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Author Topic: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8  (Read 11067 times)

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Gandrtravis

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Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« on: October 22, 2017, 10:45:25 AM »

I have been looking at maybe trading the 2014 cvo king on a 2018 limited was wondering with all the changes harley has been making is it worth getting the 17-18 m8 motor or is the old 110 on the 14-16s just as good? Looking for some opinions on the things that have changed and if it’s worth getting brand new or used.
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2017, 11:33:11 AM »

Wow, this is gonna get a ton of responses. Is money at all a consideration? If so, used will always be a better option based on economics. Do you like the latest gadgets, upgrades, a few more cubic inches? If so, new works best but you have to deal with the purchase dance.

I went with a 2018 Road Glide Special recently because I loved the new blackout look, upgraded bluetooth option and the extra features added to the special model.

Good luck,
Simon
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Gandrtravis

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2017, 01:28:20 PM »

I love the new road glide as well I was looking at one but they want 55,700 can then I’d have to buy a tour pack and be close to 60k Can when I can get a limited for 51 with tp I also like the red fade it’s growing on me. I’ve also been looking at a 2015 Limited with only 1600 kms so pretty much new for 42 so a good bit cheaper.
Wow, this is gonna get a ton of responses. Is money at all a consideration? If so, used will always be a better option based on economics. Do you like the latest gadgets, upgrades, a few more cubic inches? If so, new works best but you have to deal with the purchase dance.

I went with a 2018 Road Glide Special recently because I loved the new blackout look, upgraded bluetooth option and the extra features added to the special model.

Good luck,
Simon
« Last Edit: October 22, 2017, 02:20:34 PM by Gandrtravis »
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2017, 03:16:49 PM »

as big a difference between M8 motor and twin cam as was twin can vs EVO. Of course there are some early issues with the motor but as far as "new motors" go this one has definitely been the most trouble free release Harley has ever had. I have 12000 miles on mine with the stage 3 and it has been perfect. IMO it is a great motor and absolutely the future for HD
I am the "Polly Anna" of the group.. The "Yang" to GRC's "Ying"  ;D
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Alan

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2017, 09:41:14 AM »

I went from a 2012 with the 110 to a 2017 with the M8.  Wife and I both agree that this is the first (out of 4 CVO Ultra or Limiteds that we have owned) that we feel is worth keeping long-term and is capable of fulfilling our needs and desire to do a cross-country trek.  We bought the bike in mid-June (it was built at the end of May) and because it was almost the end of the model year, we got a great deal and I am reasonably confident that they had a lot of the bugs worked out by then.  Given the prices/gouging being tossed around for the 2018's, our timing couldn't have been better!  Unfortunately, given the current state of things with HD; pricing, overall reliability, features/accessories, etc. This will in all likelihood be our last CVO Limited.  If you are in the market for a CVO with the 110, Manchester HD in Manchester, NH has a brand new 2016 CVO Limited holdover on the floor at $32k (wife didn't care for the red color). 
« Last Edit: October 23, 2017, 01:31:54 PM by NH Bulldog »
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acevtwin

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2017, 10:31:00 AM »

I personally am happy to be rid of that gawd awful Twin Cam 110.  Very happy with the M8 114 so far.
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IRNEngineer

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2017, 12:27:33 PM »

I guess I'll buck the trend here.  I love my '16 FLHXSE and the 110.  I have no desire to trade for the new m8.  I worked with our HOG chapter leading dealership rides on the '17's & '18's, so I've ridden several models. (One was a 117 Stage 4 - and THAT machine was a beast!) Personally, I just didn't like the quiet unremarkable smoothness of the m8.  I couldn't wait to get back on my 110. I don't argue the m8 is probably a better overall motor, handles heat much better and is certainly the way of the future for the MoCo.  And I don't argue that it has been long awaited and really loved by many.  This is purely a subjective, psychological, sensory position for me.  I want a bike I love to ride and suits me.  I love love love the sound of my 110 - and with my V&H headers, Rinehart exhaust and Pro tuner I have more hp and torque than the stock m8 117 (not apples-to-apples comparison, I know). I haven't heard an m8 exhaust note yet that I really like and I understand the Pro tuner is no more.  I may be the only one here that loves the 110 and all the racket it makes.  And I may be sitting all by myself at the '18 Eureka Springs GTG - banned from hanging with those that love their m8's. But I'll carry the lonely banner for the twin cam! Ha!
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NH Bulldog

