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[HD Street Performance]

Thanks for sharing your results. Your testing is closer to what can be used for "real world" than we typically get. When someone chimes in and says a cam does or does not do something there is usually a barrage of loyalists that will feel the need to defend the brand and then a lot of other results from Twin Cams but not 110s and then the ones that say there is something screwed up.
The 110 in terms of bore and stroke are nothing unusual. The heads however are very different and what works on a 103 or 96" may not actually give the same result for the 110" and visa versa. I too have experienced similar in my testing. I use the TW5-6 as a torque grind for these motors and then bypass all of the other short duration stuff and move right up to a TW400,TW408,TW8 or larger for these motors, now with HC pistons and headwork. The end users (riding style) and load vary a lot some are bar hoppers and some are long range riders so we have to roll with what they want.

[Vosselman (NL - Europe)]

Everything else equal (pipe, aircleaner, good tune), by switching from a 255 to a TW7H you will probably loose some below 3000rpm and start gaining some above 4000 rpm.

You could add a 4 degree gear to make things a tad better.
In our tests, the TW7H with 4 degree gear runs quite a bit cooler compared to the 255

[HD Street Performance]

This is the straight scoop, a tuner with in-house dyno and a 110 motorcycle, who has tested back to back under similar conditions and on the road.

[ruiner73]

My numbers may be conservative because of the pipe. No question the d&d flows more and the heads on the 110 may need more flow. On a previous bike the borazillas got me 10 more hp and torque then the fat cats.
The point of my post however was not my exact numbers. It was that the tw7 did not actually provide much if any benefit over the 255 in a cam only exchange. I believe the fueling cam may have been a better bet.
As far as the pipes, I get as good or better results as identical bikes using fullsac head pipe and baffles in this area. I have seen my buddies dynos (255 cam)

OK, sorry if I got things sidetracked too much, I did go straight from stock to pipes & cams, just excited how much better the bike runs & the results from the tune/upgrades...

[timtoolman]

 Vossellman     i really dont think the 255  out performs  the tw7h below 3000 rpms, ive had both,  the tw7 kinda runs out on the top end  but  later then the 255 also,  the tw7 ramp speeds being what they are,  really makes them quicker than the 255  all things  being equal on the bike.  Yes im a loyalist to woods,  but ive tried many s.e. performance grinds, 203, 204, 257. 211, s&s 585, 640g, andrews37h, 54h, tman590, 625 ,woods tw7(2) 400-6, 408's   those other brands  caused me to be loyal,  awwwwww  im hopless,  i just love the quickness of the woodscams   sorry  for being hopless brand lover,  haa haa haa  

still the dyno results arent that bad for what the engine has done to it or rather  hasnt had done to it
                                                             Chimemaster

[SBB]

While the results were on different dynos,
The best I can tell you are comparing results by comparing apples and oranges.

While the results were on different dynos,

[/color]
Different dynos are like different cams, there are a lot of variables that determine the outcome and results.

they were both on "CONSERVATIVE" dynos.

Yep, I can tell how a dyno reads by looking at it, never mind that it was different days and different operators.

they were both on "CONSERVATIVE" dynos.

This reminds me of the classic response when Don (Deweysheads) asked a member when he posted that his heads looked okay.

"Heads looked okay"
How would ya know?

After thinking about it the member responded with
 [/color]

You right, how the hell would I know.

Both done by experienced tuners.
If I asked every tuner I have met if they are experienced or not guess what the answer would be.
As you can see I picked up a few HP. The goal however was more useable torque. Lost a couple ft/lbs.
Should have listened to Dewey (Deweysheads). He told me the tw7 would not work. Fuelmoto, Bob Woods and others said it wood. Just tellin it like it is.
Bottom line. The bike still runs very well, but not much if any improvement.

Just tellin it like it is.

