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[WFP]

Hey gang, there are a lot of FL people here so I thought I would try to extract some wisdom  

Anne and I want to start thinking about our future when we work because we wantr to and not because we have to!  We want to plan to be Florida residents at some point, maybe 10 years or so but think we want to at least get our feet wet in the Real Estate market now to prepare.  We are not looking to buy our Final Resting Place   but we think it would be good to ride the ups and downs of the RE market over the next 10 years.  So we are looking at the SW side in the Bonita Springs area.  We are looking for low maintenance so that is leading us down the Condo path...of which there are tons!

Our Number one requirement is RESALE Value with 2BR/2Ba/Garage that does not exclude MCs.  We aren't looking for waterfront and will be under $200K.

What are the things we should look for?
What are the things we should avoid if possible?
What are the things we should RUN away from, fast?
Other thoughts?

Is a Turnkey (Furnished)  option good or bad?  we aint the most creative  wrt interior decorating.
Golf-we don't but if resale is good, we would have no problem with a Golf community.

Bill

[dlaws01]

I would talk to the banks in the areas that interest me. They have a list of many foreclosures that they would be happy to receive any offers on just to get some money coming back in on those properties.  I have had several friends that have done so and are buying property under the local market values.  Good luck.

[VaEagle]

   just slightly off topic though but related......

I can't speak about the Florida real estate market but have read lately about a stress problem that has started with families where the older generation moves away from their sons/daughters to enjoy the golden years down south or someplace else, then when they get to where they need assistance they return home to family and it's like they are strangers since they have lived apart for 10+ years. You could also have the feelings of "why don't the kids/grandkids visit more often" and it could get lonely.
Not saying you can never leave the family but just saying you may feel out of place and they may be resentful... I guess good communication and planning can help.

Good luck with your plans!

(now back to the thread already in progress...    )

[WFP]

No kids so no worries or help in our golden years...but we try to keep close to our nieces from Norfolk!  Taking them on another Cruise over the Holidays.  So this may be perfect for us...they Love FL.

 just slightly off topic though but related......

I can't speak about the Florida real estate market but have read lately about a stress problem that has started with families where the older generation moves away from their sons/daughters to enjoy the golden years down south or someplace else, then when they get to where they need assistance they return home to family and it's like they are strangers since they have lived apart for 10+ years. You could also have the feelings of "why don't the kids/grandkids visit more often" and it could get lonely.
Not saying you can never leave the family but just saying you may feel out of place and they may be resentful... I guess good communication and planning can help.

Good luck with your plans!

(now back to the thread already in progress...    )

Thanks!   Part of the planning...too many foreclosures = less paying HOA fees.  Would need to strike the right balance.

/Bill

I would talk to the banks in the areas that interest me. They have a list of many foreclosures that they would be happy to receive any offers on just to get some money coming back in on those properties.  I have had several friends that have done so and are buying property under the local market values.  Good luck.

[CVOStreetglide]

No kids so no worries or help in our golden years...but we try to keep close to our nieces from Norfolk!  Taking them on another Cruise over the Holidays.  So this may be perfect for us...they Love FL.

Thanks!   Part of the planning...too many foreclosures = less paying HOA fees.  Would need to strike the right balance.

/Bill

Think about the seasons change as well. Your initial reaction is I never want to see winter again. Then you start missing the fall season with the leaves changing and a few crisp mornings. Add to it that the sun and heat never seem to go away. 

I picked Jacksonville because I can be in the Norfolk or Baltimopre Washington areas area in 10-11 hours by car with food and bathroom/gas stops. So going back and forth isn't a large expense. Travelling at night makes it a easy long days ride. I can also be up in the deep North Carolina mountains in about the same time.

As far as Real Estate goes and your idea of a low cost fixed budget Florida residence, I personally would steer away from condos. There are lots and lots of them on the market and fees and assessements for common areas and community fixed assets that may not be current because of foreclosures and property abandonments that you could be responsible for along with the other residents. 

