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[guppytrash]

I am not sure if this article has been talked about already.
I just grabbed the free rag Thunder press at my local HD dealer.  Towards the end of the newspaper is "Motorhead Memo by Kip Woodring".
He is "all in" with his bet on a limited production water cooled HD for 2013.  
Don't know if he know's anymore than the rest of us, but I for one am ready for "cooler heads to prevail".  
The idea of buying a water cooled HD to me is the missing link.  Like stated in the article "there's no reason we couldnt look forward to emissions-compliant 110" egines that make closer to 110hp instead of the 85 or so we get now, and run cooler at the same time."
That being said how many model years will it take for HD to get the bugs worked out?

[JCZ]

2013.5 SESG with water cooled heads.  Heard it from the trash man.

[GregKhougaz]

My "plumber" says 2014!      

[Buy early]

Oprah says "never!" She loves the sound of an air cooled v twin.

[ultrafxr]

I tested the beta version of the 110 in '07.  Think I'll pass on the first (or maybe even second) year of this 'improvement.'   

[guppytrash]

I tested the beta version of the 110 in '07.  Think I'll pass on the first (or maybe even second) year of this 'improvement.'   

I hear ya!  I have said my next bike will be water-cooled.  It is up to HD to make sure it is a Harley that I buy and not brand X.
So IF they do finally make my next bike I will be very hesitant to be the test monkey.  Hesitant....but I will have an 09USE4 for sale.
Build it and I will buy it.

Can you say extended warranty?

[Twolanerider]

Can understand what's finally become an at least grudging expectation of water cooling for many from HD.  For some even  greater expectation than "grudging."  The engines the last few years have been demonstrably hotter and, for many many riders, darn near too much to sit on top of.

However....

While I can appreciate the change from the engine's perspective, the motors can certainly appreciate a much narrower operating temperature range, it's no sure bet the rider comfort will be at all improved.  I'd actually expect it to be worse.

Think about the fairings or other cladding that is either is or could be on a bagger.  All that head radiated away from or otherwise pulled off the engine has to go somewhere.  And we're sitting behind and above the places where that rising expanding hot air will be pushed.

Can't see any way Mother Harley adds panels or anything else to separate us from those paths.  Even highway riding will be affected by little radiators somehow built in the lowers (assuming some variation of that is what they do).  Anything slower than highway riding could be miserable. 

Goldwings separate the rider from all the mechanicals with a few miles of plastic panels.  Being hidden from the engine on a Harley is never going to fly.  Interested to see how this is addressed when it finally happens.  Interested rather than optimistic.  But interested nonetheless.

[Midnight Rider]

Don...to my thinking, the only way to make it tolerable if they indeed put the radiators in the lowers, is to have some kind of vented exit that could be adjusted to either blow on the rider's feet/chins in cold weather (a good thing) and to angle it (the hot air from the fans, assuming there are fans) at least 45 degrees away and to the sides.  That should be feasible...

The final design should prove to be interesting...

I can assure you that I would not be the one to jump on that wagon the first year of production, or even the second, if HD does what they normally do with new product.  I could see Screamin' Eagle Coolant somehow making it's way into the oil pan...

[RedDevil]

Can understand what's finally become an at least grudging expectation of water cooling for many from HD.  For some even  greater expectation than "grudging."  The engines the last few years have been demonstrably hotter and, for many many riders, darn near too much to sit on top of.

However....

While I can appreciate the change from the engine's perspective, the motors can certainly appreciate a much narrower operating temperature range, it's no sure bet the rider comfort will be at all improved.  I'd actually expect it to be worse.

Think about the fairings or other cladding that is either is or could be on a bagger.  All that head radiated away from or otherwise pulled off the engine has to go somewhere.  And we're sitting behind and above the places where that rising expanding hot air will be pushed.

Can't see any way Mother Harley adds panels or anything else to separate us from those paths.  Even highway riding will be affected by little radiators somehow built in the lowers (assuming some variation of that is what they do).  Anything slower than highway riding could be miserable. 