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2017, 01:38:26 PM »

I guess I'll buck the trend here.  I love my '16 FLHXSE and the 110.  I have no desire to trade for the new m8.  I worked with our HOG chapter leading dealership rides on the '17's & '18's, so I've ridden several models. (One was a 117 Stage 4 - and THAT machine was a beast!) Personally, I just didn't like the quiet unremarkable smoothness of the m8.  I couldn't wait to get back on my 110. I don't argue the m8 is probably a better overall motor, handles heat much better and is certainly the way of the future for the MoCo.  And I don't argue that it has been long awaited and really loved by many.  This is purely a subjective, psychological, sensory position for me.  I want a bike I love to ride and suits me.  I love love love the sound of my 110 - and with my V&H headers, Rinehart exhaust and Pro tuner I have more hp and torque than the stock m8 117 (not apples-to-apples comparison, I know). I haven't heard an m8 exhaust note yet that I really like and I understand the Pro tuner is no more.  I may be the only one here that loves the 110 and all the racket it makes.  And I may be sitting all by myself at the '18 Eureka Springs GTG - banned from hanging with those that love their m8's. But I'll carry the lonely banner for the twin cam! Ha!

I don't really disagree.  Unlike what seems to be the multitude, I never had ANY issues with my 2012 air cooled 110.  I towed a trailer, and we rode two-up 99.9% of the time.  Quality fluids, regular maintenance, and it felt like a solid bike.  I imagine the twin-cooled models were only that much better.  We went to the dealer to look at the discounted 2016 Limited, she didn't like the color in person, so we were ready to ride away, not feeling any burning need to buy a 2017 bike.  But.....one test ride on the 2017 Limited with the M8 and we were hooked!  A set of Cobra Neighbor-Haters and a Harley authorized tune took care of the lame exhaust note.   
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Gandrtravis

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2017, 11:10:10 PM »

I went from a 2012 with the 110 to a 2017 with the M8.  Wife and I both agree that this is the first (out of 4 CVO Ultra or Limiteds that we have owned) that we feel is worth keeping long-term and is capable of fulfilling our needs and desire to do a cross-country trek.  We bought the bike in mid-June (it was built at the end of May) and because it was almost the end of the model year, we got a great deal and I am reasonably confident that they had a lot of the bugs worked out by then.  Given the prices/gouging being tossed around for the 2018's, our timing couldn't have been better!  Unfortunately, given the current state of things with HD; pricing, overall reliability, features/accessories, etc. This will in all likelihood be our last CVO Limited.  If you are in the market for a CVO with the 110, Manchester HD in Manchester, NH has a brand new 2016 CVO Limited holdover on the floor at $32k (wife didn't care for the red color).


Just coming off a 2012 does the bike ride and Handle a lot better or is it mostly the motor and features that make the new bikes better I know the gps and quick latch bags are nice 14 and up.
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2017, 12:33:53 AM »

Just coming off a 2012 does the bike ride and Handle a lot better or is it mostly the motor and features that make the new bikes better I know the gps and quick latch bags are nice 14 and up.

There was a huge handling improvement on my 15 FLTRUSE vs my 11 FLTRUSE. And then HD went and did a major upgrade to the front end in 2016 (?). So I would say yes, there should be a major difference for you. Go take a test ride. And don't forget Rushmore.
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NH Bulldog

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2017, 09:21:43 AM »

Just coming off a 2012 does the bike ride and Handle a lot better or is it mostly the motor and features that make the new bikes better I know the gps and quick latch bags are nice 14 and up.

