Rider]

Well, watch it still.  Jamey never heeded the docs warning about taking it easy after a couple of breaks in his back, and at a very young 46, he's pretty crippled up now.  It sucks when the body can't execute what the mind wants to accomplish.  We'll see you in Sedona this spring. Can't wait. 

Hey Candy...those are lyrics to a Little Feat song: 

Old Folks Boogie

Off our rockers, actin' crazy
With the right medication we won't be lazy
Doin' the old folks boogie
Down on the farm
Wheelchairs, they was locked arm in arm
Paired off pacemakers with matchin' alarms
Gives us jus' one more chance
To spin one more yarn

And you know that you're over the hill
When your mind makes a promise that your body can't fill
Doin' the old folks boogie
And boogie we will
'Cause to us the thought's as good as a thrill

Back at the home,
No time is your own,
Facillities there, they're all out on loan
The bank forclose, and your bankruptcy shows
And your credit creeps to an all-time low
So you know, that you're over the hill
When your mind makes a promise that your body can't fill

Try and get a rise from an atrophied muscle,
And the nerves in your thigh just quivers and fizzles
So you know, that you're over the hill
When your mind makes a promise that your body can't fill

[Midnight Rider]

I never thought about it as this when I bit the dust this past summer in Nelson with Cindy on the back but what tossed us was a tank slapper in the sand.

I braked in the corner, obviously was going to hit a giant chuck hole, eased to the right to get around it braking front and rear and got the tank slap going onto the shoulder/parking strip.  I just figured they do that when over cooked in a corner and braking hard etc.

Never thought of it as a defect of the bike in that case (only of the dumbass rider ME).  Maybe I have another excuse?  Nah, just the dumbass rider in my case I guess.

The tank slapper wasn't any fun though and it gave me no chance to control a role out to a stop.

You'd just used everything up you had available, Rog.  Just so glad you guys came out relatively unscathed, and the scoot was not badly damaged.

[ccr]

Hey Candy...those are lyrics to a Little Feat song: 

Old Folks Boogie

...So you know, that you're over the hill
When your mind makes a promise that your body can't fill

 

That's a good one.   Thanks Terry.   

[grc]

You don't even have to be on a motorcycle to experience the wobble or a "tank slapper"; I've actually experienced a milder version on a bicycle way back in my past, and I remember working on several pick-up trucks in the mid 70's that had a similar front end shake after hitting a bump (plastic kingpin bushings, non-power steering, shook hard enough to break your wrist if you got your hand trapped in the steering wheel).  If you look at most racing bikes or off-road racing trucks, you will find a steering damper installed to help dampen the shaking movements and give you a chance to regain control.  Doesn't always help, but it's better than nothing.

Personally, I've experienced the milder form of wobble several times on my Harley, and every time it was at speeds over 80 mph while in a sweeping curve after hitting a slight bump.  The abnormally steep steering head angle and excessive trail of the FLH, which makes for excellent low speed handling for those parades, is the factor I tend to believe is the real problem.  It doesn't create the initial instability, it just doesn't effectively dampen the motion after other factors initiate it.  It is imperative with this front end that the steering head bearings be in excellent condition and properly adjusted.

Jerry

[megavolt17]

I had a wobble at certain speeds on my Honda CB 360 (1974 I think), had to go above or below those speeds and I was fine.

On my 1998 Road Glide I had a front end wobble at 35 mph while slowing down, but it only happened if I was riding with my hands off the steering wheel.

I don't think you can categorize any particular bike as having a wobble problem. It seems to be unique and can be affected by tire pressure, tire condition, suspension condition, loading, etc.

[RJ749]

You'd just used everything up you had available, Rog.  Just so glad you guys came out relatively unscathed, and the scoot was not badly damaged.

Yep TC, all of it and then some, the shop called and my new fender is in.  Picking it up will be the last bit of pain I have from the incident (probably the most too).

[mhjimh]

Thanks for the comments doesn't look like my friend is going to do to good on this one, he is blind in his right eye and the Doctors don't think it will come back. His face hit the road pretty hard on that side, not sure he'll recover mintally either. Very sad because he grue up in a side hack and his 81 year old dad still rides.

