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[twinotter]

I can definitely see an advantage in the 7speed on a 103, heavily loaded. If your running a 117 or 124, I see no reason to do the 7, as both motors will supply adequate (more than) to run the stock 6 speed.
 Havind said that, the 6 spd imo, needs the trap door upgraded, especially if you are upping the power levels.
My buddies 106 showed variable clutch releases and noise at 43K with 100hp. We replaced the stock door with a JIMS unit (has to be twice as beefy) and the noise and clutch quirks went away. We both think under load, the stock door was flexing. It also shifts smoother and easier now. fwiw twinotter

[Major Tom]

Having predominately ridden 4,5 & 6 speed factory gear boxes I was pleasantly surprised when Heatwave was kind enough to let myself and Miss Lenda have a turn on his 09 with the DD7. We were travelling so had some gear on board and I am not a skinny person so it had some weight on board. My impression, smooth, no clunking, car park friendly and spread nicely up to top which is the same as Lucille's 6th. I very much liked the lower 1st.

Will I go out and buy one right now? No. If I were to build from scratch or had to change out Lucille's gear box or decide to ditch the house & become a full time nomadic motorcycle enthusiast (now there's a thought), then yes that's the way I would go. It is definitely better than stock, especially for those who do a lot of two up riding outside their zipcode.

Go and ride one and make your mind up if it makes sense for you and your set up.

Either way keep the meat on the seat.

Cheers Major Tom

[grc]

    It's amusing to see how things never really change.  First we had four speed transmissions and managed to do just fine with those, then someone finally decided to add a fifth gear and we did just fine with that for many years (even though some folks constantly bitched about "high rpms" at highway speeds).  Coming from Japanese bikes, I had to laugh at those folks who thought 3000 rpm on the highway was excessive.  Then Harley decided to copy the Baker folks (idea only, not the quality) and went to an overdriven primary and a six speed gearbox for 2007, which has lead to all kinds of problems we didn't have on the five speed units.  Lousy compensator, IPB failures, lousy ratio choices in the box, and much weaker components in the box as well.  Now we have the aftermarket offering seven speed boxes, to fix the lousy ratio choices Harley made with their offering.  Thanks to the cheapening process at Harley that makes some gears part of the shaft, you can't go to Andrews or others and just change gears to fix the first and second gear ratios.  Yes, Baker makes nice stuff of much higher quality than Harley could even imagine.  But for most folks who don't tow trailers or run through the mountains with six hundred pounds of people and gear, it's a big chunk of cash for little benefit.  And eventually people who really don't need seven speeds will get tired of the extra shifting, just like some did when they went from five speeds to six. 

Harley could alleviate much of this waste by fixing the ratio's in the Cruise Drive and then putting the obese motorcycles on a diet.  Constantly enlarging engines just to stay even with the increases in weight is a losing proposition.  Cut a couple hundred pounds from the nearly half ton weight of a late model touring model and they would get a very nice improvement in performance without spending a dime on the engine, brakes, etc.

Btw, a smart company wouldn't use the same gear box and ratio's for the six hundred pound bikes and the over nine hundred pound bikes, but no one ever said the folks at Harley were very smart when it came to engineering.

JMHO - Jerry

[KEB]

For all that no one has mentioned that the ECU has to be reset to fool it as to what gear its in or you will loose your cruise control. Baker has no idea what it is that needs to be done, they think the cruise works fine but it doesn't. You will have to buy a tuner to change the ECU gear ratios which if you don't already have one is an additional cost. The SE tuner won't do it, you'll need a power vision or similar aftermarket tuner.

[FlaHeatWave]

   It's amusing to see how things never really change.  First we had four speed transmissions and managed to do just fine with those, then someone finally decided to add a fifth gear and we did just fine with that for many years (even though some folks constantly bitched about "high rpms" at highway speeds).  Coming from Japanese bikes, I had to laugh at those folks who thought 3000 rpm on the highway was excessive.  Then Harley decided to copy the Baker folks (idea only, not the quality) and went to an overdriven primary and a six speed gearbox for 2007, which has lead to all kinds of problems we didn't have on the five speed units.  Lousy compensator, IPB failures, lousy ratio choices in the box, and much weaker components in the box as well.  Now we have the aftermarket offering seven speed boxes, to fix the lousy ratio choices Harley made with their offering.  Thanks to the cheapening process at Harley that makes some gears part of the shaft, you can't go to Andrews or others and just change gears to fix the first and second gear ratios.  Yes, Baker makes nice stuff of much higher quality than Harley could even imagine.  But for most folks who don't tow trailers or run through the mountains with six hundred pounds of people and gear, it's a big chunk of cash for little benefit.  And eventually people who really don't need seven speeds will get tired of the extra shifting, just like some did when they went from five speeds to six. 

