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CVO Technical => Intake/Exhaust/ECM => Topic started by: newseultra07 on November 04, 2018, 07:16:32 PM
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Anyone have any experience with this.. Thinking about getting a tuner. Only downside is having to remove the stock ECM & replace if have to take in to dealer for warranty work...Bike is a 2018 CVO Limited.
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if you go with thundermax,and have any fob issues such as loosing or dropping it and being runover and crushed you need original ecm to program new fob,keep your original ecm
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For sure will keep the original ECM. Just not how good the TM is at auto tuning.
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In my opinion stay away from the TMax, I have removed several over the years and tuned using the stock ECM and TTS. Customers have always been much happier than with the Tmax.
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+1. My experience exactly with TM.
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Doesn’t the TTS leave a footprint on the ECM when u install it. Just trying to find something that mother HD can’t detect if have any problems. Plus there isn’t anyone in my area using TTS. Most places use the Powervision.
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I just put a set of D&D head pipes on the with the 1.75” baffles from full sac in my stock cans. Is it necessary to need a tuner for this setup. Or can I just run it like it is. Bike is a 2018 CVO Anniversary Limited.
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Now days, at the dealership where I worked, the techs are many times connecting the bike to their diagnostic laptops even during routine maintenance. Doing so can pickup on ECM flashes, etc. Even updating boom audio amps, bleeding antilock brakes etc there’s the opportunity to sniff for illegal maps. The weaker the tech, the better opportunity for him to rely on test equipment and not his abilities.
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Doesn’t the TTS leave a footprint on the ECM when u install it. Just trying to find something that mother HD can’t detect if have any problems. Plus there isn’t anyone in my area using TTS. Most places use the Powervision.
The TTS does not leave a footprint.
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I just put a set of D&D head pipes on the with the 1.75” baffles from full sac in my stock cans. Is it necessary to need a tuner for this setup. Or can I just run it like it is. Bike is a 2018 CVO Anniversary Limited.
YES! You already have the high flow air cleaner and adding a non cat head pipe and less restrictive baffles will change you fuel requirements.
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Doesn’t the TTS leave a footprint on the ECM when u install it. Just trying to find something that mother HD can’t detect if have any problems. Plus there isn’t anyone in my area using TTS. Most places use the Powervision.
In previous years the TTS could be used to reinstall the original stock map and there wouldn't be any "footprint" left behind. With the latest changes since 2014, I can't personally confirm that still is the case. You would need to contact Steve Cole at TTS for a definitive answer to that question.
As for the T-Max, you will need a very good base map for it, the so-called auto tune really isn't. If they actually have a good base map for your exact setup, you might be fine. If they don't, you would need to find a tuner that tunes with T-Max to build a good base map for you. Another thing you need to investigate on a 2014 and later Touring model with CAN bus is whether or not the BCM will recognize and record the change of ECM. If it does, Harley might still be able to find out about your illegal ECM swap any time the bike is connected to the H-D network at a dealership. In other words, there are fewer easy answers these days.
Jerry
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Talked to someone at Fullsac today about the TTS leaving a footprint on the ECM if returning back to stock. He said the TTS completely copies the entire ECM info & date stamp when it downloads. And when u return back to stock in future it writes all the info back from when it was first programmed.
I talked to a service dept at dealer & he said there was a way around this. First would have to purchase a Pro tuner then put a download onto it then purchase a tuner & then dyno it. That way it seems to HD that only have a Pro tuner installed into ECM & not another tuner. Don't really know if it would work thou like this but said they've done it & so far no problems.. Said total cost around a $1000 for tuners & dyno time...
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Talked to someone at Fullsac today about the TTS leaving a footprint on the ECM if returning back to stock. He said the TTS completely copies the entire ECM info & date stamp when it downloads. And when u return back to stock in future it writes all the info back from when it was first programmed.
I talked to a service dept at dealer & he said there was a way around this. First would have to purchase a Pro tuner then put a download onto it then purchase a tuner & then dyno it. That way it seems to HD that only have a Pro tuner installed into ECM & not another tuner. Don't really know if it would work thou like this but said they've done it & so far no problems.. Said total cost around a $1000 for tuners & dyno time...
