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[Rhino]

The SE255 STOCK 110 SE CAM Specs.
 
INTAKEOPEN  6 
INTAKECLOSE  25
EXHAUSTOPEN  48
EXHAUSTCLOSE  7
INTAKEDURATION  211
EXHAUSTDURATION  235
OVERLAP  13
INTAKELOBE CENTER  100
EXHAUSTLOBE CENTER  111
INTAKE AND EXHAUST LIFT  .555
INTAKE LIFT OF .079 AT TDC
EXHAUST LIFT OF .070 AT TDC.

Now looking at specs with details like the above (a good spec site for all Harley compatible 07 cams at nightrider.com), I see people on this board recommending SE257's, 258's, and even 260's.  I see Wood TW-7's, Redshift 575's, 557's, Andrews 55's and 60's, and Freedom YB13 and 14's.  I am sure I left some out. But all these for the bagger?

However after reviewing the detail specs of each, there is nothing remotely similar to any of them. Durations, overlaps, timing, lift heights etc.  I admit I know little about selecting cams, but how is it possible that everyone says "it depends on your riding style"?  And how come so much difference from the factory? What am I missing here?

Hey, I ride, I want more power/torque, I want to cruise, I want reliability. How much darn difference are we all looking for across the board? I think not so much. I think we want to twist the throttle and go faster off the line, and we want faster from cruise...than stock.  .  So why the heck are there so many combinations for the same darn motor? Seems so confusing at this time, and I don't want to fall into the marketing hype, just plain common sense will do.

 

Maybe I am looking at this differently, but I don't want to crack the cases, but I will invest in checking out the heads and modifying them, ONLY if required, and I will go a larger TB ONLY if req. and new pistons ONLY if req and no bore.  The springs to me are a given. This seems to me to be the best all around upgrade, and affordable.  I would also consider a bolt in cam, but for the few hundred or so extra, why not make the combination run well with a few extras? Somebody must have also considered the cost/benefit scenario I think.

SO what says you all?

Rhino(stayingthefasteststockjesterintheuniversetillifigurethisouttheniwillstillbethefastestjesternomatterwhat)

[DCFIREMANN]

RHINO man a bunch of good questions.

First things first and the most important one of all. IF YOU ARE GOING TO DO ANY MAJOR UPGRADES break the cases and do the timken conversion. It is money well spent and a lot cheaper than a set of cases.

Now looking into cams and cam specs. Your riding style makes a good bit of difference. Remember one thing the longer the duration and the more overlap you have it will increase the RPMs that will be needed till the cam hits the power curve. Also the more duration and more overlap you have you will need more compression. The reason being with both valves being open at the same time you lose pressure. This loss of pressure means loss of power. It can also cause STANDOFF. Then you are really losing power.

In a heavy touring bike you want torque. The horsepower numbers are basically for bragging rights only. Torque is whats gets you moving. Look for a cam with a lot of lift and a little less duration. That is why Freedom and Zippers developed the CVO cams. They give you more static pressure and a good amount of lift and brings in your torque curve a lot earlier stretches it out and increases it. Whats not to like??

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[hd-dude]

I agree with DC. The question becomes what you want out of the bike and how much money you want to spend on it. If it is just mivng the tq curve down and getting more power earlier the cam swap wil be the ticket. For a bolt in for the 110 the YB14SE-07 is the cam my choice. If you will want more out of it then do as DC says and crack it open and do the conversion and weld the crank.

[The Mysterious Q!]

I think Screamin Beagle is now a self proclaimed cam technician! All you need to make good power is a set of rineharts. Ask the good Dr. Beagle he'll tell ya. And watch out for the early morning Growler.   Later,Q

[SBB]

Hey, I ride, I want more power/torque, I want to cruise, I want reliability. How much darn difference are we all looking for across the board? I think not so much. I think we want to twist the throttle and go faster off the line, and we want faster from cruise...than stock.  .  So why the heck are there so many combinations for the same darn motor? Seems so confusing at this time, and I don't want to fall into the marketing hype, just plain common sense will do.Rhino
You want more because everyone does.
I think you need to decide how much you want and go from there.
How much is enough? The answer is simple, there is never enough! No matter how much you have there will come a time when a little bit more would be nice.
So you pick a level and get there and ride that B**tard till you decide you want more.
At 140/140 in my Frontier I can tell you there is 12 to 15 more there for less than a grand.
My decision for the past 3K miles is I don't need it so why bother.
This is suppose to be fun. Decide the level you want and when you get there the fun begins.

