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[icybay]

No this is not a joke......


WASHINGTON (AP) - The Supreme Court gets to write on a blank slate when it takes up the meaning of the Second Amendment "right to keep and bear arms" and the District of Columbia's ban on handguns.

The nine justices have said almost nothing about gun rights, and their predecessors have likewise given no definitive answer to whether the Constitution protects an individual's right to own guns or whether that right is somehow tied to service in a state militia.

The case that will be argued Tuesday is among the most closely watched of the term, drawing 68 briefs from outside groups. Most of those support an individual's right to own a gun.

"This may be one of the only cases in our lifetime when the Supreme Court is going to interpret an important provision of our Constitution unencumbered by precedent," said Georgetown University law professor Randy Barnett.

Even if they determine there is an individual right, the justices still will have to decide whether the capital's 32-year-old handgun ban can stand and how to evaluate other gun control laws. This issue has caused division within the Bush administration, with Vice President Dick Cheney taking a harder line than the administration's official position at the court.

The local Washington government argues that its law should be allowed to remain in force whether or not the amendment applies to individuals, although it reads the amendment as intended to allow states to have armed forces.

The City Council that adopted the ban said it was justified because "handguns have no legitimate use in the purely urban environment of the District of Columbia."

Dick Anthony Heller, 65, an armed security guard, sued the District after it rejected his application to keep a handgun at his home—about a mile from the court—for protection. His lawyers say the amendment plainly protects an individual's right.

The 27 words and three enigmatic commas of the Second Amendment have been analyzed again and again by legal scholars, but hardly at all by the Supreme Court.

The amendment reads: "A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

The last Supreme Court ruling on the topic came in 1939 in U.S. v. Miller, which involved a sawed-off shotgun. Constitutional scholars disagree over what that case means but agree it did not squarely answer the question of individual versus collective rights.

Chief Justice John Roberts said at his confirmation hearing that the correct reading of the Second Amendment was "still very much an open issue."

Heller lost his suit in U.S. District Court in Washington. By a 2-1 vote, a panel of the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia struck down the handgun ban. Notably, it was the first appeals court to strike down a gun control law on the basis of an individual's Second Amendment rights.

In 2001, Attorney General John Ashcroft reversed long-standing Justice Department policy when he asserted that the Second Amendment protects individuals' rights. The administration's brief in this case holds to that view.

But Solicitor General Paul Clement told the court that reasonable restrictions should be allowed and warns that federal laws restricting sales of machine guns and barring felons from owning guns, among others, could be threatened under the appeals court ruling. Clement wants the court to send the case back to lower courts without deciding whether the handgun ban is reasonable.

Clement's brief was harshly criticized by supporters of gun rights. Cheney joined majorities in both the House and Senate in signing a brief that says a handgun ban is clearly unreasonable. Experts on the court could recall no other case in which a vice president took a public position disagreeing with the administration he serves.

Barnett is among those on both sides of the issue who believe the practical effect of the court's ruling will be limited.

Forty-four state constitutions contain some form of gun rights, which are not affected by the court's consideration of Washington's restrictions.

"There is almost no other enacted gun law that would be threatened by this case," Barnett said.

The case is Heller v. District of Columbia, 07-290.

___

On the Net:

Supreme Court: http://www.supremecourtus.gov


Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

[Fired00d]

Isn't it ironic that DC has a no gun rule, and one of the highest murder rates (by guns no doubt). As long as there are anti-gun laws then only the criminals will have guns. Don't know the statistics but I'd be willing to bet no criminal has attacked anyone that was openly toting a firearm.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[TN]

Isn't it ironic that DC has a no gun rule, and one of the highest murder rates (by guns no doubt). As long as there are anti-gun laws then only the criminals will have guns. Don't know the statistics but I'd be willing to bet no criminal has attacked anyone that was openly toting a firearm.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

wonder who comes up with these ideas/gun laws. someone forgot to inform the criminals about it.
seems like the criminals has more rights than the victims er future victims.   
i'm hushing now.



carry wisely

TN

[comfortablynumb]

There are presently 40 states with Right to carry laws. 36 of these are "shall issue" states that after a background check and meeting uniform standards  established by the State,you get a RTC permit. Some researchers believe that if all staes participated in a "uniform" process of awarding these RTCs,as many as 1570 murders may be avoided annually,4,000 rapes and some 60,000 agg assaults. FBI stats point out in that in counties where RTC laws have been put into effect, a drop of 8.5 % in murders,5% drop in rape and 7% in agg assaults. Michigan, who passed RTC 6 years ago, show that 1 in 65 citizens have the RTC permit and ALL crime stats have dropped as compared to the 6 years before passage of the law. In Florida, which was probably the most publisized battle for RTC 17 years ago, with promises from the pols of "the streets will run red with blood", crime stats have shown a continual downward track, and the well reported scare tactic that travelers in rental cars were most at risk has evaporated. I think a main problem is that when the same statistics that the antis use in predicting doom completely disprove their own beliefs, they refuse to accept that fact, accusing false or biased slant towards that information(but it was ok when they used it). Laws of any kind only apply to those that follow them. There is a word for those that don't-criminals, go get them and leave me the fuel pump alone.

[BigR55]

Check out this link! Police seize guns from citizens in New Orleans and let the looters run wild! UNBELIVEABLE!!!!!!!!!!!

youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4

[jimp]

Guns in Montana.

[CVOMOE!!]

Perfect!  Just what we need.  Another gun thread on a bike forum.

Moe

[RJ749]

Perfect!  Just what we need.  Another gun thread on a bike forum.

Moe

It's a USA thing I guess Moe.

RJ (Roger Jr age 5, circa 1984)

[BigR55]

Sorry Joe,

This site has some of the best intelectual exchanges anywhere on the web. Topics of all interest
from motorheads to cat vomit and politics find their own following.

Let us never forget what followed after the goverment removed the guns from the hands of
the citizens of Europe. 
 
Subject: Gen Eisenhower Warned us
 
United Kingdom   Memorial
 
It is a matter of history that when Supreme
Commander of t he Allied Forces, General Dwight
Eisenhower, found the victims of the death camps he
ordered all possible photographs to be
taken, and for the German people from surrounding villages to
be ushered through the camps and even made to bury
the dead.
 
He did this because he said in words to this effect:
"Get it all on record now - get the films -
get the witnesses -because somewhere down the track
of history some bastard will get up and say that this
never happened"
 
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is
for good men to do nothing."
Edmund Burke
 
In Memorial
 
This week, the UK removed The Holocaust from its
school curriculum because it "offended" the Muslim
population which claims it never occurred.
This is a frightening portent of the fear that is
gripping the world and how easily each country is
giving into it.
 
It is now more than 60 years after the Second
World War in Europe ended. This e-mail is being sent as
a memorial chain, in memory of the

six million Jews,
 
20 million Russians,
 
10 million Christians
 
and 1,900 Catholic priests
 
who were murdered,
massacred, raped, burned, starved
and humiliated while the German and Russian
peoples looked the other way!
 
Now, more than ever, with Iran ,
among others,claiming the Holocaust to be "a myth," it is
imperative to make sure the world never forgets.
 
This e-mail is intended to reach 400
million people worldwide!

How many years will it be before the attack on the
World Trade Center "never happened" because
it offends some Muslim in the U.S.

[FLYNDYNA]

I fully believe in the right to bear arms, as previously stated "when guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns"...it has been proven time and time again! Putting myself in the mind of a criminal, I would be looking into a different career if I knew anyone could defend themselves. It's not rocket science! Why do the innocents of society continue to pay the price for criminals and government ignorance?  Phew ,o.k. I am going to step down now...