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[PapaAgnis]

CVO Ultra 2010 - had it's first service at the dealers at 1000 miles. At 2400 miles it started a rattle - linked to the rpm - like an exhaust clamp or the horn cover was loose. Checked all over but couldn't find the source. Rode a bit more then noticed that the oil pressure was fluctuating, independent of revs. After I saw it drop to zero a couple of times I pulled over and checked the oil - dip stick dry!!
Got the bike taken to a different dealership and when they drained the tank there was 1 pint of oil remaining (18oz/550ml to be precise). So where had it gone? No leak, the bike has always been as dry as a bone. Could it have burnt the oil? It didn't burn any in the first 1000 miles and surely if you're burning that amount of oil there'd be signs. So if it didn't leak it and didn't burn it you have to ask how much was in there in the first place? Refilling the oil and replacing the filter has "cured" the rattle, but having spent more buying this bike than I've spent buying all the cars I've ever owned (30 years worth) I'm not in a good place right now

[HarleyRider2004]

Did you check the oil when you got back from the dealership?  If so was it full?

[Twolanerider]

Have to admit that given the description at least one very plausible explanation is they sent the bike out without refilling.  After once getting coated many would be very surprised how long an engine will sometimes go with very little oil in the pan; especially if not loaded hard.

[PapaAgnis]

Did you check the oil when you got back from the dealership?  If so was it full?

In my next life you can be sure that I will!

Twolanerider - that's the only logical explanation that I can think of. Now the fun starts I guess!

[Twolanerider]

Did you check the oil when you got back from the dealership?  If so was it full?

In my next life you can be sure that I will!

Twolanerider - that's the only logical explanation that I can think of. Now the fun starts I guess!

If it is determined that the most likely explanation is their lack of refilling and if after some agreed test period all actually does seem well don't let that be the end of it.  Harley can and has extended warranty periods after mistakes or problems on individual bases. 

Even if all seems well now this is one of those times I'd strongly argue for an extension.  Harley itself may not since it is specifically a dealer error.  In that case the dealer should pony up for a couple years extended service contract.

[HarleyRider2004]

Even if all seems well now this is one of those times I'd strongly argue for an extension.  Harley itself may not since it is specifically a dealer error.  In that case the dealer should pony up for a couple years extended service contract.

Absolutely!  And I would get a free T shirt too. 

[Ghost Rider]

Absolutely!  And I would get a free T shirt too. 

And a Dealer Dot

[sadunbar]

Your rattle was most likely the lifters not pumping up...  Logical/Plausible explanation is they did not refill your oil at the 1000 mile service. 

Potential problems are:

Cylinders//pistons/piston rings not adequately lubricated.  I would ask for a compression check and borescope of the cylinders.

Rocker arm cups/lifter cups/pushrod tips overheated due to lack of adequate lubrication.  I would ask to have them inspected.

Oil pump scored...  I would ask to have it inspected.

Valve guides scored... I would ask for a leak down test to be done.

I would not worry as much about the actual bearings (cam bearings, crank bearings)

If you had some oil pressure, it is very possible you did no damage, unless you experienced extreme heat at any point since the 1000 mile service.  If the motor (oil) overheated at any point, I would be concerned - expecially about the pistons/rings/cylinders.

Or, as Twolane suggested....get them to agree to an extended factory warranty and just ride it!  (I would want a compression and leakdown test regardless...)

Hope you have a great relationship with your dealer... Best wishes dealing with them.....   

[PapaAgnis]

Thanks for the practical advice Sadunbar - one worry I have is that the dealer who refilled the oil for me pointed out that sometimes (not everytime) when you stop the engine there's a knock from the bottom end!

[SIX38]

Since you have documented the no/low oil condition, my next move would be to drain oil, save oil, run motor till it dies, replace oil, call dealer, get new motor. Why take a chance with a motor having experienced this this kind of dealer negligence, possibly leaving you stranded somewhere or worse yet seize up while driving?

Tom P 

[GtreetSlide]

I would contact the factory rep and demand a new motor, period.

jimbob

[HOGMIKE]

Thanks for the practical advice Sadunbar - one worry I have is that the dealer who refilled the oil for me pointed out that sometimes (not everytime) when you stop the engine there's a knock from the bottom end!