Aside from the convenience features and drivetrain (transmission was quieter, less clunk shifting gears, smoother shifts, less engine noise, etc.) there was a VERY noticeable difference in ride and handling.  Wife experienced a totally different (better) ride with the new rear suspension, and road feel and handling for me was a great improvement as well with more comfort and less fatigue.  We get back from a day's ride and find that somehow we put on 250+ miles and it doesn't feel like it at all.  On one of many trips, we rode the 2012 to Florida and back from New England and our comfort limit was about 300-325 miles per day.  That is why in my first response I said that this bike was the first that I can seriously see us doing our cross-country trek on in the near future.   
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BigLew

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2017, 04:29:00 PM »

I guess I'll buck the trend here.  I love my '16 FLHXSE and the 110.  I have no desire to trade for the new m8.  I worked with our HOG chapter leading dealership rides on the '17's & '18's, so I've ridden several models. (One was a 117 Stage 4 - and THAT machine was a beast!) Personally, I just didn't like the quiet unremarkable smoothness of the m8.  I couldn't wait to get back on my 110. I don't argue the m8 is probably a better overall motor, handles heat much better and is certainly the way of the future for the MoCo.  And I don't argue that it has been long awaited and really loved by many.  This is purely a subjective, psychological, sensory position for me.  I want a bike I love to ride and suits me.  I love love love the sound of my 110 - and with my V&H headers, Rinehart exhaust and Pro tuner I have more hp and torque than the stock m8 117 (not apples-to-apples comparison, I know). I haven't heard an m8 exhaust note yet that I really like and I understand the Pro tuner is no more.  I may be the only one here that loves the 110 and all the racket it makes.  And I may be sitting all by myself at the '18 Eureka Springs GTG - banned from hanging with those that love their m8's. But I'll carry the lonely banner for the twin cam! Ha!
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Gandrtravis

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2017, 11:23:53 PM »

Aside from the convenience features and drivetrain (transmission was quieter, less clunk shifting gears, smoother shifts, less engine noise, etc.) there was a VERY noticeable difference in ride and handling.  Wife experienced a totally different (better) ride with the new rear suspension, and road feel and handling for me was a great improvement as well with more comfort and less fatigue.  We get back from a day's ride and find that somehow we put on 250+ miles and it doesn't feel like it at all.  On one of many trips, we rode the 2012 to Florida and back from New England and our comfort limit was about 300-325 miles per day.  That is why in my first response I said that this bike was the first that I can seriously see us doing our cross-country trek on in the near future.

That’s good to know I also want to get in some longer trips but the wife can only handle the 14 king for so long i would like to find something she can ride with me all day on and not complain happy wife happy life they say lol.
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zigzag930

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2017, 04:10:57 PM »

Ok, so this is an older thread, but now that I've ridden the M8 a bit and have a friends that own them, I thought I'd add my observations

Some pro/cons are personal preferences, some are hard facts and a few are unknown.

My observations:

1) Fact, the M8 is smoother and quieter.  Some like this, some don't because they like the traditional "Harley" feel.  I fall into the 2nd category at this point but may come around one day...

2) The base M8 has more torque than a stock 110.  How many of us have stock bikes?  On 110's you can pull the cat, put on a fulsac or FM headpiece and get to where the M8 will be.  Do this on M8, you void the wty.

3) As in #2, any modifications to the engine will void the wty, unless using EPA compliant parts and most like done by HD only.

4) The M8 runs cooler.  I believe this is true.  My 110 dual cool is hotter that any other motor I've owned.  Just about everyone I know complains about the heat from the 110. I live in FL.  I deal with it.  In fact I'm now considering a 117 upgrade, because I think I can squeeze a few more BTU's out of that furnace.

5) M8 is the future of Moco.   No going back

6) Suspension - while HD says the new suspension is "far superior" to the original Rushmore bikes, I don't think there is all that much difference.  In fact, those that have had Ohlins (or other decent suspension) think the new HD suspension is a joke.  Two of my ridding buddies have trashed the '17 shocks and installed the good stuff.  If your current bike has improperly inflated or worn out suspension (can happen over 25K miles) then the new bikes may appear to be vastly improved. 

