Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[wolfman]

http://www.jsonline.com/business/101471349.html

[Tabatha]

Just the opposite here in Reno,Nv.----Dealers have a load of the 2010 and even a few 2009----Not to mention the 2011s----
  This dealer has tried all the vehicle dealer tricks to sell bikes but they can't understand why folks are reluctant to pay way over mfg. suggested ----
   This coupled with way below blue book trade in values have turned me off to a new bike until customer consideration comes about. Maybe other folks have seen what I have seen and that could be the reason for the surplus inventory here ! :----
    Have riders gotten tired of H.D.= "hundred dollars" ?  Could supply and demand be equalizing despite attempts to artificially influence it ? Will the MoCo efforts to withhold product make a difference in consumer spending or will it merely pi$$ people off ?
     H.D. has had it their way for a very long time but their "warranty" is much in question on every forum around; any of you ever had a problem with H.D. service?  H.D. makes desirable bikes but the state of our economy should influence their customer relations ; not just their want to control dealers inventories/ market prices. Are Dealerships really "Stealerships ?
   OK guys feel free to let me have it --- right now this is JMHO !

[DESERTBEAR54]

AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Markum]

I could not agree more with your thoughts Tabatha. My 2009 CVO ultra at the dealership waiting for a new induction module assembly. The dealer keeps telling me it's on back order. The bike has been at the dealer since July 23, 2010. 

[grc]

I could not agree more with your thoughts Tabatha. My 2009 CVO ultra at the dealership waiting for a new induction module assembly. The dealer keeps telling me it's on back order. The bike has been at the dealer since July 23, 2010. 

Try calling H-D Customer Service.  They have the capability, if you get ahold of the right person and he isn't having a bad day, to expedite parts in a "unit down" situation.  This is a common issue in the auto industry also, especially when there is a recent engineering change to address design issues, or a surge of parts replacements due to quality issues.  Regular dealer stock orders will get the lowest priority, but often the part can be found and shipped if the order is upgraded to a higher status.  After all, I imagine they still have modules to install on the new bikes on the assembly line, right?


Jerry

[semperfi81]

Now why doesn't that surprise me, very low numbers on the floor here in Arizona. No 2011 CVO's yet

[dooinit2u]

Ditto...Everything Tabatha said...Very weel put.

[Markum]

I sent a e-mail to the Ohio Attorney General Consumer Complaint Department. Let them talk to H-D Customer Service on my behalf.

[My Bagg]

Just the opposite here in Reno,Nv.----Dealers have a load of the 2010 and even a few 2009----Not to mention the 2011s----
  This dealer has tried all the vehicle dealer tricks to sell bikes but they can't understand why folks are reluctant to pay way over mfg. suggested ----
   This coupled with way below blue book trade in values have turned me off to a new bike until customer consideration comes about. Maybe other folks have seen what I have seen and that could be the reason for the surplus inventory here ! :----
    Have riders gotten tired of H.D.= "hundred dollars" ?  Could supply and demand be equalizing despite attempts to artificially influence it ? Will the MoCo efforts to withhold product make a difference in consumer spending or will it merely pi$$ people off ?
     H.D. has had it their way for a very long time but their "warranty" is much in question on every forum around; any of you ever had a problem with H.D. service?  H.D. makes desirable bikes but the state of our economy should influence their customer relations ; not just their want to control dealers inventories/ market prices. Are Dealerships really "Stealerships ?
   OK guys feel free to let me have it --- right now this is JMHO !

If they don't start worrying about quality the rest won't matter. 

[My Bagg]

I sent a e-mail to the Ohio Attorney General Consumer Complaint Department. Let them talk to H-D Customer Service on my behalf.

? If the Ohio Attorney General is anything like the Indiana Attorney General YOU JUST WASTED YOUR TIME but good luck!

[Wheelsnkeels]

That's hard to believe when there are over 2,000 Repo's being sold at NP Auctions alone each month lots of 08, 09, an  10's.

Not to mention Manheim and Adesa's inventories of Eaglemark bikes. There is plenty of inventory out there if they want it.

It's prudent for Harley to do as all the Boat manufacturers have major and reduce production during a period of weakened demand.

[Tabatha]

I sent a e-mail to the Ohio Attorney General Consumer Complaint Department. Let them talk to H-D Customer Service on my behalf.

If they don't start worrying about quality the rest won't matter.  

? If the Ohio Attorney General is anything like the Indiana Attorney General YOU JUST WASTED YOUR TIME but good luck!

