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Author Topic: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?  (Read 9759 times)

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Twolanerider

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2011, 12:54:51 PM »

What would be interesting to see, would be a properly tuned TTS system bike on a dyno chart, then a Rev Perf. EMS installed on the same bike with its dyno run, and seeing a comparison of the two on the same chart, HP, TQ & air fuel. If the lines are very close to each other, I'd be sold on the EMS because of the flexibility of modifying without needing a new tune every change. However, it sounds like some riders are reporting some stumbling at times on the EMS, and your hands are tied to a certain extent to fix that, where a tune with TTS can usually work out all the bugs with enough time.

For what it may be worth I was able to do dyno comparisons on the same dyno.  Admittedly the runs were quite some time distant from each other.  So differences in use of the dyno wheel and a variety of other factors could all be asserted.  But it was at least the same bike on the same dyno with no other bike-specific differences than the installation of the EMS package.

Numbers were comparable.  Though I had what was always felt to be a "good tune" before I didn't lose anything with the EMS installation.  Comparing the AFR lines may not be the best comparison as most tuners tune to a flat AFR.  If that line stays flat we call it good and move on.  This package's load response intends to move that line relative load and requirements of the riding condition at the moment.  Strictly for comparison's sake these are the before and after numbers I had about two tanks full after my installation.



There have been some glitches with the EMS unit.  No one with any sense has said anything other than that it's still a very new product.  As a cohort we're small.  Not much of a sample size; especially when considering that most of the attention (at least here) has happened prior to the beginning of the riding season. 

The company has seemed to respond to the glitches directly and quickly.  One can only assume they'll get better too as their experience base grows.  It's not an uncomplicated software they're working with after all.  So whether it's a little time dialing in a TTS install, which needs to be done every time, or what has been only the occasional glitch with the EMS package needing some time it seems this package still has promise.

I, and others I've spoken to, all look forward to this spring, summer and fall as a larger test bed for our group.  To see how the units perform and hold up under larger service.  It's nice to be optimistic; and I am.  But the proof of the pudding is in the eating.  Or in our case in the riding.

So long as the company continues to be as easy to work with as they have been to date, as forthright as they've proven to be when questions arise and the product shows the promise/effectiveness it has so far it is easy to be optimistic.  So bring on the summer, and the pudding.
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rheiner

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2011, 01:18:41 PM »

That's good comparison info. Thanks for the post and the explanation. I might be joining the "small sample size" with my 120R engine once Rev Perf. gets their product to work with the 2011 ECMs.
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beechflyr

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2011, 01:40:07 PM »

Actually, I was referring to the effect on the engine IF the ECM had to temporarily be reflashed to stock to get you going before sending it back to Rev Performance for a redo flash.
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Twolanerider

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2011, 02:21:00 PM »

Actually, I was referring to the effect on the engine IF the ECM had to temporarily be reflashed to stock to get you going before sending it back to Rev Performance for a redo flash.

Admittedly I'm not sure I understand the scenario you might be envisioning.  If an o2 sensor or their little add-on module fails it's been explained to me that the system simply reverts to the map currently in the ECM, with whatever "learning" it's done to date, and simply no longer monitors o2 sensors nor makes load based adjustments as you ride.  You're simply riding on the base map. 

In that case there'd be no need to "reflash to stock" nor send the ECM back to the company.   You'd just ride on, replace the defective sensor or external module when it's convenient, and be done with the problem. 

If, on the other hand, you actually had an ECM failure of some sort you're dead in the water anyway.  RevPerf has said they intended to keep a few ECM spares on hand for failure replacements.   If they manage that you're a one day ship away from replacement stock.  A dealer is likely going to have to order in a replacement ECM so there's no real practical difference I see so long as RevPerf stays on the ball with availability and service (a question, by the way, that's always as easily directed at Mother Harley).

