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[GregKhougaz]

We’ve had the Rewire and the Hardwire. Now it’s time for the Harley-Davidson Reset.

Harley-Davidson ‘reset’ will lead to job cuts

The executives will probably get raises. Quality will not likely get better. But layoffs are coming.

[Twolanerider]

Front tires will become an add-on accessory cost at time of purchase.

[FLSTFI Dave]

The demand for motorcycles is way down and not just Harley.  Harley has way to much production capacity for the demand.  Unfortunately this means a reduction in employees.  If they do it correctly there should be a reduction in management be a similar or even larger % of the worker layoffs.

The last two Rewire and Hardwire resulted in less content on the motorcycles.  The eliminated standard feature, used lesser quality materials and so on.  We the consumer got less for our money.  I believe Reset will give the consumer even less for their money.

Harley should be focusing on suppler and their own efficiency.

[kojak]

Not really true. Demand for expensive, heavyweight motorcycles is down but there are several manufacturers that are experiencing significant growth, specially Triumph.

"Summary

Fastest growth in percentage terms (smaller niche/global brands):
✔ CFMoto
✔ Triumph Motorcycles

Strong regional performers / expanding brands:
✔ Royal Enfield
✔ TVS Motor Company
✔ Kawasaki (especially in the U.S.)

Largest global manufacturers with steady but smaller growth rates:
✔ Honda
✔ Hero MotoCorp

Decliners/Underperformers:
✔ Harley-Davidson"

The demand for motorcycles is way down and not just Harley.  Harley has way to much production capacity for the demand.  Unfortunately this means a reduction in employees.  If they do it correctly there should be a reduction in management be a similar or even larger % of the worker layoffs.

The last two Rewire and Hardwire resulted in less content on the motorcycles.  The eliminated standard feature, used lesser quality materials and so on.  We the consumer got less for our money.  I believe Reset will give the consumer even less for their money.

Harley should be focusing on suppler and their own efficiency.

[FLSTFI Dave]

Not really true. Demand for expensive, heavyweight motorcycles is down but there are several manufacturers that are experiencing significant growth, specially Triumph.

"Summary

Fastest growth in percentage terms (smaller niche/global brands):
✔ CFMoto
✔ Triumph Motorcycles

Strong regional performers / expanding brands:
✔ Royal Enfield
✔ TVS Motor Company
✔ Kawasaki (especially in the U.S.)

Largest global manufacturers with steady but smaller growth rates:
✔ Honda
✔ Hero MotoCorp

Decliners/Underperformers:
✔ Harley-Davidson"

I should have been more clear.  The heavy weight cruiser market is down significantly.  Harley's direct competitors are down like Indian, and Gold Wing.  Honda sales overall are up.

Key Factors Driving the Decline:

    Demographic Shift: The core audience for heavy, traditional cruisers is aging out of riding.

    Market Trends: Younger riders favor lighter, more technologically advanced, and less expensive motorcycles.

    Economic Pressures: High interest rates (7-9% for loans) make expensive bikes, often costing over $25,000, harder to finance.

    Inventory Issues: Reports indicate a significant backlog of unsold heavy motorcycles at dealerships.
   

[Ironhorse]

Let's not forget the frustration level of having to deal with all this. Dealerships "consolidating" or being bought out by an "auto group conglomerate" that runs it into the ground and walks away pockets full and customers angry and frustrated.  Now your closest dealer is over 100 miles away.

Then there's Harley dependability vs Honda and other brands.
Then there's the cost of a Harley vs other brands.

It used to be that owning a Harley dealership was like owning a casino. A license to print money.  But now we live in an era where a stable genius can bankrupt a casino and MoCo leadership can forget who and what got them there and it wasn't selling ball caps, shirts, flags, banners, shoes, wrist watches, catchy phrases, rallies and other stuff.  It was a good shop filled with good sales people who took care of long time customers and a shop full of mechanics who took pride in their work.

So like everything else, let the "reset" happen. 
The fault dear friends lies not in the stars but in the MoCo that this hath befallen. 

[Ironhorse]

Just curious:

If HD fails, how many would support a goverment bailout like they did of the auto industry in 2008 and 2009?  Some see it as socialism, others see it as saving jobs, others see it as rescuing so the company can turn around and come back and hopefully pay back some of the bailout like Chrysler did.

Or should we just let HD fail and be done with it? Move our passions on to more soluble motorcycle companies that are run better and produce a better product.

Would you support a government bailout, and why?   

[FLSTFI Dave]

Just curious:

If HD fails, how many would support a goverment bailout like they did of the auto industry in 2008 and 2009?  Some see it as socialism, others see it as saving jobs, others see it as rescuing so the company can turn around and come back and hopefully pay back some of the bailout like Chrysler did.

Or should we just let HD fail and be done with it? Move our passions on to more soluble motorcycle companies that are run better and produce a better product.

Would you support a government bailout, and why?   

That is a very difficult question.  I did not support the bailout for the auto industry.  They got them self's into that mess.