 

Maybe I am looking at this differently, but I don't want to crack the cases, but I will invest in checking out the heads and modifying them, ONLY if required, and I will go a larger TB ONLY if req. and new pistons ONLY if req and no bore.  The springs to me are a given. This seems to me to be the best all around upgrade, and affordable.  I would also consider a bolt in cam, but for the few hundred or so extra, why not make the combination run well with a few extras? Somebody must have also considered the cost/benefit scenario I think.
You are the only one that can decide what is required.
Do the numbers. Are you close to $350.00 per horsepower.
Divide what you have in your bike by your horsepower and see where you are.
Whether it's stock or 140 like mine, the 350 per horsepower is close.
It comes down to how much horsepower are you willing to pay for?
Remember, even as much hell as I give you, it's still all about what you want.
Good luck!

 

SO what says you all?

Rhino(stayingthefasteststockjesterintheuniversetillifigurethisouttheniwillstillbethefastestjesternomatterwhat)

[SPIDERMAN]

I think Screamin Beagle is now a self proclaimed cam technician! All you need to make good power is a set of rineharts. Ask the good Dr. Beagle he'll tell ya. And watch out for the early morning Growler.   Later,Q

Air In

Air Out

You can't have one without the other.

B B

[hard10]

Chip, Did T-Man get all the parts in? I just sold some of the boats and cars so I have the $30k needed. Let me know!

AJ(soontobefasterthanrhinobyalongshotnomatterwhatthecostorconsequencetomypersonalwellbeing)

[Unbalanced]

Ronnie Ronnie Ronnie,

They talk about your riding style .... ??   What style ~  you get on you twist it hard and fill it with gas then rinse and repeat.   

I think before you can do anything since you have such a desire to do it right the first time that your going to need the heads off or a replacement set in hand to understand what your air delivery system is going to look like.  Then once you have that your going to be better suited to make a cam choice based on "your riding style" and where you want the power.   Until you have done this I think your just looking at increasing your post count   Next we will have to call you Howie Jr.   I think you should decide on the compression your willing to go to, the air flow your going to need / desire to do what you want to do.  Then match up the flows with the riding style / cam and supporting hardware cast to do the job.  Then make your purchase and enjoy the down time while the build happens.

Remember this is the internet don't believe everything you see on the internet as once quoted on this site.

At 140/140 in my Frontier I can tell you there is 12 to 15 more there for less than a grand.
My decision for the past 3K miles is I don't need it so why bother.
This is suppose to be fun. Decide the level you want and when you get there the fun begins.

Last I did the math 12 x 350 isn't a grand either more like 4200.

[Talon]

Some of the differences are just personal preferences and the choice made, some people might be just as happy with a different cam, but made their choice and are happy with the performance they got. Like stated above, it's also a riding style issue too. If you do mostly highway a$$ hauling, then you might be happy with less bottom end torque, but I don't think this is the case for most people. Also depends on the other mods you are willing to make, many cams need higher compression and head work to get much of their benefit, if you use these cams without doing the other work, you could be waisting your money. Some people just want that big number on a dyno chart, but pay for it around town. Look at the rpm range you do most of your riding in and choose cams that give you most of the hp and tq in that range. Looking at the site below can give you confirmation on the choices people recommend.

http://www.latus-harley-davidson.com/mbbs2/forums/forum-view.asp?fid=43

[Rhino]

Some good info here, but, talking about headwork, all I find is that if you do headwork, you are getting horsepower at the top, and it does nothing for the low end grunt.  I also think that the stock cam, and correct me if I am wrong, that it only exists for one thing, the 110 and the EPA .  Is this true?  Do you think someone would actually use the 255 in an aftermarket application?

About major upgrades, I personally dont think a reasonable cam and SE pistons are major upgrades to the stock side of things, if I stay there.  Perhaps new jugs and displacement would warrant a teardown, but maybe to just make this engine run at what it is supposed to do, the cases will stay put stock. I think.

Next, riding style.    Some days its traffic and grunt from light to light, but I think everyone hates that for more than an hour, I think most like to be a bit on the free side with open roads, and like to twist it and go.  I still believe that everyone kinda has a similar riding style on the baggers.  Nice to hit the upper scale once in a while, but low and midrange ooomph is where its at.  Now, HD Dude likes the freedom cams.  I am heearing good things about them. Are they proven and installed in a 110 yet?  And the details, they are not listed at nightrider yet.