[RJ749]

Thanks for the comments doesn't look like my friend is going to do to good on this one, he is blind in his right eye and the Doctors don't think it will come back. His face hit the road pretty hard on that side, not sure he'll recover mintally either. Very sad because he grue up in a side hack and his 81 year old dad still rides.

Really sorry to hear that your friend is in such tough shape Jim. 

Our thoughts and prayers go out for him.

[Serkcus]

I remember all of the tank slapper problems with the early Gold Wings. Too many years have gone by to remember the years involved, but I do recall Honda came up with a fix which involved a fairly heavy weight that was retrofitted to the steering head. They found at the time that excessive weight on rear would make the front end light and facilitate the wobble.

[rmarion]

I have it in my 06 F-350 Ford.....

I had it happen once while racing MX......... (had to change my shorts)

never on the HD, but I know it's there............

IMO, if your bike does not track straight with no hands........ your vunerable to the wooble.........

I hope your friend heals fast........

[RedDevil]

Jim,
Sorry to hear that your friend didn't come out of the accident better.  Our prayers go out to him and hope for the best possible recovery.
 

[HUBBARD]

Jim,
  Man, that's not good.  I'm real sad for him.  My hope is his mind can, and will return to normal.  Doctor's don't know everything.  As for the "wooble", I've experienced it at high speed on every Harley I've owned, since 1976, when I had a Super-Glide.  Can't remember it on the earlier Harley's.  Then, again, I don't remember much of anything back in those days.  In sort of a "fog", if you get my drift.  As I have posted here before, putting my left foot on the high-way peg, (I removed my lower-fairings), on the crash bar, totally eliminated the wobble on Ol' Maudie.  Most folks don't believe that, but OTIS has seen it in person.  I'm talking about WFO, for miles and miles, too!  It has to do with the aerodynamics, IMO.  Later--HUBBARD 

[Jock]

Sorry to read of your friend's experience...there have been plenty of statements made regarding this matter and I for one have them on both CVOs.  It is my belief that there are many reasons for them and perhaps not a single one of them.  I have grown to know when they will occur and prepare myself to work them out.

GOD speed on the recovery.

[amigo Jorge]

Really sorry about what happened to your friend. Fortunately I haven't felt the wobble in the two baggers that I have had........Hopefuly your friend recover soon.....

[Talon]

I just reread a article from Bike Works Sept 06 on dresser wobble.

Daytec Center in Hesperia, CA did the work, I'll try to give a condensed rundown of what they found and what they did.

They worked on a 01 Dresser, it had a highspeed wobble starting at about 85mph, also in highspeed sweeping turns, it already had a Tru-Track stabilizer on the bike.

- First they put the bike on a level frame lift, I think it was made to do this work, got the bikes frame level.
- Some initial measurements were taken, to make sure the rear wheel was adjusted in the swingarm properly, it was very close.
- Removed mufflers, front and rear tire, rear shocks.
- They connected an adjustable rod from the frame to one of the brake caliper mounting holes on the forks and adjusted it to is was held
   exactly straight with relation to the frame.
- They installed a new Daytec swing arm, the isolator bushings were pretty warn, so they were replaced when the swingarm was installed.
- the rear axle was installed and adjust as to where it would be correct with the swing arm if the wheel was on. Then an adjustable rod was attached
  from the upper frame to the rear axle and adjusted to hold it at correct ride height as the shocks were removed.
- using a trammel they measured from the center of the rear axle to the center of the swing arm pivot points, this was adjusted to get the axle exactly
  aligned in the swingarm.
- Then a longer trammel was used to check from the center of the rear axle to the center of the front axle, it was a 1/8 out.
- So since the rear axle was correct with the swingarm they needed to move the swingarm side to side, they removed the front motor mounting bolt, so
  they could adjust the front motor stabilizer side to side, which will in turn moves the trans and swing arm side to side like a rudder.
- The stabilizer was adjusted until the tramels showed that the distance between the center points on the front and rear axle meassured exactly the
   same on both sides, then locked down the stabilizer.
- Next the two bolts that hold the front motor mount were loosen so it could be realigned to match the change in the stabilizer. then the top bolt was
   installed to the motor, then the two bottom bolts were tightened down.
- The motor vertical alignment was checked and adjusted but the top motor stabilizer.
- Then everything was reinstalled and taken for a ride.

