Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Tonys]

Hubbard, you do have a way with words...and I agree 100%. I look at the other brands...they are poor copies...some of them look like bloated exaggerations of a Harley. The others..Gold Wings, Ventures don't try to look like a Harley...and I have owned them all...are good bikes..but I have never loved a bike like any one of my H-D's. There are some bad dealers, there are problems with some of the bikes, but if you look nationwide at any brand there are problems. None of them are perfect. It tells me something when every brands idea of a new model is a Harley wannabe.

[HARLEYBILL]

Having been in the retail end of the Auto business for more years than the average member here is in age, I can tell you that all these issues are not unique. Competition and market share are the two most powerful factors that will change a products design and performance. To me it seems as though the Bikes are the bait for all of the non mechanical items the Motor Company sells and prospers on. Can you imagine if only Harley owners bought Motor Company apparel?  Probably go broke. The Harley thing is in many cases a lifestyle that no other manufacturer has been able to duplicate. Until some other manufacturer (who knows who) can create this total customer environment, you have to either "drop it" or get off the pot!
I always try to trade rides and test out other brands and so far, for all of it's shortcomings, the Harley still has my heart. Yep, the Harley STILL looks better at closing time.

[sefatboyscott]

The Harley is one of the few bikes that people stop and just look at. I do it. I clean her up and swear I could just sit on the stool by myself and stare forever at it. It is some mystical marvel that I don't think other bikes can ever possess. Part of it is actually the obserd cost but you can almost see where the cost lies as it glistens, dripping with chrome doo dads and blinking with lights. For me it represents a dream come true, an achievemnet of sorts. When I was a kid this is all I wanted.

The reality is it is a good bike at best for rideability. It is in fact a look at mine and I will look at yours as we struggle to find some sort of individuality by all dressing the same and gathering up where other birds are parked. I admit I am guilty of it myself.

That being said I dont think it's asking too much of a motorcycle that cost upwards of 10,000 dollars more than most other bikes on the road that I should HAVE TO UPGRADE out the door to even keep up with a stock bike from just about any other brand available.

Now the nastalgia thing I do understand on the air cooled v -twin. The V-rod has no excuses. The fact is when compared to others in the same class it simply lacks. It lacks power, and handling when compared to lets say a Suzuki m-109 for thousands less. Both these are geared at the same market but the guy buying the Vrod feels better about buying a Porshe simply because it says Harley Davidson on the side of it.

I could have baught a bigger , better handling Yamaha and invested the same amount and built a full on custom Jap bike but I chose the SE fatboy for a crusier. Is it bitchin or whining to think its ridiculous for the motor company to consider the peelin chrome on the mirrors to be "environmental damage"? We should just find this acceptable? Yes I knew there were going to be some changes that I wanted to make upon delivery of the damned thing. But the fact is replacing the "custom" mirrors was not what I had in mind.

Now have a similar problem with a competitor , no problem mr customer here is a new one right away , can we help you adjust it. Have a discount in the parts department but please return, thanks for giving us the opportunity to fix it. This is where Harely really lacks these days. Its black its orange it says "biker" to the world, it's overpriced and f you if you don't want to buy it attitude that really sucks from the moco these days.

80 percent of the Harleys out there get 500 miles a year put on em. Yet there is this air of arrogance of alot of MoCo loyalists toward riders of other brands by many ( not all ) "bikers". When a real "Rider" is not so much concerned with what your riding but how many miles are on the odometer. Put your miles in on whatever you like, just keep it on two wheels!

[gremlush]

the only thing H-D looks at ,is there stock , and I think they are looking ! DOWN 50 % my name is Dewey ,and have been riding and wrenching on H-D since 60s . I won't own anything else ,but then , I know how to make them run ! LOL...

[BalDeagle]

One question that jumps straight into my mind.

If we bought em and didn't need to do anything, or couldn't do anything, to them would we really want them?

Apart from the riding and the enjoyment that brings we get a great deal of pleasure from the mods and improvements we make.

It makes them "ours" and we love them all the more for that.

Do we all want our signatures to look like someone elses? no, we want it to be recognised as unique.

HD know that virtually every bike they produce becomes the "signature" of the person who buys it.

Nige

[grc]

One question that jumps straight into my mind.

If we bought em and didn't need to do anything, or couldn't do anything, to them would we really want them?

Apart from the riding and the enjoyment that brings we get a great deal of pleasure from the mods and improvements we make.

It makes them "ours" and we love them all the more for that.

Do we all want our signatures to look like someone elses? no, we want it to be recognised as unique.

HD know that virtually every bike they produce becomes the "signature" of the person who buys it.

Nige

Nige,

To me, there is a huge difference between modifying the bikes to "make them our own" and having to constantly repair the POS due to p-poor engineering and lousy part quality.  The fact that a large number of Harley owners constantly change out various components for the latest and greatest doesn't give H-D the right to use crap as original equipment while charging the highest prices in the market.  There are plenty of folks who don't feel the need to "out-bling" the next guy, and just buy a bike to ride.  For the prices H-D charges, I think those folks deserve a lot more than what they are getting.

Jerry

[Hoist!]

