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[HD Street Performance]

I use Dan Thayers cam plates and pump on high end builds. They return the oil to the cam chest and have separate scavenging pump section for that oil to return to tank. Sooner than later we will see bypass oil going directly back to tank, it is possible. The lower the volume of bypass the less heat is generated. Taking the oil right back to tank is a typical method used in hydraulic circuits and allows the oil to deaerate and actually not contain as much entrained air to begin with. Less air, less heat, more accurate valve actuation.

[HDGearHead]

I've been thinking about buying either the Feuling or Dan Thayer plate and pump. 

My bottom end is solid (Timken; Darkhorse trued, plugged and balanced my flywheel with H-Beam rods).  My pinion runout is .002 so I would have no problems running either.

However the though of spending more money after having already having spent good money on the SE Billet plate makes me want to take myself out to the wood shed for a beating.... 

In hindsight, I should have purchased a S&S 124 instead of rebuilding my 110.  It would have been less expensive in the end.  Some lessons are harder to learn than others.

[hrdtail78]

Nothing wrong with that SE cam plate.   The more important pressure to look at is seating pressure.   Rest of it is the pump.   Lap the plunger, oil and retest.

[HDGearHead]

That's the plan because I'm not in any hurry to throw more money at it.  How much pressure should I be looking for before the plunger starts to unseat? 

[hrdtail78]

The plunger needs to reseat around 30-35 coming down. This will show 30-35 cold warm idle and hot idle will be 20-25.

[HDGearHead]

The plunger needs to reseat around 30-35 coming down. This will show 30-35 cold warm idle and hot idle will be 20-25.

I assume it should not leak going up either until 30-35.

I ordered some Granet Lapping compound (600, 800 and 1000 Grit).  I went with Garnet because it doesn't readily embed itself in lapped parts.

I'm not sure what to use for a lap (i.e. what to put down the hole to due the lapping with).  I was taught that the lap should be softer than the part to prevent the abrasive from embedding in the part.

Do most people lap the seat using the relief plunger itself?

[hrdtail78]

I worry about full pop off pressure.  I slowly apply pressure by the regulated and record pressure when plunger is in full bypass.  It does make a popping sound.   I then slowly close regulator.  I record pressure of when the plunger closes.   The pop off should be around 45-55 and reseat should be around 30-35.   The reseat is what controls your minimum pressure. 

Plunger seat leak.   IIRC the SE plate does come with a ground plunger.  Look at it for any burrs or what ever.  You can try and stake it.  Install plunger only, apply 20-30 psi, reach brass punch down hole and wack with hammer.

Yes, I use the plunger for the lapping process.  Lapping is going to condition the plate and not the plunger.  I stick a brass bore brush into the plunger.  A 45 fits tight and works like an expandable pilot.  Plus it attaches to a cleaning rod which makes it easy to twist back and forth.

HTH

[HDGearHead]

I worry about full pop off pressure.  I slowly apply pressure by the regulated and record pressure when plunger is in full bypass.  It does make a popping sound.   I then slowly close regulator.  I record pressure of when the plunger closes.   The pop off should be around 45-55 and reseat should be around 30-35.   The reseat is what controls your minimum pressure. 

Plunger seat leak.   IIRC the SE plate does come with a ground plunger.  Look at it for any burrs or what ever.  You can try and stake it.  Install plunger only, apply 20-30 psi, reach brass punch down hole and wack with hammer.

Yes, I use the plunger for the lapping process.  Lapping is going to condition the plate and not the plunger.  I stick a brass bore brush into the plunger.  A 45 fits tight and works like an expandable pilot.  Plus it attaches to a cleaning rod which makes it easy to twist back and forth.

HTH

Thanks great tips and advice.  I'll have to buy a set of brass punches this week.  Already have the bore brush.  It never crossed my mind about using it for this.   

[HDGearHead]

I think my pressure relief valve issues have been fixed.

I lapped the SE Billet pressure relief seat and then polished it to a shine.  There were imperfections that became apparent as the anodization on the seat was being removed.

Separately, I lapped the seat face of the Axtell cartridge and then polished its face to a shine.

I then took the longer Axtell cartridge cap for the non-SE plate and milled the thicker section that rides against the roll pin so that the cap/cartridge stack was a thousands greater that the space between the plate seat and roll pin.    When the roll pin is pressed in with this slight interference, it presses and holds the stack tightly against the plate seat.

When I test it now with the Feuling 9010 tester, there is no detectable air leakage until the pressure reaches 47-48 psi.  At this point a faint hiss can just start to be heard.  As pressure continues to increase, the valve pops open at 55-58 PSI. 

Decreasing the pressure, as I reach approx. 45-42 PSI the valve reseats and no air can be heard leaking from anywhere on the plate.

I also no longer have any air leaking past the Axtell cartridge into the feed port.

I spent way more time on this than I cared to but am now fairly confident that my Pressure Relief and Axtell kit is working well (ran the pressure up and down a dozen times with the same results each time).

Regarding the replacement Axtell kit that I received, it did perform better out of the box than my original one.  Its fit was tighter and the face of its cartridge seat was slightly smoother.  However, I was able to lap and polish my original cartridge seat face and make it work as well as the replacement I received from Axtell in my plate (after lapping my plate).


On a side note, the Feuling Cam Plate Pressure Relief Valve Reamer 9008 tool markings are:

APT HS A115803
7/16"  .4375 757-1 USA

I believe this is a Alvord-Polk Tool, 7/16" Titanium Nitride (TiN) Coated, Right Hand Spiral, HSS, 757-1, Chucking Reamer EDP Number 75166 that can be purchased for considerable less than from Feuling http://www.alvordpolk.com/catalog/dept.asp?id=38

Its irritating to me when someone resells tools with a 100%+ markup than what you can buy them for directly from their original manufacturer/distributer.