Post by: kojak on January 25, 2020, 02:28:30 PM
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on January 26, 2020, 07:51:36 AM
Post by: scotman623 on January 26, 2020, 09:30:20 AM
Post by: SDCVO on January 26, 2020, 11:07:56 PM
Post by: dmnrdn on January 31, 2020, 06:42:43 PM
Post by: SDCVO on January 31, 2020, 10:55:47 PM
From another forum. Should make you happyYea, that makes me happy! Anyone hear anything about them getting CA approval?
Post by: OBB on February 01, 2020, 06:45:48 AM
Yea, that makes me happy! Anyone hear anything about them getting CA approval?I think Matt Laidlaw put something up on His youtube channel saying they're good. Someone posted it on the RG forum.
Also, the guys at Quantico are at it again. This one with some aftermarket parts and tuner. ***If you're on FB, here's a link to one of the pages it's posted on.****
Bear with me on the FB link guys, I got the sheet off of the link but then it says it isn't available. The builder says they're going to put bigger injectors in it and retune it.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/304291063109009/1203016079903165/?comment_id=1203387373199369¬if_id=1580507153920304¬if_t=group_comment_follow
Post by: kojak on February 01, 2020, 03:43:57 PM
Yea, that makes me happy! Anyone hear anything about them getting CA approval?Harley is not approving them with the street cannon mufflers. When I ordered my kit, that was the first question they asked me. Don't know why?
Post by: SDCVO on February 01, 2020, 11:38:57 PM
I think Matt Laidlaw put something up on His youtube channel saying they're good. Someone posted it on the RG forum.Just looked and still shows only 49 state compliant
Also, the guys at Quantico are at it again. This one with some aftermarket parts and tuner. ***If you're on FB, here's a link to one of the pages it's posted on.****
Bear with me on the FB link guys, I got the sheet off of the link but then it says it isn't available. The builder says they're going to put bigger injectors in it and retune it.
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on February 02, 2020, 07:27:37 AM
Harley is not approving them with the street cannon mufflers. When I ordered my kit, that was the first question they asked me. Don't know why?
Interesting as surprisingly that is exactly what muffler the Harley web site says to run with the 131 kit.
https://www.harley-davidson.com/store/milwaukee-eight-engine-stage-iv-kit-114ci-or-117ci-to-131ci (https://www.harley-davidson.com/store/milwaukee-eight-engine-stage-iv-kit-114ci-or-117ci-to-131ci)
Quote
this combination delivers a thrilling 131 ft-lb of torque and 121 HP rear-wheel output when paired with Screamin' Eagle® Street Cannon Mufflers.
My guess is that is suppose to say the new high flow exhaust system with street cannon mufflers. The HD site claims this exhaust system was designed for the 128/131 kits.
But as usually their information is not clear or not correct.
Post by: kojak on February 02, 2020, 12:25:07 PM
The kit comes with those headers.
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on February 03, 2020, 06:21:40 AM
Right off their website: Not for use with Screamin' Eagle® High-Flow Exhaust Systems with Street Cannon Mufflers
The kit comes with those headers.
Well the link I posted above, and my quote about
Quote
"this combination delivers a thrilling 131 ft-lb of torque and 121 HP rear-wheel output when paired with Screamin' Eagle® Street Cannon Mufflers."
Seems Harley contradicts its self on its own website. Not a real surprise that they cant get it right, its been that way for years.
Post by: Threephase on February 03, 2020, 07:35:42 AM
Post by: DOCGSS on February 03, 2020, 08:30:15 AM
Well the link I posted above, and my quote about
Seems Harley contradicts its self on its own website. Not a real surprise that they cant get it right, its been that way for years.
I believe the headers are different spacing from the exhaust ports on the 131 so the existing headers (all the rest) do not fit.
Post by: kojak on February 04, 2020, 06:47:10 PM
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on February 05, 2020, 07:45:08 AM
The kit is in! Dropped off my bike today, should get it back midweek next week. The black granite finish is easier to get since only cvo bikes have that finish, the standard black engine has a much longer lead time according to the parts manager. I'm not complaining, less than 10 days from order to delivery.
Wow that is pretty quick. I'm sure your anxious to get it back.
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 05, 2020, 10:15:41 AM
Harley is not approving them with the street cannon mufflers. When I ordered my kit, that was the first question they asked me. Don't know why?It won't fit with the street canon.
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 05, 2020, 10:17:43 AM
Post by: kojak on February 05, 2020, 06:09:42 PM
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 05, 2020, 06:19:21 PM
Post by: cvosjoe on February 05, 2020, 07:05:35 PM
It won't fit with the street canon.They're just finishing up a stage iv 131 kit at my dealership and the Street Cannons mufflers fit and are warranty approved. I'm having mine done as well.
