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[FLHRSE3]

Please help me to understand a little more about the TM/AT system.  First off, I’ve searched all over both the Thundermax & Zippers websites and cannot find any listings of available maps.  Are these provided free, are they provided free if you purchase through them, is that the reason you can purchase elsewhere for $130 less?  If you purchased one supplied with a compatible map and the bike ran fine without any further tweaking is a computer required at all, or is it still required for initial setup?

Thanks

Gregg

[Twolanerider]

Please help me to understand a little more about the TM/AT system.  First off, I’ve searched all over both the Thundermax & Zippers websites and cannot find any listings of available maps.  Are these provided free, are they provided free if you purchase through them, is that the reason you can purchase elsewhere for $130 less?  If you purchased one supplied with a compatible map and the bike ran fine without any further tweaking is a computer required at all, or is it still required for initial setup?

Thanks

Gregg

Zippers map are supplied as part of the product.  Their entire library is actually supplied as part of the software product.  But the map deemed closest to your application is loaded before you receive it.  A computer is needed for initial setup.

[FLHRSE3]

Thanks TL, so am I to assume then if you purchased it elsewhere there would be no library and you would have to build a map?

Gregg

[Twolanerider]

Thanks TL, so am I to assume then if you purchased it elsewhere there would be no library and you would have to build a map?

Gregg

Ask the supplier to make sure what they include with the bundle.  But I don't think the assumption would be correct.  The CD supplied with the package that contains the software to tune/manage/install the Thundermax also includes the map library.  You might have to check the T-Max website (the maps are also all there if I remember correctly) to figure out which one is which.  But availablity of their canned maps is not a difficulty. 

The only recommendation I'd make is to check the T-Max website or Zippers itself prior to ordering.  You'll want to see how closely any map they have matches your bike's configuration.  The autotune will bring it where you want it to a point.  But it can't stretch to extreme limits.  So the closer is the base map the better off you are.

[ajh]

Gregg,

This is Adam from Zipper's. John (JDK20723) is in Daytona so I'm stepping in to help out with technical questions.

To answer your question, all ThunderMax modules come with the full Zipper's Base Map library, regardless of where you buy it. This includes ALL future maps generated at Zipper's, and I can assure you that we are constantly creating maps. A computer with internet access is a requirement for using the ThunderMax system. The SmartLink IV software comes with the latest Base Map library when you purchase the ECM, but an internet connection will be required for future Map Library updates, Software updates, as well as Firmware updates. All current and future software, firmware and Map library upgrades are free and considered to be part of the ThunderMax system. If you buy today and we upgrade the firmware, you will have access to the free download through the software.

Please feel free to visit the ThunderMax website (www.Thunder-Max.com) and download the latest software (SmartLink IV Version 17.9) and instruction manual. This will give you access to seeing the layout of the software, as well as browsing the Base Map library before you spend your money. The instructions will walk you through the Map selection process, which will give you access to viewing ALL current Base Map files. The instructions have just been updated to reflect the many advancements that have occurred over the past few months, as well as the Unlock code for the SmartLink software.

Although the ThunderMax system has a lot of options, it is very feasible that once you've initially setup the module, you may never need to connect to it again with a computer if you purchase the Auto-Tune unit at the same time. I've heard both scenarios from current customers, some choose to tweak with the settings regularly, and some put it on and just ride. I cannot guarantee that it will never need to be linked to a computer, but it certainly is feasible. If you make drastic changes to the engine however, a new map will need to be selected and loaded, which will require connecting to the ECM. I'll let the members of the forum chime in and give their experiences on this matter for more firsthand experience.

Thanks for the discussion!
Adam

Adam Herbert
Mechanical Engineer
Zipper's Performance Products
Red Shift Cams
www.Thunder-Max.com

[FLHRSE3]

Adam

Thanks for the clarification and direction.  I might also add that I was a little apprehensive about purchasing a Zippers product because of some posts of late concerning a lack of contactability (doubt that’s a word) following the sale.  Your replying to my post has set those concerns aside for now.