7) Engine reliability - the jury is out on this.  Quite a few reports of early M8 engine problems (oiling).  But then again, lots of complaints about 110 lifter issues.   Of course there are those that have never experienced those problems on either engine.   My 110 has 40K and no lifter issues.   But this is the only bike I've ever taken a five year extended service contract (just in case).

8) Colors - very personal.  I absolutely dislike virtually all the new CVO colors, except the Black Fade out CVO ultra.  Other love the new paint schemes, so that's an individual choice more than anything.  Some of the paint actually looks like stick on labels on some of the color schemes.  While that isn't the case, I think it cheapens the finish.  (Personal feelings only)

9) Value - Hmm, hard to quantify this.  If you are paying 50K+ for a CVO, you want what you want and don't care about value.   Depreciation on that purchase will be fast and painful.  But the introduction of the M8 has hurt the 110 values.  I've been in that 1st category most of my life, but as I'm approaching retirement, I'm less inclined to make those type purchasing decisions any longer.
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Para Bellum

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2017, 02:18:25 AM »

I can only compare the air-cooled 110 models to the M8, since I haven't had water-cooled until now on my 2018 RGU (non-CVO).  Since our likes may vary, I'll try to make an objective comparison, followed by my personal preference.  Your choice will vary.

1.  Vibration:  The M8 engine has much less vibration.  After 10 years of 110 riding, I could closely tell how fast I was going just by the vibration level.  Although my wife really, really likes it b/c of nerve damage in her legs, I prefer the old style--it just feels like a Harley.  Then again, after I rack up a lot more miles on the M8, I might change my mind.

2. Noise (divided into mechanical noise from the engine, and exhaust sound):
    a. Mechanical:  No contest; the M8 is so much quieter than the air-110s.  I like the M8.
    b. Exhaust (as heard by me):  Stock M8 is slightly quieter than stock air-110s.  M8 with stock header and HD's warranty-friendly 4.5" SE mufflers is slightly louder (Really, too quiet for most of us).  M8 with V&H Power Dual header and 4" mufflers is noticeably louder; sounds good.  Haven't heard one with the HD warranty-friendly header and SE mufflers.

3. Harshness (aka "overall ride"; the combination of drivetrain and suspension smoothness):  The M8 is smoother than the pre-Rushmore bikes.  No idea how the M8 compares to the '14 to '16 models.

4. Predicted Reliability:  Still early, but initial results look like the M8 will be better.  No guarantee, of course.

5. Heat management:  No question, and no surprise, that the right leg is cooler on the M8 than on the air-cooled, even comparing a stock M8 to de-catted and tuned air-110s.

Overall, I like the M8s, even though keeping the warranty limits the modification choices.  However, that's my choice so I can keep the nationwide warranty, not just my home dealer.
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2018, 12:28:10 PM »

Our First CVO was a 2013 Anniv  110 motor was good ran a bit hot but don't they all? @ 28K sold her for a 2015 CVO Limited   motor about the same with power maybe a bit cooler seat was better for wife and slight better suspension in front @ 45K traded for the 2018 CVO Anniv  So far only 650 miles and impressed with the new motor and suspension BUT comparing a bike with 44K to new is not that fair.  Are they expensive?   Darn right but start adding on the things you want and that gets pretty expensive with very little warranty to back you up.   Switched from BMW's to Harley in 2010 with a 2010 Limited and added a ton to it.  Now with almost 100K on Harleys only had some very minor issues and one day that the warranty was used but worked as promised.    I do my own service and do it all that I can without the dealer getting my bike.  My dealership does have good wrenches so if needed I feel OK.   All 3 bikes dealer dealt on.    Got better than book trade in and price discounted they even dealt on extended warranty.  Our HOG chapter rides a good bit we rack up the miles each year..  Took club out on Iron Butt last year 12 bikes we all completed it and two weeks out west in 110+ temps in Utah.  I see subtle differences in all 4 bikes I have owned each change a bit better and serve my needs but I tend not to be a nit picker when it comes to my bikes over 40 years on the street on all makes me just glad to be out there.   All bikes have something odd embrace it.  Here to many more and to Harley for keeping me interested.   Our dealer gives Chapter member 15% off on everything but a new bike and then we get first dibs.  Two of us on new CVO's right now, a new anniv trike and a anniv street   So teh dealer makes the motor company.  Good like  Hope you find what makes you happy.   Ride Safe...
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2018, 04:52:06 PM »


