Topic: Heads up....Front Tire Cupping!!!!! (Read 27493 times)

sblair · « **on:** March 20, 2009, 09:23:45 AM »

To my fellow SERG brothers and sisters!
I have just over 8000 miles on my baby. The other day I rolled it out of the garage and felt a little thump, thump, thump when moving it forward (motor off). Went and looked and the front tire is cupping. The trailing edge of the tire pattern is almost even with the bottom of the grooves while the leading edge of the vee has quite a bit of tread left. Noticed not too long ago that I was getting a little more vibration in the front end.
Well. I rode it to the dealer and had service look at it. The service manager said I had to buy a new tire (IMMEDIATELY!) and said it was due to not having good tire pressure. I told them that the book states 38psi for the front and I check it every 2 weeks. It helped that the service writer knows me well and therefore knew I was not BSing them. They also threw out there that this may be all you will get out of the D407's. I told them I get 16-20k out of the older rubber fronts and that this rubber is advertised as lasting longer. I told them to call the factory..... Well the factory is aware of the problem and is replacing my tire for free (I also have the tire protection). Did not get the whole story but apparently they are reversing the tread pattern and have made some other changes in the tire. Now here is the issue..... the tire is on backorder $:-\$ so it looks like I will not be taking it on my trip next week!
They checked the back tire and it appears to be wearing normally.

So this is just a heads up to make everyone aware of a potential rubber issue. Just be prudent and check often. I just looked at my rim (front) and there appears to be little black specks so the tire is disentegrating pretty rapidly at this point. Never seen this previously when cleaning the rims.

Boatman · « **Reply #1 on:** March 20, 2009, 09:27:35 AM »

Looks like Popper is having the same issue.

jettjocky · « **Reply #2 on:** March 20, 2009, 11:59:09 AM »

THanks for the heads up, I also purchased the tire protection.

RickC · « **Reply #3 on:** March 20, 2009, 01:10:24 PM »

Quote from: jettjocky on March 20, 2009, 11:59:09 AM

THanks for the heads up, I also purchased the tire protection.

Ditto. It just makes sense...

sblair · « **Reply #4 on:** March 20, 2009, 03:12:40 PM »

Yes, but in this instance it is a HD warranty issue. So you do not have to pay labor. The down side is that you are at the whim of the MoCo as to when they want to send the part to you. Thanks for listening.

AXIL · « **Reply #5 on:** March 20, 2009, 09:29:49 PM »

what year is your bike ?

Grizzly · « **Reply #6 on:** March 20, 2009, 09:50:57 PM »

I believe this is a problem with all the '09 touring models.

We were just in Arizona for a month and a few friends flew into Vegas and renting Ultra's. Out of 4 rented 2 had a similar concern. At different times we stopped by dealers while on the road to have them check it out... Both said it is nothing to worry about!

I think NOT!

If I owned a '09 I think I would be swapping the front rims and tires back to the 16" D402's.

sblair · « **Reply #7 on:** March 21, 2009, 11:41:59 AM »

Yes this is about the new 09 rubber. The D407's. Fortunately, the MoCo is aware and from what I understand they are addressing the issue with a redesign.
Also if things get too bad, they do make a D402 the same size. It was on the previous years CVO Road King. Not sure about the rear. I do know that the MoCo asked about the rear but I am not having the issue there (yet).

Highwaystar · « **Reply #8 on:** May 24, 2009, 06:52:14 PM »

3600 miles and I noticed vibration on braking today...Low and behold the front is cupping and is getting worse. I'll have a talk with my dealer Tuesday

Black Diamond · « **Reply #9 on:** May 24, 2009, 10:13:12 PM »

This may not be an 09 problem. I have 407's on my 08 SERK. My 1st front tire was cupping badly at less than 8000 miles. Dunlop claims to have several compounds / layers on the thread of this tire to help with the cupping problem.
http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/infocenter_news_article.asp?id=212&monthYear=

I've had the new compound tires on for going on 9000 miles with no sign of cupping. But why wouldn't the 2009 SERG have this new version of the 407Fs? I noticed the 408s look just like the 407s with the tread mounted the opposite direction.

JW

Twolanerider · « **Reply #10 on:** May 25, 2009, 12:53:45 AM »

I would be curious to hear tire cupping reports (or lack thereof) from riders with the questioned tires who also have had the Traxxion Dynamics front suspension work done. Can't help but wonder if simply keeping the front wheel on the ground so much more would help the problem.

Highjagger · « **Reply #11 on:** May 25, 2009, 05:04:49 PM »

Tomorrow i have the 5000miles service ( 8000km with 9200km on the clock ) , my frontend was wobbeling when let free the handlebar when getting slower less than 40 mph .
Checked the front tire - bad looking - i thought that this would be a normal use-look and will let mount a new one tomorrow , hope the dealer has one .
I will tell him this story of replacing the front tire for free by the MoCo .

Highjagger · « **Reply #12 on:** May 26, 2009, 10:41:13 AM »

Just coming back from bringing my SERG to the dealer for the service .
No front tire available , damn , he will try to get informations about the tires from the german hd-headquarter in Mörfelden , hope he will get one soon , mine is totally undriveable , wobbling front end .
And this weekend we have another " black-forest-tour " , fuc......

jettjocky · « **Reply #13 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:32:30 AM »

cupping problem I guess I can understand, NOT HAVING TIRES ON HAND TO ME IS NOT ACCEPTABLE ......PERIOD. When the day comes that while on a trip I can not have tires replaced is the day I say fairwell to MOCO.

9 1/2 Beers · « **Reply #14 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:41:19 AM »

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=36170.0

sem_bunda · « **Reply #15 on:** May 26, 2009, 05:30:33 PM »

NOT HAVING TIRES ON HAND TO ME IS NOT ACCEPTABLE ......PERIOD. When the day comes that while on a trip I can not have tires replaced is the day I say fairwell to MOCO.

Jettjocky, this sounds more like a dealer problem than a MOCO problem but you're right - that would be unacceptable.

