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[Iglide]

Wow, I'm confused..... Much to absorb.... I will chew on it....

Great time at Ed's; and, Tex and I ordered up some of the best GUMBO I've had at a local restaurant after the tune.

I stayed at the Radisson, and had the ride trailered and parked within 50 foot of the front door. Well some Jack-off busted out the driver side window in the night, probably looking for Silver's key fob.... Luckily I had it up in the room.

Just got home. Took some extra time with the open window and glass issue, but will survive. Bad part is, I didn't get a chance to ride this afternoon. Got in later than I planned and it rained the last hour home.

I am confused bout the torque issue. All my past tunes have been Dyno-Jet. Ed's is a Dyno-Star. Those I have dealt with in the past have always insisted that dynos measure torque and that HP is a calculated figure. So how does a Dyno-star read higher torque values than a Dyno-Jet. Or... does it?? If so which is the most accurate value.

The primary changes to the bike were:
1) Removed the cat
2) Installed the Fullsac 2" baffles
3) installed Heavy Breather
4) Installed SE Spark Plugs
5) Good Dyno-Star tune using Super SERT



Here's the chart before and after the tune:

[Iglide]

After tune:

95.1 HP @4740rpm
128 ft-lbs @2750rpm

I am sure a Dyno-Jet would not rate the Tq this high. Is there some correction factor to apply ??

Ed, any comments?

[Jim Kerr]

Looks like your tuner did a good job.  I wouldn't get too caught up in the numbers.  The key is using the same equipment and getting better results than when you started.  Driving it will tell the tell. 

I've ridden mine quite a bit this weekend.  The engine is getting better.  I can tell a difference in performance as the parts break in.  I bet It is doing better than my last dyno run.  I raced 15 or so crotch rockets today down Lakeshore drive and they couldn't catch me.  I'm couldn't be more pleased with the performance of this bike.   

[Iglide]

Yes agree, the diff (before and after) is more than just noticeable. Very happy with the results.

I would like to have an understanding bout the dynos though, maybe it's just a personal thing. But, I would like to know what is what, so I can compare apples to apples with friends doing the same mod.s

[Hoist!]

Classic 255, drop like lead sfter 3500, cam profile. Now throw some 251's in and see how nice she'll run!

Hoist!

[Iglide]

I was very impressed with Ed's work.

The idle was way lean... fixed it.

He took all that slack out of the throttle. It's no longer sloppy. I didn't know the throttle responce could be programed. Now it acts more like a throttle "cable", with out the grip effort to twist it. Really cool.

I jumped on it pretty hard after the tune, and it's got more guts no doubt... How much? Well, I'll find out.

He worked with the ride for about 3 hours. When I arrived, he already had started a map, based on his past experience. He puts a bunch of time in this, more than I realized. The Race Tuner obviously requires more tune time on the Dyno, than a Power Commander.

[Iglide]

Classic 255, drop like lead sfter 3500, cam profile. Now throw some 251's in and see how nice she'll run!

Hoist!

And what else will I need to go with em..... ?? The stock market's tellin me "nothin" no extra's just the cams. 

[Hoist!]

And what else will I need to go with em..... ?? The stock market's tellin me "nothin" no extra's just the cams. 

You have the 50mm TB. All you'll need is cams, pushrods and gaskets. If ya want, do some head porting. But they'll work OK boltin on a 110!

Hoist!

[Texas 103]

Hmmm, prolly more than ya asked for, huh?

Hoist!

No not at all....Good stuff...Time for some homework

[FLSTFI Dave]

The idle was way lean... fixed it.

He took all that slack out of the throttle. It's no longer sloppy. I didn't know the throttle responce could be programed. Now it acts more like a throttle "cable", with out the grip effort to twist it. Really cool.

I am not surprized at idle being way lean.

Was the throttle responce calibrated or adjusted with the Super SERT?

[Iglide]

Adjusted with the SERT, there is a table in the Ver 2 software for that function.