I've got no dog in this hunt, but just based on all the reported failures with not only Stage III or IV M8's but also stock M8's, 2017 and 2018 models, I think it might be best to wait until Harley actually fixes the root cause of the sumping issue.  The 110 isn't exactly the epitome of high quality, but as long as you do some preventative parts replacements (like lifters every 10k - 15k miles) the odds are decent that your engine won't turn into a boat anchor.  On the other hand, the M8's with serious sumping problems are usually trashed and have to be replaced or totally rebuilt.  If you have any illegal mods on the bike that repair will come directly from your pocket.

Considering how many years it normally takes H-D to fix their design issues, you may be waiting for an M8 for a few more years.

JMHO - Jerry
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2018, 09:02:44 PM »

I'll pony up with you IRNEngineer....I  have ridden the new 107 and 114s. Yes they have a better ride and more torque than my '13 110, but compared to my 2000 Ultra it screams. With the Fullsac exhaust, new lifters and the TTS it has plenty of power. I never have had an issue with heat...I guess some do. A big deal for me is that I am not a fan of the Rushmore + outer or inner fairing. I like my old school 4 gauge inner fairing look and the solid outer. I don't need the extra $$ for a touch screen for the radio or GPS. My I phone has that. I don't listen to the radio much anyway. Rather listen to the wind. And now we get to the colors....I haven't seen any 14 + color that I like over mine. Some of the paint schemes make me wonder what they were smoking.. I guess lastly, I am not sure why they keep jackin up the price tag for the CVOs. Good Lord..You can buy a nearly new crew cab dually for that. lol  So bottom line I will keep my ol' 110. Variety is a wonderful thing....Everybody is happy..happy..happy.
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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2019, 02:55:33 PM »

I'll pony up with you IRNEngineer....I  have ridden the new 107 and 114s. Yes they have a better ride and more torque than my '13 110, but compared to my 2000 Ultra it screams. With the Fullsac exhaust, new lifters and the TTS it has plenty of power. I never have had an issue with heat...I guess some do. A big deal for me is that I am not a fan of the Rushmore + outer or inner fairing. I like my old school 4 gauge inner fairing look and the solid outer. I don't need the extra $$ for a touch screen for the radio or GPS. My I phone has that. I don't listen to the radio much anyway. Rather listen to the wind. And now we get to the colors....I haven't seen any 14 + color that I like over mine. Some of the paint schemes make me wonder what they were smoking.. I guess lastly, I am not sure why they keep jackin up the price tag for the CVOs. Good Lord..You can buy a nearly new crew cab dually for that. lol  So bottom line I will keep my ol' 110. Variety is a wonderful thing....Everybody is happy..happy..happy.

I guess I'll buck the trend here.  I love my '16 FLHXSE and the 110.  I have no desire to trade for the new m8.  I worked with our HOG chapter leading dealership rides on the '17's & '18's, so I've ridden several models. (One was a 117 Stage 4 - and THAT machine was a beast!) Personally, I just didn't like the quiet unremarkable smoothness of the m8.  I couldn't wait to get back on my 110. I don't argue the m8 is probably a better overall motor, handles heat much better and is certainly the way of the future for the MoCo.  And I don't argue that it has been long awaited and really loved by many.  This is purely a subjective, psychological, sensory position for me.  I want a bike I love to ride and suits me.  I love love love the sound of my 110 - and with my V&H headers, Rinehart exhaust and Pro tuner I have more hp and torque than the stock m8 117 (not apples-to-apples comparison, I know). I haven't heard an m8 exhaust note yet that I really like and I understand the Pro tuner is no more.  I may be the only one here that loves the 110 and all the racket it makes.  And I may be sitting all by myself at the '18 Eureka Springs GTG - banned from hanging with those that love their m8's. But I'll carry the lonely banner for the twin cam! Ha!

