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[BADBAGG]

I finally broke down and switched from the PC-V to the TTS Mastertune. I couldnt stand the fbw throttle lag any longer. What a difference. It feels like i have throttle cables again. sweeeet. Here is the dyno sheet. 

[mjb765]

If you forgive the stupid question...but where in the TTS software do you get rid of the throttle lag--or is it just a tuning thing???

[BADBAGG]

Apparently Harley has programmed the computer to only give you a portion of the throttle (65% from what i hear?) when you wack the throttle under a certain rpm. If you are above the rpm (3000) you get 100% or if you roll on the throttle you get 100%. But where's the fun in that 

[mjb765]

Do you know where the setting is to fix that???

[BADBAGG]

sorry i do not. Cycle Rama installed and tuned for me. There is definetly a huge difference.

[GregKhougaz]

BadBagg, Moved this thread here to Intake/Exhaust/ECM.  I think you'll get more responses.  Good job on the switch!

[timtoolman]

Slow throttle response??? i havent noticed any yet ,  i have a pc-v with auto tuner actuallt the only i went the the pc-v is the switch where u can go between power map and economy  map, i had a thundermax on my 07 ,  so is the  TTS system really that much better with out the wide band sensors  that comes with the pc-v auto tuner system??

[Diamondback]

 

Boy is that a loaded question?

There are as many answers as there are systems,'


I wouldn't give up my PC V with autotune for anything.

 

[timtoolman]

Yes  that is a loaded question,  but to be honest  i have pretty decent throttle response.  its a 106 cu engine  with cams and different intake valves   ive been thinking of steves x pipe,  but im happy with the pc-v  so far,  .  the auto tuner is better though in my honest opinion

[BADBAGG]

what year is your bike timtoolman? I have used power commanders on every other bike i have owned and loved them. With that being said this is the first fly by wire throttle i have owned. If you ride like i do, you will definetly notice the lag with the FBW. All my other bikes were throttle cable operated.

[timtoolman]

its  a 09  ultra,  i kinda  was thinking of the tts anyhow  ,  it has a auto tuner  also,

[timtoolman]

i just ordered a tts  from fulsac,  they are out of x pipes,  steve had a point  what if pcv breaks down while on the road?  and tts has more capability  than pcv  so when it comes mon,  i will swap them out  the sell the pcv& auto tuner

[North Star]

timely post- I am debating on either the TTS or a Power Commander with a custom map from a reputable tuner. Don't recall anyone saying anything bad about the TTS, or about anything to do with fullsac.

I don't want to thread hi-jack, so I'll make a new post with install questions, if a search doesn't do the trick  .

[Diamondback]

 


Odd with the PC V and autotune, you have a complete backup system in the original HD ECM.  If the PC V fails (which I've never heard of one failing), remove it from the harness takes ten minutes if your slow.  The HD ECM will run in the failed mode and "get you  home",  it can't sense the WB sensors and thus thinks the NB has failed and sets the AFR at a very low value (like 12).  Bike runs rich but will run just fine.

Regarding the TTS, seems to be a very good solution but we had two replaced with the PC V and autotune.  Think it was more of the map than the product, but we can all say that.  I had a SSERT and spent too many dollars and time to have a crappy running bike.  I switched to the PC V myself, no tune and I have over 11000 on the bike and would never switch.  Bike runs cool and I get great mileage (42 with two up over 1000 miles).  Power is excellent and I can make changes without going to the "dyno" man.

to each his own but I will never go back.

Also, In would wonder why HD has "slow throttle response built in" and Mastertune takes it out.  In would suspect it is emissions based and Steve does a great job at making the bike run great.

One of my long time riding buddies has a 09 CVO Roadglide with the PC V and autotune and a new 10 96 Ultra that Fullsac fixed up and both are great.  However, he has yet to ride the Ultra in the South Texas Heat.  He road the bike all the way to Nevada to get it tuned.  Sounds good and runs good with Fullsac and TTS.

 

[The Barrels]

Here is my 2 cents of the TTS vs PC-V discussions. (note that I use TTS and just have read about PC-V)

They both seem to be great products that give us the ability to do upgrades on our engines without the need of a dyno.

Installation of the TTS is very simple just hook up the interface to the bike and a computer. No extra wires or add on boxes etc. The only disadvantage to me would be if something in the programming of the ECU would go wrong, never heard of it but it might be possible. The V-tune process is not to complicated but you need to be somewhat knowing what you are doing.

If the installation of the PC-V is similar to the PCIII i used before it's not to complicated but it take some more time and it ads wires, connectors, and changing to wide band sensors. The disadvantages here is risks of getting into wear on wires, more connectors that could oxidate, and that you are seizing threads on the sensors. I guess that if you follow the instructions the risks would be low. Since this is an add on system it has to override the original ECU signals and commands instead of the TTS changes of the software settings (might be a difference to what is discussed as the throttle limitation in this thread). The autotune function are using wide band sensors and it sounds like it is a little bit easier to use v.s V-tune.

When you are using either system I recommend that you always try to understand what you are doing and not trust the systems 100%. An engine is not an linear machine and the switching sensors as well as wide band sensors might sometimes be fooled by combustion stability with unburned fuel or hydrocarboons that react with the sensor.Therefore you ned to do a rationality check of the shape of tha maps. The most usual areas there this happens are at light load all RPM:s or high load low RPM:s together with cams using a little bit more overlap etc.

Don't know about PC-V but other systems I've been working on have been tricky to run with multipoint adjustment of fuel maps live. Normally an engine needs some kind of stabilization time before the  A/F ratio is stable in each load/rpm  position. This time differs depending on if you are coming from high or low load etc. and this together with how the system interpolate between the support points  it can easily make strange behaviours in some points in the fuel maps if you just leave a self  adjusting system for it self. Hopefully this is not the case with PC-V if you run autotune continuesly but I would keep an I on it or use it for a setup and switch of autotune  for normal running and just use it for tuning. 

Again I believe both systems will do their job excellent as long as they are correctly installed.