It fixed the wobble, most people won't do this at home, but just thought I'd share a really condensed overview of this article. If you have a wobble, you should get you bike to a competent shop that can do this alignment.
I still thing that some type of stabilizer, or added bushings are needed to take out some of the slop in the rubber mounted swing arm, but I'd get the alignment checked if you having a serious wobble first.

[spydglide]

thanks for posting this Talon.  It all sounds very 'reasonable' that the different bikes experiencing 'wobble' or not could be related to an 'alignment' problem.  I still believe that other things could cause wobble on our bikes whether rubber mounted or not.  But, every bit of actual data helps us figure this malady out.     spyder

[Chief]

thanks for posting this Talon.  It all sounds very 'reasonable' that the different bikes experiencing 'wobble' or not could be related to an 'alignment' problem.  I still believe that other things could cause wobble on our bikes whether rubber mounted or not.  But, every bit of actual data helps us figure this malady out.     spyder

I've never tried this, but I have often read to use two 8' flourescent tubes to check the alignment. The tubes are vey straight and don't bend.

Lift the motorcycle and attach one tube on each side of the rear wheel. You can then look at how the tubes relate to the front wheel. They should be parallel and have the same gap on both sides. Depending on your tire widths, you may need to get creative. I don't know if this would be a good way to align the bike, but if there is an alignment problem, this may help you see it better.

[Talon]

thanks for posting this Talon.  It all sounds very 'reasonable' that the different bikes experiencing 'wobble' or not could be related to an 'alignment' problem.  I still believe that other things could cause wobble on our bikes whether rubber mounted or not.  But, every bit of actual data helps us figure this malady out.     spyder

I agree, there are many things that can cause wobble, tires, tire pressure, fall away adjustment incorrect, but I have read several threads on this site, that people have tried many of the common cures, but still have a wobble. I have new tires but still have a weave in high speed sweepers. Just thought I'd throw this out, looks like the format screwed up a little when posted, oh well. Just an option, start with the easiest and cheapest first and work until you get it fixed.

[FNGw/08SERK]

I've never tried this, but I have often read to use two 8' flourescent tubes to check the alignment. The tubes are vey straight and don't bend.

Lift the motorcycle and attach one tube on each side of the rear wheel. You can then look at how the tubes relate to the front wheel. They should be parallel and have the same gap on both sides. Depending on your tire widths, you may need to get creative. I don't know if this would be a good way to align the bike, but if there is an alignment problem, this may help you see it better.

Here comes another FNG question sorry. Do the HD dealers do an alignment check prior to delivery??  

[Chief]

Here comes another FNG question sorry. Do the HD dealers do an alignment check prior to delivery??  

No.

[Twolanerider]

Here comes another FNG question sorry. Do the HD dealers do an alignment check prior to delivery??  

 



A surprising number of dealers don't have the right tools to do an accurate alignment test at all.  As for doing it during setup; that's just a an assembly.  If nothing's obviously broke they don't fix it.

[mhjimh]

Thanks again everyone, the insurance totaled his bike and with all the info from every one I've come up with a list of problems that may have contributed to this. Hubbart he did have the canvis fairing lowers on, he had 150 miles on a new rear tire, the curve was a very slit curve with a crest on it, going to fast, had a few , the dealer that installed the rear tire had 4oz. of weight on it(was it really balanced), it was 32 degrees so I'm sure the tires where hard and possable under inflated, had a lot of crap in one saddle bag and tour pak and nothing in the other bag, this same bike had the frame replaced from hitting a deer 2 years ago(was it aligned), and the list of small thing go on. So I think everyone is right, any thing can start this off (and as said before we just need to figure out how to get out of it when it starts) and he is doing real good, wants me to go shopping with him in a few week for another bike !!

[ccr]

... and he is doing real good, wants me to go shopping with him in a few week for another bike !!

The best news.  He will take it easy to begin with.  This will be a good thing.  Wow,  it was not sounding this good at first.  Thanks for keeping us up to date.

[mhjimh]

The best news.  He will take it easy to begin with.  This will be a good thing.  Wow,  it was not sounding this good at first.  Thanks for keeping us up to date.

He does have a few reconstruction surgerys to go through so it may be more than a few weeks. He said it was like he was asleep for 3 weeks and is just now waking up.

[ccr]

He does have a few reconstruction surgeries to go through so it may be more than a few weeks. He said it was like he was asleep for 3 weeks and is just now waking up.

