Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[RayG]

First off I want to say that the support from Revolution Performance has been pretty decent so far.  Exactly one week ago I received & installed my new Engine Management System from Revolution Performance.  I did quite a bit of research and even sent out some private e-mails to individuals that are very knowledgable on this subject.  I have an 08 SERK that has had low speed throttle issues since day one.  Some of you may be tired of me writing about the same issue but trust me living with it has been very unpleasant.  Soon after my purchase I had the RHTD, Max flow A/C, SERT installed along with some dealer Dyno time.  Low speed stumble still existed so the dealer tried some maps from HD.  After another season I went with the new (09) HD Super Tuner and more dealer Dyno time.  Everytime the dealer did something it just got worse.  I now was going through a spell of Parade & Limp modes towards the end of last years riding season.  The engine warning light was continually pulling up codes P113 was one of them, I don't remember the others.  This year the engine light was on and off but I was told it was a historic code so I had it cleared.  

Prior to the installation I cleared all the codes and went for a few weeks without any engine warning light so I ordered the Rev Perf system.  After the installation which was quite simple, even for me.  I could hardly wait to try my bike without the issues that plagued me and kept me from enjoying the full potential of the bike for so long.  When I was finished  the installation I took it for it's maiden voyage.  I was so hoping for the hesitation at slow speed to disappear and receive the same results others were experiencing.  My results were intermittent backfiring, slow speed throttle responce was worse than before, it stalled a few times when stopped at traffic lights.  You have to engage the throttle slowly when taking off, if you move it quickly to rev the engine it just hesitates and wants to stall.  The engine warning light came on again, I had the P113, 1355 & 1356.  I cleared the codes and only have the 113 returning daily.  I have been in contact with Josh from Rev Perf and he seems to think it is an issue that is unrelated to the ECM.  Josh wants me to check the electrical contacts on the T-MAP sensor on the throttle body.  I removed the A/C and the screw holding the T-Map and now realise that to check the connection I will have to either raise or remove the gas tank.  I held the butterfly open and checked the sensor form the outside and it looked good and clean, but I don't know what it's supposed to look like.  Josh is sending me another ECM to try.  I'm past my comfort point when working on the throttle body.  I have talked to quite a few people and nobody has hinted about trouble with the T-MAP Sensor's.  Bike week is coming up in Laconia in a few weeks and once again it looks like I'll have a bike just limping along unless we can find a solution quick.  Anyone have any ideas on how to proceed?  I just have passed the point of indiscriminately purchasing new parts to fix problems.  I'm really mentally tired & very very frustrated and disappointed. I have gone way beyond what I should have financially, but I thought this was the end of my troubles.  (needed other costly repairs that I did on my own rather than rely on warranty and dealers) my apologies for rambling, as mentioned physically & emotionally drained

Running out of rope

Ray G.      

[timo482]

it could be the sensor has been the problem all along - since hd is not obdii its very very hard to diagnose engine problems

of course its very hard to diagnose electrical engine problems in the first place

to

[sadunbar]

First off I want to say that the support from Revolution Performance has been pretty decent so far.  Exactly one week ago I received & installed my new Engine Management System from Revolution Performance.  I did quite a bit of research and even sent out some private e-mails to individuals that are very knowledgable on this subject.  I have an 08 SERK that has had low speed throttle issues since day one.  Some of you may be tired of me writing about the same issue but trust me living with it has been very unpleasant.  Soon after my purchase I had the RHTD, Max flow A/C, SERT installed along with some dealer Dyno time.  Low speed stumble still existed so the dealer tried some maps from HD.  After another season I went with the new (09) HD Super Tuner and more dealer Dyno time.  Everytime the dealer did something it just got worse.  I now was going through a spell of Parade & Limp modes towards the end of last years riding season.  The engine warning light was continually pulling up codes P113 was one of them, I don't remember the others.  This year the engine light was on and off but I was told it was a historic code so I had it cleared.  

