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[Onewheat]

I have a 2002 FLHRSEI (1550 cc) with about 7400 miles on it.  I bought it just before winter with 6300 miles on it and didn't notice so much in November, when it was cooler out, but I have a very rough engine at cruise throttle from around 1700 - 2000 RPM's or so.  It's almost like a miss and excessive popping on decel - if this was a carbureted bike, I would say richen the pilot screw.  I believe the bike has some slip-on mufflers as there are no markings on them at all.  Other than that, I think the bike is stock and I have no plans to modify the engine any further.  Ideally, I would love a plug and play tuner, but if I need to get a dyno tune or something, I will do that, as the bike sucks in a very convenient cruising rpm range, so I need to have something done, other than moving to a colder climate.  Any suggestions?

[Banana man]

sounds like your bike has a lean condition. It does need a tuner.

[dlaws01]

 but I have a very rough engine at cruise throttle from around 1700 - 2000 RPM's or so.

Cruise throttle from around 1700 - 2000 rpm?  At what speed on the highway is that?

[Twolanerider]

but I have a very rough engine at cruise throttle from around 1700 - 2000 RPM's or so. 

That's not a "cruise" RPM range.  If in fact you're that range of RPM to do something like run 45-50 on state roads you're lugging the engine.  That will make for a rough feel.  If not lugging the engine disregard.

Does the problem show up more as the engine feels a load?  If so don't discount something as easy and cheap as a set of plug wires.  When the get old they'll cut out under a load.  The bike is pushing ten years old.  So it's at least a consideration.

[Onewheat]

This happens under a light load, like when just cruising through a 35 mph zone or leaving the subdivision and
trying to go 25. If the bike is accelerating it runs great, which was making me think it was fuel not spark.  Also the popping on decel is usually due to a lean condition.  The bike is under a light throttle - if that was a 5th gear rpm range, that would be around 45 or 50 mph, I think.  If it does need a tuner, which it sounds like it might, is there something in particular to look for?  I don't plan on making any engine mods and if there is a plug and play model, that is more preferable than something requiring a laptop and constant fiddling.  I really just want to ride, but if a more sophisticated tune with a dyno is required, than I'll do that.  Someone pointed me in the direction of a shop here near Louisville, but he is not accepting any appointments, so I still don't know where to go locally for help, which is why I was liking plug and play.

[HD Street Performance]

It is low miles but it is also 9 years old. Chances are the intake seals need changing, I would be doing that just as pre-emptive maintenance. If the pipes and or air filter have been changed then you will need a stage 1 download or better yet a custom tune to compensate for the change in airflow.

[Midnight Rider]

First, are you sure that the bike does not have a high flow air cleaner on it?  That would be a common thing to have done back in '02, along with the mufflers.  If that was done without reprograming the ECM, you're definitely running lean.

Second, do what you want, but in my opinion, you should never "cruise" at any RPM below 2K, unless you're in first gear.  The engine will lug, which is about the worst thing you can do to any motor, and particularly a HD engine.

Back in '02 (and prior), up through '06, you could get a download to the ECM from HD dealers for changes like high flow air cleaner and high flow mufflers.  I'm not sure if those are still available these days, but it might be worth checking into.  It used to cost about $100, and was generally "close enough" on the tuning.

If you can't get the above, one of the simplest things to do is get a Power Commander III from somewhere like Fuelmoto (talk to Jamie, if he's still there), tell him what you have, and they can ship it to you with a tune already loaded for your combination, in all probability.  It's a real simple install, and an effective solution.

Other options are available, but would require Dyno time...in that case, find a competent tuner in your area, ask him/her what product they prefer using to tune the bike, and go with that.  IMO, don't waste your money on things like the Vance and Hines Fuelpak...they only allow changes to the amount of fuel delivered, and don't work as well as other products, like TTS Mastertune, SERT, etc.

As an afterthought, it probably wouldn't hurt to run some good fuel injector cleaner through the motor with the next fill up.

[ROCK FISH]

I have the same bike I've owned it since new. When the bike was new it ran so hot because it was so lean, the first mod was to install a set of slip ons and a powercomander . At first I had the shop go with a canned map that powercommander offered for my particular mods, but later changed the cams and had a custom map done on a dyno.  Bike runs much cooler and performs much better. Also much smoother at cruise speeds. Cams seem to have moved the sweet spot of the rpm range to about 3000 rpm.  The bike now has 56000 miles on it . Runs great ride it every were. Have also up graded the cam chains along the way to hyd. and now running Rinehart true duals.  Also had a screamin eagle high flow air filter installed at the same time as the slip ons.  Also running the true duals eliminated the popping on decel. A 2into 1 exhaust would probably be a better performer like a thunder header. But I don't like the way it looks on a bagger.

