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[Hoist!]

I'm tending to agree with you on this Terry. Thanks. Hoist!

[Hoist!]

Just got back from my dealer today (NYCHD). They have a Blue '07 Serk on the floor and had a "07 CUSE in the back that they were working on. The head tech (who I've known for awhile) took me back and started the CUSE for me. HE installed the V&H True-Duals with the V&H ovals. I thought it sounded really nice. He used a K&N A/F and the SERT. He showed me the dyno run; 83 HP and 106ft-lb TQ. Pretty good numbers for a stock engine. He likes the V&H over the Rineharts and says they dyno better. I think we're talking peanuts in the difference in performance, if any. He started up the stock '07 SERK. Those pipes have to go! The numbers were consistent with what I've seen for stock 110"; 72 HP and 89 ft-lbs.

He also told me that if he installs these items before I take delivery, there will be no problem with my warranty. He said that if they do the install of the SERT with the CD, the factory isn't aware that it is installed. As long as you don't use the DT to download the remap. He said that if he (HD DEALER) did the work and the factory isn't aware of the SERT, that any dealer on the road would honor the factory warranty. The key is to keep the DT away from your bike. Each dealer is knowledgeable enough in writing-up their warrany claims in a way that's acceptable to the MoCo so they get reimbursed. You will also be able to make future mods and install a new map with the software you've already purchased. Believe it or not this dealer recommends and trys to sell the V&H Fuel-pak, not the SERT. The Tech I deal with said to use the SERT however. I trust this guy.

I think, based on this and the dealer's recommendation and cooperation, that I'm gonna put on the true-duals (not sure which ones yet), K&N and SERT before I take delivery and have it Dyno'd in after 1k mi. This will pretty much eliminate the possibility of those nasty heat issues from the start and assure the proper F/A ratios (factory F/A causes the heat issues). The engine will run right and be broken-in properly from the beginning.

Speaking of which, he also told me the heat is their biggest problem with the new bikes this year. Downloading per the recall/SB makes it worse because it shuts down even sooner. Remapping with even stock pipes helps but still has problems. He said the ONLY cure is true-duals with a remap, which you'll never get the factory to agree to. We're basically on our own with this. But if you're smart about how you do it, you're bike should run right from day one and you shouldn't have to fight over warranty.

How much of this do we believe now? Ah the $64k question. Like most things in life, it's gonna come down to relationship (relationship, relationship, relationship!). Go to a restaurant and yell at the waiter before you're served. What's gonna happen? I hope you enjoy eating his spit! He said most dealers will work with you on the road as long as you act reasonable with them. It's pretty subjective, but when faced with an improperly running brand new bike from the factory and knowing we're on our own with that issue, you must make the decision that hopefully will cause you the least amount of pain when you have warranty issues. So, Terry's assessment appears to be correct and the SERT is the lesser of all evils on the road to good performance. Good luck everyone.

Paint!!! This dealer has not had any paint related issues yet on any '06's or '07's. He told me that he's heard of issues elsewhere, but nothing epidemic. Almost exclusive to CUSE's/SEEG's. I have to say though, that of the 100 or so bikes on the floor (including 4 CVO's), they all looked fine. I thought all the paint jobs were acceptble to me, for whatever that's worth. Don't know what else to say on this except to [highlight]inspect your new bike very carefully and do not take delivery of it if it's defective, That is your best recourse.[/highlight] If you accept it, you own it, and must deal with the issues. If you knowingly take it defective, you can't complain too much about how the warranty is dealt with. If you unknowingly accept, it, you're still stuck dealing with it. This is unfortunate but this is how things are. [highlight]Buyer beware!!![/highlight] Wait for another one or buy a new 96" bike and make your own 110" hot-rod with the money you saved, [highlight]but don't accept a defective bike![/highlight]

If anyone's interested, there is a brand new '06 CUSE I believe on the floor (silver/red) for sale for I believe under $28k. I didn't talk to anyone and don't know what these are worth but I thought I'd pass that along. PM me if you want me to get more info on it for you.

I hope this helps some of the lost newbies out there dealing with this stuff for the first time (myself included) to make good decisions. If possible, keep your emotions out of the purchase process. Salesmen feed on emotional decisions. Keep it business and convey the attitude that you'll accept nothing less than perfect and that you're willing to walk away from it if you have to.

