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[Indenial]

Thanks for all the great replies.  So here's what I have for now. Went to the dealer after work last night and my bike was in 3000 pieces.  They had it all tore apart, I mean really tore apart. Therefore, can't get a second opinion. They've done my work for 10 yrs and I've been happy with them, except for their attitude on synthetic oil.  The lifter bearing went out and a chip came off the lifter housing that hold the bearing in place. This caused wear on the cam, which got into the oil pump, which got to the pistons and rings, which got to the crankshaft.  They said they have never seen this much metal in the oil pan. They showed me all the pieces and they were tore up and worn pretty good. I'll post pics when I get them back.

Parts so far are $4800, plus labor.  No extended warranty either.

Amsoil and synthetic in general is fine while the bike is running. They say the problem is when the bike sits for long period of time, the "cling factor" is so low that there is no oil film on the parts above the oil line.  If some rust or pitting gets started it will cause faster wear when the bike is started again, before oil can saturate the area.  My bike had been sitting in a heated shop for 5 months during the winter. I rode it 200 miles on the first ride of the season and started to hear a noise, which supports this theory. Then I rode another 200 miles the following week to a meeting and on the way home the oil pressure went to 15 and at the stop sign went to 0, but the oil light never came on. When the rpms were increased the oil went back to 15 the rest of the way home.

 But I didn't have any problems the previous two seasons when I did the same thing.

I have contacted HD corporate and they are going to contact the dealer to find out the cause of problem. I told them he said it was the synthetic oil and they didn't say much, just gave me a case #.  I also contacted Amsoil and they want an oil sample and to see the damaged parts.  The oil only has 400 miles on it, so other than a lot of metal shavings, they won't find much.

There will be a lot of finger pointing and everyone will be wrong and I won't get a single cent. But I'll keep you all informed.

[Indenial]

Aren't the rollers galling and the "hardened chrominiminimm" is flaking off these lifters? I thunked I saw it somewhere, gall, spindle out the bearings and kaboom the motor?

Miker had it right. I think his is the shortened version of what happened.  Have others heard of this being the case?

[GregKhougaz]

The whole incident is a shame.  Perhaps you'll get to have that "built" motor we all dream about and have a happy ending.  Good luck!   

GK

[grc]

Miker had it right. I think his is the shortened version of what happened.  Have others heard of this being the case?

There have been many reported instances of lifter roller failures over the past few years.  The situation tends to be as you described yours, with the cams damaged and metal strewn throughout the engine.  I seem to remember reading a report not too long ago about a similar situation where the MoCo wound up supplying a replacement engine and the customer just paying for the dealership labor.  So if the stars are aligned just right, and the MoCo person handling your case is in a good mood, you just might wind up a lot better off than you thought earlier.

And btw, unless your ace mechanic has scientific evidence to back up his claims, he really should shut his mouth and stop showing his ignorance.  Amsoil has always tested among the very best oils on the market, and consistently tests better than the stuff Harley sells.  It also meets and exceeds all API and SAE specifications. 


Jerry

[Midnight Rider]

Go smear some synthetic Amsoil on a pole in your basement, then take some Dino oil and do the same thing on the other side of the pole.  Let us, and the dealer, know if either of them doesn't "cling" sufficiently to the metal, or if there is any difference between the two.

I cannot believe these people who keep saying this same old chit year after year about synthetic oil.

Not only does it come in your CVO, but also in Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborgini...I guess those folks who make motors that produce 500HP don't know WTF they are doing...

[LovemyCVOgirl]

Go smear some synthetic Amsoil on a pole in your basement, then take some Dino oil and do the same thing on the other side of the pole.  Let us, and the dealer, know if either of them doesn't "cling" sufficiently to the metal, or if there is any difference between the two.

I cannot believe these people who keep saying this same old chit year after year about synthetic oil.

Not only does it come in your CVO, but also in Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborgini...I guess those folks who make motors that produce 500HP don't know WTF they are doing...