Prior to the installation I cleared all the codes and went for a few weeks without any engine warning light so I ordered the Rev Perf system.  After the installation which was quite simple, even for me.  I could hardly wait to try my bike without the issues that plagued me and kept me from enjoying the full potential of the bike for so long.  When I was finished  the installation I took it for it's maiden voyage.  I was so hoping for the hesitation at slow speed to disappear and receive the same results others were experiencing.  My results were intermittent backfiring, slow speed throttle responce was worse than before, it stalled a few times when stopped at traffic lights.  You have to engage the throttle slowly when taking off, if you move it quickly to rev the engine it just hesitates and wants to stall.  The engine warning light came on again, I had the P113, 1355 & 1356.  I cleared the codes and only have the 113 returning daily.  I have been in contact with Josh from Rev Perf and he seems to think it is an issue that is unrelated to the ECM.  Josh wants me to check the electrical contacts on the T-MAP sensor on the throttle body.  I removed the A/C and the screw holding the T-Map and now realise that to check the connection I will have to either raise or remove the gas tank.  I held the butterfly open and checked the sensor form the outside and it looked good and clean, but I don't know what it's supposed to look like.  Josh is sending me another ECM to try.  I'm past my comfort point when working on the throttle body.  I have talked to quite a few people and nobody has hinted about trouble with the T-MAP Sensor's.  Bike week is coming up in Laconia in a few weeks and once again it looks like I'll have a bike just limping along unless we can find a solution quick.  Anyone have any ideas on how to proceed?  I just have passed the point of indiscriminately purchasing new parts to fix problems.  I'm really mentally tired & very very frustrated and disappointed. I have gone way beyond what I should have financially, but I thought this was the end of my troubles.  (needed other costly repairs that I did on my own rather than rely on warranty and dealers) my apologies for rambling, as mentioned physically & emotionally drained

Running out of rope

Ray G.      

If you had the issue both before and after the installation of the EMS, it likely isn't related to the EMS or the ECM...  Josh is an exceptionally talented tuner and mechanic...if he suggested the map sensor, I'd swap it out.

Your codes are:

P0113 IAT Sensor Voltage Open/High EFI
P1355 Rear Ignition Coil High/Shorted EFI
P1356 Rear Cylinder No Combustion EFI

[sadunbar]

Found this on another site...

The Electronic Control Module (ECM) supplies and monitors a voltage signal (terminal 7) to one side of the Intake Air Temperature sensor (IAT). The other side of the IAT sensor is connected to a common sensor ground, which is also connected to the ECM (terminal 26).

The IAT sensor works by having a specific resistance at a specific temperature. As the resistance varies, so does the voltage on terminal 7.

At high temperatures, the sensor resistance is very low, which effectively lowers the signal voltage on terminal 7.

At low temperatures, the resistance is very high, alowing the voltage to rise close to 5 volts.

The ECM monitors this voltage to compensate for various operating conditions.

DTC P0112: IAT sensor voltage low
DTC P0113: IAT sensor open/high

You might check for:
- Poor connections on ECM and harness connector, damaged terminals, etc
- Intermittent faults "wiggle test" of wiring for poor connections
- Sensor may have become out of calibration.

The manual you are missing is the "Electrical Diagnostic Manual" for your particular model. Just like the Shop Manual, you can order one from the dealer. The electrical diagnostic manual has a table of sensor temperatures and voltages to check sensor performance.

The manual is well worth the $$ if you have one of these Delphi bikes - pretty straight forward once you have the proper documentation. 
     

[Twolanerider]

I'm generally not a fan of shotgunning a problem.  But if you've fought it for awhile you may be to that point.  Especially if the diagnositics necessary to really break things down and the repetitive efforts to get it done are beyond the comfort level.  With the codes and descriptions you've offered would have to consider IAT sensor, MAP sensor, coil and plug wires as a good first load of the barrel.  Fortunately none of those are just FRIGHTENINGLY expensive.  Good used coils can be found on eBay cheaply with good regularity. 

[sadunbar]

I'm generally not a fan of shotgunning a problem.  But if you've fought it for awhile you may be to that point.  Especially if the diagnositics necessary to really break things down and the repetitive efforts to get it done are beyond the comfort level.  With the codes and descriptions you've offered would have to consider IAT sensor, MAP sensor, coil and plug wires as a good first load of the barrel.  Fortunately none of those are just FRIGHTENINGLY expensive.  Good used coils can be found on eBay cheaply with good regularity. 

And I would check the pin connections mentioned in the post from the other site for any issues...

[Twolanerider]

And I would check the pin connections mentioned in the post from the other site for any issues...

Those fall in the "free and easy to check category."  Visual inspection of nearly all the pins are easy once he gets used to what he's looking at.  Go as slow as you need to to be effectively thorough.

[hogasm]

The most problematic terminals on the ECM and related harness are

Terminal 7-monitors voltage to engine sensors

Terminal 14- Powers all sensors

Terminals 8  23- O2 feed back

Terminal 26- sensor ground..controls all grounds to all sensors

Make sure all terminals in the connector are fully set into the plug, and make sure that the terminals on the ECM are also.

Not having a good contact will cause the problems you are describing.....It was happening before the install and will continue till found and corrected.

[RayG]

Thanks for taking the time to forward all the helpfull information.  I really didn't expect such a quick and thorough responce, once again it speaks volumes about the type of people on this forum.


A very gratefull rider

Thanks

Ray G.

[porthole]

I can vouch for Hogasm's input with pins.
I had an issue and found a "pin" problem in the ECM.