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[RedDevil]

HERE HERE ..very good post !! The union now days wont do much more then break a company and send them to China ...times are changing .... union members need to realize they are "employee's" NOT partners and all they have invested is their time!

Bubba

My take on the unions is that they have out-lived their purpose.  When unions were organized the working conditions in the states were deplorable.  Basically, long hours and very low pay.  Now, they do more damage than good.  They are driving out-sourcing.  US companies cannot afford to keep up with Japan, China, etc on operating costs.  The only way they can survive is to out-source, so who gets pissed off when their members are laid off?  The unions, the ones that caused the problems to begin with.  Sorry for the rant...I've never been a union member, so I probably don't know the whole picture...
Cheers ,
Red

[WFP]

I am not a strong supporter of unions but they do have their place even today...however, in most cases they appear far more concerned with financial issues than working conditions. 

 

An example is the recent "complaint" from former NE Patriot Ted Johnson who says that the Team did not watch out for his welfare related to Head trauma.  This is just the type of area the union SHOULD be negotiating instead of worrying about Pro Bowl Bonus numbers.

 

Another sports analogy is the Baseball strike of 1994...I wrote off basebal on 8/4/1994 for ten years because of that strike.  I found it unreasonable that the players demanded so much money...it only raised ticket prices to stratospheric levels.  Then when I did go back to Fenway park for the first time since, in 2004, i could not belive the difference in that beloved park...it looked like a minor league stadium with all the advertising.

 

Now, I am a capitolist, but I am also reasonable.  If the players did not escalate the pricing, then te fans could have solely focused on the owners for gouging them and there would have been ways to attack that situation.  But now, the owners can say we have to pay the players os we have to charge $$$$$ for top row bleacher seats.  the players argue that they have short careers and deserve >$100K per game and corporate america pays into the park advertising getting seats reducing available seats thereby also raising prices.

 

[VaEagle]

HERE HERE ..very good post !! The union now days wont do much more then break a company and send them to China ...times are changing .... union members need to realize they are "employee's" NOT partners and all they have invested is their time!

Bubba

Hi KentuckyHarleyDude,
I agree with yours and other's ideas about unions hurting themselves by driving up wages and benefit packages. I do see where China would be an attractive labor force for corporate to consider setting up manufacturing.
Not having been an employee of the MOCO I don't know what the day -to-day policies were for Harley in dealing with all of it's employees. I have seen in stockholder booklets,ads and catalogues where actual employees model the clothes etc. and the MOCO acts like since the AMF days the company is a family working together for the success of Harley. I can see where that could breed some sense of entitlement as "family" and a worker was just not the "hired help." Were employees encouraged to invest in the MOCO for their benefit packages too? Maybe behind closed doors employees were told something different from the P.R. generated?
Lower level employees also resent seeing the upper level employees getting large bonuses,severance packages or other benefits when they don't get any raises for years.
I know where I worked in Virginia they don't allow collective bargaining or striking in my occupation but it was nice to have union reps to at least have a regular voice to higher-ups so working conditions or equipment issues could be brought up without repercussions to an individual. Then if we got a raise it was always a percentage raise usually accompanied with an increase cost for health benefits.
The admin would say what are you complaining about 3% is good amount per month increase and we would have to point out, yes 3% of your high admin salary was good but look at 3% of worker's salary then see the difference.
I think that all workers need a fair assessment of the skill levels needed to do their job as well as job risks and working conditions then be paid according to the degree of difficulty and ability.
How many people are really making good money for a low skill or risk job?

[jimp]

I sold the stock short, thats all I have to say.

[skippy]

For what it,s worth a buddy of mine an x HD PHD tech went to work at Freightliner they sent out pink slips lastweek closeing the plant in March  He applied with Indian Motorcycles and got a call today that the new plant in Kings Mt NC will hire him. Also said that a new Chief will be out by the end of 07. Great timeing for Indian....

[Hoist!]

Hey gang, this is the latest from York. Hoist!

Harley meeting ends, another set
Union rep said the next meeting 'couldn't be any worse than today'
By ANDRÉA MARIA CECIL
Daily Record/Sunday News
Article Launched: 02/06/2007 01:32:47 PM EST


Update: 4:17 PM
Feb 6, 2007 — Harley-Davidson representatives and negotiators with the union representing nearly 2,800 of the company's workers concluded their meeting today with two federal mediators just after 3:30 p.m.
The three parties are scheduled to meeting again tomorrow at an unknown time and location.

“I'm optimistic about tomorrow because it couldn't be any worse than today,” said Tom Boger, business representative with the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers Local 175.

At least a half-dozen negotiators representing the union and a handful of representatives from Harley-Davidson met today at a Manchester Township hotel.

The meeting also includes two mediators from Washington, D.C.-based Federal Mediation and Conciliation Service. The service is a government agency that tries to preserve and promote labor-management peace and cooperation.

An overwhelming majority of unionized workers at Harley's Springettsbury Township plant, the company's largest with 1.3 million square feet, voted last week to strike after rejecting the company's proposed contract.

Employees said they rejected the proposal mostly because of four factors: wage increases would be contingent upon the union finding a health-care plan Harley approved, a lower wage scale for new hires, health care for retirees and decreased pension benefits.

The president of Maryland-based International Association of Machinists Tom Buffenbarger said today's meeting is “exploratory.”

“Both sides want to get this thing resolved, and I have no doubt there's going to be sincere efforts at the bargaining table to try to get this thing resolved,” he said today.