SO,I think I am getting it now.  So each manufacturere makes cams for the 110, but if I understand this, the mating process of the cam, must relate to the TB, must relate to the gearing, must relate to the pipes and intake, so they all work in harmony.  If I stay with stock heads, cam A would be good. If I go with ported heads, and a larger TB, the cam B might be the best choice.  Am I on the right track?

If so, what I think I want is the cam to go with the SE 10.25 pistons, no headwork, no TB change, and stay with the ATune, RTDuals and AC.

So, as I have done with other projects, I will test the waters here, and call them my training wheel cams.  And BTW, I do my own work, not afraid of that, I rather enjoy it. So what cam would I want for the above?  Let me know model, manufacture and spec numbers and why, if you dare.  And SB, please use a calculator next time. You are scaring me.

Rhino(justignoreajheisnevergoingtomakeitfasterthanmeeverwithinthislifetimesorryajjustthefactsmaam)

[SBB]

At 140/140 in my Frontier I can tell you there is 12 to 15 more there for less than a grand.
My decision for the past 3K miles is I don't need it so why bother.
This is suppose to be fun. Decide the level you want and when you get there the fun begins.

Last I did the math 12 x 350 isn't a grand either more like 4200.

Hey lead dog
Don't confuse a slow computer with your version of voodoo math.
4200 might be a # based on your advice but fortunately Tman delivers facts not rhetoric that he read on some other V twin site or reads in a magazine.

See ya at MBBW! 
 

[SBB]

SO,I think I am getting it now.  So each manufacturere makes cams for the 110, but if I understand this, the mating process of the cam, must relate to the TB, must relate to the gearing, must relate to the pipes and intake, so they all work in harmony.  If I stay with stock heads, cam A would be good. If I go with ported heads, and a larger TB, the cam B might be the best choice.  Am I on the right track?

If so, what I think I want is the cam to go with the SE 10.25 pistons, no headwork, no TB change, and stay with the ATune, RTDuals and AC.

So, as I have done with other projects, I will test the waters here, and call them my training wheel cams.  And BTW, I do my own work, not afraid of that, I rather enjoy it. So what cam would I want for the above?  Let me know model, manufacture and spec numbers and why, if you dare.  And SB, please use a calculator next time. You are scaring me.

Rhino(justignoreajheisnevergoingtomakeitfasterthanmeeverwithinthislifetimesorryajjustthefactsmaam)

Rhino

You are getting it! 

So what part of the math scares you, the 350 per horse?
Some cost may be higher and some may be lower but the 350 is close.
100 H/P X 350 ='s an Ultra

 

[Unbalanced]

Trust me I am not confused and my comprehension is just fine.   
Not my voodoo math either Chippy, but your own statements .. 350 per hp like you said ... I will try and go really slow for you and your computer and see if you can follow your own information.   If you have 12 extra horsepower to find well based on your numbers 12 times 350 per horsepower = 4200 dollars not a 1000 dollars unless of course you went to a different school than the rest of us. 

Besides a man like you with all your means would lead us to believe that if there were 12 or 15 more to be had for only a 1000 dollars you wouldnt have spent the money up front to get it ...  sure sure.   

Whats also very interesting Chippy is that some of the other guys with your build have 150 / 150, so tell us are you just Sand Bagging ole Hubbard to toy with his emotions or what?

[Rhino]

No, it's not the $$, it's the knowledge and hunger. I am not one to drop off the bike at a shop and say do-it.  I want to understand it and be one with the mods.  Karma you know makes it faster if you build it yourself.

Rhino(dazedandconfusedjustbeforeibecomethefastestjesterwithacametc)

[hard10]

No, it's not the $$, it's the knowledge and hunger. I am not one to drop off the bike at a shop and say do-it.  I want to understand it and be one with the mods.  Karma you know makes it faster if you build it yourself.

Rhino(dazedandconfusedjustbeforeibecomethefastestjesterwithacametc)

Rhino that's why you'll never be the fastest! I say: Throw as much money as possible at it!!!    

That Karma stuff went out with the hippies. Wait a minute... How old are you???

AJ(ineedmoremoney)