Later. Hoist!

[Rhino]

Thought I would just add my .02
After talking to a few different dealers, I see differences. 1 said no way to aftermarket parts other than Harley Period!  I will not do business at that one.  3 others said, waraanty issues? We will absolutely support any parts and pieces we install, including SERT, Rhineharts, cams, etc.  The issue seems to be that warranty will be an issue if;
A. You install wierd stuff yourself and your bike breaks as a direct result of that stuff
B. You go against what the dealer recommends for aftermarket or MOCO parts, and the dealer is pushed for that install.

So what I feel is that if the mods are actually field proven, and the dealer agrees, and then installs, there is nothing to worry about.  We have some pretty strong motors with the HD product, and frankly, most mods are not realyy going to be TRUE race caliber.  Pipes, mild cams, maybe aftrermarket ecm and or throttlew bodies are not turning this into a racing engine.  Now if the dealer encourages porting, cams and other internal work, and WILL support it, there is no reason to beleive that warranty is going to be a problem either. But me personally, will follow the road with a reliable and streetable mod program. If I wanted a racing machine, I would not be doing it to my 30K+ bike, but rather a standard classic and a Jims pushed to 145-175HP .

scuse the spell, my laptop keys are small.

Rhino (BULL)

[Mikey]

Guys,
I think all warranties are subjective. What caused the problem? After market parts or defective workmanship. It is up to the manufacture to decide. If cams are going flat on all 110's how are other parts going to effect that? Doesn't matter what exhaust etc. it had nothing to do with the problem. I think the Moco would take care of anything reasonable.
My 2 cents.

[grc]

Folks, as a guy who used to be a "factory rep" for an auto company, let me clarify something.

[Hoist!]

Folks, as a guy who used to be a "factory rep" for an auto company, let me clarify something.

[Woop De Doo]

This really ticks me off. All I want to do is get my 07 CUSE to the point where my wife and I can ride the bike without being totally bummed out/burned/ticked off because of the unacceptable level of heat that this bike generates. Are you telling me I have to wait two years so that I don't void the warranty. Unacceptable. We know that adding True Duals, K&N a/f, and the SERT with map 84 that we relieve the excessive heat problem significantly. My ET in the 1/4 mile is not important but reducing the heat is. What would a campaign with the after market suppliers accomplish? If all of us wrote emails to K&N, V&H, Bub, Zippers, on and on and told them that the use of their products would violate/terminate our warranty, what kind of a response would we get?  I am going to attempt to get something from the MoCo as well as the after market suppliers.

   Don S

[Hoist!]

This really ticks me off. All I want to do is get my 07 CUSE to the point where my wife and I can ride the bike without being totally bummed out/burned/ticked off because of the unacceptable level of heat that this bike generates. Are you telling me I have to wait two years so that I don't void the warranty. Unacceptable. We know that adding True Duals, K&N a/f, and the SERT with map 84 that we relieve the excessive heat problem significantly. My ET in the 1/4 mile is not important but reducing the heat is. What would a campaign with the after market suppliers accomplish? If all of us wrote emails to K&N, V&H, Bub, Zippers, on and on and told them that the use of their products would violate/terminate our warranty, what kind of a response would we get?

[SPIDERMAN]

I'm doing some mods to my new 07 Road Glide. My dealer said that the parts I put in only carry the 90 day warranty but the remaining parts are covered for the full 7 years so long as they do not fail as a result of the added performance parts. I have been doing business with this dealership for about 9 years and they've pissed me off a couple of times ( crappy work on a service - - once) wouldn't sell me a bike ( 02 SERK) in advance of delivery and the clothing side of the dealership is hit or miss ( I think it's like 27 day PMS) BUT, they have never failed to cover a warranty item they said they would. Elvis has a SERT, Stage 1 breather and Reinharts and they fully covered the cam chain tensioners AND cams when they crapped out. Sooooo, here's my advice. You are not bound to the dealership you bought the bike from on warranty service. Check around, find out which dealer in your area functions as I have described mine. Take the bike to them for the mods you want to make and do not ever have your bike serviced at another dealer unless it's just oil, tires etc.