Highjagger · « **Reply #16 on:** May 26, 2009, 05:45:14 PM »

The D 407 F is replaced by the D 408 F by Dunlop

Highwaystar · « **Reply #17 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:20:25 PM »

I was informed by Appleton HD that the problem is known but no warantee replacement is being offered! Has any one had the front replaced at no cost? 3600 miles is bull sh#t. I've always gone 15k or better on fronts...Oh ya this is the "new" dual compound for extended mileage! Just read the sales brochure!

Highjagger · « **Reply #18 on:** May 27, 2009, 01:53:03 AM »

Like allways , they just want to rob our bucks and try to sell their stuff .
The ones built later than january 2009 should have mounted the new D 408 F tires , and the problem is fixed for them , mine is december and i have the chit , and no replacement tire available , that`s the greatest fuc..... of all ,

Should i buy a BMW to make my tours now ?
I don`t want .
Will make a couple of phones now to try where to get a tire , perhaps i will have luck , cross your fingers .

cvosjoe · « **Reply #19 on:** May 27, 2009, 08:20:19 AM »

Highwaystar,
The dealer replaced my front wheel and tire at 13k on my 09 SERG under warranty. Front tire was worn so bad that the trailing edge of the tread was worn down to the groove and the bike had one heck of a vibration. They installed the D408 F. I have 2K on the new tire and the tread wear is perfect.

FLSTFI Dave · « **Reply #20 on:** May 27, 2009, 09:30:36 AM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on May 26, 2009, 11:20:25 PM

I was informed by Appleton HD that the problem is known but no warantee replacement is being offered! Has any one had the front replaced at no cost? 3600 miles is bull sh#t. I've always gone 15k or better on fronts...Oh ya this is the "new" dual compound for extended mileage! Just read the sales brochure!

You need to press you're dealer harder and talk to the area rep. These are being replaced under warrenty

grc · « **Reply #21 on:** May 27, 2009, 02:27:51 PM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on May 26, 2009, 11:20:25 PM

I was informed by Appleton HD that the problem is known but no warantee replacement is being offered! Has any one had the front replaced at no cost? 3600 miles is bull sh#t. I've always gone 15k or better on fronts...Oh ya this is the "new" dual compound for extended mileage! Just read the sales brochure!

I suggest that no one should accept statements like that from any dealer. If a problem has been verified, and it's not caused by the owner of the bike, then there is no way they and the MoCo can legally or morally weasel out of responsibility to correct the problem. For a dealer to suggest that you will just have to eat it, and not offer to help resolve the problem to your satisfaction, is just further testament to the sorry state of many Harley dealers. Here we have the worst market conditions in decades, and they blow off a good customer who recently handed them over $30k for a friggin' motorcycle (over $6k gross profit to the dealer, btw, you would think if they can't stand up to H-D for you then they could at least give you a $200 tire for pete's sake).

You need to go straight to the horses ~~ass~~ mouth and ask H-D directly what they will and will not do. All I can tell you is, if they blew me off on this known issue they would get tons of negative press and I would be very tempted to spend a little of that cash that I wouldn't be spending with them in the future on a good lawyer. Since tires tend to be safety related products, a little missive to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration would also be in order. And that dealer would be invited to kiss my posterior as I promised to never spend another nickel in his store.

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

Jerry

56FLE · « **Reply #22 on:** May 27, 2009, 02:39:41 PM »

Go out and get yourself a Dunlop Elite 3, the same tire HD put on the front of the 2007 SERK. I got 9K out of the original D407 front on my 2008 SERK. When I had it replaced in Flagstaff AZ. they only had the E3 so they put that on. I got 16K out of that tire before it stared cupping and that was only a little cupping.

Yes, the tread does not match the the back but the tire last so much longer. A buddy of mine that has a indy motorcycle repair and he told me the E3 is the tire used on the Honde Gold Wing so you should be able to find one somewhere but probably not at the HD dealer. $:-\$

grc · « **Reply #23 on:** May 27, 2009, 02:48:41 PM »

Quote from: 56FLE on May 27, 2009, 02:39:41 PM

Go out and get yourself a Dunlop Elite 3, the same tire HD put on the front of the 2007 SERK. I got 9K out of the original D407 front on my 2008 SERK. When I had it replaced in Flagstaff AZ. they only had the E3 so they put that on. I got 16K out of that tire before it stared cupping and that was only a little cupping.

Yes, the tread does not match the the back but the tire last so much longer. A buddy of mine that has a indy motorcycle repair and he told me the E3 is the tire used on the Honde Gold Wing so you should be able to find one somewhere but probably not at the HD dealer. $:-\$

Yup. And if you ask a one of the local Honda establishments, you might just be surprised at how many tires they install on Harley's. I've got a Honda dealer about 20 miles from me that has already talked to me about installing E3's (or even standard Dunlops) on my SEEG, no charge for labor. I'm seriously considering taking him up on the offer this fall.

(I wonder how many Harley shops would even consider working on a Honda. Of course, with all that warranty work in the average Harley shop they probably don't have the extra time on their hands that the Honda guys seem to have).

Jerry

Highjagger · « **Reply #24 on:** May 27, 2009, 03:47:55 PM »

No D 408 F available here in germany , nowhere , backorder , damn .
The D 407 F would be available at some online stores , should i take one ? Otherwise i won`t be able to ride when the weekend is gone . E3 you mean , i will check this .

Highjagger · « **Reply #25 on:** May 27, 2009, 03:52:35 PM »

The E3 is 130/70 R 18 63 H and the D 408 F is 130/70 B 18 63 H
A "R" instead of a "B" , i think this "B" is fixed in the papers of the bike and you are not allowed to mount a "R" instead of a "B" tire - Damn .

9 1/2 Beers · « **Reply #26 on:** May 27, 2009, 03:58:44 PM »

Quote from: Highjagger on May 27, 2009, 03:47:55 PM

No D 408 F available here in germany , nowhere , backorder , damn .
The D 407 F would be available at some online stores , should i take one ? Otherwise i won`t be able to ride when the weekend is gone . E3 you mean , i will check this .

