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[beerman]

Bike is in to get valve train noise looked at. Rockers / rods / lifters...I mentioned checking the runout and the Service Writer said it would be pretty expensive and all on me! NOT under warranty.
Perhaps I misunderstood the suggestions from other guys on the board.
The bike is not going in for base gaskets right now - just the valve ticking issue - can they check the runout or is it something to wait until they are doing head / base gaskets.??
Man, this bike sure is noisy once it get hot - the rat a tat tat around 2000 RPM is annoying as h*ll
any advise or help is appreciated - they aren't cracking it open until Monday around noon
thanks
-Beerman

[Steve_G]

Maybe you should make a deal with the shop.  Tell 'em you'll pay to have this checked (assuming they have the tools and skill to accurately do so)  -and if there's a problem, ie. out of spec.  they pay for the whole shebang under warranty.  Personally, I believe Donny Petersen's 1 thou. spec.  -Hell, there's not even a bearing for the back of the cam journal to spin in! 
You'll have the satisfaction of KNOWING the pinion shaft runout, and the satisfaction of a smoother ride!
I'd make sure if it isn't within .001" runout, they have someone who can true the flywheels.  I wouldn't want some highschool dropout new "tech" telling me the runout is at -say .003" and have them put it back together telling you "it's OK, it's not at .004".
-Just my 2 cents.

[Hoist!]

Bike is in to get valve train noise looked at. Rockers / rods / lifters...I mentioned checking the runout and the Service Writer said it would be pretty expensive and all on me! NOT under warranty.
Perhaps I misunderstood the suggestions from other guys on the board.
The bike is not going in for base gaskets right now - just the valve ticking issue - can they check the runout or is it something to wait until they are doing head / base gaskets.??
Man, this bike sure is noisy once it get hot - the rat a tat tat around 2000 RPM is annoying as h*ll
any advise or help is appreciated - they aren't cracking it open until Monday around noon
thanks
-Beerman

It's all based on how your dealer handles it. With all your noises, he can easily make a case that he hears it from the cam chest too. If he can't devise a method to check this for you. then he's not really working with you. With all the problems on the 110, he should go out of his way to make sure your motor is sound. And it's all how he presents it to the MoCo. Are you doing cams? If not, you might want to think about telling him you want 251 cams. It will not cost anything to check runout, if your paying for a cam job. If it's no good, of course you're not doing cams, you're getting a new engine. If it's good, go ahead with the cams. Make sure he won't give you a w.....ty problem with the 251's. If he does, find another dealer! If you do the cams, make sure you also use the 50mm SE TB.

Hoist!

[Fired00d]

From what I understand that is a common practice to charge for this procedure. If it is found to be out of the MoCo specs then it will be a covered warranty item, if not then it is your dime. They will not go by any other specs then what the MoCo have established however.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Steve_G]

I brought my wife's '99 Road King and my 2000 Ultra to my previous Harley dealer, from whom I'd purchased 11 new bikes, regarding the cam bearing issue.  I got the letters telling me they'd cover anything caused by cam bearing failure for 50k miles -yada -yada. 
I wasn't comfortable with that crap and told the shop so.  They installed new Timkens and turned it in as a warranty claim saying "I heard a noise".  -Didn't pay a dime.  Got my satisfaction.  It's all in how the dealer wants to treat you.  -Obviously there have been problems with excessive runout.  I know I'll have mine checked if and when I finally get my new bike.  The real problem is the feeling of uncertainty about whether your bike is OK or not.  I don't like that feeling.  "Enquiring minds want to know".  Retail- PLUS

[skreminegul07]

Talking with customer service, they agreed to check the runout before replacing the two cylinders.  Makes sense.  It goes in on Monday.

