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[SE66]

OK Guys let me have it.
I just purchased the Vance and Hines Power Duals.  Takeing them and the bike to by local Harley Dealer that I am very confident in.  They told me that by putting these pipes on the bike, I would need a SERT and Dyno to get the bike where it should be.  Of course I like the looks of the V&H Pipes, and I do want to get the engine to run cooler.  But didn't know that I was going to have to have the Dyno charges on top of all this.  I have talked with other guys that have had different pipes and race turner installed without having their bikes put on a Dyno.  Just not sure if I am getting taken advantage of on this deal or not.  Of course I want the bike to run great and cooler.  But I am sastisfied with the power that the bike already has,  I just wanted to get rid of the CAT and like I said,  I like the looks of the V&H Power Duals, and have them to install a SERT to help the bike run cooler.  So is the Dyno a MUST DO when replacing the pipes and adding a SERT.  Also I am thinking about putting the Screamin Eagle Heavy Breather on the bike,  Like the looks,  just not sure that the FLHTCUSE4 is suited for this type of breather.  Looks good on other bikes,  just not sure to put it on the Ultra or leave the stock breather cover on,  and Yep I know the fileter has to be replaced also when they swap out the pipes and add the SERT.  Your Thoughts and suggestions appreciated as always.  Oh yeah,  one other thing,  I am running te BUB 7 muffs.  Will they fit the V&H Power Duals.  I sure hope so.  Don't need to buy more muffs.  especially when I already have the sound I like. 
Thanks Guys

[LarryB]

if a dealer is doing it then yes they will have to dyno it, you have an option. TTS Mastertune

[Heatwave]

OK Guys let me have it.
I just purchased the Vance and Hines Power Duals.  Takeing them and the bike to by local Harley Dealer that I am very confident in.  They told me that by putting these pipes on the bike, I would need a SERT and Dyno to get the bike where it should be.  Of course I like the looks of the V&H Pipes, and I do want to get the engine to run cooler.  But didn't know that I was going to have to have the Dyno charges on top of all this.  I have talked with other guys that have had different pipes and race turner installed without having their bikes put on a Dyno.  Just not sure if I am getting taken advantage of on this deal or not.  Of course I want the bike to run great and cooler.  But I am sastisfied with the power that the bike already has,  I just wanted to get rid of the CAT and like I said,  I like the looks of the V&H Power Duals, and have them to install a SERT to help the bike run cooler.  So is the Dyno a MUST DO when replacing the pipes and adding a SERT.  Also I am thinking about putting the Screamin Eagle Heavy Breather on the bike,  Like the looks,  just not sure that the FLHTCUSE4 is suited for this type of breather.  Looks good on other bikes,  just not sure to put it on the Ultra or leave the stock breather cover on,  and Yep I know the fileter has to be replaced also when they swap out the pipes and add the SERT.  Your Thoughts and suggestions appreciated as always.  Oh yeah,  one other thing,  I am running te BUB 7 muffs.  Will they fit the V&H Power Duals.  I sure hope so.  Don't need to buy more muffs.  especially when I already have the sound I like. 
Thanks Guys

You could also go with the Harley SuperTuner, download the stage 1 map for your bike and then use SmartTune to dial the bike in on your own. No need to pay for a tech or a dyno if you went this route. I think you'd be very satisfied with the significant improvement in performance. I've used the smarttune and its made significant improvements i throttle responsiveness. My brother also went the stage 1 upgrade on his 2009 Ultra and found that tuning the bike on his own resulted in great seat of the pants improvement. (Of course there's no dyno but if that doesn't matter to you, you'll be more than happy with the improvement) You might miss the last bit of performance by not getting it dynoed but for a simple stage 1 upgrade I think it would be negligible.

[michaelbmenaker]

Do the dyno tune!!! The air/fuel ratios will be right and the bike will run correctly. A good tuner working with your bike and its specific setup will do more than any canned map can do. You've got a lot of money in your ride, don't cheap out now...
One man's opinion.