          Caveat Emptor  is the ruling theme now-a-days !  What has happened to a "real" warranty ? How did "we" , the buying public allow any company to evade the performance of such an obligation ? Forums are full of H.D. shirking warranty issues everyday ! Most of us have been party to/or at least witnessed this phenomenon. We should not have trouble enforcing the very document that exists solely to prevent a disruption of use with our very expensive  Harley Davidson motorcycles !   What is the MoCo getting away with ; what are they really selling ; how do we as humble buyers stand up for our rights ; can they really manipulate markets ; can they really defraud us,the modest American consumer ? I work too hard on a daily basis in an attempt to earn my money , to allow any one company to relieve me of that cash without some type of consideration ! I bet most all of the readers here feel that same way after a days work !
................Anybody have any solutions ? Seems as though us poor working commoners in an attempt to entertain ourselves have created a corporate monster ! A monster with seemingly few checks and balances !
OK,OK I've said all that Iam going to , about this subject---hope there is something to be done !

[JCZ]

          Caveat Emptor  is the ruling theme now-a-days !  What has happened to a "real" warranty ? How did "we" , the buying public allow any company to evade the performance of such an obligation ? Forums are full of H.D. shirking warranty issues everyday ! Most of us have been party to/or at least witnessed this phenomenon. We should not have trouble enforcing the very document that exists solely to prevent a disruption of use with our very expensive  Harley Davidson motorcycles !   What is the MoCo getting away with ; what are they really selling ; how do we as humble buyers stand up for our rights ; can they really manipulate markets ; can they really defraud us,the modest American consumer ? I work too hard on a daily basis in an attempt to earn my money , to allow any one company to relieve me of that cash without some type of consideration ! I bet most all of the readers here feel that same way after a days work !
................Anybody have any solutions ? Seems as though us poor working commoners in an attempt to entertain ourselves have created a corporate monster ! A monster with seemingly few checks and balances !
OK,OK I've said all that Iam going to , about this subject---hope there is something to be done !

Get a lemon law attorney.  They specialize in lemon law and don't make any money unless they're successful.  We just setttled a case against BMW after being told that we are crazy and would never win.  The wife and I were surprised at how easy it was, that the car loan was paid off within 24 hours once the case was decided and how much $ we got back.  It was well worth it.  

If you have documentation of your attempts to get them to repair the issue and still have the issue........it doesn't cost anything to talk to a lemon law attorney.  They will tell you "yes, you have a case" or "no, you I would not be able to help you".

The flip side of it is that the MoCo built a new motor with her original VIN stamped in it (09 Street Glide w/cams, tuner, exhaust, air cleaner, etc.), shipped it and had it back in her bike within ten days!   http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=52617.0

They just replaced the compensator, spring assembly, etc. in my 10 SESG.  I have cams, tuner, baffles, etc. and the mods were never a question in either case.  We're very happy with the service that we got.......especially how quick they took care of us

[Wild Card]

I sent a e-mail to the Ohio Attorney General Consumer Complaint Department. Let them talk to H-D Customer Service on my behalf.

Yeah, best of luck with that.  Next time, do as Jerry suggested by taking the five minutes to call HD Customer Service yourself.  40% of the time, it works all the time!  Ha!

But, I suppose getting lawyers involved right away is the American way, right?!  Ugh. 

[Markum]

Called HD Customer Service today about the induction module which is on a back order status. They stated it's on back order but will try and pull one off the line at the factory. Could not give me a time frame when it would arrive at the dealership for installation. Bike been at the dealership since July 23, 2010. In the mean time summer is slipping away

[Wheelsnkeels]

How does that relate to low inventories?  

[WestCoastRuss]

...if parts constantly need to be taken off bikes on the factory line then fewer bike are shipped.. ??  One month (so far) is not right tho'   

[Wheelsnkeels]

Crazy Stuff 

[Tabatha]

I suppose ,much like the lottery, every once in a while somebody gets lucky with H.D. "customer service" ! Wonder what the ratio of good luck to being shirked may be,again, sort of like hitting the lottery !
Harley controls its inventory and "we" get to pay $300.00 an hour plus for an attorney. Makes sense to me !

[JCZ]

I suppose ,much like the lottery, every once in a while somebody gets lucky with H.D. "customer service" ! Wonder what the ratio of good luck to being shirked may be,again, sort of like hitting the lottery !
Harley controls its inventory and "we" get to pay $300.00 an hour plus for an attorney. Makes sense to me !

