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[DEB]

I'm not a PC fan because it is another layer of complexity added to an already complex system. With the R/T nothing is added to the bike, it just gives you the ability to talk to the ECM.
In time I think the R/T will be way more popular then the PC as everybody gets familiar with how to tune with it.
I went back and looked at dyno runs posted by JCZ, are you refering to the '103 crate motor' that show well above 110 ft lbs? Woods cam and carb......

[phattey]

Well I'm on the search for a better tuner than my dealer can supply...

I just got the bike home and while they were able to find a better AFR (13.4 - 14), but I lost some hp and tq.

I went from 90.4 to 88.7 HP....and 93.7 to 92.1 TQ with the better AFR.

The bike runs great and still feels strong. Yet, I'd like better numbers.

I'm going to set up a tune @ my buddy's Yamaha shop where they're trained by DynoJet on the PC and the actual dyno.

It'll be next week, so I'll show where we went from as it becomes ready.

Phattey...

[2uece]

I had the V&H pro pipe on my 01' Deuce and loved the hell out of it. I am now on a 05' FLHTCSE2 and have been making my eyes bleed on this web sight tring to decide what to do. I want what most of you want ...the most bang for the buck. Has anyone thought of Thunderheaders as an option? I love the sound and would concider them if the HP & TQ are close to the Pro Pipes. Let me know what you think.
Thanks in advance
2uece [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

[ak]

I had the V&H pro pipe on my 01' Deuce and loved the hell out of it. I am now on a 05' FLHTCSE2 and have been making my eyes bleed on this web sight tring to decide what to do. I want what most of you want ...the most bang for the buck. Has anyone thought of Thunderheaders as an option? I love the sound and would concider them if the HP & TQ are close to the Pro Pipes. Let me know what you think.
Thanks in advance
2uece [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

I,d bet money 2to1 that the thunderheader will out perform any 2 into 1 pipe out there would love to see someone run dyno with thunderheader -AK

[MAS]

I,d bet money 2to1 that the thunderheader will out perform any 2 into 1 pipe out there would love to see someone run dyno with thunderheader -AK
 

AK,

Bear posted a dyno sheet on this thread http://flhrsei.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=eg_gen;action=display;num=1072508181;start=165#165 page 12. He has a Thunderheader and the runs are with stock cams and 211's. His numbers look great to me [smiley=laugh.gif].

[PCC]

JMORTON10

I'm not sure you know what these tuning programs do! The Race Tuner and Powercommander interfaces function in the same manner and the ECM inputs are the same. Air/Fuel Matrix and Ignition Curves. The difference is with the Powercommander you get feedback from the dyno with the Race Tuner...you don't. Your statement  that  "with a good tuner the RC will beat the PC every time is unsupported and the dyno rresults on this site support just the opposite viewpoint.

I'm not necessarily a PC fan...but  without a dyno interface, it's going to take lomger and be harder to do EXACTLY THE SAME THING.

[mfgreen]

JMORTON10

I'm not sure you know what these tuning programs do! The Race Tuner and Powercommander interfaces function in the same manner and the ECM inputs are the same. Air/Fuel Matrix and Ignition Curves. The difference is with the Powercommander you get feedback from the dyno with the Race Tuner...you don't. Your statement

[ak]

MAS: Thanks for the direction to thunderheader dyno run   i must have missed that post-AK

[Twolanerider]

I agree that the majority on this site support the pc for the immediacy of feedback.

[BLM777]

Right on the money 2lane.  The secret is indeed, the "nut behind the wheel" when it comes to dyno tuning.  I've used both and think that the results are about equal depending upon the experience of the tuner, or of the last few years, my ability to get it exactly where I want it.  Of late, I've tuned almost exclusively with the RT, but that is influenced greatly by having nearly unlimited dyno time with a couple of old pro's that specialize in that product.  Contrary to what some say, the RT seems to fit better with my old brain than does the PC.  Probably a short circuit somewhere on my end.  In short, a good tuner should be left alone with the equipment that facilitates his ability to squeeze the very last HP and TQ out of what he has to work with.

[mfgreen]

so twolane rider,
what do you think of the results you are getting from your current dyno guy?
If you are satisfied with the results that is what it is about.

[Twolanerider]

so twolane rider,
what do you think of the results you are getting from your current dyno guy?

For a bike with only the exhaust and air cleaner changed and no internal mods of any kind I'm ok with what my local dyno guy did    .  

Of course I'm lucky in that John Golden (aka., Rolling Thunder Dyno) lives only about 5 minutes from my house.  At least that's where he's at when he's not out on the road 8 months out of the year taking the dyno to rally after rally after rally after rally after rally.  

In all seriousness I wish the torque curve rolled in a little earlier.  But it won't without working inside the motor.  And, at least right now, I just don't care enough to make the change worthwhile to me.  Even for just a cam change.

[mfgreen]

Yeah Don,
I think you are right.  Your numbers are good.

If you tear into the motor, valve sizes can be changed and the head can be flowed to really bring forth the potential of the 103.  Alittle work can be done with the intake to tweak that, too.  All in all, I think you are doing well on this motor.  

There is another thread that I think PCC started as a results oriented comparison of pretty much what you have already done.  It should be an interesting comparison for us to look at on how the results turn out with the different combinations.  Thanks for the dyno sheet.

Mike

[jmorton10]

I agree that the majority on this site support the pc for the immediacy of feedback.

[Twolanerider]

If the PC quits on the road(& they do)you're out of luck.

If the Power Commander fails on the road you're not completely out of luck.