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Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 05, 2020, 07:18:26 PM
They're just finishing up a stage iv 131 kit at my dealership and the Street Cannons mufflers fit and are warranty approved. I'm having mine done as well.Nice! I read that they didn't fit, good for those that have them already.
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Post by: OBB on February 05, 2020, 07:46:02 PM
They're just finishing up a stage iv 131 kit at my dealership and the Street Cannons mufflers fit and are warranty approved. I'm having mine done as well.My understanding from reading all over the place (Hey, it's true, I read it on the internet) is that the normal header doesn't fit and that's why it comes with a new one. Now, IF, that's true, then I'd think the new header would have the cat in it hence why they are saying the SC mufflers won't work. UNLESS, people are mixing up the SC mufflers that have the cat in them instead of the head pipe.
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I think I just confused myself. :P
Post by: OBB on February 05, 2020, 07:49:56 PM
What's the hesitation with posting actual amount?He did state how much labor His dealer is charging Him. 10 hours. Now whether His dealer gave Him a break or not due to customer relations is unknown. Other dealers have posted up that install is 12 hours. Labor rates from dealers vary also. So it would not be an accurate price if His dealer rates are less than your dealer rates and the amount of hours vary.
The kit itself is online to get parts prices from.
You pay for the kit, oil pump, se tuner, dyno time plus 10 hours labor for the twin-cooled swap.
Post by: cvosjoe on February 05, 2020, 07:58:42 PM
My understanding from reading all over the place (Hey, it's true, I read it on the internet) is that the normal header doesn't fit and that's why it comes with a new one. Now, IF, that's true, then I'd think the new header would have the cat in it hence why they are saying the SC mufflers won't work. UNLESS, people are mixing up the SC mufflers that have the cat in them instead of the head pipe.
I think I just confused myself.
The pipe fitment is identical. There is no direct literature about it but I believe the catalyst in the kit head pipe is not as restrictive as the factory head pipe. As you mentioned there is some confusion with the SC mufflers. The high flow exhaust that is only sold as a complete system uses a non-catalyst head pipe and the catalyst is in the SC muffler. You have to use the non-catalyst SC mufflers with the stage iv kit head pipe.
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Post by: kojak on February 05, 2020, 07:59:34 PM
Wow that is pretty quick. I'm sure your anxious to get it back.Yeah, don't have multiple bikes to ride like you, lol!
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 05, 2020, 08:06:44 PM
He did state how much labor His dealer is charging Him. 10 hours. Now whether His dealer gave Him a break or not due to customer relations is unknown. Other dealers have posted up that install is 12 hours. Labor rates from dealers vary also. So it would not be an accurate price if His dealer rates are less than your dealer rates and the amount of hours vary.It would be accurate if he gave all the information for his dealer. That doesn't mean that it will translate to mine, but it will still be accurate.
The kit itself is online to get parts prices from.
Post by: Fired00d on February 05, 2020, 09:03:06 PM
He did state how much labor His dealer is charging Him. 10 hours. Now whether His dealer gave Him a break or not due to customer relations is unknown. Other dealers have posted up that install is 12 hours. Labor rates from dealers vary also. So it would not be an accurate price if His dealer rates are less than your dealer rates and the amount of hours vary.Exactly... being that it's winter (colder) months here on the east coast some (a lot) of dealers have promotions going on for parts/labor installations due to their shops being slow. So there could be additional discounts/savings.
The kit itself is online to get parts prices from.
It would be accurate if he gave all the information for his dealer. That doesn't mean that it will translate to mine, but it will still be accurate.Maybe that information is between him and his dealer as far as the final dollar amount. Giving you the information he did you can check w/dealers in your area for comparison... you are in Cali so what he paid in Virginia is/could be substantially different.... unless you are going to ship your bike to his dealer in Virginia to have the work done... but then the shipping back in forth would be added cost... add to that what he paid and what you might pay at the same dealership could be different depending on the relationship he has w/that dealer and you being a "one hit wonder" so to speak. :nixweiss:
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
Post by: kojak on February 06, 2020, 06:42:06 PM
You pay for the kit, oil pump, se tuner, dyno time plus 10 hours labor for the twin-cooled swap.What I paid is between my dealer and myself, they take care of me. Anyway from memory, the retail prices in the same order are $3495+$150+$299+$495+ 10x$99+probably another $100 for misc odds and ends. If you need the heavier duty clutch as well, you can add a few hundred more. Hope it helps.