Around 1:30 p.m. today, Boger said the company had not withdrawn anything from the proposed contract that workers rejected last week.

[TCinVA]

Hey gang, this is the latest from York. Hoist!

Harley meeting ends, another set
Union rep said the next meeting 'couldn't be any worse than today'
By ANDRÉA MARIA CECIL
Daily Record/Sunday News
Article Launched: 02/06/2007 01:32:47 PM EST

Howie,
Just read the "latest" from the York paper's web-site, and the meeting today ended (I think around 3:30).  A HD rep said the meeting ended and no new dates were set... doesn't sound promising.
It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.  Just wish I was watching from the sidelines on a B&O CUSE  ...
Tony

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

Howie,
Just read the "latest" from the York paper's web-site, and the meeting today ended (I think around 3:30).  A HD rep said the meeting ended and no new dates were set... doesn't sound promising.
It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.  Just wish I was watching from the sidelines on a B&O CUSE  ...
Tony

Tony I hope you get yours ..we do have one more that is supposed to come in about the same time Johns (ColbaltMan) is supposed to be here mid next month ...we seem to feel these have already been built but cant guarantee it ...if you do not get yours you might consdier this B/O I have coming ...

Bubba

[Hoist!]

Hey Tony, hang in there. But if you also like the B/O, I'd talk to KHD about it. After all, A bird in the hand...! Personally, and I'm not starting with the "Red" bike guys, I like the B/O best. It's your bike, and just my $.02! Hoist!

[Twolanerider]

Tony I hope you get yours ..we do have one more that is supposed to come in about the same time Johns (ColaltMan) is supposed to be here mid next month ...we seem to feel these have already been built but cant guarantee it ...if you do not get yours you might consdier this B/O I have coming ...

Bubba

Will completed bikes be shipped while the strike is going on?  Initial reports were of concrete barriers set in place blocking vehicle access points and other types of limitations.  And that doesn't even address the question of Teamsters crossing the line.

[RedDevil]

Howie,
Just read the "latest" from the York paper's web-site, and the meeting today ended (I think around 3:30).  A HD rep said the meeting ended and no new dates were set... doesn't sound promising.
It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.  Just wish I was watching from the sidelines on a B&O CUSE  ...
Tony

Tony,
Keep the faith.  I can't see how the MoCo, or the union, can let this strike go on too long.  I know the MoCo wants to cut back, but they're coming up on the busiest time of the year here shortly.   From what I've read, most dealers have enough stock on hand to last them until around March, which means if they don't get the line started before then, the MoCo is going to have a lot of pissed off dealers at them.  Now, with the CVO's being hand built, I don't believe you'll lose yours, but it may not make it in March, like it was supposed to.  I still think you'll get it, or I'm optimistic that you'll still get yours.   But remember, I talked to "Big Daddy" and told him where I got my B&O from and he stated that he understood me getting it where ever I could get it.  He said that the CVO's are so hard to get you have to go where you can.  I don't think he would hold it against you at all if you found one elsewhere.   Just my thoughts shipmate.
Cheers ,
Red 

[DavidB]

Does anyone know what month Harley normally starts production for the next years bike ?

[ultrafxr]

Does anyone know what month Harley normally starts production for the next years bike ?

Don't know exactly but I was at the York facility in June last year on my way home from Laconia.  Could not tour the production line because they were producing '07 models which had not yet been introduced. 

[RedDevil]

Don't know exactly but I was at the York facility in June last year on my way home from Laconia.  Could not tour the production line because they were producing '07 models which had not yet been introduced. 

Ultra,
I don't know exactly either, but I would say that given the new model year officially starts in Sept, but I've known dealers to have the new bikes in Aug and already selling them because they are out of the previous years bikes, and that the MoCo has to make a sufficient amount of bikes so that the dealerships can have a pretty good representation of the new models, I would say that May/June is a good guess as to when they start producing the next years models.  I don't know how much time the MoCo needs to shut the lines down for re-tooling like the auto manufacturers do. .
Cheers ,
Red

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

Hot off the press



In other developments, Harley-Davidson reported that as a result of the strike in Pennsylvania, it expects to reduce production of engines and transmissions (powertrains) at the Company’s facility in Menomonee Falls, Wis. The Company also expects to reduce production of injection-molded components at its facilities in Tomahawk, Wis.

The Company anticipates that reduced powertrain production could result in temporary layoffs for up to 500 of its approximately 1,500 production and distribution employees in southeast Wisconsin. Reduced components production in Tomahawk could result in temporary layoffs for up to 240 of the approximately 360 production employees who work there.

Layoffs at the Menomonee Falls and Tomahawk facilities could start as early as the week of February 12 for some employees. The Company has sought voluntary layoffs and will implement additional non-voluntary layoffs as needed.

The Company is disappointed by the decision of its union employees in York to strike and regrets the temporary impact the strike may have on some of its Wisconsin employees and its extensive supplier network.

Harley-Davidson’s facility in Menomonee Falls produces “Big Twin” powertrains – the largest of the Company’s engines and transmissions – used in motorcycles assembled in York and Kansas City. The Company’s facilities in Tomahawk produce windshields, fairings, saddlebags, Tour Paks and other components used on motorcycles assembled in York and Kansas City. Motorcycle sidecars are also produced in Tomahawk.

During the strike, the Wisconsin facilities will stop building powertrains and injection-molded components for shipment to the assembly plant in York.

The Company’s powertrain plant in Wauwatosa, Wis., is not expecting reduced production at this time.