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Author Topic: Open letter to Harley Davidson  (Read 5978 times)

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FLSTFI Dave

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #75 on: April 13, 2019, 08:18:17 PM »

In the meantime over on the Indian Forum there are spy pictures of an Indian in development with a fixed frame fairing like the Road Glide but also with a completely water cooled engine!!

I knew they were working on a Fixed fairing.  I did not know about the water cooled.  This will be interesting.
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mrmagloo

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #76 on: April 14, 2019, 12:14:47 PM »

I think what pisses me off more than anything is the big box corporate dealerships now. In the old days, you'd sit and have a beer with the owner and top guys, and talk shop. You'd just stop by to talk about what's coming down the pike, mods, etc. Everything was laid back and when you were ready to buy, you got fair deals. You walk in and they knew you by name.

Now this f$%*er Ozzie and his cohort investors have bought out just about every dealer with 50 miles of Chicago, and filled the places with a bunch of used car salesmen who are clueless. They have high pressure sales mgrs sitting on raised pedestals snapping fingers at their minions to attack the second you walk in. They start with the sales BS immediately and can't answer a single question. They now have cornered the market around here and they look at you like an alien if you even bring up club discounts or try to negotiate on a bike. F that.

Every time I go to parts, these guys are idiots. I have to look up my own stuff or they will f$%* it up. They don't have a friggin clue.

For years I was on the advisory panel, until I stopped answering personal questions about my f$%*ing income and chit. When it stopped being about the bikes, and only about my means, that was over the line.

I'm totally disgusted. I'm pretty well done with Harley too. I really don't care if they go belly up. The entire culture is gone. When they forced the independent owners out in favor of the big corporate machines, the writing was on the wall. Don't see any saving grace here.

My .02 fwiw.
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scottt

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #77 on: April 14, 2019, 01:58:35 PM »

I think what pisses me off more than anything is the big box corporate dealerships now. In the old days, you'd sit and have a beer with the owner and top guys, and talk shop. You'd just stop by to talk about what's coming down the pike, mods, etc. Everything was laid back and when you were ready to buy, you got fair deals. You walk in and they knew you by name.

Now this f$%*er Ozzie and his cohort investors have bought out just about every dealer with 50 miles of Chicago, and filled the places with a bunch of used car salesmen who are clueless. They have high pressure sales mgrs sitting on raised pedestals snapping fingers at their minions to attack the second you walk in. They start with the sales BS immediately and can't answer a single question. They now have cornered the market around here and they look at you like an alien if you even bring up club discounts or try to negotiate on a bike. F that.

Every time I go to parts, these guys are idiots. I have to look up my own stuff or they will f$%* it up. They don't have a friggin clue.

For years I was on the advisory panel, until I stopped answering personal questions about my f$%*ing income and chit. When it stopped being about the bikes, and only about my means, that was over the line.

I'm totally disgusted. I'm pretty well done with Harley too. I really don't care if they go belly up. The entire culture is gone. When they forced the independent owners out in favor of the big corporate machines, the writing was on the wall. Don't see any saving grace here.

My .02 fwiw.
WOW, thought i was the only one. You nailed it. A loyal Harley rider for 28 years, loved the "old days" when a Harley dealership was "the shop". I could walk back to see the wrench working on my bike. He would explain things, it was a brotherhood. As stated, it didn't  feel like it was just about money. The focus was riding Harleys and a connection with other riders along with your shop.

Once the dealers got rich they wanted more. The MoCo forced the high overhead fashion centers known called Harley dealerships.

The primary buyers I've seen have been car dealer chains and they run the new HD shopping centers as such with the backing of the MoCo.

All said; i still hope Harley returns to being a motorcycle company for the riders first. Build competitive rides. For now I've jumped ship and bought a 18 BMW K1600 B or bagger. While not perfect, the best motorcycle I've ever owned. They don't buy crankshafts in China, they make them themselves in Germany. I would have preferred buying another Harley after the 12 new ones i have owned but decided to stop.

Personally I'm turned off by fake tattoos, Harley branded clothing made in China for twice the price, car dealer owned dealers with balloons like cheap used car lots. On and on.

Harleys answer; electric bikes?  Why not invest in quality and competitive motorcycles?



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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #78 on: April 14, 2019, 02:09:02 PM »

+1 well stated.

Once they started building those mammoth new dealerships the writing was on the wall.  You need to move a lot of merchandise and appeal to a bigger market to make monthly payments.

Seems they don't care much about making the best motorcycles anymore.  Just leveraging the HD brand.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2019, 02:11:34 PM by 2002FXDWG3 »
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scottt

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #79 on: April 14, 2019, 03:38:20 PM »

+1 well stated.

Once they started building those mammoth new dealerships the writing was on the wall.  You need to move a lot of merchandise and appeal to a bigger market to make monthly payments.

