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Author Topic: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?  (Read 17629 times)

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MUFFMAN

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2009, 12:04:08 PM »

I have Hq  575 in mine. Also have head work done as well. Happy with the package.
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2009, 12:13:48 PM »

The 54 was touted as a high lift 37 but IMO & IME and based on what I have seen from the dyno runs it falls short. If the LSA was kept the same as the 37 IMO this cam could have been a winner. The 54 is more exhaust sensitive than some of the other grinds out there and from what I have seen and experienced I still would choose a 37 over the 54 in most cases. Understand that there is a large cult bias effect and the owners that use these cams may get into a flame with me so let me temper it by saying it is not a bad or the worse choice, but there are better. Same holds true with the TW26 it could be a winner with the same LSA and higher lift. Have proved it with high ratio rockers. But Andrews offers no high lift with 235 duration and a 34-36 intake close, wish they did. The TW5 woods fits that slot
A few falacies
High lift does not kill torque, if the heads flow there and the duration is conservative, plus the LSA are proper for a motor with a desired useable torque range from 2-4500 the lift has the potential to work with the rest of the motor components to add torque
Woods TW400 and T-Man 625 being a few examples (not necesarily a recomendation just observation)

If you want to research HD Vtwin power I suggest reading Dennish books.
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Iglide

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #17 on: April 25, 2009, 05:26:04 PM »

Swapped out the cams today. The stock 255s were replaced with the Andrews 32H. The bike was run on a DynoJet before and after. The "before" run shows the 255s in "blue" with a tune by The Dyno Difference. The run shown in red is after the new cam install today, with the Andrews 32H. It is a bit lean on the top and bottom end and will get a fine tune next weekend.

Short shifting is now a thing of the past. The new ride pulls out past 4500 and I am very pleased with the results.

Made the 3 hour ride home in 80 deg ambient temps, max CC temp was 245 deg.
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twmartin1970

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #18 on: April 25, 2009, 06:18:05 PM »

Keats- I'll be interested to see the numbers-

TWmartin- do you have a dyno chart to post? Wodnering about numbers?

Here is the before and after dyno sheet for my 2009 SE RoadGlide.
The after included the TW-7 and Vance and Hines Power Duals.  Tuned with a PCV.  Much improved riding area over the 255's>


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HD Street Performance

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #19 on: April 25, 2009, 07:55:07 PM »

The TW7 fits the bill and does all that. The TW5 does too if the power and torque are to be better from idle on up in a stock motor. The TW408-44 is a little more for a lighter bike and a guy that wants to do some roll-on racing.
The TW32 is a good grind too and Dewey has reached 104hp 114 TQ with his 07 and this is just tuned with a TFI stock redline and timing untouched. There is more in there. His heads are stock except for the OS intake valve and a light mill.

So headwork believe it or not is a midrange booster in these 110 motors because of the unfavorable throat to intake ratio stock. Change the intake valve and some minor work mostly on the exhaust side and these heads work much better and the motor will respond in the midrange. Change the TB and then power keeps climbing past 5,500 assuming a good pipe
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jfh

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #20 on: April 25, 2009, 07:57:41 PM »

Here is the before and after dyno sheet for my 2009 SE RoadGlide.
The after included the TW-7 and Vance and Hines Power Duals.  Tuned with a PCV.  Much improved riding area over the 255's


Twmartin - Very nice curve!  Did you use the +4 advance gear or maintain stock cam timing? Many Wood cams have very aggressive ramps that are great for performance but tend to be on the noisy side. Have you noticed any increased valve train noise with the TW-7? I assume you are using stock heads without modifications.

Thanks
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Hammer - CVO Member #641

2009 FLTRSE3: Axtell jugs, JE forged flat top pistons, S&S 585 cams, SE 58mm TB, Dewey's Pro-Street porting, SE cam plate, Zipper's tapered pushrods, Cat-less, 2" Fullsac, TTS, Twin Jagg oil coolers, AK-20, 13" Works Black Trackers w/ARS, Clearview, Hawg Wired, Yaffe Monkey Bars, Danny Gray Big Seat

jfh

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #21 on: April 25, 2009, 08:03:53 PM »

The TW7 fits the bill and does all that. The TW5 does too if the power and torque are to be better from idle on up in a stock motor. The TW408-44 is a little more for a lighter bike and a guy that wants to do some roll-on racing.
The TW32 is a good grind too and Dewey has reached 104hp 114 TQ with his 07 and this is just tuned with a TFI stock redline and timing untouched. There is more in there. His heads are stock except for the OS intake valve and a light mill.

So headwork believe it or not is a midrange booster in these 110 motors because of the unfavorable throat to intake ratio stock. Change the intake valve and some minor work mostly on the exhaust side and these heads work much better and the motor will respond in the midrange. Change the TB and then power keeps climbing past 5,500 assuming a good pipe

Deweysheads - Which do you believe will perform better on a stock CVO 110 bagger (with tune and slip-ons), the TW-5 or TW-7?