Goldwings separate the rider from all the mechanicals with a few miles of plastic panels.  Being hidden from the engine on a Harley is never going to fly.  Interested to see how this is addressed when it finally happens.  Interested rather than optimistic.  But interested nonetheless.

Personally, I've had water-cooled bikes, an '86 pre-totally cladded Wing and an '85 BMW K100LT.  Both of them got extremely hot in stop and go traffic and the BMW would get so hot in the saddle, I felt the "boys" getting cooked.  (Not a good feeling, I might add).  I agree Don, the only way to keep the heat away is to do what BMW and Honda do now, and that's totally clad the engine in plastic.  (Both my Wing and Beemer had exposed engines and were cookers.) I would not like to see, nor would I buy a Harley with a totally encased engine.  Seeing that big v-twin sitting in the frame is one of the things I love to see and makes it a Harley.  I don't know, I'm not that excited about seeing a water-cooled big twin come out of the MoCo.  I know that it's inevitable, but not for me, nonetheless.

[Twolanerider]

Personally, I've had water-cooled bikes, an '86 pre-totally cladded Wing and an '85 BMW K100LT.  Both of them got extremely hot in stop and go traffic and the BMW would get so hot in the saddle, I felt the "boys" getting cooked.  (Not a good feeling, I might add).  I agree Don, the only way to keep the heat away is to do what BMW and Honda do now, and that's totally clad the engine in plastic.  (Both my Wing and Beemer had exposed engines and were cookers.) I would not like to see, nor would I buy a Harley with a totally encased engine.  Seeing that big v-twin sitting in the frame is one of the things I love to see and makes it a Harley.  I don't know, I'm not that excited about seeing a water-cooled big twin come out of the MoCo.  I know that it's inevitable, but not for me, nonetheless.

It seems inevitable though Charlie.  Can't see Harley hiding the motor/mechanicals.  But can't see a good way to make that riding envirionment even mostly tolerable. 

Come that time the decision to keep riding the old bikes will be even more set in stone.  Or, if a new bike becomes necessary, then it really is just a preferable mode of transportation and time to get a Wing or BMW instead.  More bells and whistles, modernity, with better money and a better ride.  If it's just two wheeled transportation that doesn't in any other way speak to you than nothing else will matter.  Mother Harley hasn't earned my money for a new bike for a long time.  She'll have to do something pretty remarkable with some future model to reel me back.

[Montanakid]

What issue of TP was the sarticle in? I have both June and May and they are about Trannies and Clutches. Just a thot.

[guppytrash]

What issue of TP was the sarticle in? I have both June and May and they are about Trannies and Clutches. Just a thot.

Jul '12 page 90&91

[DCFIREMANN]

2013.5 SESG with water cooled heads.  Heard it from the trash man.

I guess I need to stand out on the Mountain Road Thursday in the AM and get the scoop!!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[mrbhd]

Twolane rider has said it very well.  Harley's recent history has put me in a place where it will be a long long time before I buy a new Harley water cooled or not,  if ever.  Their piss poor quality control , endless lame excuses ( it's normal"), poor dealership service and in many cases  total lack of respect for their consumer base says it all.  I have been riding Harleys for over 25 years and  while I have loved all my bikes ( for different reasons.  the Mother Company's attitude for the past several years is just plain unacceptable to me.   The "mystic" is just not enough anymore.       There are just far too many mechanically better bikes available today with far superior warranty, service and customer support.

[grc]

Twolane rider has said it very well.  Harley's recent history has put me in a place where it will be a long long time before I buy a new Harley water cooled or not,  if ever.  Their piss poor quality control , endless lame excuses ( it's normal"), poor dealership service and in many cases  total lack of respect for their consumer base says it all.  I have been riding Harleys for over 25 years and  while I have loved all my bikes ( for different reasons.  the Mother Company's attitude for the past several years is just plain unacceptable to me.   The "mystic" is just not enough anymore.       There are just far too many mechanically better bikes available today with far superior warranty, service and customer support.

 


Jerry