Thanks

Gregg

[TimBone]

Gregg,
Seal the deal on the TMax and Auto Tune, I did after recommendations from my two buddies that have 07 Street Glides and 103 kits in them.  I just installed mine last weekend and LOVE it!!  I used to be apprehensive about Reving a Harley past 4500 RPM, but with this TMax, the Bike loves it!!  And so do I.  It is a very easy install and setup and like Adam said, the new Tuning manual can really help you dial your bike in!
Good Luck and let me know if I can help in any way for you.
TimBone

[Pbody]

Gregg,
Seal the deal on the TMax and Auto Tune, I did after recommendations from my two buddies that have 07 Street Glides and 103 kits in them.  I just installed mine last weekend and LOVE it!!  I used to be apprehensive about Reving a Harley past 4500 RPM, but with this TMax, the Bike loves it!!  And so do I.  It is a very easy install and setup and like Adam said, the new Tuning manual can really help you dial your bike in!
Good Luck and let me know if I can help in any way for you.
TimBone

TimBone (or any other recent TM/AT User),
Has your TM/AT setup caused any other problems on your 07 SEUC?  Any related problems with Turn signals (or Auto-Cancel function)?  ACR?  Security system?  Any other side-effects?

I've read several reports about TM/AT on this forum, and am sold on the system.  But I think I recall a couple folks reporting these types of problems.
Thanks.
Pbody...

[TimBone]

Pbody,
No problems at all, smooth install and I have about 500 miles on the system now.  My two buddies have 07 Street Glides and one of them has over 3000 miles with the system installed and he too has had NO problems.  All the accessorries work just like stock.  I did have to "bend" the Bung on my Rinehart pipe, but that was much easier than I thought it would be.
The posts that you read with problems, do you recall what year bike they were?  I don't remember reading about any 07s having problems.
I got the all-in-one ECM too that has the AutoTune built in and it is simple for installation.  You won't be dissappointed one bit!
TimBone

[FLHRSE3]

Ok, this decision has been solidified; I am going with the TM/AT.  I downloaded the Smartlink IV software and manual as advised, perused the manual and played with the software, both very impressive.  Taking that into consideration along with all the praise it receives from fellow forum members, this appears to be a no brainer.

Thanks to all who helped persuade me

Gregg

[Pbody]

Pbody,
No problems at all, smooth install and I have about 500 miles on the system now.  My two buddies have 07 Street Glides and one of them has over 3000 miles with the system installed and he too has had NO problems.  All the accessorries work just like stock.  I did have to "bend" the Bung on my Rinehart pipe, but that was much easier than I thought it would be.
The posts that you read with problems, do you recall what year bike they were?  I don't remember reading about any 07s having problems.
I got the all-in-one ECM too that has the AutoTune built in and it is simple for installation.  You won't be dissappointed one bit!
TimBone

Thanks TimBone...  As soon as I get back stateside, I'll pick up the TM/AT.  The last thread I read about problems was with the 07's and the auto compression release.  I know the latest firmware corrected this.  I had also read about the other problems, but don't recall if they were with 06 or 07 models.  Anyway, based on your verification that everything is working fine, and all the other positive comments from members here, I too am sold. 

I don't plan to change AC or Pipes yet--bike only has 9 miles on her (bought it last September).  Based on all the comments from CVO Harley forum members, I think getting the AFR under control is the most important thing.  The TM/AT setup looks like the best way to correct the AFR (with everything else stock), then will adapt to any exhaust/AC changes I make later.
Thanks.
Pbody...

[TimBone]

Pbody,
With the new ECM, the ECRs has been fixed and worked into it.  That is what I waited for
to be solved before I pulled the trigger.
You in the service over there in Oki, I know us Marines spend lots of time on that Rock!
Be safe and get back soon!

