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Author Topic: New Zippers ECU.  (Read 6569 times)

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Ironhorse

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New Zippers ECU.
« on: September 15, 2007, 12:00:27 AM »

Well last Sunday I finished about 3,500 miles with my new Zippers ECU.

I am running MAP 307, and the bike did fine. My worst tank was 30mpgs, stop and go traffic in Malibu CA, my best tank was 46mpgs, at altitude running about 45-55mph. When I rode 75-85 I got 35mpg, 65-76 I got 38mpgs, 55-65 I got 42mpgs, and 45-55 about 44mpgs. The bike ran the same at sea level as it did over 7,000 feet. It survived floods, hail, and lightning storms without a glitch.

I ran a couple of tanks of 87 octane with no problems or pinging, and that included temps in the high 90s, going up a hill, and pulling away in 5th gear from 2,300rpm. JDK says I probably have a few more horses that could be tuned in, but I won't look for them, the bike has enough for me right now.

I have but two complaints.

One is that when warmed up, and I come to a stop, the engine speed drops below the set idle just a second, then comes right up. The engine does not stall, it just drops and comes up. My IAC Stop Target is set to 7.

I still have popping on decel. The Decel Fuel Cut is activated, the range is set from a high of 2500 to a low of 1280, and the Decel Post Fuel Enrichement is set at 10.

Any ideas where to adjust?
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rednectum

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2007, 03:28:12 AM »

you may try adding a wee bit of timing in the 500, 750,1000 rpm range. i know those arent the exact numbers but you get the idea.  late timing and reversion from the pipes may be the problem.

you may think im nuts, but clean your speed sensor in the tranny also.
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Ironhorse

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2007, 10:43:42 AM »

you may try adding a wee bit of timing in the 500, 750,1000 rpm range. i know those arent the exact numbers but you get the idea.  late timing and reversion from the pipes may be the problem.

you may think im nuts, but clean your speed sensor in the tranny also.

I already cleaned the speedo sensor about a month ago, it was covered with the usual gunk and metal shavings. I may check it again.
As for the timing, I need a little more info please.

At what throttle degree position do I start to raise the line?
At what throttle degree position do I start to lower the line?
And how many degree blocks should I raise and then lower it?
Should I do this to ALL the rpms ranges you suggested, 512, 768, 1024?

Right now, on MAP 307 the timing line for:

512rpms is flat all the way across at "8.000 deg of change @ throttle position 0".

768rpms the line starts at "13deg change @ throttle position 0", continues there to "13deg change @ throttle position 12.699", then jumps up to "15.000 deg change @ 14.076 throttle position" for two blocks, down to "14.000deg change @ 16.891 throttle position", to "12.000deg change @ 19.299 throttle position", to "11.000deg @ 19.707 throttle position, to "10.000deg change @ 21.114 throttle position, to "9.000deg change @ 22.522 throttle change" where it levels out and maintains that across the chart.

1024 rpms the line starts at "13.000deg change @ throttle position 0.000", continues flat until, "14.000deg change @ throttle position 12.669" where it continues up one one block increment at at time peaking at "16.000deg change @ throttle position 15.484", then continues back down in one block increments to "9.000deg change @ throttle position 23.930" where it levels out across the chart.

I don't mind making changes as you suggest, but I really don't want to change too much stuff because except for these two issues, the dropping idle, and the decel popping, the bike runs really well.

Thanks
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rednectum

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2007, 08:17:30 PM »

wow, i wish everyone provided that much info!!

try this------------at 0 to 5 percent throttle, raise dots 2 notches in the beforementioned (is that a word?                                     ) range. if you get less popping, you know you are on the right track! if it seems to work, raise a cople more notches. if popping goes away, smooth the line!

BTW, forgive my memory, but if this is an 07, be sure and pull some timing out of the rear cylinder to avoid ping.