Some of my friends have several bikes ( and I think they know who they are) and can wait to change the tires they want. I had to buy a new 407 because I couldn't wait, needed/wanted the bike to go on a ride...

Marty

(just my opinion)

UFO_HOG · « **Reply #27 on:** May 27, 2009, 08:13:22 PM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on May 26, 2009, 11:20:25 PM

I was informed by Appleton HD that the problem is known but no warantee replacement is being offered! Has any one had the front replaced at no cost? 3600 miles is bull sh#t. I've always gone 15k or better on fronts...Oh ya this is the "new" dual compound for extended mileage! Just read the sales brochure!

Had mine replaced under warranty @ 5k

Highjagger · « **Reply #28 on:** May 28, 2009, 02:40:01 AM »

This will be the next battle to beat , warranty-replacement in germany , that sucks .

hdbrad03 · « **Reply #29 on:** May 28, 2009, 07:57:32 AM »

Quote from: Highjagger on May 27, 2009, 03:52:35 PM

The E3 is 130/70 R 18 63 H and the D 408 F is 130/70 B 18 63 H
A "R" instead of a "B" , i think this "B" is fixed in the papers of the bike and you are not allowed to mount a "R" instead of a "B" tire - Damn .

"B" = Biased Belted Tire
"R" = Radial Belted Tire

As long as you match front and back tire no issue. Also watch weight rating.

Brad

Highjagger · « **Reply #30 on:** May 28, 2009, 09:34:10 AM »

63 is the index for the weight and that is the same .

Highwaystar · « **Reply #31 on:** May 28, 2009, 11:20:52 PM »

Stealer says No replacement for my cupped out front at 3.6K. I was told I had to replace it at my expense if its worn out. I say it is a safety issue and should be recalled. Has any one else gotten a replacement under warranty? If this were a car......

UFO_HOG · « **Reply #32 on:** May 29, 2009, 01:04:16 AM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on May 28, 2009, 11:20:52 PM

Stealer says No replacement for my cupped out front at 3.6K. I was told I had to replace it at my expense if its worn out. I say it is a safety issue and should be recalled. Has any one else gotten a replacement under warranty? If this were a car......

As I said 5 posts before this one, my dealer got approval from MoCo to warranty my tire at 5k

cvosjoe · « **Reply #33 on:** May 29, 2009, 06:43:55 AM »

Highwaystar,
See quote.

Quote from: cvosjoe on May 27, 2009, 08:20:19 AM

Highwaystar,
The dealer replaced my front wheel and tire at 13k on my 09 SERG under warranty. Front tire was worn so bad that the trailing edge of the tread was worn down to the groove and the bike had one heck of a vibration. They installed the D408 F. I have 2K on the new tire and the tread wear is perfect.

56FLE · « **Reply #34 on:** May 31, 2009, 09:43:19 PM »

Quote from: Highjagger on May 27, 2009, 03:52:35 PM

The E3 is 130/70 R 18 63 H and the D 408 F is 130/70 B 18 63 H
A "R" instead of a "B" , i think this "B" is fixed in the papers of the bike and you are not allowed to mount a "R" instead of a "B" tire - Damn .

The E3 was the standard tire for the 2007 SERK, if you can get an E3 installed you will be very happy with that tire. Just ask HOIST! about it!

gordy · « **Reply #35 on:** May 31, 2009, 10:02:23 PM »

Has anyone put Metzler ME 880's or Avon Cobra's on? I have them on my Deuce and am happy but on the SERG?

2009FLTRSE3 · « **Reply #36 on:** June 22, 2009, 02:16:47 PM »

Quote from: UFO_HOG on May 29, 2009, 01:04:16 AM

As I said 5 posts before this one, my dealer got approval from MoCo to warranty my tire at 5k

Your Dealer must like you! I am at 5K on the tire and feel it is unsafe but I was told by Victorville HD and Customer service that there is a "Running Change" at the factory but it is not a recall and they will not warranty the tire.

Any Ideas other than just use my Tire and Wheel Coverage?

UFO_HOG · « **Reply #37 on:** June 22, 2009, 07:10:14 PM »

Quote from: 2009FLTRSE3 on June 22, 2009, 02:16:47 PM

Your Dealer must like you! I am at 5K on the tire and feel it is unsafe but I was told by Victorville HD and Customer service that there is a "Running Change" at the factory but it is not a recall and they will not warranty the tire.

Any Ideas other than just use my Tire and Wheel Coverage?

My service manager told me that it was on a case by case basis and that they would have to call HD customer service to get approval. If your servicing dealer won't make the call, you do it. The number is in the front of your owners manual. I would stress the safety factor and that 5K is too little milage to be replacing a tire. Dunlop obviously knew they had a problem, why would they build a tire that only the dealers can get and is not even on their website. They want to try and get through all the 407's so they don't have to destroy a bunch of tires. Hope this helps Joe!.......

56FLE · « **Reply #38 on:** June 22, 2009, 08:26:56 PM »

I have been looking to get a new front tire for my 2008 SERK before the Hood River GTG. I been to the two Austin TX dealers and the Temple TX dealer. This is what I found out. Dunlop is changing the D407F to a D408F which reverses the tread pattern, two of the three dealers I spoke to don't have any front tires in stock and the new D408F tires are on backorder until June 24th. If you get a tire from a dealer now, it will probably be the old D407F tire that wears out in 8K or less miles.

I'll wait until June 24th, get the latest then and if I have to, I'll just go to the Honda dealer and buy a Dunlop Elite 3 for the front and ride for 16K miles. I have had two of them already for about 32K.

2009FLTRSE3 · « **Reply #39 on:** June 22, 2009, 11:23:49 PM »

Quote from: UFO_HOG on June 22, 2009, 07:10:14 PM

My service manager told me that it was on a case by case basis and that they would have to call HD customer service to get approval. If your servicing dealer won't make the call, you do it. The number is in the front of your owners manual. I would stress the safety factor and that 5K is too little milage to be replacing a tire. Dunlop obviously knew they had a problem, why would they build a tire that only the dealers can get and is not even on their website. They want to try and get through all the 407's so they don't have to destroy a bunch of tires. Hope this helps Joe!.......