WOW  That was well said. 

[Boatman]

Hillsidecycles said in another post that if he had a 110, he would change the lifters every 10,000 miles.
Lifters seem to fail the most in the 110's.  There may be too much spring pressure on the rollers and the cams.   
The old Big cam Cummins had a lot of cam failures in the 80's..

It is definitely not the type of oil.

I think if Indenial has a good dealer, the MOCO will make it right.

FWIW..

[HOGMIKE]

Go smear some synthetic Amsoil on a pole in your basement, then take some Dino oil and do the same thing on the other side of the pole.  Let us, and the dealer, know if either of them doesn't "cling" sufficiently to the metal, or if there is any difference between the two.

I cannot believe these people who keep saying this same old chit year after year about synthetic oil.

Not only does it come in your CVO, but also in Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborgini...I guess those folks who make motors that produce 500HP don't know WTF they are doing...

You forget these are "factory trained technicians" working at an "authorized H-D dealership"!!
They are MUCH smarter than the rest of us! They have degrees in engineering, design/build, chemical analysis, and a touch of VooDoo in their history.
Just sayin'
 

[spydglide]

  Amsoil has always tested among the very best oils on the market, and consistently tests better than the stuff Harley sells.  It also meets and exceeds all API and SAE specifications. 


Jerry

No doubt that it meets or exceeds all API and SAE specs, but have you ever seen any comparison tests that were not done or sponsored by Amsoil that showed it to tests better than the other oils?  spyder

[hogasm]

Not here to knock Amsoil because I know a lot use it with great success but I too had a bad Amsoil experience on a previous bike I had ('08 EGC w/96 ci).  I was on a trip when my bike started tapping real bad and would not stop.  I was running Amsoil at the time with an Amsoil oil filter.  Was able to take it to the nearest dealer near Hot Springs, Arkansas and they told me the oil had basically broken down.  Changed the oil and luckily all was ok and the engine fine.  I contacted Amsoil when I returned from the trip and explained what happened.  They seemed to think the problem was in the oil filter and not the oil itself.  Maybe it was but I was never able to use Amsoil again and started using Mobil 1 with zero problems to date.

Amsoil is not snake oil...but you must believe that Mobile 1 is. If you have a bad part, no and I mean NO snake oil is going to keep it from going bad.

[Cat Eye]

I have 32K on my Limited .....started to use oil at 25K....then starting knocking when got hot.  Found out there was 1/8 in of carbon buildup on the pistons from worn rings..........OIL was HD Syn 3......now I run Red Line in all three wholes.

Dealer said it wasn't caused by the oil.....rather stated "it a Harley and chit happens when you ride them"....I smiled at him and said fix it and put in Red Line....BUT took this opportunity to upgrade to a 113

[Twolanerider]

I have 32K on my Limited .....started to use oil at 25K....then starting knocking when got hot.  Found out there was 1/8 in of carbon buildup on the pistons from worn rings..........OIL was HD Syn 3......now I run Red Line in all three wholes.

Dealer said it wasn't caused by the oil.....rather stated "it a Harley and chit happens when you ride them"....I smiled at him and said fix it and put in Red Line....BUT took this opportunity to upgrade to a 113

I'm not yet to the level of diligence Scott exercises with annual top end and cam chest tear down and inspection.   But the questionable overall reliability of the modern bikes easily illustrates the man isn't wrong.   Very sad when there's not. even good natured ridicule earned for such an abundance of caution.   

[dlaws01]

Go smear some synthetic Amsoil on a pole in your basement, then take some Dino oil and do the same thing on the other side of the pole. 


What are you going to do with that oily pole in your basement? Also, how are you going to lure you dealer down into the basement?   

[Midnight Rider]

With the right 25 year old woman, I could kill a bunch of birds with one stone.   

[dlaws01]

I guess that double ended oily pole is one method of obtaining an opinion on which oil is slicker!