Post by: Cat Eye on October 02, 2017, 07:24:17 PM
"8 Reasons Indian Motorcycle Beating Harley Davidson"
https://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/05/07/8-reasons-indian-motorcycle-is-beating-harley-davi.aspx
"Harley-Davidson is expecting to ship just 1% to 3% more bikes this year than it did in 2015, but shipments aren't sales, and as we've seen before, that doesn't mean more sales. It will be hard pressed to keep them flat instead of falling. Polaris Industries, on the other hand, is forecasting sales will continue growing at double-digit rates, pegging them to expand by percentage rates in the high teens -- suggesting the market-share gap between the two U.S.-based motorcycle makers will get much tighter over the next few years."
This will get interesting now that Polaris is more focused and getting a taste of success.
While HD is pruning it product offering (Just like Polaris did with Victory ) by combining the Dyna and Softails, which means they have more resources to focus on less.
But don't through the baby out with the bath water, Polaris revenue is $4.7 billion while Harley is $1.3 billion. I guarantee that the Bean Counters at Polaris will dump the Indian line just like they did Victory if it is good for the company. Which is not likely anytime soon.
On the other hand, Harley is going to bleed a lot but will not go down with out a fight. That is obvious with what they have done in the past few years.
For me, I am going to hang on to my CVO TC for a while....cause its a Harley and I like you guys! :bananarock:
:drink:
Post by: skratch on October 02, 2017, 09:38:21 PM
Post by: SDCVO on October 02, 2017, 11:22:41 PM
Post by: JCZ on October 02, 2017, 11:31:31 PM
Post by: SDCVO on October 02, 2017, 11:42:29 PM
And they sell more snowmobiles than Harley does! :huepfenlol2:Yea, forgot about those.. Think they might make quads as well?
Post by: iski on October 03, 2017, 07:54:02 AM
Long term could be healthy for the MC business. Currently HD is the 800# gorilla in the cruiser zoo of weaker selling also rans/wanna bes. That can change, and if it does, bike buyers will have more choices and more competition than they do now. For the first 50 or so years of their history, HD & Indian were industry leaders. Not a bad thing if that occurs again, but a lot of HD workers will very likely no longer be employed as an end result.
Post by: rigidthumper on October 03, 2017, 08:59:50 AM
From Polaris Industries P&L sheet:
"Motorcycle segment sales, including its PG&A related sales, decreased 35 percent in the 2016 fourth quarter to $105.7 million. Both Indian and Victory reported lower sales in the fourth quarter due to difficult comparables as product availability for all brands improved significantly in the 2015 fourth quarter, and as the Company reduced motorcycle production in the 2016 fourth quarter to complete the final paint system upgrade in Spirit Lake, IA. Slingshot® sales were down due to low product availability related to recall activity. Gross profit for the fourth quarter 2016 decreased 94 percent to $1.6 million compared to $24.0 million in the fourth quarter of 2015 due to lower production rates and higher warranty expense."
If Indian sold 500 units in Q4 2015, a 17% increase would mean only 585 units were sold in Q4 2016- not a staggering number, and it's easy to look like sales are way up when you're small.
Post by: J.D. on October 03, 2017, 09:03:43 AM
Post by: iski on October 03, 2017, 09:51:33 AM
You have to look at the real numbers- Polaris motorcycle units had a horrible Q4 2016, down 35% from 2015, so any growth in 2017 will look bigger than it actually is. I wonder what those motley fools are trying to sell? something...
If Indian sold 500 units in Q4 2015, a 17% increase would mean only 585 units were sold in Q4 2016- not a staggering number, and it's easy to look like sales are way up when you're small.
Have read Motley Fool for many years and many times have viewed their financial advice in a similar way to Paul Krugman's economic advice. Dead wrong, or unlikely to happen, sort of like a pair of Bizarro Supermans. Others will disagree, but it has worked ok for me. Plus I find them both at times to be unintentionally funny.
Post by: rigidthumper on October 03, 2017, 11:18:58 AM
Post by: CVO Aqua-Glider on October 10, 2017, 09:02:18 AM
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Post by: ultrarider123 on October 10, 2017, 09:24:16 AM
Just traded my Limited for an Indian FWIW.
Pictures a'comin I'm hoping.... :2vrolijk_21:
Post by: CVO Aqua-Glider on October 10, 2017, 09:30:16 AM
Pictures a'comin I'm hoping.... :2vrolijk_21:It's a 2017 Springfield. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171010/08109989b564247f49bccd132f10f2c1.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171010/75dbf53949af60efceb270b5ace9d544.jpg)
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Post by: ultrarider123 on October 10, 2017, 09:34:02 AM
You realize that with this bike change, your site moniker will have to change... ;D
Post by: CVO Aqua-Glider on October 10, 2017, 10:01:28 AM
Very nice ride. Love their black....good quality paint and deeper than a hollow!
You realize that with this bike change, your site moniker will have to change... ;D
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Post by: iski on October 10, 2017, 11:04:49 AM
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Nice ride. :2vrolijk_21:
On that moniker, Indigenous Peoples Glider just doesn't have that biker ring to it..... ;)