Yea i spoke with the customer service this morning before the post they were no help. I will file a complaint with the NHTSA, mabey with some help it might force a recall.

56FLE · « **Reply #40 on:** June 23, 2009, 06:42:08 PM »

Stopped by the Central Texas HD in Round Rock today and the subject of the tire came up with the part counter guy. Now this dealer has the old D407F tire in stock so his computer had the new D408F tire's part number superceded back to the old D407F tire and the old D047F tire pending obsolete. The Cowboy HD in south Austin did not have any of the old D407F tires in stock so their compture showed the D407F tire superceded by the new D408F tire.

Isn't that just like HD to let the customers foot the bill on clearing old stock of problem tires instead of getting the manufacturer Dunlop to eat the junk tires.

Highwaystar · « **Reply #41 on:** June 23, 2009, 07:17:05 PM »

What is the number to the NHSTA? We need to send a strong message concerning safety....The treatment I got from APPLETON HARLEY DAVIDSON was not good. I was told NO tire at 3200 miles and get out my wallet if I wanted to order a new tire...MoCo said N...O... #$@&%^$ and $#&@*%!!!!!! ...

grc · « **Reply #42 on:** June 23, 2009, 07:54:07 PM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on June 23, 2009, 07:17:05 PM

What is the number to the NHSTA? We need to send a strong message concerning safety....The treatment I got from APPLETON HARLEY DAVIDSON was not good. I was told NO tire at 3200 miles and get out my wallet if I wanted to order a new tire...MoCo said N...O... #$@&%^$ and $#&@*%!!!!!! ...

Quote from: 56FLE on June 23, 2009, 06:42:08 PM

...............................
Isn't that just like HD to let the customers foot the bill on clearing old stock of problem tires instead of getting the manufacturer Dunlop to eat the junk tires.

Yes, that's exactly like H-D and it's the reason I've refused to buy another bike from them. They peddle crap and then expect the dumb asses who buy their products to foot the bill to fix their lousy engineering and their lousy quality. Definitely file a complaint with the NHTSA, (888) 327-4236 or you can even do it online by filling out a form on their website.

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm

Jerry

hdbrad03 · « **Reply #43 on:** June 23, 2009, 08:44:34 PM »

It's not up to the dealer or Harley! My dealer kept saying to many miles I said go read the Dunlop Warranty include with every bike sale, I got 3 tires from Harley on the wife's 07 FLHRSE3. I know I'm the exception. Maybe Harley has change their Warranty but Dunlop has not!!!!

The tires are warrantied by Dunlop as follows.

WHAT IS WARRANTED
Every new Dunlop motorcycle tire that becomes unserviceable within six years or 72 months of the date of manufacture for conditions other than those which are listed under "WHAT IS NOT COVERED" will be replaced on the basis specified under "REPLACEMENT COST" below.

ELIGIBILITY
This warranty is extended to the first retail purchaser.

REPLACEMENT COST UP TO 50% WORN
If, during the first fifty percent (50%) of tread wear, the tire becomes unserviceable for a condition covered by this warranty, it will be replaced with a comparable new Dunlop tire. You pay only for retailer services, such as mounting and balancing.

AFTER 50% TREAD WEAR
If, after the first fifty percent (50%) of tread wear, the tire becomes unserviceable for a condition covered by this warranty, your Dunlop motorcycle tire retailer will replace it with a comparable new Dunlop tire at a cost calculated in the following manner:

Either your original buying price substantiated by invoice, or the retailer's current selling price, times (x)
Fifty percent (50%)
Plus (+) all applicable federal excise taxes, and local taxes and all charges for retailer services such as mounting and balancing
A CASH REFUND WILL NOT BE EXTENDED IN LIEU OF THE ABOVE.

Brad

charles05663 · « **Reply #44 on:** June 23, 2009, 09:26:10 PM »

Thanks for the info on the tire Brad. I checked my front tire and I have one of the dreaded D407F's. Good to know before I have to hold some feet to the fire.

I was at the stealer today asking about using Amsoil/Redline/Mobil instead of Syn3. Was given the line that it would void my warranty.

It seems that most of the stealers/HD/Dunlop/HD Extended Warranty are trying to avoid holding up their end of the bargain.

Highwaystar · « **Reply #45 on:** June 23, 2009, 09:44:10 PM »

Why can't the stealer help out and make the connection with Dunlap and get these junk experimental 407F #cking tires replaced before some one is hurt.

charles05663 · « **Reply #46 on:** June 23, 2009, 09:52:34 PM »

Does anyone have a pic of what the cupping looks like?

Highjagger · « **Reply #47 on:** June 24, 2009, 02:34:41 AM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on June 23, 2009, 09:44:10 PM

Why can't the stealer help out and make the connection with Dunlap and get these junk experimental 407F #cking tires replaced before some one is hurt.

money ( makes the world go around )

Highjagger · « **Reply #48 on:** June 24, 2009, 02:37:31 AM »

Quote from: charles05663 on June 23, 2009, 09:52:34 PM

Does anyone have a pic of what the cupping looks like?

You better feel it with your finger than see it with your eyes .
Side profile , not in the middle , the braking edge of the rubber disapears , the opposite edge is fully ok .
I think that you won`t see it on a picture .

grc · « **Reply #49 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:46:04 AM »

Quote from: hdbrad03 on June 23, 2009, 08:44:34 PM

It's not up to the dealer or Harley! .......................................
Brad

Brad, I agree up to a point. The tire warranty is still through Dunlop, but these tires are exclusively designed for and supplied to Harley-Davidson and branded as such. Harley needs to join the modern age and stop hiding behind that BS separate warranty from the tire company crap and do what folks like Ford have done, handle the warranty themselves. Dunlop is a supplier to H-D, and if they peddle crap and then refuse to stand behind it the purchasing folks at H-D need to find another vendor. If H-D was worth a chit, they would give Dunlop a choice, take care of the people and get the crappy parts out of inventory, or take the rest of your tires and peddle them elsewhere. I think the folks at Dunlop would be more than happy to handle the problem properly if faced with the loss of all that OEM business. So yes, as far as I'm concerned it's still a MoCo problem. After all, you bought the bike and the tires from Harley, not from Dunlop. You are a customer of that dealer and Harley-Davidson, and they need to step up and take care of their customers.