Hard to say if I would support a Harley bail out.  I love my Harley's, it is an American Icon.  I would say half of why Harley is in the position they are in is their fault.  The other half is not. 

I would have to give it lots of thought.

[kojak]

I dont think the story is written yet. Yes, "Harley is in a transition phase: trying to stabilize and reset the business with leaner production, financial discipline, and a slower paced recovery rather than rapid growth." Running a company that sells 135k motorcycles is very different from 2006 when they shipped 350k to the dealers. Its definitely going to be a much smaller, niche manufacturer with a devoted fan base. The new CEO understands this I believe and isnt chasing the holy grail to recapture irrevocably lost sales due to demographics and cost pressures. They can be right sized and continue as a profitable public corporation. Fewer dealers, fewer employees, fewer models. Getting out from under the tariffs would certainly help.

Just curious:

If HD fails, how many would support a goverment bailout like they did of the auto industry in 2008 and 2009?  Some see it as socialism, others see it as saving jobs, others see it as rescuing so the company can turn around and come back and hopefully pay back some of the bailout like Chrysler did.

Or should we just let HD fail and be done with it? Move our passions on to more soluble motorcycle companies that are run better and produce a better product.

Would you support a government bailout, and why?   

[Ironhorse]

That is a very difficult question.  I did not support the bailout for the auto industry.  They got them self's into that mess.

Hard to say if I would support a Harley bail out.  I love my Harley's, it is an American Icon.  I would say half of why Harley is in the position they are in is their fault.  The other half is not. 

I would have to give it lots of thought.

Agreed,

However HD is not "Bubba's Shrimp n Grits". By that I mean their factories and company support whole towns and communities.  If we let them fail we might be dooming the communities that support them too.  It's not a small business, it affects whole communities too.

[FLSTFI Dave]

Agreed,

However HD is not "Bubba's Shrimp n Grits". By that I mean their factories and company support whole towns and communities.  If we let them fail we might be dooming the communities that support them too.  It's not a small business, it affects whole communities too.

That is really not much different then when GM or Chrysler shuts a plant.  We have two town in TN that the manufacture in those towns closed their doors, small rural towns lost 800 jobs.  Employed half the town.  We are going to have some EV plants shutting or cutting way back, and the plants that support the EV plants.


As Kojak says, story is not yet written on Harley.  I do believe there will be a drastic down sizing of production, workers and management to right size it with demand wich is way down. 

[Ironhorse]

As Kojak says, story is not yet written on Harley.  I do believe there will be a drastic down sizing of production, workers and management to right size it with demand wich is way down.

Well I'm hopeful HD can turn it around, but it will take generations to repair the damage.  It's just sad to see so many family owned dealerships get burdened by the unreasonable and unsustainable floor plans set by management, and then get bought out by auto conglomerates who care for nothing other than filling their pockets. 

[FLSTFI Dave]

Well I'm hopeful HD can turn it around, but it will take generations to repair the damage.  It's just sad to see so many family owned dealerships get burdened by the unreasonable and unsustainable floor plans set by management, and then get bought out by auto conglomerates who care for nothing other than filling their pockets.

While I agree some of the floor plan and mega store mandated by Harley caused some of the dealers problems.  Many dealers also caused their own problems.  $200 or more Doc fees, never paid that for a car or truck, 50 at max.  Huge setup fees which are already included in the price.  Many charged over MSRP  So your looking at almost 2K over MSRP.  There is a whole lot of profit margin in the MSRP of the bike.  40 for a tee shirt, are you kidding me.  I use to by lots of T shirts, price went over 29.99 haven't bought one since.

Tried to buy a bike in 22 from a local dealer.  They came back with their numbers for my trade and their bike cost.  I promptly got up and started to leave.  I was asked where I was going, I said the numbers are not even close enough to negotiate.  They were 3K over on their bike for all the bs, and 2500 below low book on mine.

1.5 years latter when I did trade for a new bike, I got 4000 more than the above dealer offered for my bike.  Got the new CVO at MSRP.

[Tractor Bubba]

I hate to admit it, but the purchase of my current CVO was the very worst vehicle purchase experience of my life. I went through with it - but felt it was nearly extortion. Not the salesperson, but everything else was not at all a good experience. I had to point out to the sales manager the bike was showing on their website for thousands less than the original quote. And, them when I got to the “F&I guy” to do the paperwork, he tells me “that price is for financing” and if I pay cash, I lose one of the discounts!  Never heard that before…. 🤪

[Ironhorse]

I hate to admit it, but the purchase of my current CVO was the very worst vehicle purchase experience of my life. I went through with it - but felt it was nearly extortion. Not the salesperson, but everything else was not at all a good experience. I had to point out to the sales manager the bike was showing on their website for thousands less than the original quote. And, them when I got to the “F&I guy” to do the paperwork, he tells me “that price is for financing” and if I pay cash, I lose one of the discounts!  Never heard that before…. 🤪

Damn,....that IS extortion.  That should have been reported to consumer affairs, Motorcycle Consumer News (MCN) or local TV news.