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[2smoke]

The decline of the H-D "mystique" is everywhere. H-D = BFD

OK, maybe that comment was weird on a site dedicated to their bikes.  I live in the Milwaukee area so my feelings run very deep about the company.  As a guy with a garage full of bikes   (including 2 H-Ds and  Buell) I am saddened by the empty buildings (Capital Dr., East Troy, and soon to be empty Franklin).  Couple that with personal friends that have been laid off permanently from a Company that once seemed untouchable.  Blame some on the economy, but when a golfer is hired to run a motorcycle company this is the result.  I see the last great American icon going the same way as all the rest.   

[porkypig]

I bought a new 2008 Victory Vegas Low with the factory premium edition and then put pipes, intake etc for another 1200 bucks
I just traded it for a used 2010 FLSTSE in the crimsom red after looking for a new HD for 5 months.....when I first started looking I was being given trade values of 7 to 8k that was a slap in the face to me...so I just kept looking and was patiant......finally my local HD shop ended up with the Conv and it had 1927 miles on it and looked brand new...matter of fact they fooled me as it was sitting in the "new" bike area
They finally gave me what I was looking for on the Vic with 3900 miles on it;I paid 19500 w/pipes  & dyno and they coughed up 12500 on the trade and I paid 21300 for the Conv...so I felt I got a decent buy on the CVO and I knew I was going to take it up the on the Vic.....

Loved the Vic as the only stock V that could stay with me was a 110 SE (and I loved the sound); but no service, hell to pay on getting warranty work done, they are good with chrome and paint but short on the little things....like instead of using stainless bolts on the exhuast brakets I got rusty ones, got cool rims but they did not match the rear sproket; things like that irritate the hell out of me....I am old school and if I pay big bucks for "custom" it better be "finished" not half ass! I could teach Polaris a thing or two and they could have a great bike....instead they seem to be going the other direction.

Hence my desire to get back on an HD.....(owned 5 before) I never have had a "dresser" but I decided to be open minded and took a 2010 CVO Ultra for a ride and it was nice but I felt confined......wait a few more weeks and up shows the Conv. I took for a spin and fell in love.....Just got it back Friday as thye put the new pipes and SE intake and filter and put it on the dyno (1600 bucks) and I now have the badest sounding screaming Conv I think in the county LOL...I can't help but smile......wife told me to stop cause the bugs stick to my teeth LOL....

Here is my dyno print out

Well, it certainly looks like you are pleased with your purchase.  And you seem to have done better than you were led to believe on the trade.  When I traded my '10 in on the '11 I received 22k for the bike and it is now on sale at their dealership for 25K.  If they sell it, they will do well.  If it doesn't sell by Christmas, I would expect they may drop the price for next spring to get it out of there.  My 05 Heritage I traded in on the '10 is still sitting on a dealer's floor from over a year ago.   So, I would say if you got the new one for 21+K with 1900 miles on it, you did well, there also.  My experience with dealers on cars as well as motorcycles is you rarely get a good deal the first conversation you have with them.  they have written the rules of the game and know them very well and the price they quoted you is absolutely the bottom line because they just can't keep the lights paid, employees paid, inventories full, yadda yadda yadda.  the price they initially quote you is actually a "no profit" deal..........  Now, once you have a few subsequent conversations they realize you are more serious about becoming the next owner of the bike and they may now stand a chance of selling a bike.  Remember it takes a seller and a buyer to strike a sale.  Generally, I have found that I need a "difference" price to make me jump.  I want to know what the $ out of my pocket applied with my trade-in will result in the new one being exchanged in my garage.  The last 2 bikes I traded in, during the negotiations period I didn't ride the old one at all.  I was fearful, I guess, of dropping it and damaging it.  I thought I got a good deal and didn't want a damaged trade-in scuttling the deal.  
Dealers typically give you a good deal on your trade-in but full price on theirs.  You seem to have conquored both arenas.  Good for you!  Bottom line is you're satisfied.  Put that Fat'boy windshield on the bike and most of those bugs will go away.  Nothing like keeping mama happy!!          Pork ....(star)?

