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Author Topic: Crankshaft Tolerance  (Read 5563 times)

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DakotaZeb

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Crankshaft Tolerance
« on: January 08, 2009, 04:25:03 PM »
I've had a mechanic pull the cams and cam plate.  I wanted to install new gear drive cams but the crank is out of balance by .005".  Apparently Harley allows a tolerance of .010".  Anyway, he says that he can't install the gear drive cams if the tolerance is off by more than .003" so it appears I'll be putting the original cams back.  Or is there another set of chain drive cams that will get me more performance?  He's also installing a Feuling Oil Pump and Cam Plate.
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Twolanerider

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2009, 04:26:55 PM »
Nearly all cam grinds that are available in a gear drive form are also available in a chain drive variant.
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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2009, 05:12:46 PM »
Quote from: DakotaZeb on January 08, 2009, 04:25:03 PM
I've had a mechanic pull the cams and cam plate.  I wanted to install new gear drive cams but the crank is out of balance by .005".  Apparently Harley allows a tolerance of .010".  Anyway, he says that he can't install the gear drive cams if the tolerance is off by more than .003" so it appears I'll be putting the original cams back.  Or is there another set of chain drive cams that will get me more performance?  He's also installing a Feuling Oil Pump and Cam Plate.

He's right on the crank. I wouldn't use gears at 0.005" runout either. And the HD spec is now 0.012", not 0.010"! :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:

S&S doesn't make chain drive, but there's plenty of others out there. If you wanted to do cams, no reason to put the old ones back in though. Call Woods or Mackie and discuss your application so you can select the right cam for your build. ;)

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WVULTRA

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2009, 07:46:14 PM »
DakotaZeb:

If I'm seeing your bike correctly, it looks to be an '06SEUC.  IMO if your wanting to upgrade, I'd recommend doing the new style conversion of cams, pump, plate, chains, etc!  Yes .005" is a bit high for runout; but short of pulling the crank to have it trued/welded, a conversion will tolerate it as well as, if not better, than your stock system.

If you have an interest in the conversion, John at http://www.flyingwperformance.com/ offers excellent service and customer support!

 :2vrolijk_21:

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2009, 07:55:22 PM »
Quote from: WVULTRA on January 08, 2009, 07:46:14 PM
DakotaZeb:

If I'm seeing your bike correctly, it looks to be an '06SEUC.  IMO if your wanting to upgrade, I'd recommend doing the new style conversion of cams, pump, plate, chains, etc!  Yes .005" is a bit high for runout; but short of pulling the crank to have it trued/welded, a conversion will tolerate it as well as, if not better, than your stock system.

If you have an interest in the conversion, John at http://www.flyingwperformance.com/ offers excellent service and customer support!

 :2vrolijk_21:



Excellent solution! Best way to go! :2vrolijk_21:

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hd-dude

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2009, 10:59:46 PM »
I have to agree with the above, do the conversion to the 07+ camplate, oilpump and tensioners. Cam choices are a bit limited when you do this. The 54N from Andrews will work well in the CVO 103.

Here are the conversion instructions with a listing of parts needed.

http://www.andrewsproducts.com/PDF_files/Cams_conversion_chain-01.pdf
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dsmbagger

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2009, 11:22:40 PM »
Yup, DO NOT use the fueling pump. They wont tolerate the runout for that long. Go with the conversion setup or fix the crank.....JMO..
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WVULTRA

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2009, 01:08:01 PM »
Quote from: hd-dude on January 08, 2009, 10:59:46 PM
I have to agree with the above, do the conversion to the 07+ camplate, oilpump and tensioners. Cam choices are a bit limited when you do this. The 54N from Andrews will work well in the CVO 103.

Here are the conversion instructions with a listing of parts needed.

http://www.andrewsproducts.com/PDF_files/Cams_conversion_chain-01.pdf

If your investigating the conversion, I'd also figure in adjustable pushrods, Timken inner bearings, Cometic exhaust gaskets, and definitely a quality assembly lube.  Herko-Bagger (John) at FlyingW Performance has the parts list down pat!
« Last Edit: January 09, 2009, 01:10:09 PM by WVULTRA »
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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2009, 01:15:39 PM »
Quote from: WVULTRA on January 09, 2009, 01:08:01 PM
If your investigating the conversion, I'd also figure in adjustable pushrods, Timken inner bearings, Cometic exhaust gaskets, and definitely a quality assembly lube.  Herko-Bagger (John) at FlyingW Performance has the parts list down pat!

I'm assuming you're referring to Torrington full coverage cam bearings, not Timken bearing in the bottom end. If he does the Timken, he'd have the crank trued, balanced and welded, or replace it, and he can then go with the gear driven-cams he originally wanted to use. ;)

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WVULTRA

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2009, 01:19:09 PM »
Yes, the Timken/Torrington inner CAM bearings.

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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2009, 01:30:03 PM »
What could happen if he put gear drives in???
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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2009, 02:07:51 PM »
Quote from: rj walkup on January 09, 2009, 01:30:03 PM
What could happen if he put gear drives in???

The gear mounted to the crankshaft would wobble with the crankshaft, while the mating gear would not.  Therefore you would have tight spots and loose spots.  This will create noise if runout is minor, and gear failure if it is major.  Back when Harley Big Twins used gear drives straight from the factory, typical runout was held to less than .001", and the maximum wear tolerance was .003".  Now that Harley has gone to chain drive, they obviously don't think it's worth the time and money to maintain tolerances they had 20 years ago.  I guess they figure the average rider does maybe 4000 miles a year, so by the time the runout ruins the oil pump the bike will be out of warranty and the customer will probably want to hop the engine up anyway, so why not just let the customer spend money to fix this little issue?

Jerry
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Re: Crankshaft Tolerance
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2009, 03:33:48 PM »
For a 103" C.I.  go with Andrews 54 ,great cam and quiet or Woods TW-6-6 .  Dewey
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