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Author Topic: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes  (Read 3668 times)

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Rooster

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #15 on: September 06, 2018, 09:35:01 AM »

Interesting information.

I have a 2017 CVO with the 114. Just had the 10k service done last Saturday. I have had zero issues to date. The tech spoke with me when he got back from the test ride and said my bike is perfect. I asked him if he checked for sumping still and he said no, not unless the owner complains of symptoms related. He said they had a few early on and it is a non-issue at this point. Don't shot the messenger, simply sharing what I was told.
Hope your answer is correct and not just another dealer denial. Sorry it's just hard for me to believe what the dealers say as they all seemed to either act dumb to deny the early 110 issues back in the day. Being told your bike is perfect has got to be a nice feeling anyway.
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grc

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2018, 11:55:52 AM »

Interesting information.

I have a 2017 CVO with the 114. Just had the 10k service done last Saturday. I have had zero issues to date. The tech spoke with me when he got back from the test ride and said my bike is perfect. I asked him if he checked for sumping still and he said no, not unless the owner complains of symptoms related. He said they had a few early on and it is a non-issue at this point. Don't shot the messenger, simply sharing what I was told.

Not taking any shots, you're just reporting what someone told you.  But I hope you understand that just because someone at a dealership tells you something is not an issue it isn't necessarily true.  In my experiences it is rarely true.  And if it was true, why are we still seeing new reports of failures on recently purchased 2018 models?  Dealership people have been telling customers obvious defects are normal, they all do that, I've never heard of that problem, etc., for decades.  I've often wondered if that is part of the "factory training" they supposedly receive. ::)

Jerry
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Rooster

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2018, 02:34:05 PM »

Maybe they drink they drink the  MOCO Kool-Aide Jerry :huepfenjump3:
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Fatboy

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #18 on: September 06, 2018, 08:20:17 PM »

Well my local Dealer tried to put me at ease by gleefully stating "all our new bikes come with a lifetime powertrain warranty"!  ;D

I replied I'd rather know that the M8 issues have been acknowledged and the root cause(s) identified by the MFG as well as permanently remedied with documented proof so a "lifetime powertrain warranty" doesn't ever need to come into play for previously known engineering and design flaws.

Guess I scared him off as he quickly turned and scurried back to his office. LOL.

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #19 on: September 06, 2018, 08:48:06 PM »

Well my local Dealer tried to put me at ease by gleefully stating "all our new bikes come with a lifetime powertrain warranty"!  ;D

I replied I'd rather know that the M8 issues have been acknowledged and the root cause(s) identified by the MFG as well as permanently remedied with documented proof so a "lifetime powertrain warranty" doesn't ever need to come into play for previously known engineering and design flaws.

Guess I scared him off as he quickly turned and scurried back to his office. LOL.


Those selling dealer only warranties are very nice to have; so long as you never go more than 50 miles from home.
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flhse

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2018, 05:49:28 PM »

Only comparison I've been able to find so far is a parts manual side-by-side.  That should be instructive though.  Any new part or altered part should show a new part number or revision.  No other way to trust that old and new inventory aren't mixed.  That's not a gold standard of inventory management it's a minimum standard to avoid screw-ups.

That being so if Mother Harley is adhering to this basic minimum standard all the talk of new engines and specialty machining crankcase improvements for 2019 appear to be a wee bit bupkus.  At least if you believe the parts manuals.

Just finished doing a side-by-side of 2018 and 2019 parts diagrams for comparable CVO touring bikes. Exploded views of the engine cases and all their associated parts.  Everything was the same.

Found one difference between 2018 and 2019 in the cam chest.  It's not the oil pump.  Same part number for oil pumps (62400182) for both years.  Only difference between bottom ends in 2018 versus 2019 is a different oil pump cover with 2019 going to a cover that includes a new seal that didn't exist in 2018.  The seal isn't a revision of a seal used the prior year.  Instead it is a completely new addition to the cam chest that appears to add an additional sealing surface/attempt outboard of the original o-ring (which is the same).  This of course suggest the cover part is new for whatever machining is necessary to accept that seal.  The new 2019 part number for this is 62400206.

Everything else in the bottom end appears to stay the same though.  It was admittedly cursory look but if one can trust revisions by part numbers all the promises/suggestions that were ostensibly given to the unfortunate souls with failed or multiply failed bikes seem to be just a bit... um... overblown.

Hopefully the new seal is an end-all and be-all of the problem.  Much like poking a hole in the primary and calling the fluid transfer problem fixed I'll prefer to see the fleet collect some real miles before taking the MoCo's word for it.

Well, just had to buy one, here are a couple photo's of the new seal on the cover.
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flhse

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2018, 05:49:59 PM »

The other photo
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Twolanerider

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #22 on: September 22, 2018, 06:29:46 PM »

The pictures beg the obvious question Brad.  Since the seal carries a separate part number itself with the part in hand does it look to be as simple a replacement as the pictures suggest?
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flhse

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2018, 08:51:15 PM »

Well Don, I'd like to think so however without seeing what the seal mates up to inside the chest its kind of hard to say.  Couple more pics.

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flhse

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2018, 08:51:50 PM »

second pic
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SDCVO

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #25 on: September 22, 2018, 09:13:41 PM »

Boy I hope it works! New bike coming in next week.
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Alan

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2018, 11:49:28 AM »

Why would anyone believe that this new oil pump will prevent sumping when a guy starts a new thread in this forum with a brand new 2019 CVO RG that's already sumping and he hasn't even hit his 1000 mile service? And over on HDForums a different guy posts a video of his 2019 CVO dumping quarts of boiling oil on the ground. Different 2019 bikes already sumping ... in only a matter of a few weeks after launch? These 2019 bikes have the exact same oil pump upgrade (#9 version or higher) that guys are going to run out and have installed thinking their sumping woes are over? I don't think so!
« Last Edit: September 26, 2018, 01:02:17 PM by Heatwave »
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2018, 01:30:51 PM »

Agree.  Blood is in the water and the sharks are circling.
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Haird

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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #28 on: September 26, 2018, 03:09:58 PM »

Miss me yet?..... ;D
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Re: 2018-2019 comparison of engine and primary changes
« Reply #29 on: September 26, 2018, 04:20:54 PM »

nope.  still got my 2013   :bananarock:
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