Really???
Time to find another dealer!!

[grc]

I've avoided commenting in this thread because it really isn't my main purpose in life to make people feel bad.  But there are some obvious questions about the situation, and some bad advice as well.  First, if we ASSUME that Dealership #1 didn't fill the tank with oil, how do you suppose the bike managed to travel an additional 1400 miles before it lost oil pressure?  Second, and likely to be the first question Harley might ask, if Dealer #1 didn't add oil or left it extremely low, why didn't the customer notice this during the routine oil level checks over the subsequent 1400 miles?  Third, I haven't seen any mention of a response from Dealership #1.  Have they been contacted?  If yes, what did they say?  If no, why not?

As for the advice to demand a new engine from Harley, or even better the purposeful destruction of the engine to force H-D to give him a new one, folks need to try to understand basic responsibility.  Dealerships are independent businesses, not part of H-D, and H-D isn't legally responsible for a dealerhip's mistakes.  IF this dealership didn't fill the oil tank properly, they have some responsibility to the customer, but H-D does not.  I would most certainly agree that the customer should contact the MoCo and explain the situation and even ask for their assistance.  But I don't think that starting out making "demands" will get any sympathetic treatment.  Considering how Harley treats some folks with totally legitimate warranty concerns, I don't think I'd start out with an attitude and expect any help in what appears so far to be a very iffy situation.  And btw, without going into the obvious ethical and legal issues with the "blow it up" solution, what happens if H-D finds out how that engine came to be destroyed and voids the warranty?  I'll tell you what happens, you get out your checkbook and write a much bigger check.


Jerry

[SIX38]

Jerry, it's good to see cooler heads prevail, but PapaAngis is certainally stuck between the ol' rock and a hard place. I agree that not checking his oil level for 1400 miles did not help his situation, and bringing the bike to a differant dealer will further complicate this issue. Your advice of contacting the MOCO is the proper course of action and I wish him the best of luck with that. We have all seen many examples of how well (??)that works out.
   You have to feel his pain, buying his CVO Ultra should have been a real high point of his life, he followed up with a 1000 mile service, and now at 2400 miles he's in this mess.
 Jerry, between you and me, would you head out on a long distance trip with that engine in your bike?
Keep us posted PapaAgnis, one way or another things will work themselves out. Good Luck.
Tom P. 

[Jus Cruisin]

I've avoided commenting in this thread because it really isn't my main purpose in life to make people feel bad.  But there are some obvious questions about the situation, and some bad advice as well.  First, if we ASSUME that Dealership #1 didn't fill the tank with oil, how do you suppose the bike managed to travel an additional 1400 miles before it lost oil pressure?  Second, and likely to be the first question Harley might ask, if Dealer #1 didn't add oil or left it extremely low, why didn't the customer notice this during the routine oil level checks over the subsequent 1400 miles?  Third, I haven't seen any mention of a response from Dealership #1.  Have they been contacted?  If yes, what did they say?  If no, why not?

As for the advice to demand a new engine from Harley, or even better the purposeful destruction of the engine to force H-D to give him a new one, folks need to try to understand basic responsibility.  Dealerships are independent businesses, not part of H-D, and H-D isn't legally responsible for a dealerhip's mistakes.  IF this dealership didn't fill the oil tank properly, they have some responsibility to the customer, but H-D does not.  I would most certainly agree that the customer should contact the MoCo and explain the situation and even ask for their assistance.  But I don't think that starting out making "demands" will get any sympathetic treatment.  Considering how Harley treats some folks with totally legitimate warranty concerns, I don't think I'd start out with an attitude and expect any help in what appears so far to be a very iffy situation.  And btw, without going into the obvious ethical and legal issues with the "blow it up" solution, what happens if H-D finds out how that engine came to be destroyed and voids the warranty?  I'll tell you what happens, you get out your checkbook and write a much bigger check.


Jerry

I have to agree with Jerry's comments/opinions. The running for 1400 miles without ever checking the o il level will certainly allow the dealership an "out". If, in fact, the dealership did not put oil in, they were negligent. The OP was just as negligent by not checking fluid levels for 1400 miles and only decided to check after it started making noise.