No matter what you choose to do I strongly recommend using a good title and settlement attorney to protect your interests in that area and a good independent property appraiser and inspector as opposed to one recommended by the Real Estate people.

Remember to include your brides and your own personal interests in the location you select along with access to shopping and grocery stores and crime.

Good Hunting!

[WFP]

Think about the seasons change as well. Your initial reaction is I never want to see winter again. Then you start missing the fall season with the leaves changing and a few crisp mornings. Add to it that the sun and heat never seem to go away.  

I picked Jacksonville because I can be in the Norfolk or Baltimopre Washington areas area in 10-11 hours by car with food and bathroom/gas stops. So going back and forth isn't a large expense. Travelling at night makes it a easy long days ride. I can also be up in the deep North Carolina mountains in about the same time.

As far as Real Estate goes and your idea of a low cost fixed budget Florida residence, I personally would steer away from condos. There are lots and lots of them on the market and fees and assessements for common areas and community fixed assets that may not be current because of foreclosures and property abandonments that you could be responsible for along with the other residents.  

No matter what you choose to do I strongly recommend using a good title and settlement attorney to protect your interests in that area and a good independent property appraiser and inspector as opposed to one recommended by the Real Estate people.

Remember to include your brides and your own personal interests in the location you select along with access to shopping and grocery stores and crime.

Good Hunting!

Thanks great advice.  Regarding the highlighted text....When we have been asked how long we have been married, my canned response is happily married for TWO years since 1992  Annne then hits me and agrees  

/Bill

[owl893]

I have been a "snowbird" for twenty years now. I am familiar with this area (SW Florida). Bonita Springs is beautiful, but expensive. It borders Naples Florida which is known as one of the highest priced areas in the US. I live in Punta Gorda on the water. If you are not a boater stay away from the water, insurance is hard to get and expensive. If your budget fits in Bonita then look there, otherwise you may get more for the money in Cape Coral, North Fort Myers, Punta Gorda, Port Charlotte, North Port and South Venice.

What are the things we should look for? What are the things we should avoid if possible?
Homes built after 2004 have been constructed to a tougher building code. Use a buyer representative and if offering make it contingent on "inspection", hire one it's worth it. Check with an insurance agent on the address so it is NOT in a "velocity zone" (wind). Buy a hip roof home, many insurance credits here vs. gable roofs. "Home Owner Associations" can be good if the guy next door jacks up cars to repair, but bad if they are hyper restrictive and/or charge additional fees. 
What are the things we should RUN away from, fast? Condos, unless they are luxury they are likely to be rental pool investments, and are usually abused party barns or "project housing". The Villages of Ocala, good TV commercials, very crowded living. Know where the frost line is, the Riviera, Jacksonville, even Orlando are gorgeous but they can get cold, just be aware of it.
Other thoughts? Florida has no State income tax, but we DO have a 7% sales tax, and hefty property taxes. Water is as expensive as electricity and you will be watering your lawn and filling your pool. Our estate laws make wills more favorable to your family (as long as you homestead). We have quality, available health care (citrus, vegetables and old people drive our economy). DO NOT start at the top end of your budget, get down here, explore, learn, research, chances are you will move one more time.

If you want more information send me an e-mail with your phone # and I will give you a call. I don't sell homes, insurance or cars so it's safe.

OWL

[Chains]

We have been looking in Cape Coral and around Punta Gorda.  Had a place in Bradenton for 10 years sold it prior to the housing crash.  Will be buying a perminant residence this year.

Good luck on your search

[FlaHeatWave]

I have been a "snowbird" for twenty years now. I am familiar with this area (SW Florida). Bonita Springs is beautiful, but expensive. It borders Naples Florida which is known as one of the highest priced areas in the US. I live in Punta Gorda on the water. If you are not a boater stay away from the water, insurance is hard to get and expensive. If your budget fits in Bonita then look there, otherwise you may get more for the money in Cape Coral, North Fort Myers, Punta Gorda, Port Charlotte, North Port and South Venice.