I agree and love my 110!!
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fkhan726

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2019, 02:52:35 PM »

We purchased a 2016 with the 117 kit after test riding both a 2017 with the 114 M8 and a new 2019 with the 117 M8 at Red Rock Harley in Vegas.  Price aside, the twincam upgrade to the stage IV just flat out moves.  And as others have mentioned the bike feels and sounds like the Harley's I have owned over the last 20 yrs.  Maybe some day but right now I am not ready for a Harley that is as smooth and refined as the M8.  As far as heat goes, the M8 may be cooler but we live in Vegas and it's ridiculously hot in the summer so twin cooled was the only option for us regardless of twincam or M8. 
« Last Edit: February 10, 2019, 08:20:43 PM by fkhan726 »
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Davestune

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2019, 05:08:52 PM »

i have a 2016 cvo ultra,  its silver and black , think all the paint looks like gay to me.
have no faith in the motor just from reading and hearing the failures ,  its a modern bike, i would get a new bike but they just are not worth the money and my 16 isn't either, when it blows up i will put a 124 in it,  like the ride and like it on the highway  longest day on the bike was 1060 miles  long ride, normally stop at 800 miles for a day,    but I love to hate it and love it at the same time,   my heart is with my knuckleheads. so i look at these modern bikes just to ride long with the ol lady. 
  its nice to push a button been riding since 78..........
to much for a new bike f that :oops:
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Spiked Olive

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #21 on: April 15, 2019, 05:47:07 PM »

I rode a 08 with 96 and a 2010 with 96 motors. Both got the job done. Then I bought a 2016 with the HO103. WOW it was a noticeable improvement in performance. Then we upgraded to a 2017 CVO Limited with 114 and WOW it was like adding a supercharger to the 103. You need to go ride some. That is what we did. I go to Daytona, or York every other year and demo the heck out of them. 

Good luck with your decision
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Heatwave

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Re: Twin cooled 110 vs 114 vs 117 m8
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2019, 11:49:24 PM »

I guess I'll buck the trend here.  I love my '16 FLHXSE and the 110.  I have no desire to trade for the new m8.  I worked with our HOG chapter leading dealership rides on the '17's & '18's, so I've ridden several models. (One was a 117 Stage 4 - and THAT machine was a beast!) Personally, I just didn't like the quiet unremarkable smoothness of the m8.  I couldn't wait to get back on my 110. I don't argue the m8 is probably a better overall motor, handles heat much better and is certainly the way of the future for the MoCo.  And I don't argue that it has been long awaited and really loved by many.  This is purely a subjective, psychological, sensory position for me.  I want a bike I love to ride and suits me.  I love love love the sound of my 110 - and with my V&H headers, Rinehart exhaust and Pro tuner I have more hp and torque than the stock m8 117 (not apples-to-apples comparison, I know). I haven't heard an m8 exhaust note yet that I really like and I understand the Pro tuner is no more.  I may be the only one here that loves the 110 and all the racket it makes.  And I may be sitting all by myself at the '18 Eureka Springs GTG - banned from hanging with those that love their m8's. But I'll carry the lonely banner for the twin cam! Ha!
I’m with you. I had both a 2017 CVO 117 stage 4 (3 replacement engines due to sumping) and an upgraded 2010 CVO Ultra. I’m rid of the M8 and I still have the 110. The power and sound of the TC is far more fun that the M8. That being said, I was looking forward to buying a new 2020 CVO. I was hoping it would be a CVO RG Ultra.

They didn’t even try to put lipstick on the 2020 CVOs. About as boring as they get. The 2020s are definitely off my shopping list. I’ll be looking at getting either a new BMW Grand America or the new 2020 water-cooled Indian Challenger Touring bike.

With the $15k I’ll save over a CVO Limited, I can get one helluva custom paint job on either the BMW or the Indian.
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