Jerry

Screamin · « **Reply #50 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:46:25 AM »

Quote from: charles05663 on June 23, 2009, 09:52:34 PM

Does anyone have a pic of what the cupping looks like?

You can feel it if you run your hand along the the edge of the tread pattern. Tread is higher on one side of the short leg of the "Y" than the other (front to back.)

Highjagger · « **Reply #51 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:54:55 AM »

And in germany we do not have the choice of a tire warranty , there is none , and there is no extended harley warranty available . You are lucky guys .

grc · « **Reply #52 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:55:55 AM »

Quote from: charles05663 on June 23, 2009, 09:26:10 PM

Thanks for the info on the tire Brad. I checked my front tire and I have one of the dreaded D407F's. Good to know before I have to hold some feet to the fire.

I was at the stealer today asking about using Amsoil/Redline/Mobil instead of Syn3. Was given the line that it would void my warranty.
It seems that most of the stealers/HD/Dunlop/HD Extended Warranty are trying to avoid holding up their end of the bargain.

I sure hope you set whoever told you that crap straight. In some places it's just an individual or two that play that game, but in other's it's a policy that comes from the top. Those places need to quit treating customers like idiots, but most won't as long as customer's accept the BS. Find the guy or gal who actually runs the place and ask them if that answer reflects their policies or if it's just a misinformed employee spouting BS. Then you might want to refer them to the Magnusson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975, which specifically outlaws the crap you were told. And if they don't back off their claims, I would let them know they have seen the last of me and my wallet. If people would quit supporting the crooks, the crooks would either change their ways or fade into the sunset.

Jerry

charles05663 · « **Reply #53 on:** June 24, 2009, 10:12:02 AM »

Not to hijack the thread...

Jerry,

I did mention the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act to the service tech who gave me the BS. He still tried to continue to give me the BS. I told him I would take my chances. Asked how much the Amsoil was and they wanted $16/qt. Needles to say, I will be buying it online. Looking at servicing my own bike at this point.

Highwaystar · « **Reply #54 on:** June 24, 2009, 05:49:40 PM »

If yours front tires crapped out on your new Ford at 3000 mile, heads would roll..... Sound's reasonable to me...Guy kinda looks like the parts department manager!...

Fired00d · « **Reply #55 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:57:14 PM »

Seems Dunlops have some serious issues going on.

The following pictures were sent to me by a friend showing a blowout of a Dunlop (rear) tire that a friend of his had. Not sure what make of bike it is but in his email he states that Dunlop wouldn't warranty the tire (said it happened due to low air pressure in the tire, but the tire had 32lbs of pressure when he trailered it to the shop), however the dealer did replace the tire.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

Fired00d · « **Reply #56 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:57:38 PM »

Another...

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

Fired00d · « **Reply #57 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:58:03 PM »

Another...

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

Fired00d · « **Reply #58 on:** June 24, 2009, 08:58:29 PM »

Last one...

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

Fired00d · « **Reply #59 on:** June 24, 2009, 09:11:26 PM »

Disclaimer: The email said this was a Dunlop I have not been able to determine if it was or wasn't. If any one recognizes this tire as being something other then Dunlop let me know.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

SBB · « **Reply #60 on:** June 24, 2009, 09:21:36 PM »

Quote from: Fired00d on June 24, 2009, 09:11:26 PM

Disclaimer: The email said this was a Dunlop I have not been able to determine if it was or wasn't. If any one recognizes this tire as being something other then Dunlop let me know.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

It may be a Damlop, that's the cheap version of Dunlop.
You know, I was doing burnouts and the dam tread lopped off!

Twolanerider · « **Reply #61 on:** June 24, 2009, 10:23:25 PM »

Quote from: Fired00d on June 24, 2009, 09:11:26 PM

Disclaimer: The email said this was a Dunlop I have not been able to determine if it was or wasn't. If any one recognizes this tire as being something other then Dunlop let me know.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

SX01 (from the sidewall) is a Dunlop. But it's a tire intended for little scooters. OE supplied for the Yamaha Majesty. If someone put this on a full sized street bike just because it happened to have a satisfactory ID or OD they might hace deserved having it blow underneath them for trying to be too cheap. Almost certainly wouldn't have been rated for speed or weight.

bandit · « **Reply #62 on:** June 25, 2009, 05:53:38 AM »

special for CVOSJOE and UFO_HOG, but also the other, who got their front-tire changed under warranty:

does your dealer has anything on paper from the MOCO, about this warranty, or do they have
written that they will take over warranty. Here in Europe it doesn't help us, that we have the
infos out of the forum. We need written facts, to force HD Europe to move their a....!! Same
problem with the nasty gap, they "know" nothing about it. Calling CustomerService in USA,
wan't help, they forwarded it to HD-Europe.

bandit

Highjagger · « **Reply #63 on:** June 25, 2009, 06:07:08 AM »

I got a new seat here in germany after sending the link of the CVOharley board to my dealer and complaining 2 month again and again , but as all the others it was the same problem with the new one , rode home and hung it into the garage and put the signature seat on again .

Fired00d · « **Reply #64 on:** June 25, 2009, 06:56:50 AM »

Quote from: Twolanerider on June 24, 2009, 10:23:25 PM

SX01 (from the sidewall) is a Dunlop. But it's a tire intended for little scooters. OE supplied for the Yamaha Majesty. If someone put this on a full sized street bike just because it happened to have a satisfactory ID or OD they might hace deserved having it blow underneath them for trying to be too cheap. Almost certainly wouldn't have been rated for speed or weight.

Thanks for the clarification.