If you're considering some scenario I'm not please share it.  We can't prepare for what we've not considered.
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beechflyr

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2011, 02:49:53 PM »

you answered it. Thanks. Failed ECM was what I was questioning.
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rheiner

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2011, 03:31:36 PM »

Maybe this should be directed to Rev Perf. tech support, but how do you know if an o2 sensor failed? I've never had a failed o2 sensor, but doesn't the motorcycle on stock bikes just shut down?
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digga25

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2011, 04:37:04 PM »

I have also experienced some stumbling after decel in the off idle mode.I have the rev perf ems and have  about 200 mi on this system.The bike runs great otherwise.Had the TTS system but could not get rid of the off idle stumble so I switched to EMS. Also had a problem with engine light on sometimes,no cruise and limited power,(TTS).The bike runs noticably smoother and a little stronger with the EMS,have not experienced the engine light on yet.Sounds to me that I have an additional problem.Will have to check headpipes for leak.Any one have similar probs.
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sadunbar

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2011, 04:53:05 PM »

I have also experienced some stumbling after decel in the off idle mode.I have the rev perf ems and have  about 200 mi on this system.The bike runs great otherwise.Had the TTS system but could not get rid of the off idle stumble so I switched to EMS. Also had a problem with engine light on sometimes,no cruise and limited power,(TTS).The bike runs noticably smoother and a little stronger with the EMS,have not experienced the engine light on yet.Sounds to me that I have an additional problem.Will have to check headpipes for leak.Any one have similar probs.

Check for both intake and exhaust leaks...   :2vrolijk_21:
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digga25

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #23 on: April 28, 2011, 05:00:02 PM »

Thanks for the reply I will do that right away.On the intake I changed the a/c maybe I moved the throttlebody enough to make a leak, and I changed  the head pipes a while ago but I put new gaskets in and tightened them real well,maybe the heat and vibration loosened them up.
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hogasm

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #24 on: April 28, 2011, 06:05:50 PM »

The few instances I am aware of where stumbles existed with the EMS system were all traced to intake/exhaust leaks.  Once the leaks were corrected and after some riding time to allow the 02 sensors to adjust, the stumbles disappeared.  If you're (or anyone) is experiencing stumbling, I'd look for a cause such as a leak...   :2vrolijk_21:

Just ordered 2 sets of intake seals.......1 for just incase :nervous:
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dmnrdn

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #25 on: April 28, 2011, 07:27:05 PM »

Don. Besides the increase in HP @ TQ I thought I read in one of your posts that you also got an increase in your MPG. Is that a correct statement?
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Twolanerider

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #26 on: April 28, 2011, 09:07:38 PM »

Don. Besides the increase in HP @ TQ I thought I read in one of your posts that you also got an increase in your MPG. Is that a correct statement?

Yes, that'd be correct.  I don't pay a lot of attention to fuel mileage on the bikes.  Only the quickie calculations necessary to know something isn't working right.  But in the first three or four tanks full after the install was done I was curious enough to monitor fuel usage closely.

Prior to the install the bike got around 35 mpg knocking down highway miles.  It's a 107" build that produces fair numbers for its displacement so I never knocked that mileage.  Pulling the trailer or if I was playing with it a bit it'd do 32-ish mpg.  In those tanks of fuel I monitored closely after the EMS install it had gone to (if I remember correctly) 42+.  Gaining almost 20% in fuel economy while keeping performance numbers the same speaks to some real efficiencies gained.
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dmnrdn

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #27 on: April 28, 2011, 11:16:47 PM »

Thanks. For the info. That is a nice improvement.
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ultrafxr

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #28 on: April 28, 2011, 11:22:13 PM »

Maybe this should be directed to Rev Perf. tech support, but how do you know if an o2 sensor failed? I've never had a failed o2 sensor, but doesn't the motorcycle on stock bikes just shut down?
Couple years ago while I was wrestling with the 110 problems on my 07 I picked it up from the dealer after the 'enhancement' had been done.  On the way home I noticed that the check engine light was on.  After I got it home I discovered that both O2 sensors had been left unconnected.  I connected them and cleared the codes.  Bike ran ok even though neither of the 02 sensors were functioning.
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Tnbrit

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Re: Updates from Rev Perf EMS users?
« Reply #29 on: April 29, 2011, 10:23:23 AM »

Hi,first post,i'm reading all I can on the EMS across the 3 forums i read,on another forum there's a thread about the EMS having more work needed,for 2010 bikes,not sure if it's relavant to this thread but thought i'd mention it.
Graham. :)
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