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[spydglide]

'breeze, haven't you ever read or heard a joke that was so good it brought tears to your eyes?  Well, in the interest of efficiency we have found a way to skip directly to the tears without wasting a lot of time with the joke.

Jerry

Is this what's referred to as 'dark' humor?  spyder

[RJ749]

Well, you knew it would happen.................

With Gas Falling, Trucks Come Back

After nearly a year of flagging sales, low gas prices and fat incentives are reigniting America's taste for big vehicles. Trucks and SUVs will outsell cars in December, according to researchers at the automotive Website Edmunds.com, something that hasn't happened since February. Meanwhile, the forecast finds that sales of hybrid vehicles are expected to be way down. "Despite all the public discussion of fuel efficiency, SUVs and trucks are the industry's biggest sellers right now as a remarkable number of buyers seem to be compelled by three factors: great deals, low gas prices, and winter weather," commented Michelle Krebs of Edmunds. Gasoline prices now average about $1.67 a gallon, according to the most recent AAA gas price survey. Prices had topped $4 a gallon this summer. This month, trucks and SUVs will make up 51 percent all vehicles sold in the U.S., according to CNN. And for every truck they sell this month, automakers are spending an average of about $5,200 on incentives, according to data from Edmunds.com. Next year, incentive spending is expected to drop and, correspondingly, prices paid by consumers will rise as recently announced production cutbacks limit the supply of new vehicles.

[Coolbreeze]

Quote from: grc on December 23, 2008, 05:28:12 AM
'breeze, haven't you ever read or heard a joke that was so good it brought tears to your eyes?  Well, in the interest of efficiency we have found a way to skip directly to the tears without wasting a lot of time with the joke.

Jerry

Is this what's referred to as 'dark' humor?   spyder


Ahhhhh! you guys are killin' me!!!   And my brother-in-law just showed up in his brand spankin' new Excursion...   Holy sheet, batman, that creetter is BIG!!!  but, according to him, it gets such good mileage , that he just couldn't resist!   

[FNGw/08SERK]

Wonder how the CMC will manage plants like this one 


http://info.detnews.com/video/index.cfm?id=1189

[grc]

Quote from: grc on December 23, 2008, 05:28:12 AM
'breeze, haven't you ever read or heard a joke that was so good it brought tears to your eyes?  Well, in the interest of efficiency we have found a way to skip directly to the tears without wasting a lot of time with the joke.

Jerry

Is this what's referred to as 'dark' humor?   spyder


[color]]Ahhhhh! you guys are killin' me!!!   And my brother-in-law just showed up in his brand spankin' new Excursion...   Holy sheet, batman, that creetter is BIG!!!  but, according to him, it gets such good mileage , that he just couldn't resist!   

I hate to talk about anyone's relatives, even the in-laws, but I think you need to keep a close eye on that brother-in-law.  He is obviously delusional.  Last time I checked an Excursion's fuel economy was measured in gallons per mile, not the other way around.

I guess when a person really wants something they can always find a way to justify it.  Just look at all of us idiots who paid way too much for Harley's so-called flagship models.

Jerry

[RJ749]

Auto Supplier Tells GM Where To Go

 

This message says a lot about our need to stand up and be responsible.  Hopefully it will get a wide distribution.

This is one of the greatest responses to the requests for bailout money I have seen thus far.  As a supplier for the Big 3 this man received a letter from the President of GM North America, requesting support for the bail out program.  His response is well written, and has to make you proud of a local guy who tells it like it is.

 -------------
Dear Employees & Suppliers,

 Congress and the current Administration will soon determine whether to provide immediate support to the domestic auto industry to help it through one of the most difficult economic times in our nation's history.  Your elected officials must hear from all of us now on why this support is critical to our continuing the progress we began prior to the global financial crisis.

As an employee or supplier, you have a lot at stake and continue to be one of our most effective and  passionate voices.  I know GM can count on you to have your voice heard.

Thank you for your urgent action and ongoing support.

Troy Clarke
President,
General Motors North America



Response from:

 
Gregory Knox, Pres.
Knox Machinery Company
Franklin, Ohio
 
Gentlemen:

In response to your request to contact legislators and ask for a bailout for the Big Three automakers please consider the following, and please pass my thoughts on to Troy Clarke, President of General Motors North America.