[Wheelsnkeels]

IMO the answer is no you do not!

The CVO comes with a "tune" on it for the Cams, ported heads and engine mods.

The factory Air intake is already a "High Flow" intake so you are not really changing anything except the exhaust.
This is minor and will not need compensation.

I am installing the same V&H head pipes and Boom Cans this week. I contacted my Dyno Shop owner and he assured me that it wont "need" it.

While you may get a couple horsepower "less than 10" and a perfect map on the Dyno. It will be negligible in normal riding. Many people spend the money on the TTS or comparable equipment without the need.

Mostly from wanting to get the "Most" out of the install but its not necessary for intake and exhaust mods on the CVO.

Now if you want to go with "Want" then by all means buy a Super Sert and tune it yourself but still no Dyno time needed unless your riding buddies have to see the sheet!

[DESERTBEAR54]

I have the Screaming Eagle Heavy Breather on my 08 SEUC. I also have a SERT and yes you don't have to do a dyno but if the tech knows your pipes and the intake he can set your bike up nicely to run better and cooler. I'm sure he has a mapping for that and also tell him how you want it to run in the low end or on the top end. My tech at Tucson Harley tweaked and tweaked and got Kasper running awesome. I like nice transition between gears and the way it was setup originally from him was to race from stop light to stoplight. That was not what I wanted. I lost some gas milage but my motor runs cooler and better than it ever did. I also love the look of the HB but I had to take my lowers off which I like that look better than the goldwing look so to each his own but that motor needs air and needs to breath and be fine tuned. I posted a picture of the bike.

[Wheelsnkeels]

As far as running Cooler this is only going to come from a richer (Air Fuel ratio) AFR tuning to richen the fuel mixture will help reduce the lean condition and therby Heat.

But your Harley Dealer cannot do it "legally" as it violate the EPA restrictions and to do it properly you need to add wide band O2 sensors that are not yet available for the 2010 models.

You will soon be able to get a plug and play solution from Steve at www.nightrider.com should be available for the 2010 models by December.

Check out the XIED solution and there is an abundance of documentation on tuning as well!

Also has a site www.tuneyourharley.com

[DESERTBEAR54]

If your local Harley Dealer enjoys performance and setting up your screaming eagle they can keep it within certain parameters that they will support and warrant the bike. These bikes have a huge range outside of whats legal but the dealer should know that or should I say the Dyno guy should know that. I have had that done on my 08 since it was new and they have warranted all things on the motor and bike.Fatten up the motor with fuel and enjoy the ride!!

[Fired00d]

IMO the answer is no you do not!

The CVO comes with a "tune" on it for the Cams, ported heads and engine mods.

The factory Air intake is already a "High Flow" intake so you are not really changing anything except the exhaust.
This is minor and will not need compensation.

I am installing the same V&H head pipes and Boom Cans this week. I contacted my Dyno Shop owner and he assured me that it wont "need" it.

While you may get a couple horsepower "less than 10" and a perfect map on the Dyno. It will be negligible in normal riding. Many people spend the money on the TTS or comparable equipment without the need.

Mostly from wanting to get the "Most" out of the install but its not necessary for intake and exhaust mods on the CVO.

Now if you want to go with "Want" then by all means buy a Super Sert and tune it yourself but still no Dyno time needed unless your riding buddies have to see the sheet!

The tune is already lean due to EPA standards which is what is making these bikes run hotter.

The SEUC I don't believe comes with a "High Flow" intake due to it coming stock w/lowers and that intake (High Flow) would not pass noise emmision standards.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[LarryB]

The tune is already lean due to EPA standards which is what is making these bikes run hotter.

The SEUC I don't believe comes with a "High Flow" intake due to it coming stock w/lowers and that intake (High Flow) would not pass noise emmision standards.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

dead on. these 110's need a tune out of the box. I know 1 HD shop out of 8 that can properly do race tuner/dyno. some great indy shops can too,
what everyone wants is a cooler running motor, and maybe some noise.
IMO TTS Mastertune, no dyno, easy peasy

[Heatwave]

As far as running Cooler this is only going to come from a richer (Air Fuel ratio) AFR tuning to richen the fuel mixture will help reduce the lean condition and therby Heat.