You know,  a few weeks, a few months, a few years ............. whatever it takes as long as it is progress.  Thanks and send all of our best wishes. 

[spydglide]

Yes, very good news.  I'm glad he's doing this well and hope he'll continue to improve.    spyder

[RedDevil]

That's great news that he's starting to come along better...just tell him to let the healing happen naturally and don't push anything.  He'll be back on the road in no time if he does.

   

[Dan_Lockwood]

He does have a few reconstruction surgerys to go through so it may be more than a few weeks. He said it was like he was asleep for 3 weeks and is just now waking up.

Really sorry to hear about your friends accident.  I wonder about my new SERK as to how soon it will be, if ever, before I get the wobble.  I've thought about the stabilizers between the trans and frame, but even with them it sounds still like a crap shoot.

One thing I didn't see in any of the posts, maybe I missed, what type of helmet was he wearing; 1/2, 3/4, full etc.

Good luck to your friend and a speedy recovery.

[mhjimh]

One thing I didn't see in any of the posts, maybe I missed, what type of helmet was he wearing; 1/2, 3/4, full etc.


[/quote]Well, we where discusing that, on that day. And as he put it, it should be each individuals choice!! (He was not wearing a helmet) We both are very active in our local ABATE chapter and only wear them in states with a helmet law. This is just my oppinion but I don't think he'll wear one after this.

[megavolt17]

Has anybody "upgraded" from a Road Glide to an Ultra (or SE Ultra)?     I would not say my bike handles badly, but it certainly does not feel as stable as my old Goad Glide did.  Wind affects it much more, and at low speed it does not feel as sure footed.  I am sure that part of this is that I need to get used to it (only drove it 300 miles before it got too cold/icy to ride).

Since it does not seem to pull to the right or left this is not likely an alignment problem, correct?    I thought the dealers (or HD) aligned the bikes before they sold them to us.  How would I know if I had a problem with the alignment?  I really have never had a wobble, at least not a bad one, but that is not on my to-do list! 

[Midnight Rider]

Has anybody "upgraded" from a Road Glide to an Ultra (or SE Ultra)?     I would not say my bike handles badly, but it certainly does not feel as stable as my old Goad Glide did.  Wind affects it much more, and at low speed it does not feel as sure footed.  I am sure that part of this is that I need to get used to it (only drove it 300 miles before it got too cold/icy to ride).

Since it does not seem to pull to the right or left this is not likely an alignment problem, correct?    I thought the dealers (or HD) aligned the bikes before they sold them to us.  How would I know if I had a problem with the alignment?  I really have never had a wobble, at least not a bad one, but that is not on my to-do list! 

M...I'm not sure I'd consider going from a RG to a UC an "upgrade", as their function is the same, but they are two really different bikes.  The low speed handling is because of the extra weight on the handlebars with the Batwing.  The Batwing is sorta like pushing a piece of plywood through the air at speed.  It is affected more by turbulence coming off of semi's, etc.  It's something you just get used to.  Regarding the dealer aligning the bike before delivery...when pigs fly!!  If you can take your hands off the grips on a FLAT road, and the bike does not pull one way or the other, alignment is probably OK, accounting for the crown in the road surface.  The Traxxion front suspension upgrade will help a LOT with both low speed handling, and tracking/handling in general.

[SBB]

M...I'm not sure I'd consider going from a RG to a UC an "upgrade",

Thank you T/C!

 

[Twolanerider]

M...I'm not sure I'd consider going from a RG to a UC an "upgrade"

Thank you T/C!

 

I'd be in the same choir.

[RedDevil]

I'd be in the same choir.

I'd have to agree with that sentiment also. 

     

[magic-rat]

At Maggie Valley this year on the way home from a "gap" run, I watched a CVO Harley (Pete) do that.

I had cameras rolling but we were on a wide open 2 lane road with nobody around and he was in the lane next to me just off camera.

Essentially, it kicked in someplace between 90 and 110 mph on a very slight bend in the road ... max 10 degrees ... probably closer to 8 ... very subtle turn.  The bike seemed to kind of "resonate" ... sorta bounce about an inch up and down and maybe 1/4" to the right and left.

It was the back of the bike that was doing this (not the front) ... and it was very visible to me following on his back right.