What are the things we should look for? What are the things we should avoid if possible?
Homes built after 2004 have been constructed to a tougher building code. Use a buyer representative and if offering make it contingent on "inspection", hire one it's worth it. Check with an insurance agent on the address so it is NOT in a "velocity zone" (wind). Buy a hip roof home, many insurance credits here vs. gable roofs. "Home Owner Associations" can be good if the guy next door jacks up cars to repair, but bad if they are hyper restrictive and/or charge additional fees. 
What are the things we should RUN away from, fast? Condos, unless they are luxury they are likely to be rental pool investments, and are usually abused party barns or "project housing". The Villages of Ocala, good TV commercials, very crowded living. Know where the frost line is, the Riviera, Jacksonville, even Orlando are gorgeous but they can get cold, just be aware of it.
Other thoughts? Florida has no State income tax, but we DO have a 7% sales tax, and hefty property taxes. Water is as expensive as electricity and you will be watering your lawn and filling your pool. Our estate laws make wills more favorable to your family (as long as you homestead). We have quality, available health care (citrus, vegetables and old people drive our economy). DO NOT start at the top end of your budget, get down here, explore, learn, research, chances are you will move one more time.

If you want more information send me an e-mail with your phone # and I will give you a call. I don't sell homes, insurance or cars so it's safe.

OWL

  Being close to the coast brings prevailing sea breezes that temper the climate. Condos (town homes are more prone to have garages) can be good if they suit your needs and you can enjoy the amenities that they offer. The HOA fees usually cover insurance of the structure, so are not as expensive when you figure that in. An inspection is worth its weight in gold. Taxes are generally less than MA.

If your schedule allows it, y'all might consider coming down and renting a while, before you buy.
Friends of mine, moved down from MA last year, and the climate takes a little getting used to for some, (just about like anywhere else), I don't think they are going back north any time soon...

Florida is (and always has been) the fastest growing state in the Union, we must be doing something right...   

[mark]

Be informed about Flood Insurance issues.  Don't commit to anything on the coast until Congress resolves the issue with federal flood insurance.   The recently passed Biggers Water Act requires coastal owners to start paying flood insurance rates that represent their true risk (up until now the fed govt subsidized flood insurance).  Some owners have found their new flood insurance policies are unaffordable.  For example, a coworker's flood policy went from $2k a yr to $7k a yr.  Some have experienced rates as high as $20k+ a yr.  Congress has placed a suspension on the Biggers Water Act pending a review, but who knows what the outcome will be.  I expect the rise in rates will adjusted upward yearly until the owner is paying rates equal to the full risk (which will be very high).

Also, having lived on the Gulf, expect hurricane issues in SW Florida.

[Finster101]

Cape Coral is a nice but taxes are higher than Ft. Myers.  I have lived in the Cape for 23 years.  I am hoping to move to a couple of acres in N Ft. Myers soon though.  If you have any specific questions about the Cape PM and I'll try to answer them if I can.

James

[efrbc1]

Hey WFP - Been in SW Florida for 30+ years.  Ass others have said, Lee and Collier counties are pricey.  That being said, My in-law's house in Venice is for sale.  2/2/2 under 200K.  PM me if you want some more info.

Chris

[chicoman]

WFP, Watch out for the chinese drywall, built from @2004-2007, i think, not all were fixed correctly. All drywall, wiring, appliances, ac and air handling units, should be replaced. An inspection is needed.
Building new eliminates that problem, lots of land for sale cheap. I bought a waterfront lot in the cape for what i thought was a good price, now its worth half what i paid. Good deals are there if you have time to research them out.

[miker]

Sorry Bill, no help, I am over in SE Fla....Wellington Fla...
I like it fine the last 22 yeahs away from Newton/Needham....
The coast in Palm Beach is pretty spicy.  