Politicians and Management of the Big 3 are both infected with the same entitlement mentality that has spread like cancerous germs in UAW halls for the last countless decades, and whose plague is now sweeping this nation, awaiting our new "messiah," Pres-elect Obama, to wave his magic wand and make all our problems go away, while at the same time allowing our once great nation to keep "living the dream."  Believe me folks, The dream is over!

This dream where we can ignore the consumer for years while management myopically focuses on its personal rewards packages at the same time that our factories have been filled with the worlds most overpaid, arrogant, ignorant and laziest entitlement minded "laborers" without paying the price for these atrocities.  This dream where you still think the masses will line up to buy our products for ever and ever.

Don't even think about telling me I'm wrong.  Don't accuse me of not knowing of what I speak.  I have called on Ford, GM, Chrysler, TRW, Delphi, Kelsey Hayes, American Axle, and countless other automotive OEM's throughout the Midwest, during the past 30 years and what I've seen over those years in these union shops can only be described as disgusting.

Troy Clarke, President of General Motors North America, states:  "There is widespread sentiment throughout this country, and our government, and especially via the news media, that the current crisis is completely the result of bad management which it certainly is not."

You're right Mr. Clarke, it's not JUST management.  How about the electricians who walk around the plants like lords in feudal times, making people wait on them for countless hours while they drag ass so they can come in on the weekend and make double and triple time for a job they easily could have done within their normal 40 hour work week. How about the line workers who threaten newbies with all kinds of scare tactics for putting out too many parts on a shift and for being too productive.

(We certainly must not expose those lazy bums who have been getting overpaid for decades for their horrific underproduction, must we?!?)

[RJ749]

CONT'D

Do you folks really not know about this stuff?!?  How about this great sentiment abridged from Mr. Clarke's sad plea:  "over the last few years we have closed the quality and efficiency gaps with our competitors."  What the hell has Detroit been doing for the last 40 years?!?  Did we really JUST wake up to the gaps in quality and efficiency between us and them?  The K car vs. the Accord?  The Pinto vs. the Civic?!?  Do I need to go on?  What a joke!

We are living through the inevitable outcome of the actions of the United States auto industry for decades. It's time to pay for your sins, Detroit.

I attended an economic summit last week where brilliant economist, Alan Beaulieu, from the Institute of Trend Research, surprised the crowd when he said he would not have given the banks a penny of "bailout money."   

"Yes, he said, this would cause short term problems," but despite what people like politicians and corporate magnates would have us believe, the sun would in fact rise the next day and the following very important thing would happen.  Where there had been greedy and sloppy banks, new efficient ones would pop up.  That is how a free market system works.  It does work if we would only let it work."

But for some nondescript reason we are now deciding that the rest of the world is right and that capitalism doesn't work - that we need the government to step in and "save us".  Save us my ass, Hell - we're nationalizing and unfortunately too many of our once fine nation's citizens don't even have a clue that this is what is really happening. 

But, they sure can tell you the stats on their favorite sports teams. 

Yeah - THAT'S really important, isn't it.

Does it ever occur to ANYONE that the "competition" has been producing vehicles, EXTREMELY PROFITABLY, for decades in this country?  How can that be???  Let's see.  Fuel efficient.  Listening to customers.  Investing in the proper tooling and automation for the long haul.

Not being too complacent or arrogant to listen to Dr. W. Edwards Deming four decades ago when he taught that by adopting appropriate principles of management, organizations could increase quality and simultaneously reduce costs.  Ever increased productivity through quality and intelligent planning.  Treating vendors like strategic partners, rather than like "the enemy."  Efficient front and back offices.  Non union environment.

 
Again, I could go on and on, but I really wouldn't be telling anyone anything they really don't already know down deep in their hearts.

I have six children, so I am not unfamiliar with the concept of wanting someone to bail you out of a mess that you have gotten yourself into - my children do this on a weekly, if not daily basis, as I did when I was their age.  I do for them what my parents did for me (one of their greatest gifts, by the way) - I make them stand on their own two feet and accept the consequences of their actions and work through it.  Radical concept, huh.  Am I there for them in the wings?  Of course - but only until such time as they need to be fully on their own as adults.

I don't want to oversimplify a complex situation, but there certainly are unmistakable parallels here between the proper role of parenting and government.  Detroit and the United States need to pay for their sins.