I actually slowed down when I saw it because I wanted to put some distance between us in case he needed some space to recover.  He slowed down, too.  It definitely looked like it had the potential to turn into a tank slapper.

At the next stop, he told me it was a "known problem" and that when he felt it he backed off.

[Mikey]

My local dealer service department told me these bikes are not designed or tested to run 100 mph. Harley does not admit a wobble exists. I notice rear tire air pressure effects the wobble a lot.
I collect Classic Muscle Bikes, mostly three and four cylinder, and most of them have hand adjustable steering dampers on the steering stem. As Harley calls, adjusting the swing. Some have hydraulic steering dampers on the side also.
These are designed to prevent tank slap. The faster you ride the tighter they need to be. That stops the wobble. That might be a nice upgrade for Harley.
Mikey

[arcticdude]

Has anybody "upgraded" from a Road Glide to an Ultra (or SE Ultra)?    

The wife went from her 01 SERG to the 06 CUSE and definnitely noticed a difference.  The SERG is MUCH more stable at speed than the CUSE (or ANY ultra, for that matter).  It handles better at low speed once you get over the size of the fairing in front of you.  One of the reasons the Goldwing does so well is it's frame mounted faring.  It doesn't push the bike around like a fork mounted one does.  You'll ONLY see frame mounted fairings on high speed bikes because of the handling abilities.  We met a couple at the 2002 Alaska State HOG rally on a new "Ultra Road Glide".  We got chatting with them and found the had a brand new Ultra, rode to one of the demo ride sites that year, road a Road Glide and immediately traded the Ultra for the Road Glide!  They couldn't believe the difference.  Ask the guys who ride the Road Glides, they'll tell you what's what!  If the moco would build a SERG with a full sized tourpak, CB and the other goodies you find on an Ultra, there'd be 2 in our drive.  The batwings LOOK better, but ain't chit when you want to "ride".

arctic

[megavolt17]

The wife went from her 01 SERG to the 06 CUSE and definnitely noticed a difference.  The SERG is MUCH more stable at speed than the CUSE (or ANY ultra, for that matter).  It handles better at low speed once you get over the size of the fairing in front of you.  One of the reasons the Goldwing does so well is it's frame mounted faring.  It doesn't push the bike around like a fork mounted one does.  You'll ONLY see frame mounted fairings on high speed bikes because of the handling abilities.  We met a couple at the 2002 Alaska State HOG rally on a new "Ultra Road Glide".  We got chatting with them and found the had a brand new Ultra, rode to one of the demo ride sites that year, road a Road Glide and immediately traded the Ultra for the Road Glide!  They couldn't believe the difference.  Ask the guys who ride the Road Glides, they'll tell you what's what!  If the moco would build a SERG with a full sized tourpak, CB and the other goodies you find on an Ultra, there'd be 2 in our drive.  The batwings LOOK better, but ain't chit when you want to "ride".

arctic

After riding a Road Glide for 10 years I do notice a difference in the handling of my new Ultra Glide.  I like the look of the UG and the engine and brakes are a step up, but I do not like any wind or trucks at high speed.  It buffets so much when you are following a truck, or any large vehicle.  It fights going straight when there is a cross wind.

We had a warmer than expected day this past Thursday and I took my bike to work.  I road on I81 and took it to 75mph and there was a long stretch and I thought I'd see how it accelerated and give the engine a chance to break in at a higher speed.  I pushed it quickly to 90mph in 6th and as I passed a semi and was about to slow down and pull back into the slower lane I thought I was experiencing a wobble.  Once I finished the pass it stabilized and I had no problem with the rest of the trip.  I don't think it was a wobble, I think it was buffeting from the wind off the truck, but I am not 100% sure. 

I never thought about wind, cross wind, truck passing, etc. on my RG.  I am a bit anxious about what will happen the next time I pass a truck.  Does anyone make a kit to mount the Ultra's fairing to the frame?  If it's under $5,000 I'm doing it, no hesitation.  Are there any suspension or other parts I could add to lessen this buffeting effect? 

I will probably get used to the handling, but I have to agree that I think this bike is inherently less stable then my last.  I will likely comply with doing the speed limit more often in the future.  The way I feel now if they come out with a SE Road Glide in the future I may trade for it.  I added an Ultra Kit to my old RG so I had the CB, rear tour pack, cruise control,etc.  This was not an enjoyable ride home! 