TimBone

[Pbody]

Pbody,
With the new ECM, the ECRs has been fixed and worked into it.  That is what I waited for
to be solved before I pulled the trigger.
You in the service over there in Oki, I know us Marines spend lots of time on that Rock!
Be safe and get back soon!

TimBone

TimBone,
Former Navy, sticking around Okinawa as a civilian--now supporting Marine Intel systems under contract.  I've actually been in Iraq the past 16 months, supporting USMC Intel systems in the Anbar Province.  I'm due to rotate out of here in a couple weeks.  I'll go through the states before heading home to Okinawa.  I'll get to see my bike for the first time (I've owned her since September) as I pass through Virginia.  I'll have to get her boxed up and find someone to ship it to Okinawa for me.  I believe this will be the first, probably the only, SEUC on Okinawa.

Any overseas rotations planned for you--do you plan to rotate back through Okinawa?  We have small offices on all the camps there.  When on Okinawa, I work out of Camp Hansen.  What Unit are you with?
Ride safe...
Pbody...

[TimBone]

Pbody,
Thanks for helping us Marines out, I am not due to go to Oki anytime soon, but I may have a good buddy on his way
there for 3 years.  He will find out for sure next week. 
I am with 2MAW now and headed for an instructor job this summer for the next 3 years, so unfortunatley
I will be grounded from any good deployments...DAMN it,  I joined to stink'n travel!!!!
Have Fun and stay safe!

[hdblackice2007]

just got back from trip from gulfport  to daytona on mine blackice roadking
on the way there was just ok the way back was great had thundermax auto tune and Rinehart's
true dual installed Saturday morning got there really early in am Pete and his installers
made this bike be able to run wfo (wide f$%*ing open) all the way back to gulfport
they made this bike  fast the way it should of been from hd but worth every penny
put 600 miles on bike since daytona running great and even went to new Orleans for a day
and Pete going to send my org. parts back to me i pay shipping don't know why  ever need them
this bike is fast and sounds great 1 of guys i rode with has ultra 110 same motor as mine but
alot slower buy the time my bike was done there was 10 to 15 bikes waiting for installing so go early if you are going to them put it on your bike but anyone can do it at home too

[Pbody]

Gregg,

This is Adam from Zipper's. John (JDK20723) is in Daytona so I'm stepping in to help out with technical questions.

To answer your question, all ThunderMax modules come with the full Zipper's Base Map library, regardless of where you buy it.  All current and future software, firmware and Map library upgrades are free and considered to be part of the ThunderMax system. If you buy today and we upgrade the firmware, you will have access to the free download through the software.

Please feel free to visit the ThunderMax website (www.Thunder-Max.com) and download the latest software (SmartLink IV Version 17.9) and instruction manual. Thanks for the discussion!
Adam

Adam Herbert
Mechanical Engineer
Zipper's Performance Products
Red Shift Cams
www.Thunder-Max.com

Adam,

I'm sold, and plan to buy the TM/AT combo.  But, I normally deal with a distributor who can save me significant dollars (leaves me with more money for my OCD).  I believe they're going through Drag Specialties.  I'm a little concerned about getting an older model, that's maybe been sitting on a shelf for a while (that's the way my luck goes).  It seems you've gone through so many upgrades in such a short period of time, I'm sure there must be some old units still floating around out there.
1. How can I make sure I get the latest model with the latest firmware (I see it's currently version 17.9)?  I think I see the physical configuration has changed recently.
2. Would I have to buy directly from Thunder-Max to make sure I get the latest and greatest model? 
3. If I get an older model/firmware, will Thunder-Max work with me to upgrade?
4. I want to install this without any intake or exhaust changes, for maybe the first 500 to 1000 miles.  Is this one of the base maps?

Thanks for the feedback.
Charles...

[ajh]

Charles,

To answer your questions:

I believe they're going through Drag Specialties.  I'm a little concerned about getting an older model, that's maybe been sitting on a shelf for a while (that's the way my luck goes).

ALL distributers only carry the newest Gen2 modules. They never stocked the Gen1's so old stock is not an issue.