I may be the exception to the rule.  I've been riding since the early 70s and I think anybody that's been riding as long as I have will tell you that the quality of the bikes today vs. those built in the 60s and 70s is remarkably higher.  I also believe that while there are a number of those that are not happy with their bikes (or BMWs or whatever make and model of vehicle), I think that those that are happy far out weigh the number of those that are not happy.  Having said that, I realize that doesn't help the person that's going through hell trying to get issues resolved on their bike and I empathize.  I've read the BMW motorcycle forums and the Goldwing forums and we certainly don't have a monopoly on those that are unhappy with their bikes.

By the way, you don't pay an attorney for lemon law..........if they don't collect for you (and you have to accept the deal that they work out or it goes to trial), they don't get paid.  It's really much easier than anybody would think.

As for low inventory......my memory is mostly that you walk into a dealership and put down a deposit and wait from three to six months for your bike.  That was the norm for most of my life.  Now days, you walk in and the floors look more like a car lot with multiple choices of colors in each model (except the CVOs and I certainly don't want the market flooded with CVOs!).  What's all the whinning about?

[grc]

I suppose ,much like the lottery, every once in a while somebody gets lucky with H.D. "customer service" ! Wonder what the ratio of good luck to being shirked may be,again, sort of like hitting the lottery !
Harley controls its inventory and "we" get to pay $300.00 an hour plus for an attorney. Makes sense to me !

You asked for possible solutions earlier.  Here's a surefire solution; STOP BUYING THEIR STUFF!  It does absolutely no good to complain to them, or to anyone else, if they know you will still keep handing them big piles of money for subpar products and customer service.  They, and many of their dealers, still have that attitude from the last decade that basically said they could and would do whatever they pleased and if you don't like it tough chit.  Until their sales drop far enough to offset the cost cutting (jobs) moves they've made to appease the shareholders, and they start showing huge losses, I don't think bitching to them, or on one of the many internet forums, or even in courtrooms across the country, will make much difference.  They need to sweep out the entrenched management with the old attitude and reinvent the company.  It won't happen as long as people continue to accept chitty products and service.  I don't know how many times I've been tempted to tell someone they are a total idiot when they come on the site to tell us they finally fixed all the many things wrong with their bike, by trading it in on a new version.  In other words, pay Harley and the dealer another big pile of money because they didn't/wouldn't fix the previous POS.  Yup, that really gives them an incentive to do things right.


Jerry

[Keats]

I do not know about in other states, But in Pennsylvania the "Lemon Law" for motorcycles is just a Myth......

[FLYNDYNA]

love my bike, hate having to spend money to fix it after only three years...will be fixing the jug issue myself when I get the money together, but can at least ride it with the "band aid" head gasket repair for awhile.

Would I buy another Harley? If I had the expendable income, I would most certainly buy another one (and keep the one I got)

Do I think they shirk their responsibility? Yes...but so do most American manufacturers-but look at the example the Gubbermint sets...

[JCZ]

You asked for possible solutions earlier.  Here's a surefire solution; STOP BUYING THEIR STUFF!  It does absolutely no good to complain to them, or to anyone else, if they know you will still keep handing them big piles of money for subpar products and customer service.  They, and many of their dealers, still have that attitude from the last decade that basically said they could and would do whatever they pleased and if you don't like it tough chit.  Until their sales drop far enough to offset the cost cutting (jobs) moves they've made to appease the shareholders, and they start showing huge losses, I don't think bitching to them, or on one of the many internet forums, or even in courtrooms across the country, will make much difference.  They need to sweep out the entrenched management with the old attitude and reinvent the company.  It won't happen as long as people continue to accept chitty products and service.  I don't know how many times I've been tempted to tell someone they are a total idiot when they come on the site to tell us they finally fixed all the many things wrong with their bike, by trading it in on a new version.  In other words, pay Harley and the dealer another big pile of money because they didn't/wouldn't fix the previous POS.  Yup, that really gives them an incentive to do things right.
Jerry

So tell us how you really feel about it, Jerry.


On the serious side.....for many of them, I think you said it best in your fourth sentence.

