Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[RoadDawg]

Anyone using Red Shift® Dual Piston Cam Chain Tensioners? Worth it?

[prodrag1320]

they don't hurt,but they don't work any better than OEM.$$ can be better spent elseware IMO

[FlaHeatWave]

The Zipper's Tensioners had very little wear at 20k mi. the rollers had yet to touch the shoes. Going in the Cam Chest this week (30k) will post if we see any increased wear...

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

S&S came out with one now as well I have not used them but cost wise they are not much more than OEM.. which do work fine 

[grc]

I often wonder if it's only the Harley aftermarket that constantly dreams up and sells stuff we don't really need, or is everyone doing it these days?  I'm not aware of any serious issues with the hydraulic tensioner and roller chain system Harley uses, as opposed to the earlier POS system that often self destructed.  But of course if you're in there replacing a perfectly good cam plate and oil pump with one of those pretty "billet" plates and super high output oil pumps several companies sell for a very nice bump in price, why not splurge and buy a new tensioner system to go with it?  Maybe get some chrome plated bolts to install all that stuff as well.  No one else will ever see them, but you will know they are there.

Yes I'm being facetious, but I sometimes wonder if I'm the only person out here that doesn't fall for all these things.

Jerry

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Myself would not call a S&S 3 stage pump or their cam plate worthless or more so lump it into the billet goodies basket.. It has improved features over stock. Look at the car world you don't build a high performance engine and run a stock pump. Bushing vs plain bearing 3 stages vs two.. increased oil pressure at idle with out the power robbing higher pressures at higher RPM ranges ..

 

[FlaHeatWave]

I often wonder if it's only the Harley aftermarket that constantly dreams up and sells stuff we don't really need, or is everyone doing it these days?  I'm not aware of any serious issues with the hydraulic tensioner and roller chain system Harley uses, as opposed to the earlier POS system that often self destructed.  But of course if you're in there replacing a perfectly good cam plate and oil pump with one of those pretty "billet" plates and super high output oil pumps several companies sell for a very nice bump in price, why not splurge and buy a new tensioner system to go with it?  Maybe get some chrome plated bolts to install all that stuff as well.  No one else will ever see them, but you will know they are there.

Yes I'm being facetious, but I sometimes wonder if I'm the only person out here that doesn't fall for all these things.

Jerry

For the most part I'm with you... (Some of) The Aftermarket coming up with solutions to problems that don't really exist...

As far as the Zipper's Tensioners go, with the $credits that I was getting from my Dealer and the discounts I was getting from my Vendor, they really didn't cost me much, if anything... Also, I got to admit, there was some "May as well while we're in there" involved...

[grc]

Myself would not call a S&S 3 stage pump or their cam plate worthless or more so lump it into the billet goodies basket.. It has improved features over stock. Look at the car world you don't build a high performance engine and run a stock pump. Bushing vs plain bearing 3 stages vs two.. increased oil pressure at idle with out the power robbing higher pressures at higher RPM ranges ..

I agree with you Steve, if you're building a balls to the wall high performance engine then upgrading those other components makes sense.  However, I think you and I both know that most of those Fueling or SE plates are sold to people running Stage I or at most Stage II setups and who just ride normally.   

JMHO - Jerry

[FlaHeatWave]

I agree with you Steve, if you're building a balls to the wall high performance engine then upgrading those other components makes sense.  However, I think you and I both know that most of those Fueling or SE plates are sold to people running Stage I or at most Stage II setups and who just ride normally.   

JMHO - Jerry

It depends on what your definition of "just ride normally" is...

[DRAGO B W]

Biggest issue is HD cam plate and pump. The castings are very porous and  bypass the seat sucks. And they are on 4D tensor's. Look at inside of bore they are not finished and they stick.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Frank That goes for the cam plates as well I get they are making like 225,000 of them each year , however as most shops know we have all seen odd issues with stock plates. Oil pressure that will fluctuate , or drop to zero for no reason then bounce back , the lack of bushings in the plate is not about being a plain bearing but just being low cost to produce.. I feel you can save money on other things but these are air cooled engines , having increased oil PSI when hot at idle is a great thing.. Not beating the drum just looking at how these are built.. Its not like HD is has ever gone above and beyond to get the job done.. More so its enough that most work well .. and the rest well its a warranty item.  With the new 4 valve engine coming out look forward to some forward thinking..   