[eddfive]

 Yes, I have  DynaStar Dyno.  The main reason I can run any length bike on it from sporsters to full choppers and everything in between.  My DynaStar Dyno has an integrated Strain gauge for actual Torque readings.  While I am running the dyno my machine will give you live HP/TQ values no matter what gear and what speed.  It is continually updating and displaying.  I run every WOT run in 4th gear SAE.  All bikes are tightened down to the same force pressure.  The exception would be the monster motors where I do not want the rear tire to spin on the drum.  I set up everything as close to the same as I can for consitency from Bike to Bike.  Dyno's have to be calibrated periodically and the weather station along with this calibration is key to consistent numbers.  You can change the output numbers by "fudging" any of the calibration numbers.  I try to keep everything the same and consistent to know calibration standards.

  I really do not care that much about final numbers as long as I start with a baseline and what I end up with has shown improvement.  I have yet to tune a bike that did not improve number wise.  This goes for stock bikes dealer delivered to the monster custom bikes.  The biggest satisfaction for me is the rideability/driveability of the bike when I am done.  HP/TQ numbers show the improvement but all my customers will feel it in the seat of their pants and all say it is much smoother through the entire RPM band.

  There is method of tuning that is important for people to understand.  Step testing is one method.  I prefer to tune a bike more similar to how it will be ridden.  I hold and test at every throttle site through the RPM range which is a little different than going in some programmed RPM step and stopping and holding to get data.  I have done a lot of bikes this way and it has proven to work very well.

  With the price of gas these days I am always being asked to de-tune or tune the bike for best mileage maybe giving up some performance.  If a bike is tuned properly, it will be at its peak efficiency(highest Torque) throughout the entire RPM band.  I believe you can have best performance and still get good gas mileage.  There really is no compromise of anything if the tuning is done correctly.  This is not only AFR/fuel, this encompasses the entire range of tables that can be adjusted.  Cranking fuel, warmup fuel, front and rear ignition, accel/decel etc.etc..  They all have to be adjusted to what the bike wants for best efficiency.  THERE ARE NO 2 BIKES EXACTLY THE SAME.

Thanks for reading and I will say this is not intended to bash any other dyno or any other techniques, this is the way I was trained and the way that has produced excellent results.  I am sure my customers will tell me if I did not get something right.

[planenut]

 hi iglide,

 great #s from a killer tune let us know how the ride is 

    Jon

[Iglide]

Eddfive,

If a DnyoJet does not have an integrated Strain gauge, how does it measure torque?

I thought all dynos measured torque and calculated HP, right or wrong?

Guess I just need some education on this subject.... The "Readers Digest" version will suffice.

And yes "seat of the pants" is a measure; but, at the end of the day, it's how many ft/lbs of torque do you get per $.
So, in that respect numbers, accurate numbers are important to me.

My Levi's just can't give me that info. That's part of the reason I pay for a dyno, right?

[eddfive]

The standard offering from DJ ia a speed control dyno(no load brake).  An option on a Dj is a load cell(strain gauge or some method of measuring Torque and a brake).  The DJ models have just one trigger for drum speed, my Dynastar has four(will be more accurrate and stable) another manufacturer, DynaPro, has 16 triggers(even more accurate and stable).  horsepower = torque * rpm / 5252. 
So I know the weight of the drum, under a load the strain gauge gives a value, the drum has the optical triggers to calculate speed, and we are using an RPM pickup for RPM.  On DynaStar, Torque is measured and HP is calculated from the collected infomation off of the drum.  What you paid for was a tuned motorcycle that is smooth through the RPM range and when you go WOT will get you all that it has.  That is the reason for running the baseline before tune and then a final after tune.  That number increase is part of what you paid for but a bike with great driveability/rideability is what you will be most happy with.  You can see from the dyno chart what the increase in HP and TQ was regardless of the final numbers.  The real question is how many DJ's out there have the load cell option?  You watched my method of tuning and I could not do that without a load cell and eddy current brake. I have not run or looked closely at a DJ.  DJ is the motorcycle industry standard.  When I was researching Dynos I looked at them all and I chose the one I have based on features, capability and end results of tuning.  The tune on a non-load cell dyno will not be near as good as on a dyno with a load cell.  I try and tune to an overall quality level on each and every bike and I can get there with my DynaStar.  I believe the numbers from my DynaStar to be accurate, but as I said earlier there is a lot of calibration and consistency that has to be done to maintain that accuracy.