1. How can I make sure I get the latest model with the latest firmware (I see it's currently version 17.9)?  I think I see the physical configuration has changed recently.

This one is easy. The current Firmware is 4.4, if you happen to get one with let's say a 4.2, there's an option in the SmartLink software for "Firmware Upgrade". You don't even have to call to find out if you have the newest firmware, or to upgrade it. Just let the software do it for you! Internet connection is a must. The SmartLink IV Software is currently at 17.9, but again, just select "Update SmartLink" and if there's an update, it will update for you. Because we're constantly improving the product as feedback comes to us, and as HD constantly changes their bikes, we will upgrade the firmware and the software in the future. Do you have to call and get a CD mailed when we make an improvement? Absolutely not, Both can be upgraded very easily without dealing with anyone!

2. Would I have to buy directly from Thunder-Max to make sure I get the latest and greatest model?

Nope, buy anywhere!

3. If I get an older model/firmware, will Thunder-Max work with me to upgrade?

I've already written about the firmware/software, so consider those issues a non-issue. You can upgrade it yourself!

The Gen1 vs Gen2 debate is easy too, we are out of Gen1's (we do sell these factory refurbished for a price cut IF you call Zipper's and specify), but any new modules sold are Gen2's. "Old Stock" is not an issue because as soon as we make them, they go out the door!

4. I want to install this without any intake or exhaust changes, for maybe the first 500 to 1000 miles.  Is this one of the base maps?

The closest Base map was generated with a stock platform, the only change is an air filter. This will work just fine even if you don't change your air filter at the start. It always takes mileage for the Auto-Tune to work, but I would not expect it to take long to work out a simple filter difference.  The big changes that require a new map are throttle body, engine size, and exhaust system.

I would recommend downloading the software and instructions from the www.Thunder-Max.com website. This will give you an early start on learning the software and looking at all of the Base Maps we've generated.

Thanks for asking, this information will help everyone!
Adam

[Pbody]

Charles,
To answer your questions:

Thanks for asking, this information will help everyone!
Adam

Adam,
Awesome feedback--thanks!  I think this forum has covered every possible angle on the TM/AT.  Additionally, I'm impressed with the high level of Customer Service (quick response and detailed explanations) you've provided here.  I downloaded all associated pdf files earlier and just finished browsing through them.  I'll place my order by the end of the day.
Take care.
Charles...

[myfxdse07]

Have anyone install the Vance & Hines Big Radius exhaust with the TM\AT? I talk to a rep at Zipper and they said they have heard some complaints about slight back-fire on throttle dowm. They said it because the pipes are short and w too mush curve. I like the looks but performance is my goal.
Tks,
Manny

[Talon]

I was originally convinced that I was going SERT, but looking at TMAT, I like the idea that I don't need to go back and dyno everytime I make a change!! I live at 5000', and ride up over 11,000 sometimes, and down to 100' so this would be ideal for me. I have an 05, so I'll have to weld in the bungs for the O2 sensors, but that's no big deal. All the comments above are positive, does anyone know of any down side of the TMAT vs the SERT?

One more thing, what is the list price on the TMAT? I find the TM price on their site, but can't find the TMAT price.

[bisounours]

On Zanotti site :
http://www.shopzanottimotor.com/shop/productdetail.htm?productId=3877686&browse=23225&shopBy=4045&catalogId=643

For 01-07 models w/ Delphi EFI
Part#: 1020-0323 List Price: $869.95 (USD)
Our Price: $739.46 (USD)
You Save: $130.49 (USD)

Jacques

[Twolanerider]

On Zanotti site :
http://www.shopzanottimotor.com/shop/productdetail.htm?productId=3877686&browse=23225&shopBy=4045&catalogId=643

For 01-07 models w/ Delphi EFI
Part#: 1020-0323 List Price: $869.95 (USD)
Our Price: $739.46 (USD)
You Save: $130.49 (USD)

Jacques

Pretty sure that's less than I paid Zippers for the prior generation hardware.