Nige,

To me, there is a huge difference between modifying the bikes to "make them our own" and having to constantly repair the POS due to p-poor engineering and lousy part quality.  The fact that a large number of Harley owners constantly change out various components for the latest and greatest doesn't give H-D the right to use crap as original equipment while charging the highest prices in the market.  There are plenty of folks who don't feel the need to "out-bling" the next guy, and just buy a bike to ride.  For the prices H-D charges, I think those folks deserve a lot more than what they are getting.

Jerry

 

You really gotta love this guy!!! Agree completely Jerry!

Hoist!

[ramjet]

Nige,

To me, there is a huge difference between modifying the bikes to "make them our own" and having to constantly repair the POS due to p-poor engineering and lousy part quality.  The fact that a large number of Harley owners constantly change out various components for the latest and greatest doesn't give H-D the right to use crap as original equipment while charging the highest prices in the market.  There are plenty of folks who don't feel the need to "out-bling" the next guy, and just buy a bike to ride.  For the prices H-D charges, I think those folks deserve a lot more than what they are getting.

Jerry

Want to trade for a 2005 Gold wing?
 

[BalDeagle]

Nige,

To me, there is a huge difference between modifying the bikes to "make them our own" and having to constantly repair the POS due to p-poor engineering and lousy part quality.  The fact that a large number of Harley owners constantly change out various components for the latest and greatest doesn't give H-D the right to use crap as original equipment while charging the highest prices in the market.  There are plenty of folks who don't feel the need to "out-bling" the next guy, and just buy a bike to ride.  For the prices H-D charges, I think those folks deserve a lot more than what they are getting.

Jerry

Don't get me wrong Jerry as I wholeheartedly agree with what you are saying. I, like a lot of other good folk on here, have invested a huge amount of money this last year in an 07 SERK. I love the bike, but mechanical issues are constantly on my mind and I could happily do without that. I have made a good few changes to the bike to try and alleviate the problems that have been arising with the bikes - and so far so good.

My point is that it's partly because of the problems people have with their bikes that they love em all the more. It's the heart & soul that you put into making them "just right". If we all wanted perfections of mechanical engineering (and I'm not saying we don't deserve that for the money we spend) then why are there still so many Pans, Shovels, Knuckles etc. still rolling around?

I would never defend the MoCo for putting out cheap crap just so we have to spend more of our hard earned on buying good stuff to put it right, but as yet I am still not in the market for any other brand.

Nige

[ccr]

the only thing H-D looks at ,is there stock , and I think they are looking ! DOWN 50 % my name is Dewey ,and have been riding and wrenching on H-D since 60s . I won't own anything else ,but then , I know how to make them run ! LOL...

Dewey

I envy you the skill to know how to make it run.  And all you great guys who know how to turn those wrenches, cause I just have to keep working to be able to pay the indy to make it work.  I still go to the HD shop for all my warranty work, wishin there wasn't any, I go to the shop to meet up with friends and we belong to a couple of HOG chapters ----- who meet at the shop.  But as for changin my bike out?  No Way!  I love that red bike and don't want to get another, thank you very much.   

[Twolanerider]

It's really a simple summary here.  We should be able to do things we want to personalize our bikes, or to improve them.  Anything we choose to do, however, should never be done because it was a remedial product to begin with.

Hiding poor modern manufacturing and design behind the notion that "they're just going to change it anyway" is parsimonious and chicken chit.

[BalDeagle]

It's really a simple summary here.  We should be able to do things we want to personalize our bikes, or to improve them.  Anything we choose to do, however, should never be done because it was a remedial product to begin with.

Hiding poor modern manufacturing and design behind the notion that "they're just going to change it anyway" is parsimonious and chicken chit.

Hear hear Don.

As you rightly say though - a lot of folk will still personalise or improve their bikes anyway. That's not unique in the world of motorcycles, but you can bet a pound to a penny that there are more HD riders that do it than riders of any other brand.

Nige

[HEADPAN62]

Gender:
Posts: 2461




2QIK4U

Location: Beckley
Member since: 02/12/05



    Re: MOCO needs to take notice
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2006, 12:49:24 PM » Quote 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dam, some of you clowns would bitch, if you was hung with a new rope!  Ain't got a CVO, just got a "regular ol' man's bike", as some clown said, but if I did have a CVO, I would treat it the same way I do Ol' Maudie.  If somthin' breaks, I fix it.  If I can't fix it, I take it in.  If it ain't a warrantable failure, and it usually ain't, I pay for it.  Half the fun of ownin' a Harley, has been workin' on it, for me.  A "Harley-Davidson is the World's Finest Motorcyle."  Not the "World's Most Perfect Motorcycle."  Why?  Because it is made by Humans, and Humans make mistakes.  If your Transmission locked up in your Harley, and you was on the side of the road, loadin' it up in your Buddie's truck, you'd still have more class broke-down, than someone ridin' by you and wavin', on any other brand.  There endeth the lesson.  Late-HUBBARD       (((...how much harley stock do you own?....H-D is for sure in reverse..endeth my opinion)))

[CVOJOE]

Hiding poor modern manufacturing and design behind the notion that "they're just going to change it anyway" is parsimonious and chicken chit

   

He's back!!!     

Blasphemous, but true statement. Change will only come with increased competition, reduced market share, and a major revolt by us that spend the hard earned $'s for products that are not ready for release to the roads. IMHO.