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 06, 2020, 07:19:20 PM
What I paid is between my dealer and myself, they take care of me. Anyway from memory, the retail prices in the same order are $3495+$150+$299+$495+ 10x$99+probably another $100 for misc odds and ends. If you need the heavier duty clutch as well, you can add a few hundred more. Hope it helps.Thank you.
Post by: acevtwin on February 07, 2020, 09:42:16 AM
Post by: cvosjoe on February 07, 2020, 10:33:58 AM
This Could be a stupid question: Is it still "Twin Cooled" / wet heads when you are done or do the radiators and fans go away?There are Twin Cooled and an Oil Cooled kits. You just use the one compatible with your bike.
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Post by: kojak on February 07, 2020, 04:53:43 PM
Post by: scotman623 on February 07, 2020, 05:31:35 PM
Post by: cvosjoe on February 07, 2020, 06:30:36 PM
They're just finishing up a stage iv 131 kit at my dealership and the Street Cannons mufflers fit and are warranty approved. I'm having mine done as well.They put the other 131 bike on the dyno today. 120hp & 134tq with the SE base map and no additional adjustments.
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Post by: kojak on February 08, 2020, 03:27:47 PM
Post by: kojak on February 08, 2020, 03:28:43 PM
Post by: kojak on February 08, 2020, 03:29:40 PM
Post by: kojak on February 08, 2020, 03:30:11 PM
Post by: kojak on February 08, 2020, 03:31:24 PM
Post by: cvosjoe on February 08, 2020, 03:39:46 PM
After 4 runs on the Dyno, ended with 126 hp and 140 ft-lb of Torque.Excellent! It'll definitely put a smile on my face if mine turns out like yours.
Congratulations! Ride and have fun.
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Post by: scotman623 on February 09, 2020, 12:21:37 AM
Post by: FLSTFI Dave on February 09, 2020, 06:42:28 AM
After 4 runs on the Dyno, ended with 126 hp and 140 ft-lb of Torque.
Very nice for a motor with full factory warranty, Heck its nice for one with out warranty. I am sure you are very pleased with that.
Post by: kojak on February 09, 2020, 06:54:14 AM
Very impressive numbers my Friend... Definitely sounds like this build is a winner..I went aftermarket 128 with head work 2 months, the 131 wasn’t out yet... Mine is 136 HP and 157 Torque.. But I now have no warranty..The 131 is definitely the way to go to keep warranty in tack, and down the line it could be built into a Monster if so chosen... Very nice looking bike too my friend.. Enjoy and keep us posted..Having a factory built motor and being able to get service anywhere there’s a Harley dealer was important to me, honestly I had no intentions of going after a bigger motor till I saw the Harley 131kit. Couldn’t pass up the 20% off winter savings my dealer was offering on parts and labor. Since I do a lot of long distance riding, I’m curious about the mpg now. Hope it stays in the mid 30’s at least.
Post by: scotman623 on February 09, 2020, 12:20:58 PM
Post by: kojak on February 09, 2020, 03:42:53 PM
Post by: Indenial on February 10, 2020, 10:54:45 AM
Post by: Unbalanced on February 10, 2020, 05:05:35 PM
Nice that you got it back and the grin is there.
As a suggestion you might want to have the clutch checked it appears you have clutch slip going on or tire slippage on the Dyno.
See all those small depressions in the lines (the dips)
You can also have the shop print out the clutch graphs from your runs to see how well it is holding. If it is the clutch slipping you will be replacing the discs a lot sooner than their normal life.
Also you might ask on the top end of your tune for them to throw some additional fuel at it up past 5200 rpm it’s pretty lean for WOT pull should be down around 13 to 1 and even as low as 12.5 to 1 depending on what the motor likes and the heat their seeing.
Ride safe and enjoy
Post by: kojak on February 10, 2020, 05:39:59 PM
Post by: anzac on February 11, 2020, 11:51:06 AM
Congrats
Post by: Fullsac Performance on February 12, 2020, 04:57:47 AM
SG
Post by: scotman623 on February 12, 2020, 12:57:27 PM
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 12, 2020, 01:03:42 PM
Post by: Unbalanced on February 12, 2020, 01:37:21 PM
Post by: hd-dude on February 12, 2020, 04:29:52 PM
Does anyone think it's strange that the dyno runs starts at 3200 RPM, the TQ and HP lines cross at 4600 RPM, and it only makes 80 FT pounds of Torque at 6K RPM? I'm sure it runs a lot better, but there's a happy meal and a quarter pounder left sitting on the table with that tune. :stars:
SG
Yes, this is one of the strangest dyno sheets i have seen!