[Midnight Rider]

After riding a Road Glide for 10 years I do notice a difference in the handling of my new Ultra Glide.  I like the look of the UG and the engine and brakes are a step up, but I do not like any wind or trucks at high speed.  It buffets so much when you are following a truck, or any large vehicle.  It fights going straight when there is a cross wind.

We had a warmer than expected day this past Thursday and I took my bike to work.  I road on I81 and took it to 75mph and there was a long stretch and I thought I'd see how it accelerated and give the engine a chance to break in at a higher speed.  I pushed it quickly to 90mph in 6th and as I passed a semi and was about to slow down and pull back into the slower lane I thought I was experiencing a wobble.  Once I finished the pass it stabilized and I had no problem with the rest of the trip.  I don't think it was a wobble, I think it was buffeting from the wind off the truck, but I am not 100% sure. 

I never thought about wind, cross wind, truck passing, etc. on my RG.  I am a bit anxious about what will happen the next time I pass a truck.  Does anyone make a kit to mount the Ultra's fairing to the frame?  If it's under $5,000 I'm doing it, no hesitation.  Are there any suspension or other parts I could add to lessen this buffeting effect? 

I will probably get used to the handling, but I have to agree that I think this bike is inherently less stable then my last.  I will likely comply with doing the speed limit more often in the future.  The way I feel now if they come out with a SE Road Glide in the future I may trade for it.  I added an Ultra Kit to my old RG so I had the CB, rear tour pack, cruise control,etc.  This was not an enjoyable ride home! 

The buffeting is never going to completely go away, but it can be MUCH, MUCH improved (the total stability of the bike) with the Traxxion AK-20 cartridge forks and better (Bitubo) rear shocks.  You would be amazed at how much different the bike feels with the fork upgrade.  On a RG, I would guess the difference in handling would be even more dramatic.

[Twolanerider]

There is also one little (and cheap) thing that can help the buffeting on an EG a surprising amount.  It's that little wind baffle more commonly used on Road Kings.  58520-79TC.  This thing:

[Hobo]

I added that to the SERG and it noticably helped the wind turbulance that comes from between the gas tank and fairing. Well worth the money weather it helps the wobble or not.

Hobo

[spydglide]

Will it make my motor run cooler?    spyder

[Hobo]

Will it make my motor run cooler?    spyder

I don't think it does, but did really help turbulance behind the winshield.

Hobo

[Fired00d]

Will it make my motor run cooler?    spyder

It's chrome it doesn't have to. It is on a I know of.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[ccr]

Will it make my motor run cooler?    spyder

Definately will make the SEEG look cooler.   

[Twolanerider]

Will it make my motor run cooler?    spyder

Who knows for sure ?  It does help the turbulence.  It at least doesn't hurt engine temps; even with lowers on.

[REGGAB]

There is also one little (and cheap) thing that can help the buffeting on an EG a surprising amount.  It's that little wind baffle more commonly used on Road Kings.  58520-79TC.  This thing:

Really?  Stock?  Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

[REGGAB]

It's chrome it doesn't have to. It is on a I know of.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

OK..........I'll laugh at that.   

[Boatman]

Really?  Stock?  Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Henry-
It used to be stock on Glides and Ultra's too until the MOCO figured they could charge extra for it.      I don't believe it makes the engine run hotter (I leave mine on year round).  When actually mounted on the bike, it looks like it funnels the air (that used to go up the tank) down on the engine and would aid in cooling (but what do I know).  Bob

[REGGAB]

Henry-
It used to be stock on Glides and Ultra's too until the MOCO figured they could charge extra for it.      I don't believe it makes the engine run hotter (I leave mine on year round).  When actually mounted on the bike, it looks like it funnels the air (that used to go up the tank) down on the engine and would aid in cooling (but what do I know).  Bob

I'm not sure about earlier models, or 2006 and beyond, but Tony's (father-in-law) 05 FLTRI came with one of those in black out of the crate.  I've seen other FLTRs with them as well.  Never seen an FLHT or FLHR with one stock.  That's a pretty funky, vortex laden area down there.  Heck I wonder about the effectivity of the oil cooler in that area.  Anyway, my deflector is on, it works, and I'm OK with that.