I'll try to find out what bike this was on.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

cvosjoe · « **Reply #65 on:** June 25, 2009, 07:10:43 AM »

Quote from: bandit on June 25, 2009, 05:53:38 AM

special for CVOSJOE and UFO_HOG, but also the other, who got their front-tire changed under warranty:

does your dealer has anything on paper from the MOCO, about this warranty, or do they have
written that they will take over warranty. Here in Europe it doesn't help us, that we have the
infos out of the forum. We need written facts, to force HD Europe to move their a....!! Same
problem with the nasty gap, they "know" nothing about it. Calling CustomerService in USA,
wan't help, they forwarded it to HD-Europe.

bandit

bandit.
The dealer told me that they called the HD Customer Service and explained the problem with the tire. HD customer service told them to replace the tire and wheel. Apparently the first bikes produced had front wheels that were not machined correctly. Anyway that is what I was told.
Hope this helps,
Joe

UFO_HOG · « **Reply #66 on:** June 25, 2009, 04:34:56 PM »

Quote from: cvosjoe on June 25, 2009, 07:10:43 AM

bandit.
The dealer told me that they called the HD Customer Service and explained the problem with the tire. HD customer service told them to replace the tire and wheel. Apparently the first bikes produced had front wheels that were not machined correctly. Anyway that is what I was told.
Hope this helps,
Joe

Same here, except no wheel replacement. My main complaint was front end wobble and an unsafe tire.

Fired00d · « **Reply #67 on:** June 26, 2009, 11:06:55 AM »

Quote from: Twolanerider on June 24, 2009, 10:23:25 PM

SX01 (from the sidewall) is a Dunlop. But it's a tire intended for little scooters. OE supplied for the Yamaha Majesty. If someone put this on a full sized street bike just because it happened to have a satisfactory ID or OD they might hace deserved having it blow underneath them for trying to be too cheap. Almost certainly wouldn't have been rated for speed or weight.

Heard back from friend of the friend with this bike and he believes it is a Honda 400.

Ride Safe,
Fired00d

anglia48 · « **Reply #68 on:** June 26, 2009, 03:06:57 PM »

I had the same problem on a 2005 Heritage. I was running the recommended pressure and it still cupped. Changed to Metzelers and they said to run max air pressure that it states on the tires. At least 40 psi. The Dunlop had approx. 7-8000 miles.

bandit · « **Reply #69 on:** July 02, 2009, 12:29:56 PM »

Tried to get the D408 here in Switzerland, no way. Contacted Dunlop using their
web-contact and asked why. That's what they answered:

"Dunlop Tire"
<website@dunlopmotorcycle.com>
07/01/2009 09:43 AM
Subject: Dunlop Tire Contact Form Submission

Thank you for taking the time to contact us. Unfortunately, we have no
information available regarding Dunlop products in locations outside of
North America. We're very sorry.

They give you no contact here in Europe or Switzerland, nice service.

bandit · « **Reply #70 on:** July 02, 2009, 12:31:51 PM »

Looking at dunlop news center/articles,
you see in the attached picture, that they
are very fond of their D407.

bandit · « **Reply #71 on:** July 02, 2009, 12:36:52 PM »

missed something in my last post: its the last sentence on the picture!!!

but using dunlops fitment guide for motorcycle tyres, they don't propose
their D407, it just show the size of the tyres.

bandit · « **Reply #72 on:** July 02, 2009, 12:38:09 PM »

and to make this thin absolutly ridiculuos, they
propose the D407 for the FXSTSSE3.

Highjagger · « **Reply #73 on:** July 02, 2009, 06:03:20 PM »

is there a D408 for the rear ?
the bikes with D 408 in front do have a D407 at the rear .( I heared )

Highwaystar · « **Reply #74 on:** July 02, 2009, 06:34:25 PM »

Stealer just gave me thumbs up on front replacement today...MoCo said OK to 4-407 fronts for other bikes here in Wisconsin.

56FLE · « **Reply #75 on:** July 02, 2009, 07:39:18 PM »

You should push for the D408F if possible. The guys with that tire are faring better when it comes to wear and cupping.

cvosjoe · « **Reply #76 on:** July 03, 2009, 04:52:06 PM »

FYI: The dealer replaced my D407F with the D408F and after 6K the tire looks great. BTW I took the balance weights off that the dealer put on with the new tire and I added dyna beads instead.

Highwaystar · « **Reply #77 on:** July 03, 2009, 10:07:40 PM »

I have an appointment Wednesday for the 408F replacement. Full warranty 4600 miles. Here is the picture of typical cupping of the 407F.

Ultrafun · « **Reply #78 on:** July 08, 2009, 11:59:17 PM »

Hey Folks,

VA HD shops apparantly know nothing about a D407 cupping problem. What I did do is say you can have my 09 CVO Ultra tire (1200 mile) and I'll pay for a D408 tire. When the recall comes out - ya owe me. Tire is due in this Friday.
I did walk around the show room and show few folks the newer 09's tread vs the older 09's.

Humm - what next?

Ride safe,

Ultrafun

bandit · « **Reply #79 on:** July 09, 2009, 11:25:10 AM »

Everybody is talking about cupping, well we are supposed to drive
in sunny weather. What about rain-conditions with a aquaplaning
on the street, if the tread is gowing the wrong side, what will the
water do? I hope for everyone of us, that no one will go down
cause of this!!!!!

bandit

$:-\$

UFO_HOG · « **Reply #80 on:** July 09, 2009, 11:48:28 AM »

Quote from: bandit on July 09, 2009, 11:25:10 AM

Everybody is talking about cupping, well we are supposed to drive
in sunny weather. What about rain-conditions with a aquaplaning
on the street, if the tread is gowing the wrong side, what will the
water do? I hope for everyone of us, that no one will go down
cause of this!!!!!

bandit

$:-\$

Compare it to a ME880 Metzeler, tread design is nearly the same, and a ME880 works well in the wet........

Highwaystar · « **Reply #81 on:** July 09, 2009, 05:48:48 PM »

I did a 70 to zero panic stop in heavy traffic on the new 408F today. The ABS and tire saved my life. I went down hard in 93 on a GSXR 1100 from a lock up slide...and it hurts. The SERG stopped better than any bike I have ever ridden. Thanks Wiily G. for excellent engineering.