PM if you need more help.
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Eqcons

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2007, 08:58:08 AM »

I still have popping on decel. The Decel Fuel Cut is activated, the range is set from a high of 2500 to a low of 1280, and the Decel Post Fuel Enrichement is set at 10.

Any ideas where to adjust?

Maybe problem 1 is the result of the settings for problem 2, horse?

Can I ask how you came up with the settings for the Decel range and Post Fuel Enrichment?  I have the decel popping too, and I'd like to try this...

Jim
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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2007, 01:03:22 PM »

Maybe problem 1 is the result of the settings for problem 2, horse?

Can I ask how you came up with the settings for the Decel range and Post Fuel Enrichment?  I have the decel popping too, and I'd like to try this...

Jim

I honestly am not trying to be a smart a$$, or start anything, but I also had the problem of significant popping under decel with my TMax and Autotune.  I tried to utilize Zippers customer service to solve this problem for quite some time.  Quite an experience....  I could lessen the problem by sacrificing mileage - which was an unacceptable solution, but I could not get rid of it.  But then, I came upon an solution which eliminated the problem completely.  I now have better mileage then I ever had with any program or modifications to the TMax, and I have absolutely no popping under decel.  And, I have the best performance numbers since owning the bike.  The solution was a Power Commander tuned by Speeds Performance...

Scott

p.s. - I have a slightly used TMax ECM w/autotune module  - 02 sensors - cd - cables for sale.  First $500 including shipping buys it.

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2007, 01:11:16 PM »

I honestly am not trying to be a smart a$$, or start anything, but I also had the problem of significant popping under decel with my TMax and Autotune.  I tried to utilize Zippers customer service to solve this problem for quite some time.  Quite an experience....  I could lessen the problem by sacrificing mileage - which was an unacceptable solution, but I could not get rid of it.  But then, I came upon an solution which eliminated the problem completely.  I now have better mileage then I ever had with any program or modifications to the TMax, and I have absolutely no popping under decel.  And, I have the best performance numbers since owning the bike.  The solution was a Power Commander tuned by Speeds Performance...

Scott

p.s. - I have a slightly used TMax ECM w/autotune module  - 02 sensors - cd - cables for sale.  First $500 including shipping buys it.



Interesting Scott. You seem to be among many who have chosen this solution to fixing TM problems. Zippers is their own worst enemy in this issue. The problem can also be solved by ripping out that AT POJ and having the bike w/TMax ECM tuned on a Dyno. But the people who are good tuning them are few and far between. Even if you choose to keep the AT, it'll never work right without a correct base map anyway. Don't fall for the "it'll be all setup for your bike" from Zippers. From what I've seen, their base maps aren't close enough, even for Zipper built engines. There is no substitute for a proper tune, regardless of what tuning device or ECM you use. Don't believe anything else. If you do, I also I have a nice bridge here in NYC for sale! ::)

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2007, 01:27:55 PM »

Interesting Scott. You seem to be among many who have chosen this solution to fixing TM problems. Zippers is their own worst enemy in this issue. The problem can also be solved by ripping out that AT POJ and having the bike w/TMax ECM tuned on a Dyno. But the people who are good tuning them are few and far between. Even if you choose to keep the AT, it'll never work right without a correct base map anyway. Don't fall for the "it'll be all setup for your bike" from Zippers. From what I've seen, their base maps aren't close enough, even for Zipper built engines. There is no substitute for a proper tune, regardless of what tuning device or ECM you use. Don't believe anything else. If you do, I also I have a nice bridge here in NYC for sale! ::)

Hoist! 8)

Well, despite the decel popping, and the problems I had with the TMAT on engine 1, I'm happy with it at this point in time, and I have no difficulty in getting a response (by email) from them when I need it.  YMMV....