[Chief]

Will it make my motor run cooler?    spyder

When the Twin Cams came out in 1999, they first came with that shield on there. I believe it was in 2000 that a Bulletin came out of Milwaukee reccomending that the baffle be removed to allow more air pass to the rear cylinder. This was all because of the complaints of the excessive heat from the Twin Cams. Gee, is it 2000 all over again?

[sadunbar]

I'm not sure about earlier models, or 2006 and beyond, but Tony's (father-in-law) 05 FLTRI came with one of those in black out of the crate.  I've seen other FLTRs with them as well.  Never seen an FLHT or FLHR with one stock.  That's a pretty funky, vortex laden area down there.  Heck I wonder about the effectivity of the oil cooler in that area.  Anyway, my deflector is on, it works, and I'm OK with that.

Took this picture at the Chicago show today....it is a Ducati...one end is attacted to the frame and the other end is attached to the tree...

[spydglide]

Took this picture at the Chicago show today....it is a Ducati...one end is attacted to the frame and the other end is attached to the tree...

Does it come in 'chrome'?  har!  spyder

[HUBBARD]

Does it come in 'chrome'?  har!  spyder

  Later--HUBBARD

[HUBBARD]

Guys, I'm tellin' ya'!  Get rid of them pansy a$$ lowers, put some hi-way pegs on your crash bars, and lay that big left foot up there on it when you're doin' 100+MPH, and you're wobble is history.  Don't scoff until you try it.  Trust me.  I'm tellin' 'ya, it works!  It's all about aerodynamics.  There endeth the lesson.  Later--HUBBARD

[spydglide]

Guys, I'm tellin' ya'!  Get rid of them pansy a$$ lowers, put some hi-way pegs on your crash bars, and lay that big left foot up there on it when you're doin' 100+MPH, and you're wobble is history.  Don't scoff until you try it.  Trust me.  I'm tellin' 'ya, it works!  It's all about aerodynamics.  There endeth the lesson.  Later--HUBBARD

OR, just buy and ride a Road Glide like your 'buddies', and you won't have ANY aero problems, either!  (you ole 'road-dog')  har!  spyder

[magic-rat]

... and to stay in on the fun in this post  ...

There's always that "buy a race bike to add to your stable" option 

I'm tellin ya, that new Buell 1125 is HOT!

[spydglide]

... and to stay in on the fun in this post  ...

There's always that "buy a race bike to add to your stable" option 

I'm tellin ya, that new Buell 1125 is HOT!

Hey Magic......you gonna spring for one?  If only I was your age.... .....har!  spyder

[Fired00d]

Hey Magic......you gonna spring for one?  If only I was your age.... .....har!  spyder

Ain't that the truth!! Can you just imagine our ole arthritic/bionic parts arse sliding across the seat hanging off the side of one of those bikes.

We'd get set up for the first turn and wouldn't recover until the lap had finished and it was time to set up for the first turn again.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[spydglide]

Ain't that the truth!! Can you just imagine our ole arthritic/bionic parts arse sliding across the seat hanging off the side of one of those bikes.

We'd get set up for the first turn and wouldn't recover until the lap had finished and it was time to set up for the first turn again.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

Well, as 2lane would say:  spewwwwww!    har!  spyder

[REGGAB]

Guys, I'm tellin' ya'!  Get rid of them pansy a$$ lowers, put some hi-way pegs on your crash bars, and lay that big left foot up there on it when you're doin' 100+MPH, and you're wobble is history.  Don't scoff until you try it.  Trust me.  I'm tellin' 'ya, it works!  It's all about aerodynamics.  There endeth the lesson.  Later--HUBBARD

  I ain't scoffin', but that's there's some funny chit.


Tried it on my 02 Ultra.  Scooter wobbled.  Lesson learned:  Don't do 100+ MPH.


Next lesson:  Best I recall, I've never experienced a wobble on my SEUC, not like that old Bagger anyway............with, or without lowers..............WELL above 100MPH.............not that I stayed there that long.   Now, I need to find some wood on which to knock.   

[REGGAB]

... and to stay in on the fun in this post  ...

There's always that "buy a race bike to add to your stable" option 

I'm tellin ya, that new Buell 1125 is HOT!

