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Author Topic: To Upgrade or not to upgrade  (Read 2602 times)

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sleepybare

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To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« on: March 04, 2012, 10:03:21 PM »

I am currently in the process of changing the wheels, rotors and tires on my 2007 CVO Ultra. At this time seems that it would be easy to upgrade the calipers for brake system to either a set of 4 piston Performance Machine calipers or possibly the Non anti-locking Brembos', which came on the 2008 Ultras.  Neither of these changes are cheap to facilitate but I am buying new rotors with the wheels.  My first question would be is the change to the Brembo calipers be better than the Performance Machine rotors or is it even possible on a 2007 CVO and secondly, has anyone made either one of the upgrades? My dealership seems to think this an easy swap but I am not always a believer in what they say.   If anyone has made either of these swaps.  was the increase in the performance and/or braking ability significant to be worthy of the added cost or am just dreaming and will see no real benefit at all.  Your opinions are welcome and if you have used either of the systems please let me know which one you prefer and why.  I just don't want to throw a bunch of money at this if there is no real increase in performance. I currently use LRB Gold Pads in my stock system and have had on complaints but this is one area where performance really can matter..

Craig
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Twolanerider

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2012, 11:11:43 PM »


My first question would be is the change to the Brembo calipers be better than the Performance Machine rotors or is it even possible on a 2007 CVO and secondly, has anyone made either one of the upgrades? My dealership seems to think this an easy swap but I am not always a believer in what they say.



Craig, I've got HHI's best calipers on my 05, stock calipers on the 00 SERG and the Brembo upgrade you question on the 02 Road King.  Lyndall pads on all of them.

First things first; the most cost effective change you can make to improve brake effectiveness and feel is swap the stock pads for the Lyndalls.  If you're not sure if you want to do the more expensive swaps start there.  You might be satisfied with that improvement on its own.

As for the Brembo conversion; yes you can.  Though your horse might already be part way out of the stable on the retrofit.

The calipers mount on the legs as a bolt on.  There's also no difference in the calipers for ABS or not.  The calipers need an 11.8" rather than an 11.5" rotor though.  So if your wheels are already supplied with a new (expensive) rotor for your original stock brakes you've got an unfortunate redundant expense in another set of rotors.

The other part that should be changed is the master cylinder.  You'll need the Brembo era master cylinder to really utilize the Brembo calipers.  I know two bikes that haven't done this.  It works.  But the feel at the lever is different.  It's not as good.  The feedback you get isn't as good.

Also, if you replace the master cylinder you're likely buying some other parts solely for cosmetics.  Changing the master cylinder means changing the brake lever on the right side.  The levers don't look the same.  So you're probably then looking at getting a clutch perch and clutch lever for the other side too. 

On mine the good HHI calipers compare to other bikes with Performance Machine calipers you mentioned.  They are a recognizable improvement from the stock calipers.  The feedback just short of lockup is better and they clamp more quickly.  Overall control and braking is better than stock. 

The Brembo retro on the Road King is comparable but not identical to the HHI upgrade on the SEEG.  Both clamp at comparable levels.  The feedback to the rider is better on the Brembo equipped bike.  I'm less likely to lock up the Brembo equipped Road King than I am the HHI equipped Electra Glide.  This is even though the Road King is a considerably lighter bike.  Pretty sure the stopping distance between the two is nearly identical despite that difference in control feel.

Hope this helped at least a little.
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backroad Mike

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2012, 05:22:04 AM »

I replaced the OEM calipers on my 05 Ultra with the 4 piston Performance Machine.  Braking was improved, but I wouldn't say it was night and day difference.  If I did it again, I'd have went with the 6 piston model.   It could also be that I had the Lyndal pads on the 05, and whatever the PM's come with stock.   I'm getting ready to put EBC's in the PM's this week.  We'll see what the difference is then.

If your satisfied with what you have, keep it.  Unless your getting a fantastic deal, it's quite a few dollars to change out calipers, and matching rotors if your also changing wheels.


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sleepybare

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2012, 05:10:05 PM »

Thanks for the input, I don't think I want to endure the expense of a Brembo swap when considering the master cylinder, rotors, etc. It would seem that the P.M. would be the way to go as they are a direct bolt on with no additional work needed. If the stopping power is not that much of an improvement over the stock clinchers, I am even questioning the cost of the P.M. change out which is about $800.00.  It seems that the additional performance that I would get is not in the $800.00 value range.  I have already changed the pads for the Lindell Gold pads and I am happy with the way they consistently perform.  I was hoping I would see an increase of at least 25 to 35% by changing out the calipers and get a better feel for the brake system in the process..

Thanks for all the input and help

Craig
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Twolanerider

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2012, 06:37:57 PM »

  I was hoping I would see an increase of at least 25 to 35% by changing out the calipers and get a better feel for the brake system in the process..

Thanks for all the input and help

Craig


Not nearly that much of an improvement.   
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sleepybare

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2012, 07:29:38 PM »

Thanks, I think you have made my decision to stay with the stock calipers a very simple one
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Twolanerider

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2012, 09:15:53 PM »

Thanks, I think you have made my decision to stay with the stock calipers a very simple one


Hmmm, wonder if there's a commission to be made on the savings ::) ?
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1sharprdkg

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Re: To Upgrade or not to upgrade
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2012, 09:11:22 PM »

Thanks, I think you have made my decision to stay with the stock calipers a very simple one
I agree with Twolane about using the Lyndall pads, they are on my wifes RKC and I will use them on my Ultra whem it needs new pads.
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