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Cat Eye

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Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« on: October 05, 2018, 09:01:03 AM »

With around 60k on my 2015 SG, I will be doing some prevented maintenance. One of the things on the list is the oil pump.

In doing my research on aftermarket oil pumps, S&S states that their pump will deliver more pressure during low RPM operation.

What my question is:
-Can the S&S pump be mounted on the stock camplate to achieve these results.
-Are there any advantages to installing the S&S camplate over stock unit.
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efrbc1

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2018, 09:08:05 AM »

Yes, you can install an S&S pump on a stock cam plate.  Make sure you order the correct one as the pump for the S&S cam plate is different.  Advantages are increased oil pressure and the S&S has screens on the intakes to minimize the amount of crap that can get into the pump in the event of something failing in the cam chest.
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grc

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2018, 12:04:00 PM »


With 60k miles on the clock, you might need a new cam plate anyway, so inspect it carefully before reusing it.  Since 2007 the  cams run in what is called parent material "bearings".  In other words, the aluminum the plate is made of, with no separate bearings.  In 2011 they also removed the bushing in the plate for the crankshaft, so the crank also runs just in the aluminum of the plate.  Haven't heard of a lot of excessive wear at the cam "bearings", but have heard of a lot of wear at the crank "bearing" due to the crank runout issues.   Btw, the bypass valve is located in the cam plate.  If you have low oil pressure at idle and low rpm's, it's often due to a bad relief valve that bypasses all the time.  A better pump mounted on an old plate with a bad bypass might not give you much of an increase in idle and low speed pressure.  Just a couple things to think about and check out before deciding what parts you want to use.  I'm sure one of our more experienced experts around here can give you more detailed info and recommendations.

Jerry
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SHRADER

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2018, 02:03:30 PM »

The cam plates also have the bypass consisting of a valve and spring. Stock cam plates are known to start bypassing at as little as 20PSI depending upon the seal at the valve, spring pressure, etc which can and will drop the oil pressure further. If it were mine I would absolutely do both the pump and plate, and I fully intend to do just that as soon as I go into the cam chest again.....
« Last Edit: October 05, 2018, 04:35:35 PM by SHRADER »
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2018, 02:25:59 PM »

Check the runout while in there
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Unbalanced

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2018, 02:49:38 PM »

The cam plates also have the bypass consisting of a valve and spring. Stock cam plates are known to start bypassing at as little as 20PSI depending upon the seal at the valve, spring pressure, etc which can and will drop the oil pressure at further. If it were mine I would absolutely do both the pump and plate, and I fully intend to do just that as soon as I go into the cam chest again.....

Shrader Zebco, so we should expect a report on this in 2020 based on how long it took you to go in the first time?  :huepfenlol2:
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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2018, 03:37:12 PM »

Jim,

We have about 12 lbs at idle even in hottest weather down in FL with the S&S pump and plate.    At 65k I’d recommend both (pump/plate which are also available as a kit).   

When was last time you changed lifters, checked your compensator and checked your primary chain (they) stretch over time.

As previously mentioned do check the runout but also do a compression test and leak down test.    Great time to get these out of the way.
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SHRADER

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2018, 05:07:14 PM »

Shrader Zebco, so we should expect a report on this in 2020 based on how long it took you to go in the first time?  :huepfenlol2:

"The ox is slow, but the earth is patient"
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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2018, 08:35:12 PM »

Got mine from PDI Racing.  Best price and free shipping.

www.pdi-racing.com

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Cat Eye

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2018, 09:14:48 PM »

Thanks for all a helpful information.

PDI-Racing does offer the TC3 pump and camplate at a good price!

Once I crack her open, I'm sure I will have some followup questions.

Thanks again
Jim
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Serdvd6

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2018, 09:22:44 PM »

Thanks for all a helpful information.

PDI-Racing does offer the TC3 pump and camplate at a good price!

Once I crack her open, I'm sure I will have some followup questions.

Thanks again
Jim

What lifters are you using?

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Cat Eye

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2018, 08:02:40 PM »

What lifters are you using?

S&S part# 33-5350  These are their std lifters and I replace around every 20-25K
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Dacuda

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2018, 03:41:41 PM »

S&S TC3 Oil Pump and Cam Plate after only 4,000 miles, not happy
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Cat Eye

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2018, 03:46:45 PM »

S&S TC3 Oil Pump and Cam Plate after only 4,000 miles, not happy

OMG :'(

Any thoughts as to what happened.

I just installed that Cam Plate and Pump. 
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sadunbar

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2018, 04:24:40 PM »

S&S TC3 Oil Pump and Cam Plate after only 4,000 miles, not happy

I'd figure out what happened before you point towards the pump failing.  An oil pump doesn't run 4,000 miles and then have a gear break for no reason.  Find the source of the debris that jammed in the pump - just my suggestion...
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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2018, 06:03:12 PM »


What he said ^^^.  Also check the crank runout, there is a limit to how much runout any oil pump can survive, and Harley has a BS maximum tolerance that is well above that limit.

JMHO - Jerry
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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #16 on: October 25, 2018, 06:22:06 AM »

S&S TC3 Oil Pump and Cam Plate after only 4,000 miles, not happy


pretty much guarantee it wasn't the fault of the pump or plate,like said,check the run out

prodrag1320

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #17 on: October 25, 2018, 06:23:47 AM »

Thanks for all a helpful information.

PDI-Racing does offer the TC3 pump and camplate at a good price!

Once I crack her open, I'm sure I will have some followup questions.

Thanks again
Jim


we`ll beat any advertised price,call us

johnmowcop

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2018, 03:56:52 PM »

Just curious.
Other than enough pressure to work the hydraulic lifters, (whatever that is?) why do you need more oil pressure. More flow, yes maybe, which would increase the pressure, but just increasing pressure? Or is the pressure gained by increasing flow.
JohnT
« Last Edit: October 25, 2018, 04:00:47 PM by johnmowcop »
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sadunbar

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2018, 11:15:48 AM »

Just curious.
Other than enough pressure to work the hydraulic lifters, (whatever that is?) why do you need more oil pressure. More flow, yes maybe, which would increase the pressure, but just increasing pressure? Or is the pressure gained by increasing flow.
JohnT

Pressure is needed for lifters and chain tensioners.  Otherwise, good scavenging and constant flow is important.  Excessive pressure only creates heat.
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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2019, 07:08:34 AM »


pretty much guarantee it wasn't the fault of the pump or plate,like said,check the run out
When checking run out, what are the accepted tolerances? Suggestions for outside of accepted.

Thanks!

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2019, 07:36:13 AM »

When checking run out, what are the accepted tolerances? Suggestions for outside of accepted.

Thanks!

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oil pump problems will start around .006,that said,acceptible max crank run out is .0035 (here anyway) anything above that,we recommend have the crank done

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Re: Aftermarket Oil Pumps
« Reply #22 on: June 09, 2019, 10:58:25 AM »

There was a group of pumps that were sent out without the dowel pins, item #7 in instructions, that connect the sections. Installers that were not on their game can miss this. The sections then are not in alignment.
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