But your Harley Dealer cannot do it "legally" as it violate the EPA restrictions and to do it properly you need to add wide band O2 sensors that are not yet available for the 2010 models.

You will soon be able to get a plug and play solution from Steve at www.nightrider.com should be available for the 2010 models by December.

Check out the XIED solution and there is an abundance of documentation on tuning as well!

Also has a site www.tuneyourharley.com

With the SuperTuner, you only need to change the AFR metrics to a lower # and you'll get a richer map. Lower the VE tables to match and run Smarttune several times and you'll have a great running bike. Not as good as an experienced tuner on a dyno will get but for a stage 1 upgrade the difference in performance will never be noticed.

Of course you'll no longer be running in closed loop, but who cares? The only reason to run in closed loop with the narrow band factory O2 sensors is because you're overly concerned that your emissions will somehow melt the glaciers in Greenland. Screw the closed loop settings and adjust the map to a more reasonable AFR in the mid to upper 13's (Open loop with the O2 sensors being ignored by the ECU) and you'll have a very cool running exhaust with very little loss in fuel efficiency. The performance will also be much stronger by tuning the bike out of closed loop with a lower AFR.

[Heatwave]

The tune is already lean due to EPA standards which is what is making these bikes run hotter.

The SEUC I don't believe comes with a "High Flow" intake due to it coming stock w/lowers and that intake (High Flow) would not pass noise emmision standards.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

The 2010 SEUC does not come with a high flow air cleaner. I upgraded my 2010 SEUC to the Ventilator which is the high flow cleaner on the 2009 SERG and the 2010 SESG.

[Wheelsnkeels]

Different methods for skinning the same Cat.

Agree the TTS and Super SERT have their capabilities but for near 400$

Night riders XIED will take you to as low as 13.7 AFR plug N Play for around $100.00

Then if you need warranty you can just remove it and Whallah your back to the factory conditions.


With the WBO2 upgrade in place under the same conditions, exhaust pipe temperatures averaged almost 100F degrees cooler after 15 minutes of idle and the ECU never went into high temperature mode. Temperatures at the heat shields were a little over 150 degrees, or 40 degree drop.



Test Results OEM Engine with Narrow Band O2 sensor
                                 AFR Engine with Wide Band O2 sensor upgrade to

                                   14.7:1       13.0:1 AFR     How much cooler?
Maximum Temperature     749            661                    88 degrees
Average Temperature       597            542                    55 degrees
Heat Shield Temperature  194            158                    36 degrees  

http://tuneyourharley.com/biketech/content/high-engine-temp-070809-bikes

[Heatwave]

Different methods for skinning the same Cat.

Agree the TTS and Super SERT have their capabilities but for near 400$

Night riders XIED will take you to as low as 13.7 AFR plug N Play for around $100.00

Then if you need warranty you can just remove it and Whallah your back to the factory conditions.


With the WBO2 upgrade in place under the same conditions, exhaust pipe temperatures averaged almost 100F degrees cooler after 15 minutes of idle and the ECU never went into high temperature mode. Temperatures at the heat shields were a little over 150 degrees, or 40 degree drop.



Test Results OEM Engine with Narrow Band O2 sensor
                                 AFR Engine with Wide Band O2 sensor upgrade to

                                   14.7:1       13.0:1 AFR     How much cooler?
Maximum Temperature     749            661                    88 degrees
Average Temperature       597            542                    55 degrees
Heat Shield Temperature  194            158                    36 degrees 

http://tuneyourharley.com/biketech/content/high-engine-temp-070809-bikes

I don't believe the XIED product is available (yet) for 2010 touring bikes.

[Wheelsnkeels]

My understanding is the XIED is done it is the same as the 2009, However the adapters to fit the new O2 are finishing testing to be released next month