[porkypig]

OK, maybe that comment was weird on a site dedicated to their bikes.  I live in the Milwaukee area so my feelings run very deep about the company.  As a guy with a garage full of bikes   (including 2 H-Ds and  Buell) I am saddened by the empty buildings (Capital Dr., East Troy, and soon to be empty Franklin).  Couple that with personal friends that have been laid off permanently from a Company that once seemed untouchable.  Blame some on the economy, but when a golfer is hired to run a motorcycle company this is the result.  I see the last great American icon going the same way as all the rest.  

2, I understand your frustration as do most of us in this fine country!  And it takes an upstanding individual like yourself to admit you may have crossed the line a bit as we do enjoy our particular breed of bike and don't like to think anybody out there would trounce the moniker, especially from the inside.  I talked to people from New Delhi,India ther other day to have a couple things straightened out on 2 of my credit report companies.....remember, there's a 3rd one, right?  Wonder where I'll have to call for the 3rd??   So now all of our credit reporting information is being accessed from out of this country??  My point is I long for the day when we take back our great nation, the current companies begin investing right here in America, close up the shops in foreign countries and start hiring again........here!  When Harley Davidson once again is every single part made right here in America!  Now there will still be the cross-town rivalry that Yamahammers and Vicory's are somehow "just as good as a Harley" but you know what??  That's ok.  My dear old departed father owned a concrete mixing company many years ago and they had a slogan that was printed on all their letterheads, give-away items, etc.  It said, "We have no problem with those who sell for less.......they know what their product is worth!"  Long live Harleys and may we ride them as long as we live!  The Pork.....well, you know.....

[Spiderman]

OK, maybe that comment was weird on a site dedicated to their bikes.  I live in the Milwaukee area so my feelings run very deep about the company.  As a guy with a garage full of bikes   (including 2 H-Ds and  Buell) I am saddened by the empty buildings (Capital Dr., East Troy, and soon to be empty Franklin).  Couple that with personal friends that have been laid off permanently from a Company that once seemed untouchable.  Blame some on the economy, but when a golfer is hired to run a motorcycle company this is the result.  I see the last great American icon going the same way as all the rest.   

Ahhhhhh, so H-D 50 weight runs through your veins and like all of us who hate to love them and love to hate them you are dying the death of 1,000 cuts watching the current crop of idiots in charge of H-D Inc lead them down the path to destruction. I'm not a CEO of any large company, never will be but some things in life seem simple and the issue here is that as was the case in the 70's, the quality of the product is declining, the attitude of the company and it's dealership network is not in touch with it's customer base . I don't GAS what goes on in the boardroom at H-D Inc, so long as my local dealer has some respect for me as customer, so long as the product is of consistent and high quality and improvements continue to be made. The most basic tenet of the free market system is  - - build a product the consumer wants, find a price point that reaches as many potential customers as economically feasible and stand behind that product. As to the golfer- - - don't hold that against the guy, we've got some great golfers on the site here who also love Harleys as much as anyone I know.

B B

[Wild Card]

Without that "golfer" we may have seen the demise of Harley Davidson.  Can you run a multi-national business in the worst recession we've seen since the Great Depression?  You don't hire a motorcycle fan (sure, it would have been nice, but do you see Disney hiring Mickey Mouse to run their company?) to keep your company afloat.  You hire the best person you can with a proven track record.  As an expert in international business matters and an executive at Johnson Controls for 20 years before Harley (a global manufacture of automotive solutions, in case you think he had no previous related experience), I would say the Board had a good reason for hiring him.  Whether you like it or not, a lot of business is done on the golf course.  

Sorry your friends got laid off but the fault lies in us not buying the bikes.  At least Wandell is looking to make up for that by selling to other markets (China, India, Europe).  These markets aren't diminishing the American image of Harley.  They are buying them BECAUSE they epitomize the great western image of freedom and excess and everything cool.

 

OK, maybe that comment was weird on a site dedicated to their bikes.  I live in the Milwaukee area so my feelings run very deep about the company.  As a guy with a garage full of bikes   (including 2 H-Ds and  Buell) I am saddened by the empty buildings (Capital Dr., East Troy, and soon to be empty Franklin).  Couple that with personal friends that have been laid off permanently from a Company that once seemed untouchable.  Blame some on the economy, but when a golfer is hired to run a motorcycle company this is the result.  I see the last great American icon going the same way as all the rest.   

