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[FlaHeatWave]

With all the Drama that I have witnessed others trying to make the CVO Primary / Hydraulic Clutch work with engine enhancements, these Components have worked with absolutely no PMS for the '09 SERG 117/DD7 over varying mileages, 47k mi on the bike.

The bike doesn't see any burnouts or track, will easily pull the front tire shifting into 2nd or 3rd, occasional "hold the throttle wide open, fan the clutch like a dirt bike at the 6200 RPM Limiter" into 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th & 7th. All with "The Ball & Chain" in tow. No slip detected on the "latest & greatest" DynoJet. With abuse I feel that other Driveline Components will fail before this Clutch set-up slips...
 
IMO the Primary / Clutch is perfect, No Slip, No Squawk, No Shudder, Smooth Linear (Motor Cops would love it) Friction Zone right in the middle of Lever Travel. Finding Neutral as good or better than stock. No Primary noises (as validated by Unbalanced, Mr. Sachs, & Scott H. from S&S).

All Components Factory Original (47k mi.), except;       

SE Compensator (<'14, last one before Oiling Tray, 27k mi. the OE was behaving fine at 20k mi. but my Dealer threw the SE Comp in during the 117/ DD7 Build)

SE Heavy Duty Spring 37951-98

Alto  Carbonite Frictions / Steels, 095750NC This Kit is a "+1" setup.

AIM VPC-95 Lockup

32 OZ of HD Formula+ (wet refill) Installing the Alto Carbonite Kit the factory recommended 45 OZ of Formula+ (dry fill) was used, everything was fine as stated above, except Neutral was evasive, at 5K mi. (on the Alto Kit) I drained the F+ and tried a QT instead of the recommended 38 OZ, Neutral is now as good or better than stock  IMO the Compensator is happier with 6 OZ less of F+ than with the ATF that is recommended / mandated by other Aftermarket Clutches, Time will tell...

Flush / Re-fill the Stock Hydraulics. I'm a firm believer in Flushing the OE Hydraulic Fluid, and having the Stock Clutch operating at it's best, before changing anything... At least you have a good starting point, before making any changes...

The only possible downside is the Lever Pull, at idle is comparable with my (stock) '05 SEEG, as the Lockup spools up (around 3.5k RPM) the effort is increased, this doesn't bother me as I ride a lot and my left hand is in good shape...

Riding habits that I think the Compensator / Driveline is happy with... No engine braking, "riding the Cams" or aggressive behavior until the Bike is fully warmed up, about 8-10 miles (Primary Chain has contracted at this point and the Auto Adjuster will not "over tighten"). I do employ aggressive engine braking in the mountains, no problem as the Drivetrain is up to full operating temp. I do rev match on downshifts. I never get close to lugging, 3rd Gear and above, I never operate below 2500 RPM, I don't get into top gear unless sustained speeds of 70+ MPH. Now with the 117 producing 120 ft/lbs at 2200, the engine pulls effortlessly below that, my main concern is with Driveline / Primary Chain "snatch" / power pulses being too far apart, especially at  constant and / or trailing throttle < 2500 RPM... IMO this is the biggest cause of TC Driveline Drama, more so than hard acceleration...      

However, since this thing has "plenty of Clutch" and feels like it will handle much more than the 117 produces, I am wanting to try a Stock Clutch Spring with this set-up, theory being less possible stress on the Hydraulics / Bearings, and easier Lever Pull in stop n go...

If anybody has a Stock (300lb)Spring that they would donate to the cause, I'll gladly pay the ride... and report back

JMHO, your results may vary...

 

[Yellow09SERG]

Thanks for the review Ed. The Alto clutch pack had caught my attention before. Maybe I need to take another look at it

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Just to be clear fanning the clutch is a recipe for disaster . WOT , chop throttle snap the gear with no clutch snap throttle back open. Faster easier on parts . If running a lock up the lock up is putting a tremendous load on the throw out high rm as well.

Here is a rod that got welded due to that very same type of riding. You can see the rod welded to both sides after the throw out bearing failed. I have tried the baker as well and it still can fail. Its better will last longer but the load the lock up put on the pack is huge

Its a mother to cut the rod on the trans side and get it out ..

VP 95 with stock spring is putting over 600 lbs of pressure on the pack 340 spring over 900 sorry but the parts where never made to take that kind of pressure and it will fail its only a matter of time as most of us shift without clutch

[FlaHeatWave]

Just to be clear fanning the clutch is a recipe for disaster . WOT , chop throttle snap the gear with no clutch snap throttle back open. Faster easier on parts . If running a lock up the lock up is putting a tremendous load on the throw out high rm as well.

Here is a rod that got welded due to that very same type of riding. You can see the rod welded to both sides after the throw out bearing failed. I have tried the baker as well and it still can fail. Its better will last longer but the load the lock up put on the pack is huge

Its a mother to cut the rod on the trans side and get it out ..

VP 95 with stock spring is putting over 600 lbs of pressure on the pack 340 spring over 900 sorry but the parts where never made to take that kind of pressure and it will fail its only a matter of time as most of us shift without clutch

Steve, thank you very much for enlightening me I've only done the "fanning" a couple of times on this bike, 'will not do it again

My Bud (12 CVORG S&S 124/DD7, full Barnett Clutch / Lockout ) has welded the rod 2x, around 60k mi. and 85k mi., now has 93k on the bike... I never did see the rods, just heard his description, he didn't say what the root cause was, just that he ran it with / without the lockout. He did say it was a nightmare to remove the "welded rods"... He keeps the 640s spooled up, >30k / yr average. 

Yea, I could tell by the way the Clutch "acts" there's a lot of pressure in there... My mindset in Post #1 was to try a 300lb Spring to reduce (some) stress on the Clutch System, Hydraulics, Bearings, etc... "it's got plenty of Clutch in it" I feel that I could "take some Clutch out of it" (lighter Spring and retain the lockout, or heavier spring and remove the lockout??) and still not slip on the street.

I'm thinking, (please correct me if I'm wrong) that a Lighter Spring (300lb) would remove some stress in the lower RPM ranges and stop n go ( like most old Touring guys, I operate <3500 the majority of the time), keep the AIM VP95 for the strollin' and Clutchless shift above 4000 or so when the pressure gets up there?  Does this sound like a recipe for better longevity?

Would you recommend the Baker Bearing as a preventative measure?

All suggestions welcome!

Thanks again for the constructive input

Ed



   

   

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

AIM has a chart of pressure its not easy to find you have to dig around its a PDF file after you open up the lock up kit with spring I think. But can see that the pressure builds very fast..

I never use the clutch on my bike over 4000 if I am getting after it that hard just chop the throttle and click the shifter it will shift with ease . much easier on parts in the long run