You ain't just kiddin' either, Pat.  That thing is a screamer.  What a metric chit ton of fun.  Still tryin' to wipe this grin off my face.

[magic-rat]

Hey Magic......you gonna spring for one?  If only I was your age.... .....har!  spyder

Well, I had planned since 2004 to get a new bike in '08 ... but the numbers just aren't there.

I still owe about 2K on this bike and if I got a new one, I'de have to put about 2K into it to get it where this one is (exhaust, power commander, camera wiring harness, different mounts for the cams cause the bolts are different than my current bike, etc) ... which would be just fine if my current bike wasn't still reliable ... but it is ... and I have so many spare parts for it, I could almost make another one (just need an engine frame, and forks).

I need to break this one, first.  LOL.

Which will likely happen sometime this year.  It's about time for my bi-annual wipe out (d'oh) and I'm going to be trying to get bumped up from the "Intermediate" to the "Expert" group this year ... so, I'll be pushing hard ... it's bound to happen.

Next year a new bike for sure, tho.

[spydglide]

Well, I had planned since 2004 to get a new bike in '08 ... but the numbers just aren't there.

I still owe about 2K on this bike and if I got a new one, I'de have to put about 2K into it to get it where this one is (exhaust, power commander, camera wiring harness, different mounts for the cams cause the bolts are different than my current bike, etc) ... which would be just fine if my current bike wasn't still reliable ... but it is ... and I have so many spare parts for it, I could almost make another one (just need an engine frame, and forks).

I need to break this one, first.  LOL.

Which will likely happen sometime this year.  It's about time for my bi-annual wipe out (d'oh) and I'm going to be trying to get bumped up from the "Intermediate" to the "Expert" group this year ... so, I'll be pushing hard ... it's bound to happen.

Next year a new bike for sure, tho.

See.......that's exactly what I'm talking about......you can still 'tuck & roll'.  Ride safe bro and we'll all be pulling for ya to make Expert Class this year.  har!  spyder

[megavolt17]

I concur with the race bike and arthritic/titanium part sentiment.  I helped my son get his Honda Interceptor around a really sharp curve up a steep hill (he was new to driving and kept stalling it).  I rode it about 1000 feet or so until the hill leveled off.  I felt sorry for him having to hike up the hill in his riding boots,  but worse for me when I had trouble getting my leg over the bike to get off of it! My bike felt like a La-Z-Boy recliner afterwards.

[magic-rat]

Thks, Spyder ... I give it a whirl.

Will make for interesting video eithe way.  LOL.

[HUBBARD]

OR, just buy and ride a Road Glide like your 'buddies', and you won't have ANY aero problems, either!  (you ole 'road-dog')  har!  spyder

I think OTIS has retired the "Tour Glide', and has succumbed to a SE V-Rod.  Can't wait to see his a$$ dragin' after a 350 mile ride on that! Later--HUBBARD

[SBB]

I think OTIS has retired the "Tour Glide', and has succumbed to a SE V-Rod.  Can't wait to see his a$$ dragin' after a 350 mile ride on that! Later--HUBBARD

Retired my butt! After outrunning you so many times he might as well retire it.
He only has the Vrod because he's bored.
Get Maude out of hibernation and race that Vrod, unless your skeered!
Respond all you like but unless you twist the throttle against the Vrod we can only assume you are skeered.
I'm not, I have seen the a$$ end of Randy's bikes before! Nothin new to me!
Tour Glide my a$$!


 

[spydglide]

I can hardly wait to see you guys in Daytona.    har!  spyder

[HUBBARD]

Retired my butt! After outrunning you so many times he might as well retire it.
He only has the Vrod because he's bored.
Get Maude out of hibernation and race that Vrod, unless your skeered!
Respond all you like but unless you twist the throttle against the Vrod we can only assume you are skeered.
I'm not, I have seen the a$$ end of Randy's bikes before! Nothin new to me!
Tour Glide my a$$!


 

I've already busted a V-Rod's a$$, Einstien, and busted everything else that said Harley-Davidson on it, many, many times.  How short some of ya'lls memories are.  Hope that's not an indication of anything else of yours.    Later--HUBBARD

[Jock]

Can't wait to see his a$$ dragin' after a 350 mile ride on that!  Later--HUBBARD

Been there, done that, not much fun the way mine is set up...Gas stops every 90 miles too...