Jim
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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2007, 01:35:22 PM »

Interesting Scott. You seem to be among many who have chosen this solution to fixing TM problems. Zippers is their own worst enemy in this issue. The problem can also be solved by ripping out that AT POJ and having the bike w/TMax ECM tuned on a Dyno. But the people who are good tuning them are few and far between. Even if you choose to keep the AT, it'll never work right without a correct base map anyway. Don't fall for the "it'll be all setup for your bike" from Zippers. From what I've seen, their base maps aren't close enough, even for Zipper built engines. There is no substitute for a proper tune, regardless of what tuning device or ECM you use. Don't believe anything else. If you do, I also I have a nice bridge here in NYC for sale! ::)

Hoist! 8)

It was really disappointing to get to the point of pulling the Tmax system off my bike.  I believe the technology is the way of the future, and I put a lot of effort into making it work.  I am most disappointed in the customer service provided by Zippers.  It is a lot of money to sit on a shelf.  I bet if I could drop my bike off at Zippers and they put serious effort into solving the problems I was having, that they could solve the problems and it would perform just as I hoped it would.  I just couldn't get there with it, and they couldn't (or didn't) help me get there with it.  I had almost convinced myself that the popping under decel was due to an air leak or other issue not related to the TMax....but after installing the Power Commander and having it dyno tuned by an expert - the problem was resolved - and I had better mileage then ever - and I had better performance then ever...  To bad - cause I love new technology and going into it, I thought this was a cool product.

Scott
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Eqcons

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2007, 01:43:22 PM »

It was really disappointing to get to the point of pulling the Tmax system off my bike.  I believe the technology is the way of the future, and I put a lot of effort into making it work.  I am most disappointed in the customer service provided by Zippers.  It is a lot of money to sit on a shelf.  I bet if I could drop my bike off at Zippers and they put serious effort into solving the problems I was having, that they could solve the problems and it would perform just as I hoped it would.  I just couldn't get there with it, and they couldn't (or didn't) help me get there with it.  I had almost convinced myself that the popping under decel was due to an air leak or other issue not related to the TMax....but after installing the Power Commander and having it dyno tuned by an expert - the problem was resolved - and I had better mileage then ever - and I had better performance then ever...  To bad - cause I love new technology and going into it, I thought this was a cool product.

Scott

For me, the big problem with the TMAT is that it neither uses the ION sensor, nor, therefore, can it dynamically adjust timing.  If they make it do that, it would be a huge step forward.

Jim
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Twolanerider

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2007, 05:17:27 PM »

For me, the big problem with the TMAT is that it neither uses the ION sensor, nor, therefore, can it dynamically adjust timing.  If they make it do that, it would be a huge step forward.

Jim

Well, that and the company support sucks like a black hole at high tide.
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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2007, 05:20:37 PM »

Well, that and the company support sucks like a black hole at high tide.

How dare you speak about my FIRST wife like that!
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Twolanerider

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #12 on: September 26, 2007, 05:25:41 PM »

How dare you speak about my FIRST wife like that!



Spew score today:

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Ironhorse

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #13 on: September 26, 2007, 11:33:36 PM »

Well guys I tried all the adjusting suggestions, and I still get a regular pop on decell. So until there is an "official fix" from Zippers, I am just going to have to live with it. Other than this, the bike starts right up, idles great, runs great, and gets okay mpgs. I know I can improve the mpgs by adjusting the "afr vs tps" settings, but for now I don't want to mess with anything. Compared to all my other Zippers issues, this one is bearable.
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Eqcons

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Re: New Zippers ECU.
« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2007, 05:56:35 AM »

Well guys I tried all the adjusting suggestions, and I still get a regular pop on decell. So until there is an "official fix" from Zippers, I am just going to have to live with it. Other than this, the bike starts right up, idles great, runs great, and gets okay mpgs. I know I can improve the mpgs by adjusting the "afr vs tps" settings, but for now I don't want to mess with anything. Compared to all my other Zippers issues, this one is bearable.

So where did you get the settings for the decel mods, Horse?   Did it improve things, or make no difference?

Jim
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