[Chief]

Bike is in to get valve train noise looked at. Rockers / rods / lifters...I mentioned checking the runout and the Service Writer said it would be pretty expensive and all on me! NOT under warranty.
Perhaps I misunderstood the suggestions from other guys on the board.
The bike is not going in for base gaskets right now - just the valve ticking issue - can they check the runout or is it something to wait until they are doing head / base gaskets.??
Man, this bike sure is noisy once it get hot - the rat a tat tat around 2000 RPM is annoying as h*ll
any advise or help is appreciated - they aren't cracking it open until Monday around noon
thanks
-Beerman

The problem is that the runout is in the bottom end and everything else we're chasing is in the top end. To check the runout, they need to open the cam chest, which is not involved with any of the top-end work. That is why they're looking at it as two different jobs.

Some others have approached it as part of a cam swap, which is in the cam chest.  So while they're swapping cams, which is easier if the rockers are off, they can check the runout without any extra effort to charge you for.

I hope this helps.

[GasRat]

I know I've seen it somewhere,  But what is considered acceptable run out?  I just got my bike back today from having the engine replaced because of a runout of .042.  I told them that I wanted the runout checked on the new motor for a reference point and was told it was "much better" because it was  at .012 which to me still seems pretty excessive.  I will admit that the oil psi is running at a much better 38 to 40 psi at about 2500rpm.  And the motor seems to be running pretty solid (knock on wood) so far, but I can't help but wonder if this motor is going to be any better than the last.

[skreminegul07]

While the exhust is off for the head removal, its pretty easy to take off the cam cover.  Basically a little time and a gasket.    Call customer service at HD and demand this be done while their defective engine is being rebuilt.  Why rebuild the top end of an engine that is in process of self destructing?

[REGGAB]

I know I've seen it somewhere,  But what is considered acceptable run out?  I just got my bike back today from having the engine replaced because of a runout of .042.  I told them that I wanted the runout checked on the new motor for a reference point and was told it was "much better" because it was  at .012 which to me still seems pretty excessive.  I will admit that the oil psi is running at a much better 38 to 40 psi at about 2500rpm.  And the motor seems to be running pretty solid (knock on wood) so far, but I can't help but wonder if this motor is going to be any better than the last.

GasRat:
If the new motor they stuck in your scooter has .012" runout, you need to put that thing on a trailer, take it back to your servicing dealer, and get yet another new engine.  That reading is way, way out of the .003 specification.  I'm wondering if you meant to write ".0012"."

[rednectum]

hd says replace crank if more than .003. andrews says .004 is limit for gear drive. replacement crank i just installed from GMR-------less than .001.

[grc]

I know I've seen it somewhere,  But what is considered acceptable run out?  I just got my bike back today from having the engine replaced because of a runout of .042.  I told them that I wanted the runout checked on the new motor for a reference point and was told it was "much better" because it was  at .012 which to me still seems pretty excessive.  I will admit that the oil psi is running at a much better 38 to 40 psi at about 2500rpm.  And the motor seems to be running pretty solid (knock on wood) so far, but I can't help but wonder if this motor is going to be any better than the last.

GasRat,

Hopefully the person you talked to said twelve tenthousandths, not twelve thousandths.  A true runout of twelve tenthousandths (.0012) would be very good for a current factory crank, but a runout of .012 would be disaster waiting to happen again.  According to Harley's own manuals, anything worse than .003 is NFG and should be replaced.

Jerry

[beerman]

Chief--
thanks - I get it now
I'm going to call or stop in on Monday and ask that they pop the cover on the Cam side and check it
Gasket and a hour should be the tops I'm guessing cost wise - I'll feel better
if it's way out then I'll ask the MOCO to pick it up regardless
This kind of bites !
have a good weekend
-Beerman

[GasRat]

I'm starting to think the tech just don't know what he's talking about.  He told me "12".  When he said that I asked 12 thousandths?  And he said yes, but with a slightly confused look. So I really think he saw .0012 on the indicator and doesn't know how to read the thing and just told me 12.

[Steve_G]

If the "tech" doesn't know how to read the gauge, I wonder if he knows how to properly use it?  Maybe he's      :orange:WORTHLESS