Let me know when you kids are down, we can meet in Clewiston, half way across...

[RayG]

Bill,

Having to live in the same winter conditions as you do we considered the same path as you are planning.  Recently grandchildren started to populate our family so there is no plan to move.  When we were looking we subscribed to a magazine called "Where to Retire"  they cover all the pluses & minuses of moving such as taxes, crime rate, cost of living etc.  I just did a quick search on Google on where to retire in Florida and there is enough information to keep you busy for some time.  You are smart folks to start gathering information now so you will avoid any potential pitfalls.  Good Luck on your search.   

[miker]

I can tell you about Florida....the west is hotter in the summah and coldah in the winta than on the east when you talk about down south Florida...jussayinsall   

[WFP]

Thanks everyone for some good advice!

miker, sending you a pm.

Bill

[WFP]

What are the things we should RUN away from, fast? Condos, unless they are luxury they are likely to be rental pool investments, and are usually abused party barns or "project housing".

OWL

Thanks again owl...just wondering where the cutoff for luxury would be versus ones that are a drain.  It is hard to see the line but obiously we appear to be well below that marker for now in that we are considering a second home.  In about 10-16 years it may be our only home and we would spend more at that time.

So the question is are we better off getting into the RE Market now to ride the ups and downs or are we better off investing the money and buying a better (Luxury to us ) home in the future.  Food for thought.  A friednd's father is living down there in a Condo/townhome, mentioned Lighthouse Bay at the Brooks, he is in Worthington.

Still not sure we want a Condo when there is such a glut of them that hurts resale but they also offer a couple like us a good low maintenance option.  If we can find something with good resale potential, we have to consider it but will do nothing on emotion and will only purchase using fiscal sense.

Bill

[WFP]

Also, we sold our boat a couple of years ago but when we get to FL, we would definately get another but this time it will be a Center Console instead of an express cruiser and only 24' instead of 42'.

Bill

[miker]

 

[Madchad]

Wondering also about the Jacksonville area as my bride works for the mayo clinic and could transfer there, is it as bad an area as I have heard? Not hijacking this thread to bad I hope!

[mark]

Wondering also about the Jacksonville area as my bride works for the mayo clinic and could transfer there, is it as bad an area as I have heard? Not hijacking this thread to bad I hope!

If moving to JAX, I'd look to the south (St Augustine area) or to the north (Nassau Co., Fernandina Beach, Amelia Island). 

[JCZ]

Bill, are you sure you and Ann don't want to consider Coronado?  While you'll not find anything in that price range on the island, we don't have the humidity that Florida has and our winters do offer.....  http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/92118   

[Trapperdog]

 $200K might make for a nice 10% down payment  in Coronado   

[FlaHeatWave]

Wondering also about the Jacksonville area as my bride works for the mayo clinic and could transfer there, is it as bad an area as I have heard? Not hijacking this thread to bad I hope!

Jacksonville does have some areas with "issues", but St Augustine (just to the South) is sweet.

[owl893]

Thanks again owl...just wondering where the cutoff for luxury would be versus ones that are a drain.  It is hard to see the line but obiously we appear to be well below that marker for now in that we are considering a second home.  In about 10-16 years it may be our only home and we would spend more at that time.

So the question is are we better off getting into the RE Market now to ride the ups and downs or are we better off investing the money and buying a better (Luxury to us ) home in the future.  Food for thought.  A friednd's father is living down there in a Condo/townhome, mentioned Lighthouse Bay at the Brooks, he is in Worthington.

Still not sure we want a Condo when there is such a glut of them that hurts resale but they also offer a couple like us a good low maintenance option.  If we can find something with good resale potential, we have to consider it but will do nothing on emotion and will only purchase using fiscal sense.