Be VERY careful believing stuff like this from people in dealerships. I'm pretty sure what they told you is bogus, H-D's system can pick up the latest change not just the first one. It's a good way for a shop to make a tidy amount of money though, selling you two tuning devices instead of one, plus a tune. And if they are like many/most Harley dealers, they probably don't have a great tuner on staff so the tune they provide may not be the greatest (or in some places not even good). Buyer Beware applies.
JMHO - Jerry
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Talked to someone at Fullsac today about the TTS leaving a footprint on the ECM if returning back to stock. He said the TTS completely copies the entire ECM info & date stamp when it downloads. And when u return back to stock in future it writes all the info back from when it was first programmed.
I talked to a service dept at dealer & he said there was a way around this. First would have to purchase a Pro tuner then put a download onto it then purchase a tuner & then dyno it. That way it seems to HD that only have a Pro tuner installed into ECM & not another tuner. Don't really know if it would work thou like this but said they've done it & so far no problems.. Said total cost around a $1000 for tuners & dyno time...
From all the reporting to date (and my own understanding of the various hardwares involved) that stretches credulity. The Protuner isn't just an external overlay (like the old Power Commanders used to be) to the ECM. That's the only way what's being described would work.
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Talked to someone at Fullsac today about the TTS leaving a footprint on the ECM if returning back to stock. He said the TTS completely copies the entire ECM info & date stamp when it downloads. And when u return back to stock in future it writes all the info back from when it was first programmed.
I talked to a service dept at dealer & he said there was a way around this. First would have to purchase a Pro tuner then put a download onto it then purchase a tuner & then dyno it. That way it seems to HD that only have a Pro tuner installed into ECM & not another tuner. Don't really know if it would work thou like this but said they've done it & so far no problems.. Said total cost around a $1000 for tuners & dyno time...
I'd sure quiz them as to what this means exactly. Have they had a motor with a warranty issue that was done this way and it passed the moco's muster? I'd want a guarantee in writing from the dealer that if this didn't work the dealer would warranty your motor. They could always say it worked before but something might have changed. Oh well, so sorry.
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I just ordered the TTS. Only tuner I know of that returns ECM back to stock.
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I just ordered the TTS. Only tuner I know of that returns ECM back to stock.
Good Choice! :2vrolijk_21:
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Which map should I load. I have D&D head pipes and 1.75” fullsac baffles.
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Was at a dealer on a customers bike talking to their service writer about this. He said it could detect a TTS MTE file that was loaded back it. Since I was in Missouri I said show me. If you find it I would pay for shop time. If he couldn't. No charge. He stuttered, tap danced, maybe even started to fake being sick. Test never got done.
On another note. I do quit a bit of tuning for another dealer. They sell the TTS and I only get to tune. This is my go to place any time I ever hear anything from locked ECM's and brake bleeding or key fob, or the mothership can tell. A lot of false info floating around out there.
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I know 100% that on a 17 at least MoCo could not see that bike was tuned with a TTS after put back to stock.
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With all the headaches you get with the M8 and tuning I am happy I have. S&S V124 with 10:1 compression and a 585 cam very dependable.
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Know I’m late to the conversation, but I’m riding 2018 CVO RG. Was set up with V&H cross overs and TTS tuner. Switched over to D&D and the Thundermax. Not sure if it’s the pipes, tuner or both, but performance is noticeably improved. I have the dyna results for both and will post em if anyone is interested.
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Please post those dyno results. The D&D certainly improved your setup but the TTS is more than capable of providing a perfect tune. Just my opinion, but I feel you went backwards when you removed the factory ECM and installed the tmax. I realize you are happy with it but money would have been better invested in a proper tune using the TTS. Again, just my opinion.
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Please post those dyno results. The D&D certainly improved your setup but the TTS is more than capable of providing a perfect tune. Just my opinion, but I feel you went backwards when you removed the factory ECM and installed the tmax. I realize you are happy with it but money would have been better invested in a proper tune using the TTS. Again, just my opinion.
Facts!! D&D will far outperform the VH pipe.
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Facts!! D&D will far outperform the VH pipe.
Seems like d and d promotes t max. I would like to see a dyno map tho to see how it’s truely working.