Bad news people - it's coming whether we like it or not. The newly elected Messiah really doesn't have a magic wand big enough to "make it all go away."  I laughed as I heard Obama "reeling it back in" almost immediately after the final vote count was tallied.  "We really might not do it in a year or in four."  Where the Hell was that kind of talk when he was RUNNING for office.

Stop trying to put off the inevitable folks.  That house in Florida really isn't worth $750,000.  People who jump across a border really don't deserve free health care benefits. That job driving that forklift for the Big 3 really isn't worth $85,000 a year.  We really shouldn't allow Wal-Mart to stock their shelves with products acquired from a country that unfairly manipulates their currency and has the most atrocious human rights infractions on the face of the globe.  That couple whose combined income is less than $50,000 really shouldn't be living in that $485,000 home.

Let the market correct itself folks - it will.  Yes it will be painful, but it's gonna' be painful either way, and the bright side of my proposal is that on the other side of it all, is a nation that appreciates what it has and doesn't live beyond its means and gets back to basics and redevelops the patriotic work ethic that made it the greatest nation in the history of the world and probably turns back to God.

Sorry - don't cut my head off, I'm just the messenger sharing with you the "bad news".  I hope you take it to heart.

Gregory J. Knox, President
Knox Machinery, Inc.
Franklin, Ohio 45005

Mr. Knox sent a reply to Snopes about their inquiry as to the origin of his letter:


http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/knox.asp

[Hoist!]

Cool Rog! I like Mr Knox! He don't speak in fork-ed tongue! He reminds me of someone else!

And a Happy New Yerar to you and Cindy!

Hoist!

[SBB]

Thank you Roger.

A very good letter that covered most of whats wrong in this country.

In my career my only job security has been my ability to make things happen and to make money for those that I work for.

The basic fundamentals of work are still the same as they have always been.

We just need to get back to them!

SBB

[RJ749]

Yep, hard work pays off..........unless you are a tycoon of some sort and then you get a life ring even if you fail it seems.

[SPIDERMAN]

Yep, hard work pays off..........unless you are a tycoon of some sort and then you get a life ring even if you fail it seems.

A number of years ago, I started writing a book I titled the American Aristocracy. My oldest was at Berkeley at the time and I e-mail her a file containing about 50 pages. She circulated it around among her friends and the consensus was that Nikki's Dad was cracked. This mind you from Berkeley students. The thrust of my "book" was that we have created an aristocracy in this country,not unlike the list of Royals in England and other countries with Monarchs. The only difference is that the American Aristocracy is made up of families with one member who either started his/her own business or became a CEO of a Fortune 500 company and they take their intitlement from that one person's efforts. Henry Ford the 19th or whatever he may be is not 1/1000th the man his great great grandfather was. And the folks who forced Steve Jobs out of Apple for years proved themselves to be nothing more than arbitragers at best and charlatans at worst. And then there's Michael Eisner. Candy says keep the word count down , well writing about M Eisner would take about 100,000,000 words. And there's 1000 Corporate CEO's just like Eisner. The panic in the boardrooms of America these days is not that Company A or B or C will go down the toilet, it's that the American Aristocracy will finally be seen for what it has become and the people will demand heads roll as much as the French demanded those of the French Nobility several hundred years ago. Each and every one of us should be screaming to our elected officials that not a dime be given to private industry and those that fail, fail. Those that survive will thrive and in place of those that would fail will be new busnesses founded on intelligence, hard work and sweat equity, not government bailouts. Ok, I'm getting my BP up here so I'll stop now, but this is a subject I've been waiting for years for someone to listen to me about.

B B

[iski]

Thanks for posting the letter from Mr. Knox, Rog.

He nails it & he knows the auto industry as well as a lot more.  Big execs clueless & overpaid has become a cliche albeit a true one when it comes to corporate America (also applies worldwide but that goes against the grain of those who figure the USA is best to blame first).  As with many disasters, this economic disaster is applicable across many levels & as in many organizations, certain levels point at the others blaming them while ignoring their own role.  Just human nature to paint a happy face on corporate excrement.   Big unions, clueless & overpaid also get their share of responsibility in this.  It's more than a 2 sided problem, but those sides have the biggest stakes & contributed the most, IMHO.