2009FLTRSE3 · « **Reply #82 on:** July 09, 2009, 08:45:05 PM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on July 09, 2009, 05:48:48 PM

I did a 70 to zero panic stop in heavy traffic on the new 408F today. The ABS and tire saved my life. I went down hard in 93 on a GSXR 1100 from a lock up slide...and it hurts. The SERG stopped better than any bike I have ever ridden. Thanks Wiily G. for excellent engineering.

good to hear you are ok. keep the shiny side up.

Highwaystar · « **Reply #83 on:** July 09, 2009, 09:58:45 PM »

Thanks, I have been taking other drivers for granted again. A new awareness for sure.

muddypaws · « **Reply #84 on:** July 16, 2009, 10:16:15 AM »

My dealer looked at my front tire yesterday and called Harley. They told her they would not replace the tire for free. She told me to call. I did and Harley told me to wait to weeks as they were working on a plan. I then told them it's their call as the tire is a safety concern. As soon as I said safety they had me talk to the next level of customer service. I will have a new FREE tire Monday. The tire has 8500 miles on it.

miker · « **Reply #85 on:** July 16, 2009, 10:50:34 AM »

Mine was replaced yesterday, gratis...It had sidewall cracking and I had a bad coast down wobble.
Only 1 once of weight on this tire...

Kudos to Terri at Harley of Palm Beach.

Highjagger · « **Reply #86 on:** July 16, 2009, 12:45:28 PM »

Quote from: muddypaws on July 16, 2009, 10:16:15 AM

My dealer looked at my front tire yesterday and called Harley. They told her they would not replace the tire for free. She told me to call. I did and Harley told me to wait to weeks as they were working on a plan. I then told them it's their call as the tire is a safety concern. As soon as I said safety they had me talk to the next level of customer service. I will have a new FREE tire Monday. The tire has 8500 miles on it.

Congrats , that`s the way it goes

GregKhougaz · « **Reply #87 on:** July 21, 2009, 02:23:33 PM »

Sad that HD is not consistent here. I called HD customer service today and was told two weeks. When I said I was

concerned about the safety of the tire, no response.... I'll give them the two weeks before I

really give

it to them.

sem_bunda · « **Reply #88 on:** July 21, 2009, 05:45:53 PM »

Anybody seen the posts about someone having wobbly handlebars when they let go of them? I thought it was a response to this thread and I have an idea for the guy who had that problem, if he still has it.

BTW, mine are 408 and love the tire, bike and performance both riding and stopping. Absolutel loved my FLHRC but this SERG beats it hands down. I think the O/B paint keeps the tires from cupping...

sblair · « **Reply #89 on:** July 23, 2009, 11:58:04 AM »

But its still not as fast as the silver!!!!!!!

charles05663 · « **Reply #90 on:** July 23, 2009, 12:55:46 PM »

And the reason that you hardly ever see the yellow SERG's is they are sooo fast you just miss them.

weamdog · « **Reply #91 on:** August 03, 2009, 11:06:16 PM »

I think this front tire problem actually killed my radio at 16k. I have nearly 17k miles on the front tire and am replacing with metzler. No dealer will touch the tire because they read tread wear at the trailing edge of the pattern which is gone. I've called customer service, they, they are a bunch of corporate idiots that read their responses out of a book. While i had my bike at my dealer there were other issues with the bike that i told them not to touch until i knew what was going to be done about the tire, of course they didn't listen and broke more $hit. I took my bike back and will go elsewhere. No more Harley/Dunlop tires for this boy and i only have 17 more days where i have to deal with the dealer for maintenance. Pretty sad that we pay this type of money and get no service. Everybody at my dealer is very much aware that I will not be going back there. I've filed complaints with customer service, BBB and NHTSA. Not that it will do any good, but at least it will make a little noise and somebody will have to do a little work.

Highwaystar · « **Reply #92 on:** August 03, 2009, 11:18:33 PM »

I'm assuming all of the Orange SERG's got their new front skin with out any problems. I think they are servicing the "Fast" bike's first. Yellow and Silver must have patience and understand priorities...

sem_bunda · « **Reply #93 on:** August 04, 2009, 12:18:36 PM »

Weamdog, too bad you're having those issues. I wish MoCo would be more consistent with their dealers as some guys love their dealers and are treated very fairly, and others hate them and can't rely on a thing they say or do. My experience with Dunlop has been great, with the 408 tire on front and just back from Sturgis - 8 states, 3,400 miles, 9 days and all kinds of weather, the tires and the bike did great. I know you're against Dunlop now, but if you are running the 407 on front, maybe consider the 408?

GregKhougaz · « **Reply #94 on:** August 04, 2009, 03:57:54 PM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on August 03, 2009, 11:18:33 PM

I'm assuming all of the Orange SERG's got their new front skin with out any problems. I think they are servicing the "Fast" bike's first. Yellow and Silver must have patients and understand priorities...

See what happens when you drink too much?!!?

Hotrod50 · « **Reply #95 on:** August 04, 2009, 05:05:14 PM »

Quote from: Highwaystar on August 03, 2009, 11:18:33 PM

I'm assuming all of the Orange SERG's got their new front skin with out any problems. I think they are servicing the "Fast" bike's first. Yellow and Silver must have patients and understand priorities...

Highway Star, 2 things. The front tire is not a dual compound. I read that in the brochure also and found out after I bought my bike that the dual compound is only on the rear. And secondly, we yellows may be slow, but at least we can spell "patience".

Hoist! · « **Reply #96 on:** August 04, 2009, 06:58:31 PM »

Wow! A couple of threads on D407 tire cupping! Where have I herard about that subject before?!!!

Us SERK guys have been going thru this with those POS D407's since '06! This is NOTHING NEW!!! HD designs around these GARBAGE tires and then you've got little to no alternatives. We have them in Radial ply. Metzler finally came out with matching sizes and weight ratings in Radial ply, so we now finally have an alternative! So figure you got about another 2 years of being tortured by HD over theses P'sOS they try to call front tires. Hopefully by then, you'll have an alternative too!!! FTF!!!