Seems they don't care much about making the best motorcycles anymore.  Just leveraging the HD brand.
Bingo! Recently read an article about a car dealership chain that started buying Harley stores. The owner said he had a Harley and figured he could make good money selling all the Harley "lifestyle "products including clothing. Guess they figure that you become a biker by buying MoCo clothing and accessories?  Makes me wanta puke.

I think some of the car dealership owners that purchased Harley dealerships have miss-read many of there customers. They don't understand that many that ride will just buy used from private parties or companies like rumbleon.com for thousands less. That many will go to independent shops for service and yes, even buy another brand.

Bikers have pride. They Don't like being screwed with, they generally are independent.

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FLSTFI Dave

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #80 on: April 14, 2019, 08:53:57 PM »

Glad the dealership I use is not as you describe.  Yes, its a new mega store, opened in Sept 2004.  Not a Car company owner.

Owner is a business man who tried to open a store for 10 years before Harley let him open a store.  If you are a regular customer they know you by name, including the owner.  The salesmen know me, the sales manager knows me, motor clothes know me.  Parts dept knows me, Service director knows me and so on.  Since he opened that store, he has opened two more dealerships, 3 tee shirt shops and a used bike store.

Main store, has a bar and Smoke house on the property.  Also does concerts on Saturday nights.  Owner is a rider and damn good one at that, Sales Staff ride, mechanics ride, parts ride and some of motor clothes ride.

I would say Smokey Mountain Harley and its staff is a lot of why I still am on a Harley especially after my 15 that needed a new motor at 2 years old.

Dealer is very involved with riding.  They have a dealer lead ride every week.  They put on lots of riding events.
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #81 on: April 14, 2019, 08:59:27 PM »

I agree there's still some good dealers/owners out there.
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scottt

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #82 on: April 14, 2019, 09:12:48 PM »

Glad the dealership I use is not as you describe.  Yes, its a new mega store, opened in Sept 2004.  Not a Car company owner.

Owner is a business man who tried to open a store for 10 years before Harley let him open a store.  If you are a regular customer they know you by name, including the owner.  The salesmen know me, the sales manager knows me, motor clothes know me.  Parts dept knows me, Service director knows me and so on.  Since he opened that store, he has opened two more dealerships, 3 tee shirt shops and a used bike store.

Main store, has a bar and Smoke house on the property.  Also does concerts on Saturday nights.  Owner is a rider and damn good one at that, Sales Staff ride, mechanics ride, parts ride and some of motor clothes ride.

I would say Smokey Mountain Harley and its staff is a lot of why I still am on a Harley especially after my 15 that needed a new motor at 2 years old.

Dealer is very involved with riding.  They have a dealer lead ride every week.  They put on lots of riding events.
Happy for you, seriously. All that really matters is that your having a good time and feel positive about your dealer relationship.

We all have different expectations and points of reference. Mine should not matter to you or anyone for that matter.

Enjoy the ride

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T-Roy

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #83 on: April 15, 2019, 08:00:35 AM »

Evidence of a Liquid Cooled frame mounted fairing Indian coming.
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T-Roy

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #84 on: April 15, 2019, 08:07:16 AM »

More Evidence. Note: I copied all of this evidence from the Indian Owner's forum.
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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #85 on: April 15, 2019, 08:07:53 AM »

One more
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scottt

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #86 on: April 15, 2019, 08:32:33 AM »

That Indian is very interesting. One of BMW Motorrad's top designer's went to work for Indian after helping with the K1600 B or bagger.

Smart move, hire experienced, successful motorcycle designers to create a totally new model. Indian is serious competition for Harley and the motorcycle industry in general.

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charles05663

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #87 on: April 15, 2019, 10:50:57 AM »

More Evidence. Note: I copied all of this evidence from the Indian Owner's forum.

That almost looks like a Road Glide fairing.

 :oops: :nixweiss:
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charles05663

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #88 on: April 15, 2019, 10:57:20 AM »

Evidence of a Liquid Cooled frame mounted fairing Indian coming.

I can also see Indian allowing "leaks" of their future products.  HD riders for years have been wanting a full liquid cooled engine.  This give HD rider something to look forward to.

I guess the changes in environmental laws are drive the changes, at least at Indian.
 :oops: :nixweiss:
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And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.
Matthew 4:19

http://www.thefishermenministry.net/

Q:  What is the USA's number one export to China?
A:  Trash!  They loved our high quality trash. (not any longer).

      Stolen technology and Jobs!

scottt

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Re: Open letter to Harley Davidson
« Reply #89 on: April 15, 2019, 01:33:47 PM »

I can also see Indian allowing "leaks" of their future products.  HD riders for years have been wanting a full liquid cooled engine.  This give HD rider something to look forward to.

I guess the changes in environmental laws are drive the changes, at least at Indian.
 :oops: :nixweiss:
You can still epa certify an air cooled engine, that said, it takes water cooling to achieve higher levels of performance along with reliability. Many of todays buyers complain about engine heat as well.

Hopefully Harley invest in a water cooled touring bike with competitive performance and features.....at a competitive price.

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