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[laylonlor]

v/h says that power dauls are a better profomrer, but the true dauls are louder

[DennisG]

Anyone know how big a difference Power Duals versus the True duals work as far a performance???

If a x pipe is designed right it makes the motor think it is seeing a 2/1 and then it splits back into two to give you the look and more like the sound of duals.  2/1  is generally a better performing pipe.   BUT: 


  Knowing what I now know about the 2010 bikes with the Lambda tuning and the sensor positions down low in front of the cat, I dont think I would get the power duals again.  Seems to me those low 02 sensors are designed to read right in front of that cat that keeps some back pressure.  Take that out and there can be some crosstalking between the 2 sensors and confusion for the computer.    Hence the reason VH moved one of the sensors up the pipe on the rear cylinder.  now it is a different distance from the head than the computer is  expecting to read, different distance from head than the front cylinder.

  A different mix, different temp.  Can the new smaller sensor hold up under  the increased heat of that new position?  Definitely throws some potential for tuning inaccuracy into the mix.  Is there too much fresh air around the sensor due to the removal of the cat  and resulting lack of back pressure, and sensors closer to the end of the pipe  potentially causing the computer to richen the mixture beyond what you want it to?   Too inexact for me. 

i think with a set of duals you could at least isolate the tuning of each cylinder and make them even.   I notice with mine and have seen others post that the left side muffler is much sootier inside the powerduals as though it is too rich.


I think the power duals look pretty nice, but I am not so sure they are properly designed with the challenging setup presented by the Lambda bikes.  i don't know if anyone has really solved the challenge of removing the cat and still running closed loop on a 2010 and up Harley and having it be RIGHT.

If someone is sure that it can be done RIGHT, please let me know!!   IMO it seems like tt was much easier with the 2009 with a good stock header, no cat in the pipe and sensors up high near the exhaust ports

I am still researching this subject, because I want my bike to run as good as it can and be right and still take advantage of the closed loop capability.  I think for a 2/1/2  that the Fuelmoto Stainless X pipe might be a better choice if you don't want duals. 

Dennis

[bbrown]

Thanks Dennis.  I really like the look of the true duals better but did not want to go that way if I would be giving up performance and or Torque

[jacksglide]

While we are on this subject, has anyone noticed how fast the inside of the H.O. slip ons rust up??? I mean any rain, a wash or simply humidity causes the inside of the output end of the pipe to rust extremely fast. Looks like Hell!!! Any suggestions, comment's input???

[hdctss]

yeah, ignore it, it is on the inside of the pipe, ever look at the inside of any other exhaust pipe on a bike, or for that matter on a show car that is actually driven.  if you want a pretty pipe on the inside and outside park your bike in the house on a pedestal and don't ride it.  I ride mine and the only color on the inside of my pipe is a nice pretty color caused by burning fossil fuels.

[laylonlor]

i took my baffles out of my, hi output v/h slipons, today and removed  the sock off the baffles, sounds good ,  much louder, i think its running better

[geezerglide]

yeah, ignore it, it is on the inside of the pipe, ever look at the inside of any other exhaust pipe on a bike, or for that matter on a show car that is actually driven.  if you want a pretty pipe on the inside and outside park your bike in the house on a pedestal and don't ride it.  I ride mine and the only color on the inside of my pipe is a nice pretty color caused by burning fossil fuels.

I think by discoloration, he means the dark rust like deposits on the indents of the end caps which are slid into the muffler and held in place by the grub screws. I just noticed on my return home after a ride of 300 miles through the rain.

geezerglide

[DennisG]

i took my baffles out of my, hi output v/h slipons, today and removed  the sock off the baffles, sounds good ,  much louder, i think its running better

Just so you know, the chrome on the mufflers will likely discolor from the heat without that sock in there.  I was told this by VH tech and I think the problem that CFR mufflers had in the past with discoloring was related to them not having anything in between the muffler and the baffle.  They have since corrected it with something similar to the sock VH has in there.

[eismcc]

Just so you know, the chrome on the mufflers will likely discolor from the heat without that sock in there.  I was told this by VH tech and I think the problem that CFR mufflers had in the past with discoloring was related to them not having anything in between the muffler and the baffle.  They have since corrected it with something similar to the sock VH has in there.

I've had the insulation out of my Hi Outputs for a couple of weeks now. The muffler body gets hotter, but not extremely hotter. No discoloration.

I just looked today and after riding several times the left pipe is not getting black like it was before. I'm using the Power Duals also.

[DennisG]

The black soot is probably being deposited on the inside of the outer can going through the little holes in the baffles. 

How would you describe the difference in sound?

dennis

 

[laylonlor]

i'll never put the sock back on my baffles again, sounds  to good , but you like loud

[eismcc]

The black soot is probably being deposited on the inside of the outer can going through the little holes in the baffles. 

How would you describe the difference in sound?

dennis

 

The left muffler end cap would turn black with carbon after some riding. After a four hour highway trip, the carbon was peeling off there was so much of it.

The sound is much louder. It sort of sounds like if you put resonators on open drag pipes. It's still a very low note.

[DennisG]

did you notice any difference in performance?  Was your bike tuned before you took socks out?  Does it have more crack to the sound?  i wonder if maybe just a partial removal of the sock would give me a little more crack without making it too loud.

dennis

[jacksglide]

Hey HDCTSS,

 I've been riding approx 40 years now! When somebody asks for input, that does not mean  we are looking for a snide comment! My wife and I just returned from Key West on the bike. I just like shinny chrome and paint. Rest assured, you can tell what color my bike is when you see it on the road.

[hdctss]

really, well my 46 years trumps your 40 years, and you will only see me on the road if you can keep up with me. so if you don't like your dirty pipes then don't ride your bike and if you don't like snide comments then don't ask stupid questions