Hoist!

Highwaystar · « **Reply #97 on:** August 04, 2009, 07:39:32 PM »

Hey Hot rod, stop pikin on us gize frum Wiscohsin dang it...I kin spell lots a stuf.

sblair · « **Reply #98 on:** August 06, 2009, 01:22:26 PM »

Hoist, hate to bust your bubble but the D407 tire first came out on the 09's. Redesigned rubber and lasts longer. The previous years were D402's. When I originally had my tire issue, the only replacement was a D402 used on the SERK's. The rear D407 on the SERG is a one off and does not go on any other bike (except maybe the new 2010 SESG).

Hoist! · « **Reply #99 on:** August 06, 2009, 02:23:31 PM »

Quote from: sblair on August 06, 2009, 01:22:26 PM

Hoist, hate to bust your bubble but the D407 tire first came out on the 09's. Redesigned rubber and lasts longer. The previous years were D402's. When I originally had my tire issue, the only replacement was a D402 used on the SERK's. The rear D407 on the SERG is a one off and does not go on any other bike (except maybe the new 2010 SESG).

Sorry, you're absolutely wrong on this man! THE D407 DID NOT COME OUT FIRST ON THE '09's! Might be the first BIAS PLY D407 for HD, but not the first D407's on a HD! The SERK3/4 uses a 130/70 R 18 radial on the front. HD started in '06 with the E3 upfront, then switched to the D407, and did not make the E3 available thru HD again. There was NEVER an E3 rear made to match the front. The rear has always been a D407 170/60 R 17. These tires are also one-offs on our bikes, except Metzler now makes ME880 Radials in our sizes. Don't know where you got your info from, but you should do more research first. It's just PLAIN INCORRECT! Go back to threads from '07 here, and you'll find info on the crappy D407 F on the SERKs from back then. I should know, I wrote most of it!

ADDED: And BTW, they last for CHIT!!!

My bubble is still intact!!!

Hoist!

Black Diamond · « **Reply #100 on:** August 06, 2009, 02:45:39 PM »

Quote from: sblair on August 06, 2009, 01:22:26 PM

Hoist, hate to bust your bubble but the D407 tire first came out on the 09's. Redesigned rubber and lasts longer. The previous years were D402's. When I originally had my tire issue, the only replacement was a D402 used on the SERK's. The rear D407 on the SERG is a one off and does not go on any other bike (except maybe the new 2010 SESG).

sblair

The D407 was OEM for the 2008 FLHRSE4. It is posted in the MoCo literature. I have replaced the front and rear twice. The front for cupping @ 10000 to 12000 miles. The rear tires were just due to wear. It seemed the 2nd 407 lasted a little longer than the 1st but only by 2000 or so miles.

Howie
I have just mounted the ME 880. My initial impression has not be overwhelming. The front does not seem to have the traction the D407 had. The ME 880 seems to transmit more of the roads irregularities thru the handlebars. They have around 150 miles on em so the jury is still out. If the traction remains an issue, I'll look at the 408 front / 407 rear set up.

JW

LarryB · « **Reply #101 on:** August 06, 2009, 02:59:34 PM »

while in Sturgis I had the chance to talk to Dunlop about this issue, their response was that the new D408F is the way they presented it to HD. HD dod not like the asthetics of the two different directions and had Dunlop procede with manufacturing it backwards. this is why the warrantee has been an issue.

Hoist! · « **Reply #102 on:** August 06, 2009, 03:25:32 PM »

Quote from: Black Diamond on August 06, 2009, 02:45:39 PM

sblair

The D407 was OEM for the 2008 FLHRSE4. It is posted in the MoCo literature. I have replaced the front and rear twice. The front for cupping @ 10000 to 12000 miles. The rear tires were just due to wear. It seemed the 2nd 407 lasted a little longer than the 1st but only by 2000 or so miles.

Howie
I have just mounted the ME 880. My initial impression has not be overwhelming. The front does not seem to have the traction the D407 had. The ME 880 seems to transmit more of the roads irregularities thru the handlebars. They have around 150 miles on em so the jury is still out. If the traction remains an issue, I'll look at the 408 front / 407 rear set up.

JW

There is NO D408 RADIAL made for our SERK's Jeff! I'm not sold yet on the ME's either. My wobble seems a lil worse with the ME's and that has me concerned. I was running an E3, not a D407 on the front, and the E3F/D407R combo handled pretty well for me. I thought I'd see a "night & day" difference with the ME's. Maybe I was hoping for too much out of em. But so far, I'm not overly impressed with em either. If that perception doesn't change, I'll be going back the the E3/D407 combo again, and just deal with the crappy wear.

Quote from: LarryB on August 06, 2009, 02:59:34 PM

while in Sturgis I had the chance to talk to Dunlop about this issue, their response was that the new D408F is the way they presented it to HD. HD dod not like the asthetics of the two different directions and had Dunlop procede with manufacturing it backwards. this is why the warrantee has been an issue.

Dunlop never addressed their issues on the D407 Radials for the SERK's, and has NEVER indicated making a D408 for the SERK's. Therefore, as of now, this is NOT an option for the SERK.

Hoist!

Black Diamond · « **Reply #103 on:** August 13, 2009, 11:33:59 PM »

Quote from: Black Diamond on August 06, 2009, 02:45:39 PM

Howie
I have just mounted the ME 880. My initial impression has not be overwhelming. The front does not seem to have the traction the D407 had. The ME 880 seems to transmit more of the roads irregularities thru the handlebars. They have around 150 miles on em so the jury is still out. If the traction remains an issue, I'll look at the 408 front / 407 rear set up.

JW

Well I'm not sure what to make of this. Now that the ME 880 have just over 500 miles on em, they are sticking to the pavement very nicely. The vibration thru the handlebars has reduced a great deal. I'm now comfortable to lean her over and have fun. I would not think it would take so long for the tires to "break in."

JW

Author Topic: Heads up....Front Tire Cupping!!!!! (Read 27493 times)