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[JC]

2015 SVOSG 117 kit, 58mm, 5.3 inj, heavy breather 259 cams, SERT, V&H power dual with H.O. mufflers(I KNOW).

I was in my ECM constants this morning because my tuner had the RPM limit a little high for my liking and i noticed that the C.I.D. was set at 150. Is this normal or a band aid to set the V.E. tables? Bike seems to be running lean. Fuel mileage in the mid 40's. I am hoping some of the great tuners on this site can give me some insight on this. Thanks in advance.

[TN]

A very good question to ask you tuner. What's yer duty cycle for the injectors?


TN

I'm only a shade tree tuner FWIW

[grc]

2015 SVOSG 117 kit, 58mm, 5.3 inj, heavy breather 259 cams, SERT, V&H power dual with H.O. mufflers(I KNOW).

I was in my ECM constants this morning because my tuner had the RPM limit a little high for my liking and i noticed that the C.I.D. was set at 150. Is this normal or a band aid to set the V.E. tables? Bike seems to be running lean. Fuel mileage in the mid 40's. I am hoping some of the great tuners on this site can give me some insight on this. Thanks in advance.

Just because you're getting the fuel economy you're supposed to doesn't necessarily mean the bike is running lean.  What other symptoms do you have, if any.

As for playing with the CID number, I've heard that mentioned several times by people on the site.  Hopefully one of the better tuners around here will jump in and explain what that does and if it's really necessary to do a good tune.

Jerry

[JC]

A very good question to ask you tuner. What's yer duty cycle for the injectors?


TN

I'm only a shade tree tuner FWIW

I just asked him why and he said it was the only way he could get the afr to come in at WOT?
As far as duty cycle... I am not sure.

[JC]

Just because you're getting the fuel economy you're supposed to doesn't necessarily mean the bike is running lean.  What other symptoms do you have, if any.

As for playing with the CID number, I've heard that mentioned several times by people on the site.  Hopefully one of the better tuners around here will jump in and explain what that does and if it's really necessary to do a good tune.

Jerry

Plug Color, lot of extra heat and exhaust header is getting pretty white up near the head. My 07 or 11 110 didn't have these symptoms with almost the exact same parts minus the 117 cylinders of course. Both of those were tuned by a friend of mine but unfortunately he is not with us anymore. This is the first bike I have had tuned with this tuner. Just trying to figure it all out.

[TN]

Do some data logging and see what ya got in real world scenario.

TN

[JC]

I will do that this weekend if I can get away from work long enough.

[hawgzilla]

VE tables can only be set as high as 127.5.  If more fuel is needed, the CID constant may be raised to allow for more adjustment.  BUT, yours has been raised by almost 30%.  That's WAY more than should be necessary.  Something is amiss somewhere.  In the constants settings, have the injector settings been set to 5.3?  Has your fuel pressure been verified?  Can you post your tune for us to look at? (the SERT file)

[JC]

VE tables can only be set as high as 127.5.  If more fuel is needed, the CID constant may be raised to allow for more adjustment.  BUT, yours has been raised by almost 30%.  That's WAY more than should be necessary.  Something is amiss somewhere.  In the constants settings, have the injector settings been set to 5.3?  Has your fuel pressure been verified?  Can you post your tune for us to look at? (the SERT file)

Injectors are set at 5.3. no I have not verified fuel pressure. I have attached the file.
Thanks for the help.

[hawgzilla]

There is no reason for the CID to be at 150.  There is still adjustment room in the tables.  When the CID is upped by 30%, all other tables are upped the same 30%.  Not sure what your tuner is trying to do--I'd give him a chance to explain or find another tuner.  Do you have a dyno sheet showing the AFR?

[JC]

There is no reason for the CID to be at 150.  There is still adjustment room in the tables.  When the CID is upped by 30%, all other tables are upped the same 30%.  Not sure what your tuner is trying to do--I'd give him a chance to explain or find another tuner.  Do you have a dyno sheet showing the AFR?

[hrdtail78]

Cunic inch and injector size is for the purpose of scaling the VE tables.  Raising cubic inch is going to add fuel across the board.  Making injectors smaller is going to do the same.  SE wont let you get to the correct injector size.  So, the tuners choice is to go a bit big. (lean out entire cal) or to be a bit small. (richen across the board)  Cubic inch is much easier to deal with because if you do run out of head room in the VE table.  You can add 10% to the cubic inch and take away same % of VE tables you are still in the ball park.  There isn't a rule of thumb like this on the injector size.  At the same time.  What ever % the cubic was raised over original can be taken away from the warm up enrichment, and this % can be used to get accel and decal in the ball park.

You do have some 117's and some cubic inch can be taken out but is it worth the time and effort to maybe drop it 5?  I don't think so.  EGR tables would probably help address some of this, but that isn't an option with SE.  Your sheet is right in line for the 259E cam.  So, I would say it is what it is and the tuner did what he needed to do.

The warm up table doesn't seem like it has enough out by looking at the cal, but that doesn't mean that it is rich on warm up.  Does it smell like fuel on start up, black smoke.  If no.  Enjoy the thing.  Other thing I noticed is:  EITMS is turned off.  I would suggest tuning it on.  If the bike is tuned correctly and you don't parade the thing.  It shouldn't be a factor.

[JC]

Thanks for the explanation hardtail78

[lonewolf55]

I'd be concerned with the tune. When comparing the finished ve numbers to the original it just doesn't work that way. There should not be "blanket" adjustments of the cells.

[FLTRI]

I'd be concerned with the tune. When comparing the finished ve numbers to the original it just doesn't work that way. There should not be "blanket" adjustments of the cells.

That looks like a desktop tune done by someone who really doesn't understand how this EFI system works and has guessed at changes, prolly from partial data observations and assuming global changes will work.
Sorta like the DFO (screwdriver tuner) mentality where big swaths of tuning is done all at once.

FWIW, upping the engine size doesn't adversely affect the rest of the tune unless the numbers change a lot. Then I prefer a small change in injector size to make bigger changes to fueling over cubic inches.

Bob