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Author Topic: Noisy engine (valves?)  (Read 5139 times)

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dkl032

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Noisy engine (valves?)
« on: May 30, 2014, 12:28:46 PM »

Anyone have the same issue with valve noise on my 110.  between 1800 and 2500 rpm it sounds like i'm losing my motor.  Valves, tappets, rocker arms, whatever, are going nuts.  i have 3500 mile on my bike.  the noise seems to be getting worse.  also worse than my 06 ultra with 70k.  bike runs good otherwise, but maybe it could run better?

Dealer says is normal.  I say BS!
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r0de_runr

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2014, 02:07:58 PM »

Change oil and filter to 20 50 conventional and observe.  If it goes away or abates, its normal.
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Dan_Lockwood

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2014, 05:15:00 PM »

Anyone have the same issue with valve noise on my 110.  between 1800 and 2500 rpm it sounds like i'm losing my motor.  Valves, tappets, rocker arms, whatever, are going nuts.  i have 3500 mile on my bike.  the noise seems to be getting worse.  also worse than my 06 ultra with 70k.  bike runs good otherwise, but maybe it could run better?

Dealer says is normal.  I say BS!

I had a new '08 SERK with the 110" and it was my first new Harley.  Around 2200 all the way up to around 3200 it made sounds like a very noisy sewing machine.  Over that speed it went away and below it went away.

I traded that in on a '09 SERG and it does the same thing, except the rpm range is just a bit different than the '08 was.

When I was in Rapid City for the '09 Sturgis new Harley showing, I asked the Harley tech guy and he said that he knew about the noise and that it was a harmonic vibration set up in the valve train at certain rpms.  I've had no issues with either bike and it is what the dealer calls normal.

There are "some" noises though that are not normal, like impending doom on the lifters going south, but the rattle in the head area between those rpms is in most stock CVO's.

I've read here that a cam change and some new lifters will most generally resolve most of the noise.  I believe the cam lobes have such an abrupt curve that they tend to rattle the valve train a bit too.

If you have the CVO rattle, you're not going to get anything from the dealer or HD.  But if you're still stock, exhaust and tuner can make it run better and cooler.  You may even forget about the rattles.

I did an Indian test ride on all three models a few Friday's ago and their 111" motor had a very similar rattle, not quite as pronounced as my bike though.  I mentioned it and they said it's normal on that large of a motor.  Go figure...
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tysndys

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2014, 02:17:14 PM »

I once told my dad that I had a rattle in a truck I had, he was mechanic I figured he could help. His response "turn the radio up". Some times it takes all 8 speakers to cover the noise makers we sit on. Normal? Who knows? If it runs ride it.
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Unbalanced

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2014, 02:40:01 PM »

My question to you is have you done a leakdown test or could the noise be piston slap vs. heads/valve train?   Many cylinders have been found to be out of round from the factory.  The head on these 110's semi noisey just like its cousin the mva head.   Some feel its the springs, some feel its the fast closing intake on the stock cam and some piston noise.   In the 120r the cam is not quick closing and has lots of overlap but still has a lot of the noise even after the head has been massaged in spring pressure, seat pressure, open pressures and had geometry looked at as well as fitment.   Yep some noise is expected some is just something you have to get used to and some require a bit more investigation.

Hope you figure it out, but I would want to know, what the leak down is myself to remove it from the list.   On two of the 5  110 engines I have had we have gone in and bored the cylinders 5 or 10 over and had a lot of the noise go away, luckily in my case it was piston slap and a set of lifters.   I put in the S&S Lifters, adjustable tapered pushrods, with the new pistons and boring and a great deal of the noise went away and the bike ran good.  Note we also saw quite a bit of rubbing on the pushrods at the top which is why the change from "perfect fit" factory pushrods to adjustables 2 flats deeper than the directions.   This is a typical setting by the way for the pushrods many do this automatically.

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2014, 07:19:11 AM »

Incorrect lifter load.
Scott
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Unbalanced

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2014, 08:28:58 AM »

Let's see 2 1/2 turns = 15 flats.  2 or 3 additional put it right there.  Guess 30 years ain't helped.
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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2014, 09:10:42 AM »

Let's see 2 1/2 turns = 15 flats.  2 or 3 additional put it right there.  Guess 30 years ain't helped.

What does that supposed to mean, Harold?
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Unbalanced

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2014, 09:31:12 AM »

The real question is why is additional flats used by many or needed.   Short answer is it seems in some cases to quiet the valve train in some folks opinion.  The real Question is why


Correcting Geometry?
Helping offset tolerances like the rocket arm or base circles

Might even be that the base circles are off or less preload might be needed to quiet the valve train.









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2014, 09:44:29 AM »

.........not that part........the 30 something part?
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2014, 03:22:23 PM »

Geometry
Nope, a little deeper in the lifter bore doesn't fix that nor is that the issue with these motors with oem equipment.
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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2014, 04:56:25 PM »

We've found that in fact by loading the lifter to .140-.150" does in fact help to maintain quiet engine operation at full operating temps.
That, combined with the correct viscosity engine oil requirements for the ambient air temps stated in the factory service manuals, and things can be kept in check quite well, FWIW.
Carry on. :2vrolijk_21:
Scott
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Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2014, 07:53:38 PM »


What does that supposed to mean, Harold?

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Eqcons

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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #13 on: June 04, 2014, 08:24:14 AM »

Anyone have the same issue with valve noise on my 110.  between 1800 and 2500 rpm it sounds like i'm losing my motor.  Valves, tappets, rocker arms, whatever, are going nuts.  i have 3500 mile on my bike.  the noise seems to be getting worse.  also worse than my 06 ultra with 70k.  bike runs good otherwise, but maybe it could run better?

Dealer says is normal.  I say BS!

I've had three 110 motors now, and they all do that.  It's a horrible engine.
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Re: Noisy engine (valves?)
« Reply #14 on: June 04, 2014, 08:32:03 AM »

Anyone have the same issue with valve noise on my 110.  between 1800 and 2500 rpm it sounds like i'm losing my motor.  Valves, tappets, rocker arms, whatever, are going nuts.  i have 3500 mile on my bike.  the noise seems to be getting worse.  also worse than my 06 ultra with 70k.  bike runs good otherwise, but maybe it could run better?

Dealer says is normal.  I say BS!


The word "normal" must be what they are instructed to say.
A 1964 FL does not have those noises, why should a bike that is 50 years newer?
Answer is..........it shouldn't. :)
Scott
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