Post by: kojak on February 12, 2020, 05:25:23 PM
Post by: kojak on February 12, 2020, 06:08:40 PM
There's something not right. Torque and HP should cross at 5252.They do, if you read the detail on the runs, look at the max torque rpm on any given run and run it down to the afr rpm line you are looking at and you will see the scale is different on the 2 graphs. It would have been easier to see if they had just plotted the final run on a graph with the afr on the same scale. Confusing I know. I really don't pay that much attention to dyno charts except for a smooth curve and what the seat of the pants tells me about how the bike is running.
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 12, 2020, 06:13:54 PM
They do, if you read the detail on the runs, look at the max torque rpm on any given run and run it down to the afr rpm line you are looking at and you will see the scale is different on the 2 graphs. It would have been easier to see if they had just plotted the final run on a graph with the afr on the same scale. Confusing I know. I really don't pay that much attention to dyno charts except for a smooth curve and what the seat of the pants tells me about how the bike is running.I still don't see how it crosses at 5252. I think that the entire RPM scale is off.
Post by: X-Man on February 15, 2020, 12:00:16 AM
The torque scale is on the right side of the graph, out of the picture.
I still don't see how it crosses at 5252. I think that the entire RPM scale is off.
Post by: ParadigmGuy on February 15, 2020, 12:57:01 PM
The likely reason that the HP and torque curves don't cross at 5252rpm is that the the torque scale is different to the HP scale.Ah, OK, I understand now.
The torque scale is on the right side of the graph, out of the picture.
Post by: kojak on February 15, 2020, 02:12:53 PM
Post by: kr on February 17, 2020, 08:28:02 AM
Post by: kojak on February 17, 2020, 03:01:36 PM
Post by: CVOSGJoe on February 18, 2020, 09:25:30 AM
Glad you enjoying the build, ride safe!!
Post by: kojak on March 13, 2020, 05:23:10 PM
Post by: dogdoc85 on May 19, 2020, 06:29:26 AM
Post by: Mofo67 on May 20, 2020, 06:14:20 AM
https://badboyzcyclez.com/
Post by: scotman623 on May 20, 2020, 11:06:43 AM
Post by: kojak on May 25, 2020, 06:39:00 AM
Kojac, were you able to find a derby cover and/or an air filter cover/badge to match the 131 badge on the timer cover. Mine was a 117, so I have 117 on derby and air cleaner and 131 on time. Just looking to match it up. ThanksSorry, man, I’ve been off the forum for a few weeks. Yeah, like other people said several outfits are now making the 131 derby cover. There is already so much badging on the bike, I just switched mine to a plain chrome derby cover. My ac cover just says screaming eagle so I didn’t have to do anything there.
Post by: Triple X on June 29, 2020, 10:19:25 PM
Here's my last update on the 131 upgrade. I rode the bike down to bikeweek and back, all together about 2500 miles in 5 day's. On the highway, ran it consistently 80 to 85 mph, the bike was basically loafing around 3000 rpm. Great to have the awesome roll-on acceleration to pass vehicles effortlessly. Averaged about 175 miles between fill-ups and generally put on about 4.7 gallons. Worst gas mileage was 36 mpg and best was 40 mpg. It did seem to get a bit better as I put more miles on the engine. The throttle is sensitive, riding over bumpy roads, I had to be extra aware of my right wrist as a little input will cause the bike to surge. Ran it in 82 degrees in bumper to bumper traffic for about 30 minutes and I can see how it could throw off a great deal of heat in 90+ degree weather. Probably worse for non twin cooled bikes. No regrets, having a blast riding my bike! It is a speeding ticket waiting to happen, lol!Nice report.
I too use Groves.
Glad to hear it was a positive experience for you.
I'll have to look into that kit for my bike.
Hope you're still happy with it.
Post by: kojak on July 01, 2020, 05:53:36 PM
Post by: Triple X on July 05, 2020, 09:44:23 PM
5k miles on the bike after the upgrade, so far so good and its been ridden hard! Funny, the tech and the counter guy I dealt with were guys I dealt with for years at Battlefield in Gettysburg. Groves was lucky to get them, need to hang on to them. Groves had a great service manager who loved racing Honda's on the side and went to work for a super sport Honda dealer a few years ago and their service dept took a dive. They got it back on track about a year ago and saved me a trip from going to Battlefield for service.Agreed.
I'm good friends with Jeff.
I heard they were bringing a couple of guys down from Gettysburg.
Glad that worked out.