Off the subject somewhat, but that letter reminded me of when I worked in a factory producing parts for auto makers many years ago.  The company had a union which I elected not to join since frankly I did not see any benefits they could offer to offset the cost to my paycheck.  Of course the union guys were SOOOO happy to see me get promoted quickly & did their best to stop it.  I ended up running a large machine that usually sat idle for a sizable portion of the shifts while the operators pretended to work on it.  This threw a wrench into the rest of production, while machine operators down the line waited for product.  Led to weekend overtime for that machine to pre-produce material, in fact.  Anyway, I decided to just run the damn thing.  Did not break my back, just ran it at a reasonable pace & in 1 shift it produced about 25% more than it had, ever. Believe me this was noticed by mgt. as well as.... Very next day I was "approached" by some union guys as well as a guy from maintenance who threatened to.... well lets just say my reproductive capabilities could have been very limited. 

I decided to ignore the threat, continued running the damn thing, & next week the machine I ran was basically in a shambles as soon I showed up for my shift.  The guy on the shift before sabotaged it - took about 2 hours to get it back online.  Somehow, a foreman figured it out & when that guy was sent to shipping, the problems disappeared.  I got a raise, got promoted again, and eventually left to find greener monetary pastures.  Will never forget that union experience or hearing my relatives who worked for a variety of auto makers, defense contractors, etc. brag about how they could create overtime by screwing with the system (goldbricking) - all with union blessing.  Not all of them, but about 80%.  Some badge of weird honor that frankly made no sense to me.  If your company wastes time/money since you decide to screw it up, then it will do poorly & your own job is in jeopardy by your own doing.  Weird.

[RJ749]

Iski, when I was working my way through school I drove truck and was in the Teamsters 174 union here.

I went to work for an outfit right out of the Air Force so I could earn enough to get back to college.  On my first Friday two guys approached me and suggested I was working myself out of a job.  I got the picture for sure.

They were a bit surprised however when I suggested maybe I should check with my cousin to see if that was in fact the case.  Check with whoever you want was their retort.  Who's your cousin anyway?  Happens to be he owns this chit hole I replied.

Turned out I hadn't worked myself out of a job, but I did stop for coffee with them the next Monday before I did my route.  They weren't all bad, just lazy and very appreciative that I didn't need to talk with my cousin.

[Hugh Janis]

Yep, hard work pays off..........unless you are a tycoon of some sort and then you get a life ring even if you fail it seems.

yeah, hard work pays off eventually, but laziness pays off now! (this is the humor board after all)

I worked as summer help in a grocery warehouse during college.  To be hired, I had to join the Teamsters.  I struggled with the techniques of building a strong pallet full of boxes for a couple weeks and was not allowed to work through the two 15 minute breaks each day to keep my productivity up.  Meanwhile, the senior guys were getting orders from the largest stores where they simply had to move pallets to the shipping area.  My orders of comparable size took an hour or more to assemble.  Guess what they did between orders?  Went to the back of the warehouse to hang with the other senior guys and smoke a cigarette and laugh while the summer help filled the days quota at 1/3 the salary.

Good story Iski.  That mentality makes no sense to me at all.

[SPIDERMAN]

I've been on both sides of the equation here. I retired as a Sr Manager but spent many years in the union at BIW. I can honestly say that there's good and bad on both sides. Some guys just come to work with the mindset that they're being paid to do a job and they do it as best they can. Others seem to feel some sort of entitlement and that attitude exists on both sides. So far as unions are concerned, I think we're forgetting the reason they came into existence. We shouldn't as WALMART is there to remind all of us everyday why the Union movement began, but for some reason it's easier to toss the baby out with the bath water than to figure out how to drain the sink. I don't think any middleclass blue collar working man or woman would like to see the entire country operate on the WALMART business model. Unions are the only way to stop that from happening. Good forbid the NLRB ever actually do it's job and protect workers from all of the abuses some employers heap on them. Our government is engaged in Corporate Socialism on a scale unprecedented in our nations's history. The POTUS elect says he also wants to help the commonfolk as well. These two worlds have to collide and I know which will win. In the next 90 days, the Obama Administration will unveil deficit spending that will make even GWB blanch. The stock market will sink to 6,500 and what little savings average Americans have will be gone. We are at the precipice and I for one refuse to sit and blame the unions for it. It's not the rattle in the snake that bites you folks.

B B