Just my $0.02

Big B

[Hoist!]

I'm doing some mods to my new 07 Road Glide. My dealer said that the parts I put in only carry the 90 day warranty but the remaining parts are covered for the full 7 years so long as they do not fail as a result of the added performance parts. I have been doing business with this dealership for about 9 years and they've pissed me off a couple of times ( crappy work on a service - - once) wouldn't sell me a bike ( 02 SERK) in advance of delivery and the clothing side of the dealership is hit or miss ( I think it's like 27 day PMS) BUT, they have never failed to cover a warranty item they said they would. [highlight]Elvis has a SERT, Stage 1 breather and Reinharts [/highlight]and they fully covered the cam chain tensioners AND cams when they crapped out. Sooooo, here's my advice. You are not bound to the dealership you bought the bike from on warranty service. Check around, find out which dealer in your area functions as I have described mine. Take the bike to them for the mods you want to make and do not ever have your bike serviced at another dealer unless it's just oil, tires etc.

Just my $0.02


Big B

B, did they install these or did you do it? I know my guys a long time too, but they still want to install those 3 things to keep the warranty good. But then they're gonna warranty everything for the 2 years. The dealer knows how to get paid back. Funny, they also messed up my bike in '94 and then backed-out on a trade-in deal when I was buying my '03 Anniv. RK from them. That was after buying 3 new bikes from them previously, so I got the RK somewhere else. But that sales manager's gone now. Thanks. Hoist!

[SPIDERMAN]

I bought Elvis used from this dealer. I bought a 5 year used bike ESP when we made the deal. The Stage I Breather and Reinharts were on it. I had them add the SERT and dyno tune it. As to the mods I'm doing this week on Los Dragon. The dealer is doing the install. As Beags mentioned somewhere on the site, there is a tech there who is really great. His name is Jimmy. He is usually busy working on projects for the owner, but I asked for him and waited a month to get him. I'm a fair wrench with about 80% of a Harley, but do not work on motors. Why ? Simply because IMHO a guy who does it every day is going to be better than me by a ton IF, as in the case of Jimmy, he's a good guy and still motivated and loves his work. I'm learning trannies by doing this 5 into 4 deal for my buddy from Hollywood I've posted about elsewhere. But motors, I don't see myself doing them at this point and dyno tuning ? In my dreams

[Hoist!]

Thanks B. I've got got a buddy Vern here that's done all of our motor work over the years as well. He's got his motor mod combos down, and built my Pro Street Evo Stroker frm scratch. But I'm gonna pay the the dealer now (and keep my fingers crossed that the chit works, without them screwing somethin up) and make sure I don't have any major issues for the first 2 years, under Warranty. I know my HD's pretty good , but when it comes to working on the engine internals, Vern told me to throw my tools away years ago. Good luck with the dealer's work on the Glide. Hoist!

[speedfreek]

Hoist,

I'm a service tech at a VA dealership.  To answer a couple questions, the SERT technically voids your powertrain warranty, says so when you first load the program.  The reason why is the amount of control one has over the ECM, and in the wrong hands, the motor could be mistuned causing problems.  Because the program comes with the SERT, even if it is tuned correctly, someone else can go behind a trained tuner and still screw it up.  However, simple fact is even though I know how to mark my tunes so I can tell if they were manipulated, they never have been and I have had ZERO powertrain issues related to the SERT or my tuning.

Other question reguarding output of the 110".  One of our parts guys bought an 07 FLHRSE3.  Using stock, open back AC, SERT, and Rinehart Duals, I got 99HP/118TQ. This is corrected at STD because our other area dynos still use this, so if you want SAE, knock 1-2 HP/TQ off each number.

[Hoist!]

Hoist,

[highlight]I'm a service tech at a VA dealership.

[rodsglide]

Harley is putting a 110 factory kit on my 07  96 in road glide now,My glide has 2000 miles ,se slip ons , stage one se open air cleaner kit. I dynoed the pipe change and air cleaner change and the bike was fine on the fuel setting.I will put a pcIII after the factory install is on the 110 is done.   Does a kn filter make a hp dif over harley se blue filter that came with the open back plate ?