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[110tHunDer]

Brian, that is exactly right.
If it isn't figured in then it will come out of profits.
It's a part of doing business.
Could you imagine the outrage when stock holders find out your using profits to settle warranty claims. Heads will roll!

Chip, I understand all that, but my point is, maybe it's becoming an excessive part of doing business at H-D these days.  And there comes a point where the market will not bear it.  Particularly when it seems the warranty is not honored, as it appears is the case with srqseeg.

Heads will also roll when profits fall off due to declining sales, right?  [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

[hd2003-se2005]

 Quote below from grc
"By the way, I refused to buy a Harley back during the AMF days due to the lousy quality, and instead rode several different Japanese bikes."
**********************************************************************
Why do people whine, get rid of the problem if it bothers you that bad.

Actually I had a 77 AMF Superglide in 78. Paid 3k for it, rode it 20K miles and sold it for 3.5K.
The guy that bought it just sold it in 04 for 11K. Not bad for an AMF POS.
************************************************************************

Another grc quote
"and every one of them would  blow the Harley's of the day into the weeds."

Sounds like one of those whinny Jap bike owners I used to race.
Always had to run them twice. They never believed it the first time.

And if they wanted to run a third time then I made them put up some money.
So imagine, beside whing because they got out run by a Harley, they were also cheap!

Life is so much fun! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif] FoA

[hd2003-se2005]

Chip, I understand all that, but my point is, maybe it's becoming an excessive part of doing business at H-D these days.  And there comes a point where the market will not bear it.  Particularly when it seems the warranty is not honored, as it appears is the case with srqseeg.

Heads will also roll when profits fall off due to declining sales, right?  [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Your right Brian
When all the whiners and wannabee's move to Goldwings then sales will fall and prices will become reasonable again for the faithful to have plenty.

And YES Brian there are exceptions. the peeling chrome, Mrs. We, etc.
But in my world I fix my problems, not just complain about them.


[smiley=oops.gif] maybe Tater's wrong and I'm the a$$hole.

[shovelhead71]

2 cents worth please -
there are harley owners that should have never bought the bike in the first place - they would find anything to bitch about and never satisfied with anything they probably own - you could gold plate their bike for free and they would bitch about the color of the gold - go figure.
there are harley owners that have higher expectations from warranty than what warranty allows - read the fine print of what is covered and what is not - what determines warranty claims and what does not. have you ever talked with anyone one to see what is actually warranty and what is not besides what they think is warranty.
there are harley owners that never repaired a dang thing on their bike - have no clue how to fix it and expect immediate results when a dealer has to fix it -  this refers to operations of the bike of what noises are natural etc.
there are harley owners that should immediately sell their bike - go buy another MFG"S brand of X bike - go piss up their rope and see how much you get from them - and you deserve it - then go take some x-lax and give the rest of us a break from the bitching.
these 2 cents worth refers to no-one so don;t go bashing on me - its life's experiences that I am commenting on here.
YOUR local dealer if you are buying from them - having your bike serviced there - frequently do business with them - have what is called COMP MONIES allowed to them for non covered warranty claims - this is not an endless amount of $'s and is used for good customers to cover their valued customers non-paid warranty repair.
1 more bitch I have - any piece of machinery is man made - it can take a crap at anytime even brand new out of the box - bad chrome - well chit happens - something rubs - something comes loose - something rattles - something does not "read" correctly - remember what is MOCO manufactured - they do not make their own gauges - and many other items - call their vendor who produces this stuff and bitch to them. I expect perfect chrome/gauges/tires/batteries/etc - but what i expect in life just ain;t reality with anything I buy.
when I specifically deal with a customer at the dealership I treat them as I expect myself to be treated - and have warranty - non-warranty items repaired as I would expect and I am one picky S.O.B.
Last penny - if someone has a specifc honest to goodness problem with a dealer than my opnion is lets start a specific thread on that problem and collect data and make specific connections with MOCO to get it dealt with as 1 power - power of CVO owners - the ELITE of Harley Owners. Also to deal directly with that dealer as a group on the same basis - they are many more smarter here than I to know how to do this and can probably come up with an attack plan for when needed.

[Rsantucc]

Question: Everyone that is having issues, are you complaining about the Manufactures 1 or 2 year warrentee or are you complaining about the Extended Warrantee purchased over and above the bike. Just intesretd in finding out what warrantee has the issues?

[JCZ]

Just a reminder guys, to please review "Rules For Posting".  Bullet Point #3 and #4 in particular.  

Please review this post from this morning, also.........

http://flhrsei.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=CVO_SITE;action=display;num=1118675835

Thanks a bunch guys!