Many of the users on this site are just end users.. I get to tune metric bikes, and Victorys and I have to say the Vic engine is a work of art.. Just had a octane I tune it made right at 97 HP with a air cleaner and slip on mufflers . Smooth as glass power revs like a buzz bomb . Go ride the thing and it will put a complete ass kicking on a sporty ..

HD will need to start stepping up in a huge way.  The competition  is gaining ground , Many of the guys that are buying are looking at Indian as well as the Victory brand .

The engines in these others have been ROCK solid ,

[FlaHeatWave]

Frank That goes for the cam plates as well I get they are making like 225,000 of them each year , however as most shops know we have all seen odd issues with stock plates. Oil pressure that will fluctuate , or drop to zero for no reason then bounce back , the lack of bushings in the plate is not about being a plain bearing but just being low cost to produce.. I feel you can save money on other things but these are air cooled engines , having increased oil PSI when hot at idle is a great thing.. Not beating the drum just looking at how these are built.. Its not like HD is has ever gone above and beyond to get the job done.. More so its enough that most work well .. and the rest well its a warranty item.  With the new 4 valve engine coming out look forward to some forward thinking..   

Many of the users on this site are just end users.. I get to tune metric bikes, and Victorys and I have to say the Vic engine is a work of art.. Just had a octane I tune it made right at 97 HP with a air cleaner and slip on mufflers . Smooth as glass power revs like a buzz bomb . Go ride the thing and it will put a complete ass kicking on a sporty ..

HD will need to start stepping up in a huge way.  The competition  is gaining ground , Many of the guys that are buying are looking at Indian as well as the Victory brand .

The engines in these others have been ROCK solid ,

Yes, using the parent material in the plates is cheaper, but it also eliminates a potential point of failure...

Yes you guys will see an odd issue with oil pressure, none are immune, the fueling in my '09 is the most expensive cam plate on the planet, there was a posting on HTT about a failure of a blue S&S plate...an extremely higher percentage than the OE Components

Yes, the Vics & Indians appear to be decent powerplants, but to expound at this point how solid they are is getting a little ahead of the game IMO, Victory / Indian will never reach the the amount of user miles that the Twin Cam already has, no way... And for that matter neither will anybody else, including all the BMWs, Honda Cruisers / GWs.... nobody...

Yes, the TCs have some common issues, mostly lifter / comp but the majority does not, especially when you consider the user miles...

Going a little off topic next...

I for one, enjoy a little vibration in my bikes, reminds me of what a motorsikle should feel like... Over my 40 years of street bikes, I've owned / ridden the baddest bikes of their day, always had a Harley or 2 or 3 in the stable, long before the MoCo created the"lifestyle", 'modded them not "to make it my own" but to address the Manufacturer's (all of them) shortcomings... If I wanted super smooth and powerful, I would have a Kaw 14 Concours...

Oh BTW, Please post on all the Forums when you trade your Shark for a Vic / Indian...



 

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

I will not trade it , I like my HD  thats not the point .

But my shark does not have a stock engine it nor stock internals ( I gave up after the 3rd yes the 3rd engine from HD under warranty ) Olhins up front and back , better seat different bars levers we all have the massive list of items we have changed , thats not hte case with most other bikes  and its dont like I watned air ride just something that worked.. stock suspension is extremely lacking  .. either way to much invested to make it right to sell it ..  the % of me buying a new one is slim I am looking forward to the 4 valve head but if you think your vibrating HD is what you like you had better keep it as well..  You will see when the release the 17's hit the floor   HA HA  My next bike will be either a Duc or a BMW if I get crazy with money if not a VIC is going to be in my stable.. Some can only see one way I like all bikes so to me I could take it either way.. HD keeps building bikes that need vast improvements and the after market company's and shops step up to fill that void .

Really I look forward to them dumping the engine all together and going total liquid cool 4 cam over head 4 valve .. Make it work ever one else has ..  Smooth as glass power on tap every wear ..  but its coming ,.... hope every likes balancers in the new bikes