[porkypig]

Baby, oh Baby, oh baby!!!  Harley, are you listening here???  If ever there was a place to listen, me thinks this is it; right here!   Happy Thanksgiving to one and all............Pork

[Dennis the Menace]

+1 what MW said.  And, more of us in the US would be buying more bikes if the economy wasnt so bad.  Too many out of work that would like a new ride, but cant swing it.

Still, I love the brand and cant ever see myself owning anything but a Harley.  I wouldnt even care if they were made off-shore.  I would still ride one.  The dealer has my name on a CVO Conv for May delivery, and I look forward to it.

Dennis

[BUCKNUT GREG]

+1 what MW said.  And, more of us in the US would be buying more bikes if the economy wasnt so bad.  Too many out of work that would like a new ride, but cant swing it.

Still, I love the brand and cant ever see myself owning anything but a Harley.  I wouldnt even care if they were made off-shore.  I would still ride one.  The dealer has my name on a CVO Conv for May delivery, and I look forward to it.

Dennis

X2. Couldnt leave if I needed to. 

[ezpgh]

PierceEye, two questions....why did you change the air intake since it's already high flow and does your 6th speed light work now?
I tried the SERT first and it pretty much sucked, hardly any noticable change in performance or heat and the 6th speed light did not work. At that time HD did not have a fix for it and i'm wordering if they do now. And, those dyno numbers are quite high. Don't know if I would believe them but if they are true you're very lucky indeed.

[Kisscorky]

My two cents....may depreciate to one cent...I paid $26400 last Feb. For the 2010 Orange Inferno FLSTSE and knew it would depreciate due to purchasing a new bike from a dealer. I have 7000 miles on it and now that the weather is changing I am missing riding. I still love the bike! My wife loves riding on the back! And understand that if Anyone trades theirs  in they should expect the dealer to offer around $22k so they can sell it for $25k. I do not see the depreciation being any different from other bikes or cars. I had my local HD check on how many were made in 2010 and it was 1865. Could not get it broke down in each color.

[porkypig]

Well, those figures seem to ring pretty consistent.  The dealer has to make a couple K to warrant "dealing" with the trade-in.  He has to make a few bucks to justify it.  He has to keep it far enough (low enough) from the cost of a new bike to entice someone to buy used.  if it was too close to the price of a new one, why would anybody in their right mind buy used??   And of course someone has to pay for the cost of this process.  It isn't going to be the dealer or he loses all he hoped to gain along the way.  It will be you and me, the consumer.  His responsibility is keeping his showroom stocked with what we like and it is ours to finance the game.  So, in the first year, we are going to take a pretty good hit.  It doesn't mean the value on the bike is really that low; it does mean it costs to make that 1st year trade and to make somebody interested in buying a 1 year old bike.  Requires a bit of a twisted vision to understand it all but it sort of has to be that way.  Realistically speaking, if it was up to us consumers, completely, we'd get our chicks for nothing and our bikes for free, right???  But, alas, it ain't............The defense rests.........

[dcigar]

and so speaks the wisdom of the porkster..........
very few have put it so succintly

[PierceEye]

PierceEye, two questions....why did you change the air intake since it's already high flow and does your 6th speed light work now?
I tried the SERT first and it pretty much sucked, hardly any noticable change in performance or heat and the 6th speed light did not work. At that time HD did not have a fix for it and i'm wordering if they do now. And, those dyno numbers are quite high. Don't know if I would believe them but if they are true you're very lucky indeed.

Sorry been busy....
The stock SE is still restrictive......they showed me a dyno run with it on and then with the new one and the a/f mix was irratic and hp & torque were down about 10% <sp>
Thier dyno was new in July so i tend to believe the numbers and from driving it for a couple hundred miles while it was stock and then after makes me belive the are on or close to it.

As to the 6th gear indicator.....I have never seen it on....Actually did not know there was one LOL

[pm203]

Any photos of your new air intake?

[PierceEye]

Any photos of your new air intake?

I will take some pictures of it tomorrow; I want some at each stage w/o the bags, then w/o the backrest, then the seat
It is supposed to be sunny and 69 tomorrow.....good polishing day LOL