No offense but telling it like it is has much more credibility when you compare apples to apples.
Until then, IMHO your test/results has to many variables to be an accurate portrayal of why you are dissatisfied with your cam swap.
Good luck in what you do, I have found the best results come from the right combination of all parts not the selection of one part and hope it works well with the others.

SBB

[Unbalanced]

Run it up to 220 + cold cranking, and you'll pick up a few on the torque side.    
John 

John its puff, puff, pass time, you must of been holding onto the bong a little to long when you wrote that or you are just clearly joking.  It would be the first time I have heard you subscribe to that much compression on a street bike over proper porting, reasonable compression and combination.    Please advise 

[timtoolman]

Its called "the mirror dyno"  I dont really pay too much atten to dyno paper,,  i had the woods in first changed it out before i realizeed they can be made quiet, installed andrews 54h,  wow the torq,  was  much slower 2000 to 3000,  i reinstalled the tw7  awww  the  quickness was back  also the tw7 pulled harder,  ,  I think in the .575 to .500 range  cams  they kick ass,  the best a 2nd would be the tw555, definately  better than any thing harley has to offer  My friend has a 2003 103 s.e. road king  with a  hpi 54tb   true duals,  dyno tuned  with a pc3r ,  high 5 a/c,  he  has 104 hp 110 hp  i dont have a dyno tune  i out accelerate him bad every time and pull away in traffic at 65 mph and up,  i  have a 2009 ultra ,  im 6-5 280 lbs, engines are very  comparable   i only have 4 cubes more, but  at 2000 to 3500  it pulls much harder,  pulls  2-3 foot wheelies  in 2nd   anytime no effort with a passenger,   The tw7 isnt the best cam out there it is a good one i like it  The 255 is a lame cam by harley as o.e.m. "performance item" (much like everything else they make)  and has to comply with o.e.m. emission  compliance not much power , makes  to much heat ,, No way a 255 is a better touring  cam than the tw7. any dyno will show u that,  not just by the butt dyno.Ill run any 255 in a 110,  ive spanked toooo many of them      "rear view mirror dyno " is  the best  dyno on the market hands down, Hmmm maybe i shouldve gotten the bike dyno tuned( it was just  auto tune,), with the tw7 ,  bu them im going back to the woods 400-6 and hillside heads, then it wouldnd be even comparable at all

[HD Street Performance]

There isn't anything wrong with the cam or brand.
What any of the cams do (or don't do) when coupled with a stock OEM head or any variant ported is not representitive of what happens with the 110. So ranking the cams as a whole...that analogy goes right out the window IMO, the water even gets further muddy when comparing in an engine group with pipe changes and tune quality. In the carb days most ran well even when they were jetted a little off but not if the pipe was stupid (fishtails, drags, boomcans), not so now tune becomes very critical. False ion sensing for example can pull 10-15hp right off the top and it is not that uncommon, however often overlooked.
The question the end user needs to ask and be able to answer with certaintly is "will spending $XXX dollars make a substantial differance in my performance" "Is it worth the cost" "when I get done with these mods will I have the software and a good dyno tuner to reap the potential benefits" Most won't tolerate playing musical cams, pipes or tunes, and most have to pay shop rates to do so.

The 110 heads are very large and that can work for or against you. Remember back to all the guys that followed the dealers lead and installed the HTCC CNC heads on the 95" motors and a 258 cam? Soggy mess below 3,200. The 110 heads are a close relative to those but as-cast, but we have 15 more inches and that helps some. Some folks changed to TW400 and TW408 cams and were please at the extreme makeover but those were gear drive and there was talk about valvetrain noise. I run a 408 with 110 heads and it is not whisper quiet but not bad at all compared to my old 95 with TW400g cams. My bike now has 188# springs and geometry is fixed. I have found that to be worthwhile and essential for all high lift stuff IMO. That includes Baisley corrected roller rockers. He is right down the freeway and I am gald to have their help with this product.
Most bagger owners are using this cam in the 110 as a bolt-in and have dealers trying canned maps (and less than good tunes) and less than good pipes. That is another critical performance item in the formula, the pipe, and can be a major obstacle.  The close LSA higher overlap cams in the 110 will not tolerate anything less open exhaust and one that scavenges well in order to deliver.