Thanks
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Hammer - CVO Member #641

2009 FLTRSE3: Axtell jugs, JE forged flat top pistons, S&S 585 cams, SE 58mm TB, Dewey's Pro-Street porting, SE cam plate, Zipper's tapered pushrods, Cat-less, 2" Fullsac, TTS, Twin Jagg oil coolers, AK-20, 13" Works Black Trackers w/ARS, Clearview, Hawg Wired, Yaffe Monkey Bars, Danny Gray Big Seat

Cvostu

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2009, 12:52:58 AM »

hey Mike...  just picked my bike from John Sachs the other nite... he did S&S 570g cams.. some valve work, lifters and cleaned up the pistons and some other things..   bike runs well but it needs a new download, so I'll be seeing Cycle Dynamics in Boynton on monday..  i'm going for the TT mastertune and then i"ll put the PC in the o/b.     should be happy when it comes back...
« Last Edit: April 28, 2009, 12:11:33 PM by cvostu »
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HDDOCFL

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #23 on: April 27, 2009, 08:41:43 AM »

Don , Which of these cams will get the temps down better 5 -7- 32- 54.   Thanks Doc
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BaggerDave

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2009, 11:35:03 AM »

Twmartin - Very nice curve!  Did you use the +4 advance gear or maintain stock cam timing? Many Wood cams have very aggressive ramps that are great for performance but tend to be on the noisy side. Have you noticed any increased valve train noise with the TW-7? I assume you are using stock heads without modifications.

Thanks

I'd like to know about the valve train noise also!
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grc

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #25 on: April 27, 2009, 12:58:07 PM »

Deweysheads - Which do you believe will perform better on a stock CVO 110 bagger (with tune and slip-ons), the TW-5 or TW-7?

Thanks

I talked with Bob Wood last week about the TW-5 in a CVO103, and he suggested that the TW-7 would be a better choice in the larger engine.  His exact words were that he thought the TW-5 would "be a bit short".  Based on that discussion I would suggest that you would want the TW-7 versus the TW-5 in a CVO110.

Jerry
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #26 on: April 27, 2009, 02:48:14 PM »

What is "a bit short"?
Take into consideration the source, Bob is a great guy, ex drag racer.

The TW5 will pump up the TQ curve in the area most of us ride, 2-4000 rpm, above what the SE255 stock cam offers and still be pulling at 5,500 (SE255 is done at 4,500) where the stock TB checks out. The TW7 would still do the same but come on 4-500 rpm later and carry to the same point and then the stock TB checks out. The 7 offers more potential hp above 4k to 6k with headwork and a TB change.
As far as cool the latest intake close cam will run the coolest but that assumes the tune is richened up to 14/1 cruise and the timing is adjusted (timing added at low speeds and throttle opening). The latest intake close will also be the latest to come on too assuming the same compression and head package.

In the late models with roller chain hydra chain drive I have not had issues with valvetrain noise as we did with the geardrives and older tensioners, assuming the geometry is right. and customer set up and mating parts proper for the build.
See the 103" dyno below
« Last Edit: April 27, 2009, 02:54:20 PM by Deweysheads »
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jfh

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #27 on: April 27, 2009, 06:31:39 PM »


As far as cool the latest intake close cam will run the coolest but that assumes the tune is richened up to 14/1 cruise and the timing is adjusted (timing added at low speeds and throttle opening). The latest intake close will also be the latest to come on too assuming the same compression and head package.


Wouldn't advancing low speed timing increase operating temperatures? I am missing the logic here. Can you please explain further?

Thanks
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Hammer - CVO Member #641

2009 FLTRSE3: Axtell jugs, JE forged flat top pistons, S&S 585 cams, SE 58mm TB, Dewey's Pro-Street porting, SE cam plate, Zipper's tapered pushrods, Cat-less, 2" Fullsac, TTS, Twin Jagg oil coolers, AK-20, 13" Works Black Trackers w/ARS, Clearview, Hawg Wired, Yaffe Monkey Bars, Danny Gray Big Seat

HD Street Performance

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #28 on: April 27, 2009, 07:09:17 PM »

NO
The timing is so far retarded , slow, that builds heat and requires much higher throttle opening to make anything happen, going the extreme the other way would build heat the object is to plant it in the middle. The 2007up timing maps are very retarded.
All of this is tuneable with the TTS or SEST.
They need around 20° at idle-2000 from 0-10% throttle
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HDDOCFL

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Re: Best bolt in cam for CVO touring models?
« Reply #29 on: April 28, 2009, 04:47:39 PM »

The PC also has timing adjusts.  Doc
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