Harley could alleviate much of this waste by fixing the ratio's in the Cruise Drive and then putting the obese motorcycles on a diet.  Constantly enlarging engines just to stay even with the increases in weight is a losing proposition.  Cut a couple hundred pounds from the nearly half ton weight of a late model touring model and they would get a very nice improvement in performance without spending a dime on the engine, brakes, etc.

Btw, a smart company wouldn't use the same gear box and ratio's for the six hundred pound bikes and the over nine hundred pound bikes, but no one ever said the folks at Harley were very smart when it came to engineering.

JMHO - Jerry

Well Jerry, since you have an automotive background let's talk cars for a minute...
The first Corvette had a 2-speed Powerglide, the new Corvette has an eight-speed automatic... the new Corvette is "somewhat more responsive" than the original... in fact the new Corvette will smoke the Formula 1 cars of the fifties everywhere... so what's wrong with advances in technology??

It cracks me up all the hatein' going on here  by folks that have never ridden a dd7 in a loaded bagger...

Especially on this site, why buy a CVO when the standard Harleys are "adequate"??

'Currently have 5, 6 and 7 speeds in the Harley stable, to me, they are perfectly suited to those bikes and the way I use them...

Now do I think that the dd7 is the perfect transmission for everybody /every bike? Absolutely not! But, in the 09, for the way I use it, it's a couple steps above anything else...

[grc]

Nothing wrong with advances in technology (most of the time), except when it's just change for the sake of change like some of the electronic doo-dads they keep adding to cars these days that are in fact a step backwards.  My point was that many folks on this site who do not use their bikes the way you do will be convinced to spend a pile of money on something they don't need, and they might get tired of having to make more shifts.  Harley could have fixed the ratio issue in production, but didn't.  They could have used a stronger trans door and bearing setup in production, but didn't.  I think we all know why.

Notice that in the auto arena we're seeing six and eight speed automatic transmissions, and possibly more in the near future.  The big difference is the automatic part.  The driver doesn't have to provide any more input on that eight speed automatic than he did on that old PowerSlide back in the day.  It is one hell of a lot better transmission, and in this case technology has provided something useful to anyone driving the car, albeit at a cost. 

For those like you who have unique riding requirements that the Baker fills, and who don't mind the expense, Baker makes great products of much higher quality than anything Harley sells.  You seem to be happy with your choice, and I'm fine with that.  My comments weren't aimed at you or anyone else in particular, just a statement of how I view the situation overall.  I'm not "hatin' on Baker", in fact I think they make some excellent products and have recommended them to others in the past.

Jerry

[Yellow09SERG]

Jerry, I have to agree with you. It is not the tranny for everyone. But as I said in a earlier post for those of us that are loading the bike on a regular bases as Ed and myself do it fits the bill perfectly where the Harley tranny leaves us hanging. Would I buy the tranny for a softail or a dyna....no way waste of money and much bigger bang for buck to be found in other places. For my bagger with the way its ridden...worth every penny and if I were to every replace the 09 and Harley hasn't fixed the ratio problem, it would be the second thing fixed right behind pipes

[FlaHeatWave]

I agree 100% with everything the both of you said ' just said it differently LOL

Jerry, The hating comment was definitely not directed at you... I should have put it in a separate post when I was quoting you, sorry...

[Classic Beast]

in my 75 shovel I put in the Andrews 1st and 3rd it made a world of difference in the 4 speed with the 96". It's easy to find reasons not to get the DD7 or anything else for that matter, I just wish I would have put it in the day I got the bike, with a loaded bagger, 2 up and stock 103 that lower first gear makes a huge difference especially on the hills in Vancouver, the gear spacing seems perfect and it shifts so smooth, most of the time not a sound when shifting gears.

[MrSurly]

I run a DD7 on my 2010, with a S&S 124 and Barnett clutch and 30T.  It works fine if tuned correctly, see Fuel Moto if you want a really good tune.  Given the size and power of my bike, it was not worth it as I'm in and out of 1st gear so fast that it's really useless.  So my advice would be if you are looking at this as your solution to low end help, then it's good.  If you have other mods, it may not be worth it.

I was struck by your complaint that first gear is now *too* short.
The DD7 lowers the first gear ratio about 12%... but I noticed that you *ALSO* did the 30 tooth sprocket conversion (if I read that right)... and that provides another 10% reduction (over all gears). I'd bet that your first gear DOES seem especially short.
I'm wondering if you've considered swapping the stock 32 toothed sprocket back on to compare?

[smiley1049]

When I did my DD7 I put my 32 tooth back on made it great for taking off
Chuck