These cams don't stand on their own legs and they have to be compared in the context of the build. For that reason and in the interest of trying to give my customers what they want I will be bypassing the 7 and the 555 (unless someone can prove it performs substantially better than the stock cam ~~~in the 110 motor with typical pipes~~~). If they want punch and rarely exceed 4,500 then the TW5 is my choice. If they want more and will raise the compression then the TW400, TW408, and TW8 all have their place with matching components.
The 555 has proven a winner when coupled to a compatable pipe in the 96 and 103" motors with OEM stock and some ported heads. So that cam has it's place too in my view, especially in a 103/107 as an alternative / upgrade to the competitive cams of similar lift and duration.

[Unbalanced]

Its called "the mirror dyno"  I dont really pay too much atten to dyno paper,,  i had the woods in first changed it out before i realizeed they can be made quiet, installed andrews 54h,  wow the torq,  was  much slower 2000 to 3000,  i reinstalled the tw7  awww  the  quickness was back  also the tw7 pulled harder,  ,  I think in the .575 to .500 range  cams  they kick ass,  the best a 2nd would be the tw555, definately  better than any thing harley has to offer  My friend has a 2003 103 s.e. road king  with a  hpi 54tb   true duals,  dyno tuned  with a pc3r ,  high 5 a/c,  he  has 104 hp 110 hp  i dont have a dyno tune  i out accelerate him bad every time and pull away in traffic at 65 mph and up,  i  have a 2009 ultra ,  im 6-5 280 lbs, engines are very  comparable   i only have 4 cubes more, but  at 2000 to 3500  it pulls much harder,  pulls  2-3 foot wheelies  in 2nd   anytime no effort with a passenger,   The tw7 isnt the best cam out there it is a good one i like it  The 255 is a lame cam by harley as o.e.m. "performance item" (much like everything else they make)  and has to comply with o.e.m. emission  compliance not much power , makes  to much heat ,, No way a 255 is a better touring  cam than the tw7. any dyno will show u that,  not just by the butt dyno.Ill run any 255 in a 110,  ive spanked toooo many of them      "rear view mirror dyno " is  the best  dyno on the market hands down, Hmmm maybe i shouldve gotten the bike dyno tuned( it was just  auto tune,), with the tw7 ,  bu them im going back to the woods 400-6 and hillside heads, then it wouldnd be even comparable at all

Tim,

Your post above caught my attention regarding your buddies throttlebody is the 54 TB new?? ,   I ask because a 54mm isn't something they have ever sold commercially on their website.   I ask cause I am looking for a 53 ideally but a 54 would be great and they discontinued the 53's about 18 - 24 months ago ideally rather have the 53 to go back on the 05 when I add some more compression this winter.  With the SE OEM Heads on his bike is he making a 104 hp or a 110 hp ?   guessing 110 tq / 104 hp

Thanks.

[timtoolman]

he bought it in 2004 from hpi  i thought it was a 54  !!!  i maybe mistaken  its the older 2 piece type delphi, i kno its the next one up from harleys stock one which at that time i think was a 48mm,  i will call him  this week and find out and post it here,  maybe its the 55 mm one

[timtoolman]

its th 55 mm  with the runners matched to the 2003 s.e. heads

[timtoolman]

yeah but the 255 cam still sucks

[guppytrash]

Good info!  
My next move is cams but not for those small gains.
Was thinking tw7 or fueling 574.
Maybe I need to just stay with the 255.

[Unbalanced]

Tim ,


Hrmph  in 2004  it was 51, 53, 56  his came with a 43 stock.    then they moved to 51, 55, 58, 62 about 2-3 years ago or so .    


so much for hoping for a 54mm   .    Thanks for following up