[grc]

A very common problem back then was intake air leaks, so I agree with Don (deweysheads) that the first thing to do is to perform some basic diagnosis and maintenance.  You may find that a small air leak is leaning the mixture out enough to cause your problem.  You may also have fuel system issues such as low fuel pressure due to fuel filter clogging (9 years, even with low miles, and you have no idea how the bike was stored) or a weak pump, dirty injectors, etc..   In other words, while it's very likely this is just related to the tune, it is best to verify the basics before spending time and money on a tune that might have to be repeated if you later find there really was a fuel pressure or air leak problem.  Start at A and progress to Z, rather than start at Z.

Btw, the rough running you describe between 1500-2000 rpm is nothing new, and it's been evident on carb or EFI bikes since emissions standards were first applied.  My '99 carb Harley did the same thing until I changed the pilot jet and idle mixture, and my '05 EFI was the same way until I added some fuel in that rpm range with a Power Commander. 

There are numerous devices on the market to allow you to modify fuel settings on an EFI bike, from the simple add-on boxes like the DFO (Digital Fuel Optimizer) or it's siblings sold by various exhaust system companies, to the high priced auto tuning solutions from ThunderMax, Revolution Performance, etc.   If you just want to play with the simple stuff first, look for one of the add-on boxes on ebay at a cheap price.  If it solves your problem, fine.  If it doesn't, you can go on to a more expensive solution.  Anything is possible, it all depends on how much you want to spend.


Jerry

[Onewheat]

I will check the intake seals first, but I don't get any other symptoms of an intake leak, so I am still leaning towards the tune being off.  Also, I'm not sure if it is a high flow air filter or not - it still has the stock cover and the filter is a cotton-looking filter element and I believe it has an HD logo on it, but other than that, I don't remember much else special about it.  It doesn't look like any hi-po element I have ever seen, but then again, I am totally new to Harley.  All of my sport bikes and 4-wheelers all have something akin to a K&N or oiled foam filters.

I got referred to Herko at http://www.flyingwperformance.com/ (John Wadsworth) which is relatively local, but he is not accepting any appointments at this time - maybe due to overloaded schedule or whatever.

IF a PC3 will fix me up with a canned map, that may be the way to go, especially if it allows for a better tune later on with some dyno work.

[HD Street Performance]

There are a lot of other good tuners in the vicinity.

[Midnight Rider]

Take the cover and the filter off, and if the backplate looks like this:  http://www.harley-davidson.com/gma/gma_product.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524441842407&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374309402743&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=2534374309402743&locale=en_US&bmUID=1307291351819&bmLocale=en_US   or this:  http://www.harley-davidson.com/gma/gma_product.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524448768356&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374309402743&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=2534374309402743&locale=en_US&bmUID=1307291522894&bmLocale=en_US  (chrome version of the backplate)

...it's the High Flow kit that was commonly installed with muffler changes...all that was considered a "Stage 1" modification.

[Onewheat]

There are a lot of other good tuners in the vicinity.

Like?  I have found my 2 local dealers, but other than that, I am Harley merchant ignorant.

[HD Street Performance]

The shops I am thinking of are not that close to you but are good tuners.
JDs cycles in Bethlehem PA, Valley Racing Chicago area, There are a few more in Central Illinois.

[06BadBoy]

Regarding air leaks, the '06 CVO I just purchased with 42,775 showing had this done at only 2,000 miles by the previous owner:

"CUST REPORTS IDLE CONDITION:
INSPECTED PRIMARY CHAIN, IT WAS LOOSE AT 7/8", TECH ADJUSTED TO 5/8". FOUND FRONT SPARK PLUG TO BE FOULE, POSSIBLY FROM INTAKE LEAK. IDLE WAS ALSO RAISED TO 1024 RPM. IT IS NORMAL FOR TACH TO DISPLAY FLUCTUATION IN THE IDLE.  TECH FOUND AIR CLEANER SCREW WAS BACKING OUT. TECH CHECKED TORQUE ON AL A/C HARDWARE & EXHAUST CLAMPS. TECH THEN RECHECKED FOR ANY LEAKS AND FOUND THERE TO BE NONE." END.

Seems to me that the smallest things can make a big difference!