[My Bagg]

You asked for possible solutions earlier.  Here's a surefire solution; STOP BUYING THEIR STUFF!  It does absolutely no good to complain to them, or to anyone else, if they know you will still keep handing them big piles of money for subpar products and customer service.  They, and many of their dealers, still have that attitude from the last decade that basically said they could and would do whatever they pleased and if you don't like it tough chit.  Until their sales drop far enough to offset the cost cutting (jobs) moves they've made to appease the shareholders, and they start showing huge losses, I don't think bitching to them, or on one of the many internet forums, or even in courtrooms across the country, will make much difference.  They need to sweep out the entrenched management with the old attitude and reinvent the company.  It won't happen as long as people continue to accept chitty products and service.  I don't know how many times I've been tempted to tell someone they are a total idiot when they come on the site to tell us they finally fixed all the many things wrong with their bike, by trading it in on a new version.  In other words, pay Harley and the dealer another big pile of money because they didn't/wouldn't fix the previous POS.  Yup, that really gives them an incentive to do things right.


Jerry

Right on the money and hey when they fail maybe a Government bailout?

[Keats]

          Caveat Emptor  is the ruling theme now-a-days !That is not new, it has always been the theme!  What has happened to a "real" warranty ? How did "we" , the buying public allow any company to evade the performance of such an obligation ? Forums are full of H.D. shirking warranty issues everyday ! Most of us have been party to/or at least witnessed this phenomenon. We should not have trouble enforcing the very document that exists solely to prevent a disruption of use with our very expensive  Harley Davidson motorcycles !First, I should not be so "preachy" but the document you refer to is a legal document that takes on different meanings in different states (statutes) that document does not prevent the loss of use or does it imply such a thing, it states simply if this fails , the company will take this action, time frames are not spelled out or mentioned. Now it is in the interest of the company to perform, otherwise you offend to many of your customers. The course of action Legal is that you can prove the failure falls into the parameters and the Company has not lived up to their obligation then you have a case. This is usually expensive to take on relative to the actual fix. Company's know this, does it make it right? no but knowing your legal standing is helpful.   What is the MoCo getting away with ; what are they really selling ; how do we as humble buyers stand up for our rights;That is a real easy question to answer....do not buy the product) can they really manipulate markets ; can they really defraud us, Defraud? now that is a strong adjective!the modest American consumer ? I work too hard on a daily basis in an attempt to earn my money , to allow any one company to relieve me of that cash without some type of consideration !You have relieved yourself of cash and in consideration was given a motorcycle plain and simple. I bet most all of the readers here feel that same way after a days work !
................Anybody have any solutions ? Seems as though us poor working commoners in an attempt to entertain ourselves have created a corporate monster ! A monster with seemingly few checks and balances ! The checks and balances are what you call the marketplace.
OK,OK I've said all that Iam going to , about this subject---hope there is something to be done ! Yes, do not buy!

I do not mind bashing the MOCO for their short sided planning, but I will neither subscribe to " I want what I want when I want it attitude either"

I know we have all had issues at one time or another with some product, and the ultimate choice of showing your displeasure is the marketplace,  You do not like it, do not buy it.
This simply forces change in itself,  the company finds new customers, the company improves it's products or the company goes out of business.

[wolfman]

Wow! Guess I really stirred it up.

[Markum]

My bike has been at the Harley Dealership going on five weeks waiting for a part. I just want my bike back so I can ride it again before the snow starts to fly again. I don't think that's asking for alot.

[Wheelsnkeels]

At the very least a "Loaner"

[Tabatha]

You asked for possible solutions earlier.  Here's a surefire solution; STOP BUYING THEIR STUFF!  It does absolutely no good to complain to them, or to anyone else, if they know you will still keep handing them big piles of money for subpar products and customer service.  They, and many of their dealers, still have that attitude from the last decade that basically said they could and would do whatever they pleased and if you don't like it tough chit.  Until their sales drop far enough to offset the cost cutting (jobs) moves they've made to appease the shareholders, and they start showing huge losses, I don't think bitching to them, or on one of the many internet forums, or even in courtrooms across the country, will make much difference.  They need to sweep out the entrenched management with the old attitude and reinvent the company.  It won't happen as long as people continue to accept chitty products and service.  I don't know how many times I've been tempted to tell someone they are a total idiot when they come on the site to tell us they finally fixed all the many things wrong with their bike, by trading it in on a new version.  In other words, pay Harley and the dealer another big pile of money because they didn't/wouldn't fix the previous POS.  Yup, that really gives them an incentive to do things right.


Jerry

   You silver tongued devil. Sounds like a perfect key to show those guys at Harley whos the boss !
Do you really think that our society is cohesive enough to pull it off ? Harley apparently counts on just exactly what you defined ! Real life "wants" and no real alternatives to the Harley "phenomenon".
............"They, and many of their dealers, still have that attitude from the last decade that basically said they could and would do whatever they pleased and if you don't like it tough chit."
--------They may be correct !