[srqseeg]

Hey Gang,

Lots of interesting posts on this thread.  Seems like bona fides are required from the way some of you folks talk, here's mine--Owned a Sportster and moved up to 1996 Wide Glide.  Outgrew Sportster and loved Wide Glide.  Moved to the SEEG last fall (okay, maybe I outgrew the Wide Glide as well).  My beef was/is with the MoCo Customer Service leadership, and in turn, Company leadership.  My transmission "clunks" when shifting into first--no gripes, put in some Redline and it's a bit better.  Bad light in tour pak nearly burned the bike up--got a replacement bulb, but no real solution.  Turn signals burn out at an alarming rate--again, no gripe, just replace the puppy.  Suspension rode like a lumber truck and seat was downright painful--again, problem solved by purchasing different shocks and seat.  Engine ran very hot--just paid $1,300+ and replaced the air cleaner, exhaust, and used race tuner--problem solved.  Trouble starting when engine is hot.  Problem seems minor and I just crank it a bit longer at gas stations to get it started as MoCo does not seem to have a solution.  No bitching or whining, just facts.

Now, after all of this, with no complaints to the MoCo, I find a simple little decorative piece which does not even impact performance has an issue.  MoCo Customer Service could have simply said; know it's a problem, here's a couple of replacement pieces.  Instead, I get the company line, a real fear of approving a previously denied and valid warranty claim because others may ask for reconsideration.  Not a good answer.  Finally, to find out the powers that be could care less (no folks, the leadership of the MoCo does NOT read our letters) about our concerns was the final blow.  

The downright pettiness of the Customer Service leadership leads me to believe Harley is having a heck of a time providing a quality product at current production levels.  Therefore, the MoCo fights us rather than helps.  Look at some of the horror stories some here have had.  That's a lot of problems.

So why am I concerned?   When I ride (and I suspect many of you do as well), I want others to know we are riding the best damn motorcycle in the world and we are happy with every aspect of our Harley ownership.  I would also venture a guess none of us are lining up outside the local Honda dealer for their newest model.  Collectively, I believe, many of us are heartsick over the seeming lack of concern for quality and/or customer service by our favorite company and/or dealer.

I just want ALL of us to be treated fairly.  It would be great to wake up one day and find the company finally does care about the rides we buy from them.  Company apologists be damned, what is right, is right.

Hope this helps those who might have wondered why I started this thread in the first place.

[ccr]

Hey Gang, Lots of interesting posts on this thread.  ,,,,,  I would also venture a guess none of us are lining up outside the local Honda dealer for their newest model.  Collectively, I believe, many of us are heartsick over the seeming lack of concern for quality and/or customer service by our favorite company and/or dealer.

I just want ALL of us to be treated fairly.  It would be great to wake up one day and find the company finally does care about the rides we buy from them.  ...Hope this helps those who might have wondered why I started this thread in the first place.

Thanks so much srqseeg for perservering through all this.  I do love my motorcycle, my second HD motorcycle. I also ride mine, it does not sit in the garage just looking pretty. I have had more than one problem and the MoCo customer service does not care and does not read our letters.  They do forward them onto a rep, so collectively they may do some good.  I am probably not going to run out and buy a Honda, but I have to say, the very - very happy glow of ownership is getting very cloudy and a heart sick feeling comes when continually get no respect.  Now - for me - to fix my problems - I am throwing a ton of money at them at a non HD dealership.  Hopefully at some point I will have a bike that works.  That is what I hope for. Then I can just happily go down the road riding a Big Harley Davidson motorcycle and SMILE Real Big when heads turn when people realise that was a girl on that bike, and not hang my head when asked what I think about my gorgeous bike.   [smiley=laugh.gif] You see ----- flaking paint, peeling chrome, non working parts and ridiculous service aside, I really do love my HD motorcycle and I love to ride it too.  Want to go for a ride?   [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

[shovelhead71]

just had to get a post back in here and in a more constructive manner  [smiley=1syellow1.gif] I am on my 31st motorcycle and it is my YELLOW - so there has been many occasion to have warranty work done - also many a non-paid warranty on many a brand of X bikes - my 30th bike is one I built and guess what - not everything is perfect on that bike - same seals that HD uses on their production bikes were purchased straight from an outside non-bike vendor (bearing & seal company) and they also wound up leaking - so who should I call besides myself ? items sent out for professional chroming started to flake after a couple months and had to pull it and send it back - this company does not work for any bike manufacturer - guages purchased straight from a major gauge manufacturer do not read correctly ?? but this bike is a riot to ride and mash the throttle on and loves 115 octane also - manx - bultaco - penton - yamaha - kawasaki - honda - ducati - bsa - triumph are just some of the past owned rides, and loved em all along with all the HD rides starting from a 69 XLCH Sportster [smiley=drink.gif]

[fxdjerry]

I'm on my eight new out of the box Harley . I can't believe I have been so lucky. Each year they get a little better. I have had misc new BMW bikes they were all good too. Before that used Honda, Triumph, Nortons, all neede work before and after a ride, but all fun bikes. My favorite poster is the one with the sea of "metric bikes" in a pile, all rusting in a huge junk yard. The caption below is "can you spot the Harley in this picture?". To me the guy from Stone Mountain, GA. hit the nail on the head about what is the perfect machine. Just simple to me ,I like the way Harley Dresser's drive nothing "feels" like it to me. So the machine ain't perfect , customer service ain't perfect. Life is too short to worry about this stuff. Nobody will take anything with them when they leave.