Bill

I need to define my use of the terms; condo (condominium) is an apartment building with "units" (apartments) and (usually) shared amenities like a pool, laundry area, parking, etc. A "VILLA" (townhouse/townhome/coachhome) is on the ground (not on the second floor for instance) but with common walls under a connected roof, with your own garage, and some shared amenities (a pool). Both living options share property tax and insurance and charge a fee for CAM (common area maintenance) garbage collection, emergency fund, etc. At this point I would consider a "luxury" condo starting at $300k.

In about 10-16 years it may be our only home and we would spend more at that time. As I mentioned before many people move again. So the question is are we better off getting into the RE Market now to ride the ups and downs or are we better off investing the money and buying a better (Luxury to us ) home in the future. We are still experiencing lower than normal prices here, but after this winter that may change, however, "investing" using a disciplined approach is always a good thing.

I started with a VILLA (instant neighbors, a pool, SECURITY) after eight years I built a house and spend seven months here.

OWL

[CVOStreetglide]

Wondering also about the Jacksonville area as my bride works for the mayo clinic and could transfer there, is it as bad an area as I have heard? Not hijacking this thread to bad I hope!

As a 20 year Jacksonville resident that moved from the Baltimore Washington area, I would be very interested in what 'bad' stuff you have heard. The area definitely is not Chicago, Atlanta, Washington DC, Baltimore Richmond, Detroit.

Like many locations there are good areas and not so good areas. I am sure if you are interested in a $200k plus residence it won't be in one of the bad areas.

As for the areas to the north of Jacksonville that are mentioned, there are lots of reasons why you would want to be careful in your due dilligence.

If Jacksonville ends up on your short list, there are numerous new planned communities springing up between Jacksonville and St. Augustine that you would want to explore.

I would also suggest you consider that being near as opposed to on the coast is good for the afternoon breezes and cooler temperatures.  The center of Florida is much hotter and the air doesn't flow as well as being near the coast.

Obviously everybody doesn't like the same things, colors or locations so in the end it is your choice. I would suggest renting in a area you like or at least staying there for a week or two before buying.

Good hunting. 

 


A good thing about   

[WFP]

Anne and I returned from Florida last week...Stupidly given the weather up here  We flew to Fort Lauderdale on 15 Feb and drove across Alligator Alley and  spent five nights on the Left Coast at the Sanibel Harbor Marriott.  While there we did some looking at places in the area.  The conclusion is we really liked the Naples/Bonita Springs area but it makes no sense to buy a place at this moment.  For the price range we were looking at there were a ton of very Nice Condos in Gated communities but there is no way that in five years the value will increase to cover the cost of ownership.  Instead, we will wait a while until we can retire before purchasing...we may even do the Jan-Mar Snowbird thing for a few years first to be sute we are comfortable down there.  

We then headed backto Fort Lauderdale for another five nights.  We really like FLL but just don't think we could afford a place there with the Amenities we desire.  Besides, we planned these five days to relax by the pool, driink 2-4-1 Mai tais and eat tons of fresh seafood.  We ditched the car for these five days knowing we could get around by foot or water ytaxi as needed.  Went back to a couple of places we really like, Coconuts and bahia Cabana.  Both have very good food but the drinks are a bit pricier.  We skipped a Steak at Sula's as this was a basically eating/dringing sleeping casual trip.

It was funny at the Courtside Steakhouse (Sanibel harbor marriott) no less than five of the people wroking there moved down from Massachussetts...never to return!

Bill

[miker]

Glad you enjoyed your time, I woulda told you bout real estate "values" (that's funny) I have some real estate....Sorry we didn't see you guys, but the work week carries on.

Maybe next time, we are only an hour north of Laudy....

[WFP]

Glad you enjoyed your time, I woulda told you bout real estate "values" (that's funny) I have some real estate....Sorry we didn't see you guys, but the work week carries on.

Maybe next time, we are only an hour north of Laudy....

Mike,
Sorry for not reaching out when down there...we really were just vegetation most of the time...
Bill

[miker]

No worries, we were working most of the time....