[Coolbreeze]

Hmmmmm......   To me the problem is a LOT more localized, and I don't know if this is fed by responses from the MoCo or just the local dealership owner...  I've had too many bikes to count at this point, most non-harley, most purchased used...  I've reached that point in my life now however, that I buy new products of the highest possible quality, and expect the input of $$ to indicate to me that they are high quality, and when there are problems they are taken care of professionally.  

I get exquisite service from my BMW dealer.  He will come to me, pick up my 765, fix whatever is wrong, detail it, fill it with premium and bring it back to me, whether I am at work or at home.  And he is visibly sorry when I have a problem, explains the issue, and takes the time to tell me what to look out for with that and other issues that may be coming up...  

My first new Harley experience was terrible.  The dealership wouldn't let me ride it.  they said "figure out what you want and buy it, then you can ride it"  I wanted it so bad that I fell for it...  Bad choie of bike, and lousy service...  The second through the fourth new harleys were great!  Great dealerships, great service, great bikes, the whole experience was like coming home to family.  Then I got to Oregon...

We've purchased three bikes from them now...  All have been service and maintenance nightmares.  The maintenance issues I can't blame completely on the dealership becuase stuff that isn't put together right just isn't right.  But, without exception, everytime I have taken one of them in for maintenance or warranty work, it has turned out badly.  A side case literally fell off of my wifes buell on the way home from having the leak on that case "fixed".  They used a sticky gasket, but forgot the bolts...  Big scratches in the chrome from a cam change...  a muffler that fell off on an exhaust change...  a front wheel that was laced up off center almost 3/4" from where it should have been, and then they wouldn't fix it...  They said I had played with the spokes and moved it over...   And then my SEEG2...  oh my god... the list is extensive and the verbal abuse I took from the owner just to get the bike was probably close to criminal.  And the fit and finish of the bike, (which I dearly love in spite of it all), is atrocious.  I am still tweaking and putting things right on the bike, and any waranty service is out of the question from this dealership.  However, I have a dealership 2 1/2 hours up the road that says they will just come pick the bike up, treat it right, take care of the problems and bring it back to me, because "that's what good service is supposed to look like."

Yup, I'm with Mrs We., I'm a bit bruised, but I'm still hopefull.  I am afraid though, that the heyday of good service and quality is over for HD, and that we are riding the downhill side of the good products and services that we used to see...   and [smiley=mean.gif] I am very saddened by it.

[Fatboy]

I called Customer Service today, first time ever and I'm on my 7th new bike in the last 9 years..........anyway I was appalled that it took 1 hour and 15 minutes on hold to get a live body to take the call. If that's customer service the MOCO way there is a major problem here folks. Either to many customer issue's being called in (poor quality control?) or staffing issues needs to be addressed.

Is it normal to be put on hold for that long a period of time? [smiley=nixweiss.gif] Oh yeah, at the 1 hour mark a "customer service operator" came on the line and asked if wanted to hold for the "customer service department" [smiley=confused5.gif] I responded by asking her if she thought I'd be on hold for an hour if I didn't want to speak to someone?? [smiley=furious.gif]

Oh well, at least now I have a reference number registering my call.............

[srqseeg]

Update and Additional Appearance Problem:

The dealer went to bat for me concerning the saddlebag trim strip.  Seems a service bulletin had been sent to the dealers concerning the bracket rubbing on the trim strip.  Area Rep initially said; "No" but when the dealer explained customers do not receive service bulletins the dealer and area rep came to an agreement to take care of the trim strips for me.

Now the paint on the air cleaner cover in red paint which has the "Screamin' Eagle" script is coming off.  Dealer advised the warranty only covers a single cosmetic correction by Harley Davidson under warranty.  Sounds screwy to me.  Anyone else heard the same story or have the same problem?  Will not ask for a new air cleaner cover just in case the chrome starts coming off of the wheels.  Now my air cleaner cover reads "Seamin' Eag".  Think I will just leave it that way.  Thanks MoCo!

[110tHunDer]

Wow, you need to find another dealer.  I had the front wheel replaced (peeling chrome) within the first two weeks I owned the bike (October 2004) and am now having all four  floorboards replaced and the transmission top cover, also for peeling crhome.

Are they referring to painted parts when making the "one cosmetic correction" claim?  Still seems screwy even if that's the case.

[srqseeg]

103-

The dealer did not distinguish between paint or chrome.  Simply "cosmetic."  My wheels are okay, but one of the examples we discussed was chipping chrome on the wheels and I was told; "Yeah, the wheel is $800."  So the dealer is taking virtually any appearance item and considering it "cosmetic" at the behest of the MoCo, no doubt.  The dealer is going to report the problem, but not put in a claim (since if we only get one shot, I certainly don't want to "waste" my one cosmetic replacement on an air cleaner cover).

One cosmetic problem seems like a screwy limitation.